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Tsoram1970 (Tsoram1970)
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Post Number: 531
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Posted on Wednesday, September 19, 2007 - 4:28 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Even though he couldn't win this time, more people supported him than had when he had won the last time. 2 years later his victory was recognised and completed.
Tobasi (Tobasi)
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Posted on Wednesday, September 19, 2007 - 4:45 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is the puzzle about sports? a game? a lawsuit?
Is he human? male? adult?
Did he do this as a part of a job? a leisure activity?
How many other persons are relevant: 0? 1? ...?
Sixtyeight (Sixtyeight)
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Post Number: 595
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Posted on Wednesday, September 19, 2007 - 5:09 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

just to clarify.. can I rewrite the sequence this way?..

1 he won
2 more people supported him / he did not win
3 2 years pass, his victory was completed
4 his victory was recognized

do parts 3 and 4 refer to his latest victory?
was the victory completed after the relevant 2 year period?
did he attempt the achievement yearly?
would he attempt again after the above sequence?
does he achieve this alone?
is a political race relevant?
time period relevant?
is any job relevant?
did he compete with other people for the victory?
location relevant?
Tsoram1970 (Tsoram1970)
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Post Number: 534
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Posted on Thursday, September 20, 2007 - 11:07 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Tobasi:

Is the puzzle about sports?No a game?No a lawsuit?No, but be careful
Is he human?Yes male?Yes adult?Yes
Did he do this as a part of a job?Yes a leisure activity?No
How many other persons are relevant: 0? 1? ...?1 closely relevant, many others indrectly so

Sixtyeight:
just to clarify.. can I rewrite the sequence this way?..

1 he won yes
2 more people supported him / he did not win Yope
3 2 years pass, his victory was completedYes
4 his victory was recognized yes

do parts 3 and 4 refer to his latest victory?Yessish
was the victory completed after the relevant 2 year period? yes
did he attempt the achievement yearly?No
would he attempt again after the above sequence?Yes
does he achieve this alone?no, he has a team of helpers
is a political race relevant? Yes!... now this might go fast!
time period relevant?Yes
is any job relevant? Yes
did he compete with other people for the victory? Yes
location relevant?Yes
~damia~ (~damia~)
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Post Number: 946
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Posted on Thursday, September 20, 2007 - 12:03 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

is the relevant job a politian? or are there more relevant jobs?

was he previously elected? but lost this time? did he win last time because people didn't want his opposition to win? as opposed to actively supporting him?

was he re-elected 2 years later?
Tobasi (Tobasi)
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Post Number: 690
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Posted on Thursday, September 20, 2007 - 12:12 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is the puzzle taken: from the press? a book/film etc.? your own imagination?
Is the location to be found out a country? a town?
Is any political party relevant?
Is the second main person a colleague? an adversary? a friend? a family member? of the man?
Tsoram1970 (Tsoram1970)
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Post Number: 537
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Posted on Thursday, September 20, 2007 - 1:29 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

~Damia~:
is the relevant job a politian?a little more precise, but yes or are there more relevant jobs? Just a bit more precise than politician

was he previously elected?Yes but lost this time?No...almost a yope did he win last time because people didn't want his opposition to win?No as opposed to actively supporting him? No

was he re-elected 2 years later?Yes...but there's more

Tobasi:

Is the puzzle taken: from the press?Yessish...not recent a book/film etc.?Yessish... books have been written that talk about this your own imagination?Sorry no
Is the location to be found out a country?yes a town?Town not particularly relevant, country is
Is any political party relevant?Poltical party might help... but not essential
Is the second main person a colleague?no an adversary?Yes a friend?No a family member?Yes of the man?
~damia~ (~damia~)
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Post Number: 949
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Posted on Thursday, September 20, 2007 - 2:14 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

confused.. so he did win this time? he won last time, this time and in 2 years time? did he win the vote, but lost some other way? morally?

his adversary is a family member? is the person male? brother/sister? aunt/uncle? daughter/son? nephew/niece? cousin?
Tsoram1970 (Tsoram1970)
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Posted on Thursday, September 20, 2007 - 3:02 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

confused.. so he did win this time?yope he won last time, this time and in 2 years time?Yes, Yope and Yes did he win the vote, but lost some other way?Yes! morally?No, he won morally!

his adversary is a family member?apologies my error... I meant to say yes to of the man and no to family member... is the person male?Yes brother/sister? aunt/uncle? daughter/son?nephew/niece? cousin?No to all

BLOOOPER ALERT!..........
answer to is the second main person a family member? should be NO!
~damia~ (~damia~)
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Post Number: 952
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Posted on Thursday, September 20, 2007 - 3:11 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

did he lose financially? did he lose some supporters? whilst he gained new ones?

is the country in europe? america?
Tsoram1970 (Tsoram1970)
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Posted on Thursday, September 20, 2007 - 3:18 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

~Damia~:

did he lose financially?probably... but that is relevant here did he lose some supporters?no, more people supported him the second time whilst he gained new ones? He did

is the country in europe?Yes america?No
Bentarm (Bentarm)
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Post Number: 1101
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Posted on Friday, September 21, 2007 - 11:32 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is the country in the EU? britain? Ireland? Northern Ireland? France?
Was he standing to be a member of parliament? president? Prime minister? First minister? Mayor?
Is the voting system relevant? PR? "first past the post"? some sort of bizarre system like the one the Yanks have for electing their president?
Tsoram1970 (Tsoram1970)
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Post Number: 561
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Posted on Friday, September 21, 2007 - 11:59 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Bentarm:

Is the country in the EU?Yes britain?yes Ireland?No Northern Ireland?No France?No
Was he standing to be a member of parliament?Yes! president? Prime minister? First minister? Mayor? No to rest
Is the voting system relevant?Nopish PR? "first past the post"?This one but... some sort of bizarre system like the one the Yanks have for electing their president?nope
Wildcard (Wildcard)
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Post Number: 530
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Posted on Friday, September 21, 2007 - 5:58 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Are all his wins and victories related to the same specific political office/position?
Or did he win a particular office in the past and then a difference office later?
Tsoram1970 (Tsoram1970)
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Posted on Friday, September 21, 2007 - 6:29 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Wildcard:

Are all his wins and victories related to the same specific political office/position?Yes
Or did he win a particular office in the past and then a difference office later?No
Wildcard (Wildcard)
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Post Number: 533
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Posted on Friday, September 21, 2007 - 6:45 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did he change political parties at any time during these events? Relevant?
When his victory was recognized, was a mistake corrected? Was he put in office? Was someone else removed?
His victory was not recognized for two years, anyone upset about that? Anyone accused of a crime here? If his victory was recognized immediately instead of two years down the road, wouold he have been in office for those two years?
Bentarm (Bentarm)
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Post Number: 1103
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Posted on Friday, September 21, 2007 - 6:48 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Was either of the victories in a by-election? In a general election?
Did he ever take a seat in parliament? After the first victory? when he couldn't win? two years later?
Would it help to find out exactly when this happened? past decade? 80s? 70s? 60s? 50s? 40s? 30s? 20s?
Are any peerages relevant?
Bentarm (Bentarm)
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Post Number: 1104
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Posted on Friday, September 21, 2007 - 6:48 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Was he for some reason not eligible to be a member of parliament any of the times?
Tsoram1970 (Tsoram1970)
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Post Number: 591
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Posted on Friday, September 21, 2007 - 7:09 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Wildcard:

Did he change political parties at any time during these events?No Relevant?No
When his victory was recognized, was a mistake corrected?Not a mistake as such Was he put in office?Yessish Was someone else removed?Yope
His victory was not recognized for two years, anyone upset about that?He was Anyone accused of a crime here?No If his victory was recognized immediately instead of two years down the road, wouold he have been in office for those two years?having said crime is not involved the law of the land is. And did stop him

Bentarm:

Was either of the victories in a by-election?Yes In a general election?yes
Did he ever take a seat in parliament?Yes After the first victory?Yes when he couldn't win?No two years later?Yes
Would it help to find out exactly when this happened? past decade? 80s? 70s? 60s?This one 50s?First win in this one 40s? 30s? 20s?
Are any peerages relevant?Yes

Was he for some reason not eligible to be a member of parliament any of the times?Yes - I sense you might know the answer to this one...
Wildcard (Wildcard)
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Post Number: 535
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Posted on Friday, September 21, 2007 - 7:35 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I'm not very familiar with the eligibility requirements for election. However...
Was the place that he represented somehow hot eligible to have a representative in parliment for some reason?
Population too small?
Some political reason?
Tsoram1970 (Tsoram1970)
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Post Number: 596
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Posted on Friday, September 21, 2007 - 8:04 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Wildcard:

I'm not very familiar with the eligibility requirements for election. However...
Was the place that he represented somehow hot eligible to have a representative in parliment for some reason?No, it was
Population too small? No
Some political reason?kind of... bentarm's questions are all leading in exactly the right direction... too much so for co-incidence...
Wildcard (Wildcard)
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Post Number: 539
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Posted on Friday, September 21, 2007 - 11:41 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

What our chap not a citizen of the proper country for a time?
Tsoram1970 (Tsoram1970)
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Posted on Friday, September 21, 2007 - 11:47 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Wildcard:

What our chap not a citizen of the proper country for a time?not precisely- if you don't know our system it might behove you to check out some of the leads that Bentarm has given you...although there is always the chance that in doing so you will discover the source of the puzzle!
Bentarm (Bentarm)
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Post Number: 1105
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Posted on Saturday, September 22, 2007 - 5:04 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I don't know any details of the story - just that peers can't be elected to the Commons, and that there was some case around that time in which this was relevant (I'm fairly sure it was Tony Benn, but I'm resisting the urge to Google...)

I'm guessing the story must have been roughly: he won the election; his father died, so he became a peer and no longer eligible to sit in the Commons; two years later he had renounced his peerage, and got elected again.

Is any of this right? Anything important missing?
Tsoram1970 (Tsoram1970)
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Posted on Saturday, September 22, 2007 - 5:28 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Bentarm:

I don't know any details of the story - just that peers can't be elected to the Commons, and that there was some case around that time in which this was relevant (I'm fairly sure it was Tony Benn, but I'm resisting the urge to Google...)

I'm guessing the story must have been roughly: he won the election; his father died, so he became a peer and no longer eligible to sit in the Commons; two years later he had renounced his peerage, and got elected again.

Is any of this right? Anything important missing?

You've got most of the story... but if you count the elections you missed out one... Oh and it was Tony Benn
Bentarm (Bentarm)
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Post Number: 1106
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Posted on Saturday, September 22, 2007 - 5:31 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

ok, so there are three elections... two general elections and a by-election? two by-elections and a general election? Is the order GBG? GGB? BGG? BBG? BGB? GBB?
So he won the first election, and became a member of the commons?
There was a second election, which he also won, but couldn't become a member of the Commons - because his father died after the result was declared so he was no longer eligible?
And then he won a third election, and did become a member of the Commons - this time because he was no longer a peer?
Tsoram1970 (Tsoram1970)
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Posted on Saturday, September 22, 2007 - 5:53 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Not quite...but you have so many of the details I'll....


**************Spoiler************

Tony Benn, a Labour MP, was the son of Viscount Stansgate, a member of the House Of Lords. In the general election of 1959 Tony was re-elected as the sitting MP (election 1 in the puzzle). On the death of his father in 1961, he inherited his father's title and became a member of the House Of Lords. As a matter of principle he refused to take his seat there. However as a Lord he was no longer eligible to be an MP, and his seat was declared vacant. He fought the ensuing By-Election (2) and won, on an increased share of the vote. However an electoral court decided that his candititure was null and void and awarded the election to the Conservative candidate, St Clair, who had won the next highest amount of votes. This by election and the aftermath led to the passing of an act of Parliament that allowed Lords to renounce their titles.

When this Act was passed in 1963 Tony Benn was the first Lord to renounce his title. St Clair, recognising that he had not really won the by-election, stepped aside, and another by-election (3)was held. Tony Benn once more took his seat as an MP.

Well done to all for working this out, especially Wildcard and ~Damia~ for struggling without knowledge of our system, and also of course to Bentarm for completing the circle!

BTW for those who didn't realise the title is a corruption of a quotation form one of our former Prime Ministers "A week is a long time in Politics"
Tsoram1970 (Tsoram1970)
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Post Number: 628
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Posted on Saturday, September 22, 2007 - 6:05 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Also the passing of the peerages act allowed one of our less effective PM's (Sir Alec Douglas Home, previously 14th Earl of Home) to take office. The political history of these islands might have been very different if Rab Butler the then Deputy Prime Minister had taken over...

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