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john e. littleton (Juggler54)
Posted on Wednesday, March 02, 2005 - 9:46 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

A woman saw a man with a musket and killed herself. Why?
Silas (Silas)
Posted on Wednesday, March 02, 2005 - 11:04 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Was he the police and she a fugitive?
Is her sanity relevant?
Isn't the musket an old firearm? Or does the time period in which this happened irrelevant?
Silas (Silas)
Posted on Wednesday, March 02, 2005 - 11:11 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is this during war?
To avoid painful death? avoid marriage?
Brian Pamandanan (Sciguy47)
Posted on Thursday, March 03, 2005 - 8:12 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Does it matter how she killed herself?
Was it accidental?
Barbara Johannessen Bailey (Rabrab)
Posted on Thursday, March 03, 2005 - 10:07 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Was it seeing the musket that caused her to kill herself? relevant that it's a musket, and not another type of gun? another type of weapon?

Was it seeing the man that caused her to kill herself? would she still have killed herself had she seen him, but he wasn't carrying the musket?

How soon after seeing him did she kill herself? immediately? within a few minutes? within an hour? two hours? twelve hours? a day? longer?

wild guess time... Would knowing something about her father or his occupation help here?
john e. littleton (Juggler54)
Posted on Friday, March 04, 2005 - 6:41 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

By Silas (Silas) on Wednesday, March 02, 2005 - 11:04 pm:


Was he the police and she a fugitive? b\(no)
Is her sanity relevant? b\(no)
Isn't the musket an old firearm? b\(right track) Or does the time period in which this happened irrelevant? b\(slightly relevant)

By Silas (Silas) on Wednesday, March 02, 2005 - 11:11 pm:


Is this during war? b\(no)
To avoid painful death? b\(no) avoid marriage? b\(no)

By Brian Pamandanan (Sciguy47) on Thursday, March 03, 2005 - 08:12 am:


Does it matter how she killed herself? b\(no)
Was it accidental? b\(no)

By Barbara Johannessen Bailey (Rabrab) on Thursday, March 03, 2005 - 10:07 pm:


Was it seeing the musket that caused her to kill herself? b\(no) relevant that it's a musket, and not another type of gun? b\(yope) another type of weapon?

Was it seeing the man that caused her to kill herself? b\(yes) would she still have killed herself had she seen him, but he wasn't carrying the musket? b\(yes)

How soon after seeing him did she kill herself? immediately? b\(this one) within a few minutes? within an hour? two hours? twelve hours? a day? longer? b\(none of these)

wild guess time... Would knowing something about her father or his occupation help here? b\(good guess, but no)
john e. littleton (Juggler54)
Posted on Friday, March 04, 2005 - 6:48 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Sry about that last post. wasn't sure how to do the bold print.

By Silas (Silas) on Wednesday, March 02, 2005 - 11:04 pm:


Was he the police and she a fugitive? no
Is her sanity relevant? no
Isn't the musket an old firearm? right track Or does the time period in which this happened irrelevant? slightly relevant

By Silas (Silas) on Wednesday, March 02, 2005 - 11:11 pm:


Is this during war? no
To avoid painful death? no avoid marriage? no

By Brian Pamandanan (Sciguy47) on Thursday, March 03, 2005 - 08:12 am:


Does it matter how she killed herself? no
Was it accidental? no

By Barbara Johannessen Bailey (Rabrab) on Thursday, March 03, 2005 - 10:07 pm:


Was it seeing the musket that caused her to kill herself? no relevant that it's a musket, and not another type of gun? yope another type of weapon? could be a sword, pistols maybe

Was it seeing the man that caused her to kill herself? yes would she still have killed herself had she seen him, but he wasn't carrying the musket? yes

How soon after seeing him did she kill herself? immediately? this one
within a few minutes? within an hour? two hours? twelve hours? a day? longer? none of these

wild guess time... Would knowing something about her father or his occupation help here? good guess, but no
Barbara Johannessen Bailey (Rabrab)
Posted on Friday, March 04, 2005 - 7:43 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Well, that little light bulb has burned out...

Is this from a movie? TV? story? poem? FYOI (from your own imagination)? something else?

You said time period was slightly relevant; was it in the 1700's? 1800's 1900's?

When she saw him relevant? Daytime? nightime?

It could have been another type of weapon and she still would have killed herself? So, if she had seen this particular man, -and- he was unarmed, would she still have killed herself?

Did she kill herself because of who the man was? what he was? his occupation relevant? law enforcement of some type? military? criminal?

Relevant what she was doing when she saw him?

Relevant how she killed herself? Jumped from something? jumped from somewhere? ate?/drank? poison? slit her wrists? shot herself? drowned herself? hanged herself?
john e. littleton (Juggler54)
Posted on Saturday, March 05, 2005 - 12:58 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

By Barbara Johannessen Bailey (Rabrab) on Friday, March 04, 2005 - 07:43 pm:


Well, that little light bulb has burned out... sry:(

Is this from a movie? TV? story? poem? FYOI (from your own imagination)? this one something else?

You said time period was slightly relevant; was it in the 1700's? 1800's? 1900's? probably 1700's and 1800's, but not very relevant

When she saw him relevant? no Daytime? nightime?

It could have been another type of weapon and she still would have killed herself? yes So, if she had seen this particular man, -and- he was unarmed, would she still have killed herself? yes

Did she kill herself because of who the man was? \b[no} what he was? his occupation relevant? no law enforcement of some type? military? criminal?

Relevant what she was doing when she saw him? no

Relevant how she killed herself? no Jumped from something? jumped from somewhere? ate?/drank? poison? slit her wrists? shot herself? drowned herself? hanged herself? none of these
Barbara Johannessen Bailey (Rabrab)
Posted on Saturday, March 05, 2005 - 1:28 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

S'okay. If all the answers were yes it would be an awfully quick puzzle

Did she kill herself because of where he was? where she was?

Did he see her before she killed herself? Did he know that she was there? Was he coming to kill or hurt her?

Relevant where she was when she saw him? What she was doing? Her position? (standing, sitting, laying down, kneeling, crouching?)
john e. littleton (Juggler54)
Posted on Sunday, March 06, 2005 - 2:34 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

By Barbara Johannessen Bailey (Rabrab) on Saturday, March 05, 2005 - 01:28 am:


S'okay. If all the answers were yes it would be an awfully quick puzzle most likely

Did she kill herself because of where he was? where she was? neither

Did he see her before she killed herself? irrel Did he know that she was there? irrel Was he coming to kill or hurt her? no

Relevant where she was when she saw him? no What she was doing? Her position? (standing, sitting, laying down, kneeling, crouching?)
Barbara Johannessen Bailey (Rabrab)
Posted on Sunday, March 06, 2005 - 5:08 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Hmmm. Let me make sure I've got this clear so far.

A woman (it's irrelevant where she was or what she was doing)

saw a man carrying a musket (but it could have been another type of weapon, or no weapon at all; and who he was, his occupation and where he was are also irrelevant)

and then immediately killed herself (but how she did it is irrelevant as well.)

This is set in the 1700's/1800's, but that's not very relevant, and it doesn't matter whether it was daytime or nighttime.

Whether or not he saw her or even knew that she was there is irrelevant. He was not coming to hurt or kill her.

Hmmm indeed.

OK, then. Was she going to kill herself anyway, and she just happened to see him just before she did it? would she have killed herself anyway if she hadn't seen him? Would she have killed herself if she had seen someone else and not him? Would she have killed herself if she had seen no-one?
john e. littleton (Juggler54)
Posted on Monday, March 07, 2005 - 5:52 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

By Barbara Johannessen Bailey (Rabrab) on Sunday, March 06, 2005 - 05:08 pm:


Hmmm. Let me make sure I've got this clear so far.

A woman (it's irrelevant where she was or what she was doing) right

saw a man carrying a musket (but it could have been another type of weapon, or no weapon at all; yep and who he was this one is relevant, his occupation and where he was are also irrelevant) all right except for the one i marked.

and then immediately killed herself (but how she did it is irrelevant as well.)yep

This is set in the 1700's/1800's, but that's not very relevant, and it doesn't matter whether it was daytime or nighttime. yep

Whether or not he saw her or even knew that she was there is irrelevant. He was not coming to hurt or kill her. right

Hmmm indeed.

OK, then. Was she going to kill herself anyway, and she just happened to see him just before she did it? no would she have killed herself anyway if she hadn't seen him? no Would she have killed herself if she had seen someone else and not him? yes Would she have killed herself if she had seen no-one? yes
Barbara Johannessen Bailey (Rabrab)
Posted on Monday, March 07, 2005 - 7:15 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Ooooo-kay. I'm confuzzled.

On March 5 at 12:58 am you said "Did she kill herself because of who the man was? no"
On March 7 at 5:52 pm, you said "...and who he was this one is relevant..."

So who he is is relevant, but that's not why she killed herself?

Does she know him? Does he know her?

does she know him: by name but not by sight?
by sight but not by name?
by both name and sight?
by reputation?

Does he know her: by name but not by sight?
by sight but not by name?
by both name and sight?
by reputation?

Are they related?
by blood?
by marriage?
by adoption?
Are they lovers? ex-lovers turned enemies?
Are they legally entangled in some way?
a business?
a plan?
a task?
a contract?
something else?
Are they friends?
nodding acquaintances?
strangers?

"Was she going to kill herself anyway, and she just happened to see him just before she did it? no"

Perhaps if I break that question into two parts, I can do away with the contradiction I seem to be running into...

Did she intend to kill herself?
Was she intending to kill herself before she saw him?

But then there's this:
"would she have killed herself anyway if she hadn't seen him? no
Would she have killed herself if she had seen someone else and not him? yes
Would she have killed herself if she had seen no-one? yes"

She would have still killed herself if she had not seen him, but had seen either someone else or had seen no-one? But if she hadn't seen him she wouldn't have? So, does the someone else have to be some other specific person? Would she have killed herself had she seen any other person, regardless of who they were?
john e. littleton (Juggler54)
Posted on Monday, March 07, 2005 - 7:55 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

By Barbara Johannessen Bailey (Rabrab) on Monday, March 07, 2005 - 07:15 pm:


Ooooo-kay. I'm confuzzled.

On March 5 at 12:58 am you said "Did she kill herself because of who the man was? no"
On March 7 at 5:52 pm, you said "...and who he was this one is relevant..." I'm so sorry. I think what I meant was that on 3/5 she didn't kill herself because of the man's occupation, but had it been another man than him. she would not have killed herself. I hope that makes sense.

So who he is is relevant, but that's not why she killed herself? that it was a certain man is relevant. If she had seen just any man then she would not have killed herself. It was seeing that 1 man caused her to commit suicide

Does she know him? irrel, but they had seen each other before. Does he know her? same

does she know him: by name but not by sight?
by sight but not by name? this one
by both name and sight?
by reputation?

Does he know her: by name but not by sight?
by sight but not by name?
by both name and sight?
by reputation? none of these are relevant.

Are they related?
by blood?
by marriage?
by adoption?
Are they lovers? ex-lovers turned enemies?
Are they legally entangled in some way?
a business?
a plan?
a task?
a contract?
something else? this one, unforunately for you
Are they friends?
nodding acquaintances?
strangers?

"Was she going to kill herself anyway, and she just happened to see him just before she did it? no"

Perhaps if I break that question into two parts, I can do away with the contradiction I seem to be running into...

Did she intend to kill herself? if she saw him yes
Was she intending to kill herself before she saw him? no

But then there's this:
"would she have killed herself anyway if she hadn't seen him? no
Would she have killed herself if she had seen someone else and not him? yes ok this one was a wrong answer on me. She would not have killed herself, had she seen anyone else besides that man.
Would she have killed herself if she had seen no-one? yes"

She would have still killed herself if she had not seen him, yes but had seen either someone else no or had seen no-one? yes But if she hadn't seen him she wouldn't have? right So, does the someone else have to be some other specific person? exactly Would she have killed herself had she seen any other person, regardless of who they were? no
Tim A. Dowd (Bodo)
Posted on Monday, March 07, 2005 - 9:27 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

This scenario is reminding me of a poem, or perhaps it was prose...

So she was waiting for a specific person to come back, and seeing the man with the musket let her know that she wouldn't see the person for whom she was waiting? Had Musketman killed her lover? Is there a war going on?
Barbara Johannessen Bailey (Rabrab)
Posted on Monday, March 07, 2005 - 9:49 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Thanks for coming back, Tim. I fear that I've tied myself in knots here.


They're legally entangled in some way? apprenticeship?
indenturement?
slavery?
anything to do with a will? or bequest?

In this legal entanglement, is MusketMan her superior? equal? inferior?
john e. littleton (Juggler54)
Posted on Tuesday, March 08, 2005 - 6:45 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

By Tim A. Dowd (Bodo) on Monday, March 07, 2005 - 09:27 pm:


This scenario is reminding me of a poem, or perhaps it was prose... could be, but i didn't take it from anything.

So she was waiting for a specific person to come back, and seeing the man with the musket let her know that she wouldn't see the person for whom she was waiting? yep Had Musketman killed her lover? exactly, you almost have it Is there a war going on? no

By Barbara Johannessen Bailey (Rabrab) on Monday, March 07, 2005 - 09:49 pm:


Thanks for coming back, Tim. I fear that I've tied myself in knots here. sorry to confuse you.


They're legally entangled in some way? apprenticeship?
indenturement?
slavery?
anything to do with a will? or bequest? none of these

In this legal entanglement, is MusketMan her superior? equal? inferior? none of these either. I like Tim's nickname.. MusketMan :)
Barbara Johannessen Bailey (Rabrab)
Posted on Tuesday, March 08, 2005 - 7:50 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Ah! She knew that Musket Man and her lover were going to have a duel? And when she saw MusketMan, she knew that her lover was dead?
john e. littleton (Juggler54)
Posted on Tuesday, March 08, 2005 - 10:58 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

**************SPOILER***************

By Barbara Johannessen Bailey (Rabrab) on Tuesday, March 08, 2005 - 07:50 pm:


Ah! She knew that Musket Man and her lover were going to have a duel? And when she saw MusketMan, she knew that her lover was dead? you hit it right on the money. Nice JOb. For a while I thot you wouldn;t solve it.
Barbara Johannessen Bailey (Rabrab)
Posted on Wednesday, March 09, 2005 - 1:32 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Bodo did it. I would have continued floundering around trying to figure out the exact relationship between the two indefinitely. Nice puzzle.
john e. littleton (Juggler54)
Posted on Wednesday, March 09, 2005 - 8:57 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

thx.

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