| Author | Message | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 2001 Registered: 5-2003 |
He was perfectly honest when he lied about his age. (Possibly a quickie.) | ||
| Johnpw (Johnpw)
New member Username: Johnpw Post Number: 1 Registered: 12-2009 |
Was e aware he was lying? Was it intentional? Are his motives for lying relevant? Age=time he has been alive? Some other type of age? Is his age relevant? | ||
| Galfisk (Galfisk)
New member Username: Galfisk Post Number: 882 Registered: 9-2009 |
Was he asked about his age? Was the question formulated in such a way that he could say something else and not lie? Did he say he was younger than he really was? Older? Relevant? Who he lied to? How about different lengths of the year on different planets? Did he lie about his age in years? Or some other time unit? | ||
| Logician (Logician)
New member Username: Logician Post Number: 620 Registered: 6-2003 |
Was he specifically asked to lie (say, in the preliminary section of a lie detector test), and he was thus honest in his decision to actually lie? | ||
| Markobr (Markobr)
New member Username: Markobr Post Number: 560 Registered: 5-2009 |
lied = intentionally told a falsehood with the expection (some of) the listeners would consider it a truth? | ||
| Kaygee (Kaygee)
New member Username: Kaygee Post Number: 386 Registered: 9-2008 |
I emailed a possible answer. | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 2002 Registered: 5-2003 |
Was e aware he was lying? Yes. Was it intentional? Yes. Are his motives for lying relevant? Yes. Age=time he has been alive? Yes. Some other type of age? No. Is his age relevant? Yes. Was he asked about his age? Yes. Was the question formulated in such a way that he could say something else and not lie? Yes. Did he say he was younger than he really was? Older? This. Relevant? Yes. Who he lied to? Yes. How about different lengths of the year on different planets? Yes. Did he lie about his age in years? This. Or some other time unit? Was he specifically asked to lie (say, in the preliminary section of a lie detector test), and he was thus honest in his decision to actually lie? No. lied = intentionally told a falsehood with the expection (some of) the listeners would consider it a truth? Yes. | ||
| Yojimbo (Yojimbo)
New member Username: Yojimbo Post Number: 260 Registered: 11-2009 |
lengths of years on different planets are relevant? if so, is he (can we call him Klahtu?) an alien? is he from a planet with a longer period/year? a shorter period? did he lie on Earth, or another planet? | ||
| Markobr (Markobr)
New member Username: Markobr Post Number: 564 Registered: 5-2009 |
Was his age relevant for legal reasons? Is a certain minimum age relevant? If so: LTPF list of natural numbers, please. Did he think his lying was justified? Would whoever he was lying to think it was justified if he/she/they were told later about the lie and its reasons? Does he tell the lie to one person? 2? 3? 4? 5-10? 11-20? More? | ||
| Alhucema (Alhucema)
New member Username: Alhucema Post Number: 1430 Registered: 11-2008 |
Army relevant? Leap years? Could the person/s he was lying to immediately identify he was lying (as if he was born on February 29th and at the age of forty said he was 10)? Is his actual age (at the time of the puzzle) relevant? Was his purpose to have fun? Play a prank? Avoid something? Achieve something? | ||
| Alhucema (Alhucema)
New member Username: Alhucema Post Number: 1431 Registered: 11-2008 |
Is the exact wording of how he was asked about his age relevant? | ||
| Jumpingjack (Jumpingjack)
New member Username: Jumpingjack Post Number: 1052 Registered: 3-2006 |
Was a transaction being conducted whereby he would need to pay a larger amount if he were older? eg. buying a movie ticket or similar Since lengths of years on different planets are relevant, perhaps he had been on a different planet for some time, was technically below 12 (for example), but said he was older because he was an honest person and knew he shouldn't really qualify for a child's ticket? | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 2003 Registered: 5-2003 |
BLOOPER AlERT! How about different lengths of the year on different planets? NO. In reference to questions about other planets, this is set on Earth, and no other planets are involved. Was his age relevant for legal reasons? Yes. Is a certain minimum age relevant? Yes. If so: LTPF list of natural numbers, please. 18. Did he think his lying was justified? Yes. Would whoever he was lying to think it was justified if he/she/they were told later about the lie and its reasons? No, but depends on circumstances. Does he tell the lie to one person? This. 2? 3? 4? 5-10? 11-20? More? Army relevant? Yes. Leap years? No. Could the person/s he was lying to immediately identify he was lying (as if he was born on February 29th and at the age of forty said he was 10)? No. Is his actual age (at the time of the puzzle) relevant? Yes. Was his purpose to have fun? No. Play a prank? No. Avoid something? No. Achieve something? Yesish. Is the exact wording of how he was asked about his age relevant? No. Was a transaction being conducted whereby he would need to pay a larger amount if he were older? eg. buying a movie ticket or similar No. | ||
| Kaygee (Kaygee)
New member Username: Kaygee Post Number: 393 Registered: 9-2008 |
Did he impersonate another person who was 18 years old? Was the purpose to join the army? | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 2005 Registered: 5-2003 |
Did he impersonate another person who was 18 years old? No. Was the purpose to join the army? Yes. | ||
| Galfisk (Galfisk)
New member Username: Galfisk Post Number: 913 Registered: 9-2009 |
Was he asked to specify his age? Did he answer with a number? If so, was the number he gave not his age but another relevant number? Is he 17 at the time? younger? Or was the question something more like "do you think you're old enough?" | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 2006 Registered: 5-2003 |
Was he asked to specify his age? Yes. Did he answer with a number? Yesish. If so, was the number he gave not his age but another relevant number? Yes. Is he 17 at the time? Assume this. younger? Or was the question something more like "do you think you're old enough?" No. | ||
| Galfisk (Galfisk)
New member Username: Galfisk Post Number: 933 Registered: 9-2009 |
Did he say "I am a teen" - which the recruiter (predictably) heard as "I am eighteen"? | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 2007 Registered: 5-2003 |
Did he say "I am a teen" - which the recruiter (predictably) heard as "I am eighteen"? No, but you've got the right idea. | ||
| Galfisk (Galfisk)
New member Username: Galfisk Post Number: 949 Registered: 9-2009 |
So he did not say the number eighteen, but he said something that could be misheard as that number? Or was the number not used directly, but he said something else to indicate that he was eighteen? | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 2010 Registered: 5-2003 |
So he did not say the number eighteen, but he said something that could be misheard as that number? No. Or was the number not used directly, but he said something else to indicate that he was eighteen? Not quite. He did say the number eighteen. | ||
| Galfisk (Galfisk)
New member Username: Galfisk Post Number: 964 Registered: 9-2009 |
Was the number 18 something else than his age? Or his age, but measured in a different way? | ||
| Tommyp (Tommyp)
New member Username: Tommyp Post Number: 1068 Registered: 3-2004 |
Was the question he answered ambiguous? | ||
| Jumpingjack (Jumpingjack)
New member Username: Jumpingjack Post Number: 1057 Registered: 3-2006 |
Did he say, "I'm starting my eighteenth year?" This, of course, means he's only 17, but could mislead the person he was talking to into thinking he was 18. | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 2011 Registered: 5-2003 |
Was the number 18 something else than his age? This.Or his age, but measured in a different way? Was the question he answered ambiguous? Assume no. Did he say, "I'm starting my eighteenth year?" No. This, of course, means he's only 17, but could mislead the person he was talking to into thinking he was 18. | ||
| Yojimbo (Yojimbo)
New member Username: Yojimbo Post Number: 288 Registered: 11-2009 |
[I've gotten over the diminished prospect that the lad was an alien, back when lengths of years on other planets was relevant for a little bit...] is the following a reasonable chronicle? a recruiter asks our chap a question. part of his answer includes,"...eighteen..." the recruiter assumes this refers to his age. reasonable? wicked FA? | ||
| Markobr (Markobr)
New member Username: Markobr Post Number: 601 Registered: 5-2009 |
Is it relevant why he wanted to join the army? | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 2016 Registered: 5-2003 |
is the following a reasonable chronicle? Yes. a recruiter asks our chap a question. part of his answer includes,"...eighteen..." the recruiter assumes this refers to his age. reasonable? Yes. wicked FA? No. Is it relevant why he wanted to join the army? No. | ||
| Yojimbo (Yojimbo)
New member Username: Yojimbo Post Number: 299 Registered: 11-2009 |
did the inclusion of "eighteen" in our chap's answer also include "years," or something similar? our chap intended to deceive -- correct? were the two questions (about his age, and the other, which was answered, in part, with "...eighteen...") consecutive? wording of the Question (to which "eighteen" was part of the answer) relevant? was the recruiter asking about something quantifiable? such as, "How many wheels on your daddy's truck?" -- or, "How many beers did you have on your way here?" (I can think of lots of those silly questions, but those two will have to represent -- for now). was he asking about something tangible (truck wheels, beers...)? something conceptual (years, degrees Celsius...)? [merry christmas on this puzzle, too] | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 2022 Registered: 5-2003 |
did the inclusion of "eighteen" in our chap's answer also include "years," or something similar? No. our chap intended to deceive -- correct? Yes. were the two questions (about his age, and the other, which was answered, in part, with "...eighteen...") consecutive? What two questions? wording of the Question (to which "eighteen" was part of the answer) relevant? No. was the recruiter asking about something quantifiable? such as, "How many wheels on your daddy's truck?" -- or, "How many beers did you have on your way here?" (I can think of lots of those silly questions, but those two will have to represent -- for now). Yes. was he asking about something tangible (truck wheels, beers...)? something conceptual (years, degrees Celsius...)? Conceptual. | ||
| Yojimbo (Yojimbo)
New member Username: Yojimbo Post Number: 301 Registered: 11-2009 |
[I'm waiting for my wife to finish getting ready, so we can go to a party, so one more batch from me...] I've assumed there were two questions: 1. about his age; 2. about something else, to which his answer included "eighteen." False Assumption? was there one relevant question? if so, was it about his age? was it also about something else quantifiable and conceptual? or do those attributes apply to the question about his age (years being -- naturally -- also quantifiable and conceptual)? [that's it -- she's ready; over and out.] | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 2023 Registered: 5-2003 |
I've assumed there were two questions: 1. about his age; Yes. 2. about something else, to which his answer included "eighteen." No. False Assumption? Yes. was there one relevant question? Yes. if so, was it about his age? Yes. was it also about something else quantifiable and conceptual? No. or do those attributes apply to the question about his age (years being -- naturally -- also quantifiable and conceptual)? Yes. [that's it -- she's ready; over and out.] Hope you enjoyed the party. | ||
| Yojimbo (Yojimbo)
New member Username: Yojimbo Post Number: 313 Registered: 11-2009 |
In response to the question, which I'll guess was along the lines of, "How old are you?" rather than "Are you eighteen?" [although the exact wording is irrelevant, as I recall] -- did our lad say, "I'm eighteen..."? did he say, "Eighteen...[followed by some other reference to quantity, as in]...times a day." [during the pause, I can imagine the recruiter writing on a form, and missing the rest of the answer]? or something similar? and yes, we enjoyed the party very much, as well as our Christmas Day, which I hope was also nice for you. | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 2028 Registered: 5-2003 |
In response to the question, which I'll guess was along the lines of, "How old are you?" Yes. rather than "Are you eighteen?" [although the exact wording is irrelevant, as I recall] -- did our lad say, "I'm eighteen..."? No. did he say, "Eighteen...[followed by some other reference to quantity, as in]...times a day." No. [during the pause, I can imagine the recruiter writing on a form, and missing the rest of the answer]? The recruiter doesn't miss anything that the recruit says. or something similar? You're weaving around the right track. | ||
| Yojimbo (Yojimbo)
New member Username: Yojimbo Post Number: 317 Registered: 11-2009 |
was our recruit's answer merely "Eighteen."? or was it along these lines, with pauses installed for sufficient ambiguity: "Eighteen... in two weeks... I'm going to Tampa to visit my mother."? [Two statements: "Eighteen in two weeks." and "I'm going, etc."] weaving any closer to the right track? | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 2031 Registered: 5-2003 |
was our recruit's answer merely "Eighteen."? No. or was it along these lines, with pauses installed for sufficient ambiguity: "Eighteen... in two weeks... I'm going to Tampa to visit my mother."? [Two statements: "Eighteen in two weeks." and "I'm going, etc."] weaving any closer to the right track? No. There were no ambiguous pauses. | ||
| Yojimbo (Yojimbo)
New member Username: Yojimbo Post Number: 325 Registered: 11-2009 |
was the miscommunication* a result of specific wording, and not inflection, dynamic, timbre, pace or other modulation? *["miscommunication" used creatively] is the specific wording of the answer relevant? (as I recall, the wording of the question wasn't, necessarily). when the recruit answered the question about his age, was he actually answering a question that had been previously asked? or was he not answering a question at all? was his statement of "...eighteen..." not an answer to the recruiter, although he took it as one? A statement about something else? | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 2032 Registered: 5-2003 |
was the miscommunication* a result of specific wording, Yes. and not inflection, dynamic, timbre, pace or other modulation? Correct. *["miscommunication" used creatively] is the specific wording of the answer relevant? Yes. (as I recall, the wording of the question wasn't, necessarily). Correct. when the recruit answered the question about his age, was he actually answering a question that had been previously asked? No. or was he not answering a question at all? Correct. was his statement of "...eighteen..." not an answer to the recruiter, although he took it as one? Correct. A statement about something else? Yes. | ||
| Yojimbo (Yojimbo)
New member Username: Yojimbo Post Number: 326 Registered: 11-2009 |
a shot in the dim light: did the recruit answer "How old are you?" with something like, "Eighteen on March 14th," although he was referring to the following year, rather than this year, as the recruiter perhaps assumed? was the recruit's statement about "eighteen" pertinent to something the recruiter had asked or mentioned in their interview? was the statement unrelated to any topic of the interview? was the statement solely intended to deceive the recruiter about chronological eligibility? was the statement something like, "Eighteen is old enough to vote and be drafted, but not old enough to drink."? did "eighteen" in the statement refer to years? or a quantity of something else? | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 2035 Registered: 5-2003 |
did the recruit answer "How old are you?" with something like, "Eighteen on March 14th," although he was referring to the following year, rather than this year, as the recruiter perhaps assumed? Not a bad guess, but no. was the recruit's statement about "eighteen" pertinent to something the recruiter had asked or mentioned in their interview? No. was the statement unrelated to any topic of the interview? Yes. was the statement solely intended to deceive the recruiter about chronological eligibility? Yes. was the statement something like, "Eighteen is old enough to vote and be drafted, but not old enough to drink."? No, much shorter. did "eighteen" in the statement refer to years? or a quantity of something else? No to both. | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 2082 Registered: 5-2003 |
Hint: The recruit is not talking about his age when he answers the question, though the recruiter thinks otherwise. | ||
| Markobr (Markobr)
New member Username: Markobr Post Number: 635 Registered: 5-2009 |
Was "eighteen" the first word of his answer? Did what he said refer to something/someone eighteen years old? To something which happened eighteen years ago? To the quantity of certain things/concepts? To the number "18" itself (maybe written somewhere)? To the word "eighteen" itself (maybe written somewhere)? | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 2087 Registered: 5-2003 |
Was "eighteen" the first word of his answer? No. Did what he said refer to something/someone eighteen years old? No. To something which happened eighteen years ago? No. To the quantity of certain things/concepts? No. To the number "18" itself (maybe written somewhere)? Yes, and it IS written somewhere. To the word "eighteen" itself (maybe written somewhere)? Irrelevant whether it's the word or the number. | ||
| Probably_monty_hall (Probably_monty_hall)
New member Username: Probably_monty_hall Post Number: 136 Registered: 10-2009 |
Did he read aloud a sign that said You must be 18 to join the military? and the recruiter thought he was saying something like "Of course I'm at least 18 or I wouldn't be applying right now"? | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 2093 Registered: 5-2003 |
Did he read aloud a sign that said You must be 18 to join the military? No. and the recruiter thought he was saying something like "Of course I'm at least 18 or I wouldn't be applying right now"? The recruiter would not have considered his statement sarcastic. | ||
| Galfisk (Galfisk)
New member Username: Galfisk Post Number: 1072 Registered: 9-2009 |
Does he read aloud something word for word, containing the word or number eighteen? Something in a recruitment pamphlet? Or other text provided by the recruiter? A poster? Or text unrelated to the recruiter? Can the recruiter's question be interpreted as to be about this text instead of his age? Which is how he manages to be perfectly honest? Is the recruit or recruiter filling out a form at the time? | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 2094 Registered: 5-2003 |
Does he read aloud something word for word, containing the word or number eighteen? No. Something in a recruitment pamphlet? Or other text provided by the recruiter? A poster? Or text unrelated to the recruiter? Can the recruiter's question be interpreted as to be about this text instead of his age? No. Which is how he manages to be perfectly honest? Is the recruit or recruiter filling out a form at the time? No. | ||
| Markobr (Markobr)
New member Username: Markobr Post Number: 652 Registered: 5-2009 |
Was the recruiter's question ambiguous? The number "18" (or "eighteen") is written somewhere: On a piece of paper? A computer screen? A wall? The floor? The ceiling? A piece of furniture? The back of a folder? Other office equipment? Somewhere outside the room? | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 2100 Registered: 5-2003 |
Was the recruiter's question ambiguous? No. The number "18" (or "eighteen") is written somewhere: On a piece of paper? This. A computer screen? A wall? The floor? The ceiling? A piece of furniture? The back of a folder? Other office equipment? Somewhere outside the room? | ||
| Markobr (Markobr)
New member Username: Markobr Post Number: 656 Registered: 5-2009 |
Is the piece of paper an ordinary paper sheet? A notebook? Another book? A stamp? Some kind of paper wrapping? A "take a number" piece of paper? Does the piece of paper belong to the recruit? The recruiter? The army/government? | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 2104 Registered: 5-2003 |
Is the piece of paper an ordinary paper sheet? A notebook? Another book? A stamp? Some kind of paper wrapping? A "take a number" piece of paper? Any kind of paper would do. Does the piece of paper belong to the recruit? This. The recruiter? The army/government? | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 2139 Registered: 5-2003 |
Hint: The size of the piece of paper is relevant. | ||
| Galfisk (Galfisk)
New member Username: Galfisk Post Number: 1126 Registered: 9-2009 |
Is the size of the paper 18 something? If not: is the paper particularly small? Large? Thick? Thin? Narrow? Long? | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 2151 Registered: 5-2003 |
Is the size of the paper 18 something? No. If not: is the paper particularly small? This. Large? Thick? Thin? Narrow? Long? | ||
| Yojimbo (Yojimbo)
New member Username: Yojimbo Post Number: 334 Registered: 11-2009 |
I was all excited to push on this puzzle until it $poiled before the turn of the year, but was unexpectedly gone for a while., and am still in transit -- have missed the puzzle...! is the paper a business card? a calling card? a handbill? a coupon? a ticket? a stamp? is it handwritten? by the recruit? by someone he knows? a relative? a friend? is it printed? mass-produced? | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 2153 Registered: 5-2003 |
is the paper a business card? a calling card? a handbill? a coupon? a ticket? a stamp? None of these. is it handwritten? Yes. by the recruit? This, none of the others.by someone he knows? a relative? a friend? is it printed? mass-produced? No to both. | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 2174 Registered: 5-2003 |
Hint: Any particularly small piece of paper would do. Why? | ||
| Hominid (Hominid)
New member Username: Hominid Post Number: 37 Registered: 1-2010 |
Is the Holocaust at all relevant? | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 2179 Registered: 5-2003 |
Is the Holocaust at all relevant? No. | ||
| Kalira (Kalira)
New member Username: Kalira Post Number: 290 Registered: 2-2009 |
okay, it's been several days since the primary puzzlers have posted here, so I'm hoping nobody minds if I join in. Does the piece of paper have a number on it? the number eight? Is the kid holding another piece of paper along with the small piece of paper? or is he holding some form of identification along with the small piece of paper? Does the underage kid cover up part of his age? other identifying information on something with the paper? For example, is his age listed as "16" (or however old he is) and he covers the 6 with the piece of paper? so that if he were asked to read it, it would look like "18" instead of "16"? | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 2184 Registered: 5-2003 |
Does the piece of paper have a number on it? Yes. the number eight? Technically, yes. Is the kid holding another piece of paper along with the small piece of paper? No. or is he holding some form of identification along with the small piece of paper? No. Does the underage kid cover up part of his age? You could say that. other identifying information on something with the paper? No. For example, is his age listed as "16" (or however old he is) and he covers the 6 with the piece of paper? No. so that if he were asked to read it, it would look like "18" instead of "16"? No. | ||
| Hominid (Hominid)
New member Username: Hominid Post Number: 46 Registered: 1-2010 |
Does it show the WORD eighteen? Is eighteen his ID number or something like that? Is the conversation in English? Another language? | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 2187 Registered: 5-2003 |
Does it show the WORD eighteen? Irrelevant. Is eighteen his ID number or something like that? No. Is the conversation in English? Yes, and irrelevant. Another language? | ||
| Hominid (Hominid)
New member Username: Hominid Post Number: 103 Registered: 1-2010 |
Does he make a comment about the paper? Is the man he's talking to exactly 18? Would the man have already noticed the paper? Is he testing literacy? | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 2204 Registered: 5-2003 |
Please specify which person you're asking about -- the recruit or the recruiter. | ||
| Torquemada (Torquemada)
New member Username: Torquemada Post Number: 40 Registered: 1-2010 |
I'm not sure that I can add much, but as it's been a week since the last question, and Jen's desperate for someone to put this out of its misery... Does the piece of paper the recruit hands over have the digits 1 and 8 written on it? Is another mark mistaken for a 1? Are the figures (whether numbers or resembling numbers) written next to each other? As 18, or 81? Is the recruiter reading it upside down? Does he hand over evidence of his date of birth, which is wrongly understood in some way to specify his current age? Do either the recruit or the recruiter make any comment about the piece of paper? Is the paper an official document? Evidence of the recruit's age? Does the recruiter think it is? Is the size of the paper relevant because the writing needs to be small? Because it's difficult to read? Because it's tatty and torn? Because it's been torn off a larger piece to give a misleading impression? | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 2237 Registered: 5-2003 |
Does the piece of paper the recruit hands over have the digits 1 and 8 written on it? Yes. Is another mark mistaken for a 1? No. Are the figures (whether numbers or resembling numbers) written next to each other? Yes. As 18, This. or 81? Is the recruiter reading it upside down? No. Does he hand over evidence of his date of birth, which is wrongly understood in some way to specify his current age? Do either the recruit or the recruiter make any comment about the piece of paper? Is the paper an official document? Evidence of the recruit's age? Does the recruiter think it is? No to all. Is the size of the paper relevant because the writing needs to be small? Because it's difficult to read? Because it's tatty and torn? Because it's been torn off a larger piece to give a misleading impression? No to all. | ||
| Torquemada (Torquemada)
New member Username: Torquemada Post Number: 45 Registered: 1-2010 |
Recap: So the recruiter asks his age. The recruit answers by showing him a small piece of paper, intending to deceive him. The size is relevant. This piece of paper contains the handwritten number 18, and the recruiter takes this to be the recruit's age. The recruiter doesn't miss anything the recruit says. Is this right? Is it relevant why the recruit hands over a piece of paper, rather than simply saying how old he is? Is he mute? Does he do it to make it easier to deceive the recruiter? Does the piece of paper contain any writing other than "18"? If so, does the recruiter see it? Does the recruit deliberately obscure it? Does the recruiter handle the piece of paper himself? Or does the recruit hold onto it? Is the size important because holding the paper would allow him to obscure a greater proportion of the paper, the smaller the piece? Is the paper something that he was only carrying for this purpose? Would he have been carrying the paper otherwise? Would it have had the same writing on it otherwise? Does the writing, if seen in full, form something that the recruiter would have been likely to want to know about? That he would find useful? | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 2241 Registered: 5-2003 |
Recap: So the recruiter asks his age. Yes. The recruit answers by showing him a small piece of paper, No. intending to deceive him. Yes. The size is relevant. Yes. This piece of paper contains the handwritten number 18, Yes. and the recruiter takes this to be the recruit's age. Yes. The recruiter doesn't miss anything the recruit says. Yes. Is this right? Other than the obvious FA which I have hopefully corrected, yes. Is it relevant why the recruit hands over a piece of paper, He doesn't. rather than simply saying how old he is? He does. Is he mute? No. Does he do it to make it easier to deceive the recruiter? Yesish. Does the piece of paper contain any writing other than "18"? No. If so, does the recruiter see it? No. Does the recruit deliberately obscure it? Yes. Does the recruiter handle the piece of paper himself? No. Or does the recruit hold onto it? Noish. Is the size important because holding the paper would allow him to obscure a greater proportion of the paper, the smaller the piece? Yesish. Is the paper something that he was only carrying for this purpose? Yes. Would he have been carrying the paper otherwise? No. Would it have had the same writing on it otherwise? No. Does the writing, if seen in full, form something that the recruiter would have been likely to want to know about? Possibly. That he would find useful? Possibly. | ||
| Torquemada (Torquemada)
New member Username: Torquemada Post Number: 51 Registered: 1-2010 |
Hm. The FAs (one commented and some others I think from your answers must be lurking) might be the opening I was praying for, or could mean I'm even further from understanding than I thought. I think I need to clarify here... This piece of paper: Was the recruit carrying it? In his pocket? Did he put it back where he was carrying it? Drop it? Throw it away? Destroy it? Was it handwritten by the recruit? Before he came in? Did the recruit take it out? To read it himself? To read it aloud? Did the recruiter see it? Did he see what was written on it? Was the writing "18" and nothing else? Does the recruit obscure part of the "18"? Does the recruit obscure it to give himself an excuse for stating his own age incorrectly? | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 2243 Registered: 5-2003 |
This piece of paper: Was the recruit carrying it? Yes. In his pocket? No. Did he put it back where he was carrying it? He never took it out. Drop it? No. Throw it away? No. Destroy it? No. Was it handwritten by the recruit? Yes. Before he came in? Yes. Did the recruit take it out? No. To read it himself? No. To read it aloud? No. Did the recruiter see it? No. Did he see what was written on it? No. Was the writing "18" and nothing else? Yes. Does the recruit obscure part of the "18"? Yesish. Does the recruit obscure it to give himself an excuse for stating his own age incorrectly? Yes. | ||
| Torquemada (Torquemada)
New member Username: Torquemada Post Number: 54 Registered: 1-2010 |
Was the paper in a bag? Held in his hand? Attached to his clothes? If so, inside? Outside? Does the recruit's excuse involve thinking that the piece of paper said something different? That it referred to something it didn't? Was he honest when he wrote the "18"? Is the exact phrasing of the recruiter's question relevant? Is the exact phrasing of the recruit's answer? Is the recruit's answer something that's literally true, but clearly misleading? Something like (looking at the paper, but pretending it's a birth certificate) "this says 18"? | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 2281 Registered: 5-2003 |
Was the paper in a bag? No. Held in his hand? No. Attached to his clothes? Like, pinned to them? No. If so, inside? This. Outside? Does the recruit's excuse involve thinking that the piece of paper said something different? No. That it referred to something it didn't? No. Was he honest when he wrote the "18"? No. Is the exact phrasing of the recruiter's question relevant? No. Is the exact phrasing of the recruit's answer? Yes. Is the recruit's answer something that's literally true, but clearly misleading? Yes. Something like (looking at the paper, but pretending it's a birth certificate) "this says 18"? No, but you're starting to get the right idea. | ||
| Torquemada (Torquemada)
New member Username: Torquemada Post Number: 68 Registered: 1-2010 |
So the paper was inside his clothes? But not pinned to them and not in a pocket? Sewn into his clothes? Stuffed inside a sock? Shoe? Hat? Is where he was carrying the paper relevant? And he didn't take it out? Or read it? But it was vital to the deception? Did he refer to the paper in his answer, in such a way that it would mislead the recruiter? And the answer relied on some sort of ambiguity or double meaning? Of a word for paper? Small? Of a description of where he was carrying it? | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 2282 Registered: 5-2003 |
So the paper was inside his clothes? Yes. But not pinned to them and not in a pocket? Correct. Sewn into his clothes? No. Stuffed inside a sock? Shoe? Sock or shoe. Hat? No. Is where he was carrying the paper relevant? Yes. And he didn't take it out? Or read it? But it was vital to the deception? Yes to all. Did he refer to the paper in his answer, in such a way that it would mislead the recruiter? Yes. And the answer relied on some sort of ambiguity or double meaning? Yes. Of a word for paper? Small? Neither. Of a description of where he was carrying it? Noish. | ||
| Kalira (Kalira)
New member Username: Kalira Post Number: 308 Registered: 2-2009 |
Does what he say have something to do with how he interacts with the paper in his sock/shoe? Does the ambiguity or double meaning of what he says have something to do with an idiom or a phrasal verb in the English language? Does the idiomatic phrase mean something like "I am 18"? but there's a way to actually make this idiom literally true by doing something with the paper? | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 2283 Registered: 5-2003 |
Does what he say have something to do with how he interacts with the paper in his sock/shoe? Yes. Does the ambiguity or double meaning of what he says have something to do with an idiom or a phrasal verb in the English language? Yes. Does the idiomatic phrase mean something like "I am 18"? Yes. but there's a way to actually make this idiom literally true by doing something with the paper? Yes. | ||
| Kalira (Kalira)
New member Username: Kalira Post Number: 311 Registered: 2-2009 |
Does he make a gesture with his foot before he answers the recruiter's question? Does the paper have to be in his footwear? Could it be in some other part of clothing? or does this phrase require it to be in his shoe/sock to come true literally? | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 2285 Registered: 5-2003 |
Does he make a gesture with his foot before he answers the recruiter's question? No. Does the paper have to be in his footwear? Yes. Could it be in some other part of clothing? No. or does this phrase require it to be in his shoe/sock to come true literally? Yes. | ||
| Torquemada (Torquemada)
New member Username: Torquemada Post Number: 75 Registered: 1-2010 |
Does his misleading statement refer to his shoe? Sock? Foot? Heel? Ankle? Toe? Some other obvious thing at the end of his leg that I haven't thought of? | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 2286 Registered: 5-2003 |
Does his misleading statement refer to his shoe? Sock? Foot? Heel? Ankle? Toe? Some other obvious thing at the end of his leg that I haven't thought of? It doesn't refer to any part of his body. | ||
| Oisin (Oisin)
New member Username: Oisin Post Number: 266 Registered: 12-2008 |
Something like "I'm over 18" because he is standing over the 18 on the paper? | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 2292 Registered: 5-2003 |
Something like "I'm over 18" because he is standing over the 18 on the paper? You got it. Spoiler: ********* During the American Civil War, it's estimated that a third of the Union Army was underage. One (apocryphal) tactic was for underage recruits to write the number "18" on a slip of paper and put it in their shoe. When asked their age, they could respond without lying, "I'm over 18." |
