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Ciaobella (Ciaobella)
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Registered: 8-2011
Posted on Tuesday, August 23, 2011 - 11:58 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

This is my first attempt at posting a puzzle, so I thought I'd go with an example from real life.

The man opened the door. He closed the door. He opened it again, but by then, it was too late. Unfortunately, the good doctor had made a mistake.
Balin (Balin)
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Posted on Wednesday, August 24, 2011 - 12:03 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Welcome to the forum, Ciaobella!

Is the doctor the same person as the first man? Is the doctor H? A? M? (human-adult-male)
Is the door he opened the same as the door he closed? As the one he reopened?
It was too late -- did someone die? Was something lost? Destroyed?
Ciaobella (Ciaobella)
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Posted on Wednesday, August 24, 2011 - 12:18 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Thank you so much! Everyone seems so friendly.

Is the doctor the same person as the first man? no
Is the doctor H? A? M? (human-adult-male) Yes, but gender is really irrel
Is the door he opened the same as the door he closed? As the one he reopened? Yes. It is the same door throughout.
It was too late -- did someone die? no Was something lost? You could say that. In any case, something was "lost" as an indirect consequence. I hope my answer isn't misleading. Destroyed? no
There was a more immediate result. It was not quite so tangible.
Sundowner (Sundowner)
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Posted on Wednesday, August 24, 2011 - 1:36 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did he go through the door?
Look through it?
Let somebody in? let somebody out?
Was it a door to the outside? a door between rooms? a door between a room and a corridor?
Was he inside (the room? the building?) when he opened the door for the first time? for the second time?
Ciaobella (Ciaobella)
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Posted on Wednesday, August 24, 2011 - 2:25 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did he go through the door? During the course of the puzzle, no one entered or left. One could assume that someone might have entered and/or exited following the puzzle.
Look through it? He looked through the open doorway after opening the door. If you're referring to a peephole or some other way of seeing what was on the other side of the door before opening it, then no. Although it might have been helpful...
Let somebody in? let somebody out? No one went in or out during the puzzle (see your first question). I will tell you that he was answering a knock at the door.
Was it a door to the outside? this a door between rooms? a door between a room and a corridor? no to the rest
Was he inside (the room? the building?) when he opened the door for the first time? for the second time? yes to both
Ciaobella (Ciaobella)
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Posted on Wednesday, August 24, 2011 - 2:33 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Questions posed by Mimino on another post I accidentally created.

Is the doctor a medical doctor? He is a consulting psychologist. His primary specialty is administering assessments. Good question.
Is he in any way related to the man? They had met once before.
Does he know the man? did he ever meet him? see above
Does the man have a relevant medical condition? or disease? did he need medication? NO to all- another great question
Is the doctor's mistake related to his profession? did it involve the man? yes to both

You're on the right track!
Ciaobella (Ciaobella)
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Posted on Wednesday, August 24, 2011 - 2:46 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Questions posed by Ostap in yet ANOTHER accidentally created post... I'll get better in time, I hope.

Was the time between the first opening and closing of the door: seconds? minutes? hours? days? more? Door opens. Stays open for perhaps a couple seconds. Door closes. A couple minutes pass by. Door opens again.
The same question for the time between the first closing and the second opening ...? see above
And yes, was it the same door for the first and the second time? yes
Was the man all the time between the first and second opening in the room? To be honest, I'm not sure. For simplicity's sake, let's say yes. It shouldn't make much difference. The only thing that is really relevant is that he did not stray too far from the door.
Balin (Balin)
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Posted on Wednesday, August 24, 2011 - 3:27 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

The thing lost: Sanity? Personality? Something mental? Something intangible?
Ciaobella (Ciaobella)
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Posted on Wednesday, August 24, 2011 - 3:33 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

The thing lost: Sanity? Personality? Something mental? Something intangible?

Perhaps my answer was a bit confusing. The thing "lost" was a particular benefit. I suppose one could consider it tangible or intangible, depending on one's perspective.
Abc (Abc)
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Posted on Wednesday, August 24, 2011 - 9:01 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Everyone seems so friendly

That is an illusion, which I will do my best to shatter. :P

A piece of advice: If more than, say, 15% of your answers contain more than one word (usually "Yes" or "No", occasionally "FA" ("false assumption" as in "have you stopped beating your wife?"), "irrelevant", and "Yesish", "Yope", "Noish" which represent degrees/shades between "Yes" and "No"), then you should perhaps stop and think a bit. We don't mind hard work in order to glean information - that's what lateral puzzling is all about (:

Anyway:

Was it his office door?
A door separating different part of his office premises?
A door at his home?
A door separating inside from outside?
A door separating rooms?
How many persons relevant in this puzzle; 1? 2? 3? More?
Abc (Abc)
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Posted on Wednesday, August 24, 2011 - 9:58 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I took the liberty of deleting the two last instances of your puzzle
Shez (Shez)
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Posted on Wednesday, August 24, 2011 - 11:37 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

had the doctor given the man a clean bill of health?

when the man opened the door, was there someone there? did the man see the person? was it H/A/F?
did the man recognise the person?

did the man forget that he had already opened the door and that's why he opened it again?

did he open the door again for another reason? did he intend to go out?

did anything significant happen between opening the door the first time and closing it again?
Ciaobella (Ciaobella)
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Posted on Wednesday, August 24, 2011 - 6:33 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Abc

Everyone seems so friendly

That is an illusion, which I will do my best to shatter. :P Lateral puzzle people and their illusions...

A piece of advice: If more than, say, 15% of your answers contain more than one word (usually "Yes" or "No", occasionally "FA" ("false assumption" as in "have you stopped beating your wife?"), "irrelevant", and "Yesish", "Yope", "Noish" which represent degrees/shades between "Yes" and "No"), then you should perhaps stop and think a bit. We don't mind hard work in order to glean information - that's what lateral puzzling is all about (: Thank you. I will work on that.

Anyway:

Was it his office door? No
A door separating different part of his office premises? No
A door at his home? Rephrase please
A door separating inside from outside? yes
A door separating rooms? no
How many persons relevant in this puzzle; 1? 2? 3? More? 3, primarily, plus a group of unknown number

Better? :-)


I took the liberty of deleting the two last instances of your puzzle Thank you

Shez

had the doctor given the man a clean bill of health? nope

when the man opened the door, was there someone there? yes did the man see the person? yes was it H/A/F? H/A/M
did the man recognise the person? yes

did the man forget that he had already opened the door and that's why he opened it again? no

did he open the door again for another reason? yope did he intend to go out? no

did anything significant happen between opening the door the first time and closing it again? yes-ish
Balin (Balin)
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Posted on Wednesday, August 24, 2011 - 10:27 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

The person in the room -- the doctor? Another man?
Ciaobella (Ciaobella)
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Posted on Wednesday, August 24, 2011 - 10:58 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

The person in the room -- the doctor? no Another man? The man from the puzzle statement.
Balin (Balin)
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Posted on Wednesday, August 24, 2011 - 11:14 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Ah...was anyone outside the room? The doctor? Another man?
Ciaobella (Ciaobella)
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Posted on Wednesday, August 24, 2011 - 11:19 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Ah...was anyone outside the room? yes The doctor? yes Another man? no
Balin (Balin)
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Posted on Thursday, August 25, 2011 - 12:24 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

If the doctor had been in the room would the thing have been lost?
Ciaobella (Ciaobella)
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Posted on Thursday, August 25, 2011 - 3:21 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

If the doctor had been in the room would the thing have been lost? yes
Yatin509 (Yatin509)
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Posted on Thursday, August 25, 2011 - 8:26 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Hypnosis relevant?
Yatin509 (Yatin509)
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Posted on Thursday, August 25, 2011 - 8:38 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Forget the last question I thought he was a psychiatrist
Sundowner (Sundowner)
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Posted on Thursday, August 25, 2011 - 11:35 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Was the one who knocked at the door the doctor? a friend of the man? a relative? a co-worker? police? postman/delivery man? insurance agent?
Did the man talk to this person? give him something? receive something?
Did the other man (the one who knocked at the door) want to come in? Did the man let him in?
When the man opened the door for the second time: was the man who knocked still there? if not: did the man try to call him back? did he forget something? Did he change his mind with respect to the first opening of the door?
Is the man's profession relevant?
The benefit that went lost: money? a new job? friendship? love? help?
Ciaobella (Ciaobella)
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Posted on Friday, August 26, 2011 - 4:43 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Was the one who knocked at the door the doctor? a friend of the man? no a relative? no a co-worker? no police? no postman/delivery man? no insurance agent? noish
Did the man talk to this person? yes give him something? no receive something? not during the time of the puzzle statement
Did the other man (the one who knocked at the door) want to come in? I think that was his expectation Did the man let him in? when?
When the man opened the door for the second time: was the man who knocked still there? yes if not: did the man try to call him back?did he forget something? Did he change his mind with respect to the first opening of the door?
Is the man's profession relevant? please rephrase- I cannot answer as it is
The benefit that went lost: money? this was part of it a new job? not friendship? no love? no help? This was essentially the rest of the benefit. It will become clearer as more of the puzzle is revealed.
Shez (Shez)
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Posted on Friday, August 26, 2011 - 8:52 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

had the visitor come to help the man?

did the man want help?

did the man fetch something between closing the door and opening it the 2nd time? did he talk to someone else? did he think and make a decision?
Ciaobella (Ciaobella)
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Posted on Saturday, August 27, 2011 - 12:41 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

had the visitor come to help the man? no

did the man want help? Did you mean the help provided by the benefit? Possibly.

did the man fetch something between closing the door and opening it the 2nd time? yes did he talk to someone else? irrel did he think and make a decision? He made the decision to fetch the object. Other than this, I'm not sure.
Balin (Balin)
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Posted on Sunday, August 28, 2011 - 2:41 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

The something fetched -- does that object relate to medicine?
Ciaobella (Ciaobella)
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Posted on Sunday, August 28, 2011 - 3:18 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

The something fetched -- does that object relate to medicine? If you're referring to the field of medicine (not just pills and such) then yes
Sundowner (Sundowner)
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Posted on Tuesday, August 30, 2011 - 1:08 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did I get it right: The man opened the door in response to a knock? A man was waiting outside? he did not let him in and closed the door? after a few seconds he opened the door again? the man was still there? he let him in?

Is the object he fetched before he opened the door the second time a medical advise? a prescription? a medical certificate?
Did he close the door to fetch this object and return to the man?

Did the man inside and the man at the door know each other? did they meet before?

Did the doctor ever see that man?
Did he give a diagnosis for the man? a medical certificate? if so: a correct one? a wrong one?
if a wrong one: on purpose?

Is the man indeed ill? does he need some evidence for his illness? is an insurance fraud going on?
Ciaobella (Ciaobella)
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Posted on Tuesday, August 30, 2011 - 5:32 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

BLOOPER ALERT

Sundowner had asked, "Was the one who knocked at the door the doctor?" I thought I had answered "yes" but looking back, I didn't answer at all! Sorry about that! Yes, it was the doctor.
Ciaobella (Ciaobella)
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Posted on Tuesday, August 30, 2011 - 5:42 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did I get it right: The man opened the door in response to a knock? yes A man was waiting outside? Yes, the doctor he did not let him in and closed the door? Correct after a few seconds he opened the door again? Correct again the man was still there? yes he let him in? Probably, but irrelevant

Is the object he fetched before he opened the door the second time a medical advise? no a prescription? no a medical certificate? no, OTWT
Did he close the door to fetch this object and return to the man? yes

Did the man inside and the man at the door know each other? yes... did they meet before? ...once before, yes

Did the doctor ever see that man? Yes, once
Did he give a diagnosis for the man? yes a medical certificate? Meaning a license to practice? no if so: a correct one? I'm going to assume you meant a correct diagnosis- no a wrong one? so, yes
if a wrong one: on purpose? no

Is the man indeed ill? no does he need some evidence for his illness? but yes is an insurance fraud going on? YES

You are very close! It simply needs to be pieced together with a couple details.

I ask because of my inexperience- how do I know when to post a recap or $poiler?
Galfisk (Galfisk)
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Posted on Tuesday, August 30, 2011 - 6:37 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did the doctor realize he'd made a mistake? Had the man been faking an illness?
Is this scenario correct: the man wants to commit insurance fraud. He goes to the doctor saying he is sick or hurt (let's say he hurt his leg). The doctor makes a diagnosis, which he wants to take to the insurance company to get a payout.
The the doctor comes to visit the man, the man (whose legs are fine) runs to open the door, sees the doctor, slams the door, gets his crutches and open the door again acting crippled. But by then the doctor realized he was faking.
Something like this?
Galfisk (Galfisk)
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Posted on Tuesday, August 30, 2011 - 6:39 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

You post a recap if someone asks for it, or if you feel like it. I sometimes post recaps when people start asking stuff that has already been answered, or the puzzle is going slowly.
You post a $p0iler when you consider your puzzle solved.
Ciaobella (Ciaobella)
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Posted on Tuesday, August 30, 2011 - 10:50 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did the doctor realize he'd made a mistake? yes Had the man been faking an illness? yes
Is this scenario correct: the man wants to commit insurance fraud. He goes to the doctor saying he is sick or hurt (let's say he hurt his leg). The doctor makes a diagnosis, which he wants to take to the insurance company to get a payout.
The the doctor comes to visit the man, the man (whose legs are fine) runs to open the door, sees the doctor, slams the door, gets his crutches and open the door again acting crippled. But by then the doctor realized he was faking.
Something like this? Close enough

**********SPOILER**********
One of my professors is a consulting psychologist for several businesses in town. A company that provides a number of services for people with long-term disabilities (including filing for monetary disability benefits, in-home services like housework, etc.) called him in one day to evaluate a potential client. The man's family had brought him in. He was in a wheelchair and seemed barely aware of his surroundings. He was drooling and had a messy appearance. The family stated that he had had some sort of mental decline, and the psychologist administered his evaluation (which included questions meant to identify fraudulent claims). However, this man's case seemed genuine, and the doctor gave a diagnosis. Later the company called the doctor back. They said that this particular man had been reported anonymously by someone who had seen him shopping, buying fast food, and participating in other activities. They asked him to pay the man a surprise visit and re-evaluate his condition. When the doctor knocked on the door, the man answered (standing up, healthy appearance, and hearty "hello"). When the man recognized the doctor, he slammed the door shut. A minute later, he was at the door again, this time in a wheelchair with messy hair and drooling again. But it was too late. The good doctor realized his mistake.

I was amused by this story, and I hope the rest of you were, too. I laughed aloud when my professor exclaimed, "He didn't even change his clothes!"

Thanks to all who participated and helped me through my first puzzle!
Shez (Shez)
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Posted on Tuesday, August 30, 2011 - 12:12 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

tee hee!
Balin (Balin)
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Posted on Tuesday, August 30, 2011 - 1:16 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Nice, and clever doctor!
Solitiare (Solitiare)
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Posted on Tuesday, August 30, 2011 - 2:11 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Good start!
Ciaobella (Ciaobella)
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Posted on Wednesday, August 31, 2011 - 4:16 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Thank you very much.
Doriana (Doriana)
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Posted on Thursday, September 01, 2011 - 12:37 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Very nice puzzle - sorry I missed it

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