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Dropofahat (Dropofahat)
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Username: Dropofahat

Post Number: 355
Registered: 8-2009
Posted on Wednesday, September 02, 2009 - 7:54 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I asked my colleague a question.

She looked at me oddly, then answered: “Well, there’s the one on…”, and told me the cross streets.

I went to this location, and did not find what I was looking for.

That’s when I realized what the problem was. What was it?
Ferrets101 (Ferrets101)
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Post Number: 88
Registered: 8-2009
Posted on Wednesday, September 02, 2009 - 8:24 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

was the question asking the location of a place? If so, is it:
a restaurant?
A supermarket?
A bank?
Something else?

Did she interpret your question correctly? Did she answer it appropriately? Would it have been possible for you to figure out what the problem was after she answered, but before you went there? If so, would you still have gone?
are the names of the cross streets relevant?
Dropofahat (Dropofahat)
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Post Number: 356
Registered: 8-2009
Posted on Wednesday, September 02, 2009 - 8:30 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

was the question asking the location of a place? Yes If so, is it:
a restaurant? This is closest
A supermarket?
A bank?
Something else?

Did she interpret your question correctly? No
Did she answer it appropriately? She tried
Would it have been possible for you to figure out what the problem was after she answered, but before you went there? Maybe
If so, would you still have gone? No
are the names of the cross streets relevant? They might help, but aren't strictly necessary
Logician (Logician)
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Post Number: 588
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Posted on Wednesday, September 02, 2009 - 10:40 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did she mishear what you said? (e.g. hearing "coffee" instead of "cafe") Misunderstand the context of the words? (e.g. thinking "McDonald's" refers to a shop belonging to Mr. McDonald)

Is the name/brand of the restaurant relevant? Is it part of a chain of restaurants? Or is it local-run?
Alhucema (Alhucema)
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Post Number: 858
Registered: 11-2008
Posted on Thursday, September 03, 2009 - 12:40 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Were you asking her where a specific restaurant was? I assume by your puzzle statement that you asked rather for its general characteristics than for its exact name, is that correct?

Did she understand you were asking for a restaurant? Or for the same thing you were actually asking?

If you were actually asking what she understood you were, it would be rather strange, is that right?
Dropofahat (Dropofahat)
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Post Number: 358
Registered: 8-2009
Posted on Thursday, September 03, 2009 - 4:08 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Logician:
Did she mishear what you said? (e.g. hearing "coffee" instead of "cafe") No Misunderstand the context of the words? (e.g. thinking "McDonald's" refers to a shop belonging to Mr. McDonald) Yes, along these lines

Is the name/brand of the restaurant relevant? Yes Is it part of a chain of restaurants?Yes Or is it local-run? No

Alhucema:
Were you asking her where a specific restaurant was? Yes, if I understand your question correctly
I assume by your puzzle statement that you asked rather for its general characteristics than for its exact name, is that correct? No

Did she understand you were asking for a restaurant? No Or for the same thing you were actually asking? sorry, I'm not sure I understand the question...

If you were actually asking what she understood you were, it would be rather strange, is that right? a bit, yes - for a particular reason
Alhucema (Alhucema)
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Post Number: 860
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Posted on Thursday, September 03, 2009 - 6:53 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

To rephrase it - did you ask her something like: "Where is the closest Mc Donald's", rather than "Where is the closest fast-food restaurant"?
Biograd (Biograd)
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Post Number: 419
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Posted on Thursday, September 03, 2009 - 8:07 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is the name of the restaurant a proper name (like McDonald's or Wendy's)? A phrase consisting of actual words (in any language)(like Burger King, Pizza Hut, etc.)? A single real word? An entirely made-up word or phrase?

Restaurant is closest: Is it a cafe (like Starbucks)? A place that serves only drinks (like Jamba Juice)?
Dropofahat (Dropofahat)
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Post Number: 360
Registered: 8-2009
Posted on Thursday, September 03, 2009 - 2:12 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Alhucema:
To rephrase it - did you ask her something like: "Where is the closest Mc Donald's" Yes, this - I guess I did understand your question correctly... rather than "Where is the closest fast-food restaurant"?

Biograd:
Is the name of the restaurant a proper name (like McDonald's or Wendy's)? No A phrase consisting of actual words (in any language)(like Burger King, Pizza Hut, etc.)? No, but... A single real word? Yes An entirely made-up word or phrase? No

Restaurant is closest: Is it a cafe (like Starbucks)? A place that serves only drinks (like Jamba Juice)? Your suggestions above are closer
Noel (Noel)
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Post Number: 357
Registered: 7-2009
Posted on Thursday, September 03, 2009 - 2:50 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

The restaurant you wanted to go to was one word, but she thought it was two words?
Dropofahat (Dropofahat)
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Post Number: 363
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Posted on Thursday, September 03, 2009 - 2:51 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

The restaurant you wanted to go to was one word, but she thought it was two words? No
Kalira (Kalira)
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Post Number: 226
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Posted on Thursday, September 03, 2009 - 3:03 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did you want to go to Subway (the sub sandwich place)? and she thought you wanted to find a subway station (presumably so you could take the subway/metro somewhere)?
Dropofahat (Dropofahat)
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Post Number: 364
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Posted on Thursday, September 03, 2009 - 3:17 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Kalira:

Did you want to go to Subway (the sub sandwich place)? and she thought you wanted to find a subway station (presumably so you could take the subway/metro somewhere)? Haha, exactly so!

So now there is only the matter of why she looked at me oddly, and one more element, a small clue of which is in the puzzle statement.
Noel (Noel)
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Post Number: 358
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Posted on Thursday, September 03, 2009 - 3:23 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Were you in a subway station when you asked her? In a subway? In front of a subway station?
Dropofahat (Dropofahat)
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Post Number: 366
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Posted on Thursday, September 03, 2009 - 3:26 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Were you in a subway station when you asked her? In a subway? In front of a subway station? Ha, no to all, but funny
Ferrets101 (Ferrets101)
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Post Number: 94
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Posted on Thursday, September 03, 2009 - 5:00 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is there a subway station extremely close to where you and your colleague were? Is there no subway station even remotely close? Was the subway station she referred to not open yet? Does the town/city where you were have a running subway? a subway under construction that hasn't opened yet?
Dropofahat (Dropofahat)
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Post Number: 367
Registered: 8-2009
Posted on Thursday, September 03, 2009 - 5:05 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Ferrets101:
Is there a subway station extremely close to where you and your colleague were? I'd say "fairly close", so this is, um, close enough
Is there no subway station even remotely close? No
Was the subway station she referred to not open yet? No
Does the town/city where you were have a running subway? Yes
a subway under construction that hasn't opened yet? No
Logician (Logician)
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Post Number: 589
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Posted on Thursday, September 03, 2009 - 5:49 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Were you on a lunch break when you asked the question? Making her wonder why you'd want to travel by train/metro (which presumably would be quite a way) on your break?
Dropofahat (Dropofahat)
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Post Number: 368
Registered: 8-2009
Posted on Thursday, September 03, 2009 - 6:30 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Were you on a lunch break when you asked the question? Just about, yes Making her wonder why you'd want to travel by train/metro (which presumably would be quite a way) on your break? This may have crossed her mind I suppose - this is an entirely true story, by the way! - but it wasn't the primary reason for the odd look
Noel (Noel)
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Post Number: 360
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Posted on Thursday, September 03, 2009 - 7:05 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Do you ride the subway every day? Was her odd look because you already know where the closest station is?
Dropofahat (Dropofahat)
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Post Number: 369
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Posted on Thursday, September 03, 2009 - 7:10 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Do you ride the subway every day? yes Was her odd look because you already know where the closest station is? Yup! Not only is it the only subway station in the vicinity, and is the main way most of us get to work, but we at some point had discussed taking that very subway.

The puzzle is just about ready to spoil, except for one last thing. She was more specific than just telling me where it was...
Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
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Posted on Thursday, September 03, 2009 - 11:36 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

You were discussing sandwiches, were getting hungry, and asked, "Oh, that reminds me, where's the nearest Subway?"

And she (never having heard of Subway sandwiches before, and thinking you were inserting a non sequitur into the conversation), replied, "Um, Xth and Y Streets, next to the bank. Go down the stairs, you can't miss it."

At which point you thought the Subway shop was in the Xth and Y subway station.
Dropofahat (Dropofahat)
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Post Number: 370
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Posted on Friday, September 04, 2009 - 12:36 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Jenburdoo:

You were discussing sandwiches, were getting hungry, and asked, "Oh, that reminds me, where's the nearest Subway?"

And she (never having heard of Subway sandwiches before, and thinking you were inserting a non sequitur into the conversation), replied, "Um, Xth and Y Streets, next to the bank. Go down the stairs, you can't miss it."

At which point you thought the Subway shop was in the Xth and Y subway station.

Hmm, no. Alhucema got my question just about right ("Where is the nearest ______?"), even though that was before Kalira figured that it was "Subway". I just went up to her and asked, no context. And I know she's heard of Subway sandwiches - I had seen her eating one a while back - I guess it just didn't come to mind, the way I phrased it. (By the way, I still have yet to find out where the nearest Subway sandwich place is - I'm embarassed to ask again!)

No, I didn't think it was in the subway station, I thought it might be nearby and I just hadn't ever spotted it.

And the way I wrote my colleague's response is accurate, lacking only the streets (Canal and Varick Streets in Manhattan, as it happens). Yet there is hidden information in her answer. Feel free to Google that subway stop, it may help...
Noel (Noel)
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Post Number: 362
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Posted on Friday, September 04, 2009 - 1:44 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is there something else at that intersection that is relevant to the puzzle? Like a mental institution or a psychiatrist office? Was she implying that you were off your rocker by asking where the station was?
Dropofahat (Dropofahat)
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Post Number: 372
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Posted on Friday, September 04, 2009 - 2:43 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is there something else at that intersection that is relevant to the puzzle? Like a mental institution or a psychiatrist office? Was she implying that you were off your rocker by asking where the station was? No to all. Like I said, she was trying to help, although she couldn't quite get why I was asking. In fact, she even told which train line was at that station. And had it been any other train line, I might not have bothered going there...
Alhucema (Alhucema)
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Posted on Friday, September 04, 2009 - 3:33 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Chowhound?

Is it relevant there is a park?
Dropofahat (Dropofahat)
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Post Number: 373
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Posted on Friday, September 04, 2009 - 3:39 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Alhucema:

Chowhound? Is it relevant there is a park? No. I'm afraid I may just have to give it away if this doesn't do it. And I don't mean to be so opaque, but there really is something kind of interesting hidden there.

In her response, which I wrote out in the puzzle statement (leaving out only the street names, which do not figure into this aspect), she told me which train line operated out of that station - although I didn't realize it at the time. If some other train line ran there, I probably would have been able to clear up the confusion right away.)
Noel (Noel)
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Post Number: 368
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Posted on Friday, September 04, 2009 - 3:45 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is it train line "One"? So if she had said "the orange line" or "smithtown line" or something, you'd have known immediately, but since the line was "One" you thought she was talking about one Subway restaurant?

PS, I'm curious as to why you said a restaurant was "closest" and not that it was a restaurant. Wouldn't you consider Subway a restaurant? I mean, you go buy food there, and then you eat it. If that's not a restaurant, what is?
Dropofahat (Dropofahat)
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Post Number: 374
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Posted on Friday, September 04, 2009 - 4:18 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Noel:
Is it train line "One"? Yes

So if she had said "the orange line" or "smithtown line" or something, you'd have known immediately, but since the line was "One" you thought she was talking about one Subway restaurant? Yes, Exactly!

****************************SPOILER***********************

Okay, this was solved awhile ago, the only element left was that the subway in question was the "1" line. This is how most of us got to and from work, since there aren't many other modes of transport in this part of downtown Manhattan.

There also aren't that many places to get lunch. I once saw my colleague eating a "Subway" sandwich. Some time later, I asked her "Where is the nearest Subway?"

Clearly thinking I meant the underground subway, she looked at me oddly (since she knows I take it) and said "Well, there's the 1 on Canal and Varick."

If the nearest train had been the "N", the "Path", ANYTHING but the "1", I would've spotted the confusion right away.

But I still thought she was talking about the sandwich shop, so I went to that corner...


And I STILL haven't worked up the nerve to ask her where she did get the Subway sandwich from...



Noel:
PS, I'm curious as to why you said a restaurant was "closest" and not that it was a restaurant. Wouldn't you consider Subway a restaurant? I mean, you go buy food there, and then you eat it. If that's not a restaurant, what is?
You're probably right, that should have been a clear Yes, although I think "deli" or "fast food joint" would be closer - I don't always consider places like McDonald's "restaurants", although I guess technically they are. (Is a hot dog stand a restaurant?) I guess I just didn't want anyone to think it was a fancy, sit-down, waiter-service restaurant. But still, it didn't take long for that answer to arise...
Alhucema (Alhucema)
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Post Number: 890
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Posted on Saturday, September 05, 2009 - 11:55 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

This one was good :-)))

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