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Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Post Number: 32
Registered: 5-2008
Posted on Saturday, May 31, 2008 - 5:01 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

You've no idea where you are or how you got here. You can't see anything, you can't hear anything, you can't feel anything, and you're paralysed from the neck down.
Travis (Travis)
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Post Number: 65
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Posted on Saturday, May 31, 2008 - 7:28 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Well... this is a lovely predicament. Is it too dark to look around? Try doing so. Try to determine why you're paralyzed. Are you tied down or is it because you're drugged, or neither? Are you sitting or standing?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Post Number: 34
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Posted on Saturday, May 31, 2008 - 8:24 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Well... this is a lovely predicament. Is it too dark to look around? yes Try doing so. you can move all the muscles around your eyes, but there's nothing here to see... Try to determine why you're paralyzed. Are you tied down or is it because you're drugged, or neither? Can't tell but you don't remember being drugged and you can't feel a thing - it is as if you're floating in space Are you sitting or standing? can't tell this either! Somehow you've lost your sense of proprioception below the neck! You're starting to feel like a disembodied head...
Travis (Travis)
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Post Number: 66
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Posted on Sunday, June 01, 2008 - 6:07 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Can you speak? Try calling out and see if anyone answers. Pay attention to any echoes that may give you an idea of your surroundings.
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Post Number: 46
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Posted on Sunday, June 01, 2008 - 1:58 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Can you speak? yes Try calling out and see if anyone answers. no one answers Pay attention to any echoes that may give you an idea of your surroundings. there was no echo.

You start to wonder if you'll ever get out of this. You can't be stuck here forever can you? If there's anything you can do to get yourself out of this it shouldn't take you too long to discover it - there's only so much you can do...

...during the course of your thoughts you get a sudden flash of your senses. For a very short moment you're aware of yourself, your whole body, floating in a liquid of some sort but it goes as quickly as it came. You regret not taking the chance to flex your fingers whilst you could, just to feel them move, to feel alive.
Unleashedllama (Unleashedllama)
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Post Number: 20
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Posted on Monday, June 02, 2008 - 9:24 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Could you tell what the liquid feels like? Was it hot? cold? Sticky?

Can you tell if your head is submerged?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Post Number: 49
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Posted on Monday, June 02, 2008 - 12:57 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Could you tell what the liquid feels like? Was it hot? cold? Sticky? It was room temperature, didn't smell of anything. You never tried to move in it but didn't feel like you were sinking... it had all happened so quick, couldn't really tell much.

Can you tell if your head is submerged? Head WAS submerged with the rest of the body in that split-second but the rest of the time you can't feel it, also you can breathe... you decide your head's not submerged right now.
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Post Number: 54
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Posted on Monday, June 02, 2008 - 1:33 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

It happened again! You still haven't learnt anything new however; it came and went as fast as it had last time.

note/hint: this is not happening in real-time, if it were it would have happened a lot more frequently than this...
Unleashedllama (Unleashedllama)
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Post Number: 24
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Posted on Monday, June 02, 2008 - 2:14 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Can you remember anything that may be relevant?

Is it possible you can be in a coma? Being ressusitated?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Post Number: 56
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Posted on Monday, June 02, 2008 - 2:22 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Can you remember anything that may be relevant? nothing memorable is relevant

Is it possible you can be in a coma? it is possible... Being ressusitated? the moments feel far to brief to be that... It feels like it's something you're doing that's causing the change - if only you can work out what it is!

This is infuriating - you're sure that you're controlling it but you don't know how.
Unleashedllama (Unleashedllama)
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Posted on Monday, June 02, 2008 - 3:10 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

What have been doing / thinking just as the liquid feeling has been coming, if you know?

Next time it happens, can you quickly try to move?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Post Number: 60
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Posted on Monday, June 02, 2008 - 3:36 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

What have been doing / thinking just as the liquid feeling has been coming, if you know? haven't really been thinking much... trying to come up with ways to get out of this mostly. You keep thinking about a room. You weren't thinking about the same thing both times, you know that... you don't know what you were doing... but then there's only so many things a disembodied head can do...

Next time it happens, can you quickly try to move? Will try...

...oh! It happened then! Damn wasn't expecting it... Will have to get it next time.

It happened again! Your arm moves... then it's gone again. You still don't know what's causing it but you do know a bit more about the liquid now. It's relatively easy to move through but if you're not moving you don't sink. Also you had your mouth open when it happened this time... no taste but you spit it out anyway; you were trying to take a breath at the time.
Unleashedllama (Unleashedllama)
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Post Number: 30
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Posted on Monday, June 02, 2008 - 4:12 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

About the liquid you spat out: what was its consistancy like? Were there any solid lumps in it? Anything else to say about it?

By 'no taste' was it like water or literally nothing at all?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Post Number: 61
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Posted on Monday, June 02, 2008 - 4:28 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

About the liquid you spat out: what was its consistancy like? Were there any solid lumps in it? Anything else to say about it? no lumps. Nothing else to say, quite nondescript really.

By 'no taste' was it like water or literally nothing at all? nothing at all
Unleashedllama (Unleashedllama)
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Post Number: 31
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Posted on Monday, June 02, 2008 - 4:30 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Are you human?

Could you be in an egg?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Post Number: 62
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Posted on Monday, June 02, 2008 - 4:30 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

hint: concentrate on the first hint (:
Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
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Posted on Monday, June 02, 2008 - 5:16 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Are we in a sensory-deprivation canister?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Post Number: 63
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Posted on Monday, June 02, 2008 - 5:33 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Are you human? fairly sure ;)

Could you be in an egg? lol, no

Are we in a sensory-deprivation canister? no
Unleashedllama (Unleashedllama)
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Post Number: 39
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Posted on Tuesday, June 03, 2008 - 3:42 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

note/hint: this is not happening in real-time, if it were it would have happened a lot more frequently than this...

So, is it happening each time you breathe? each time you blink?

Try closing your eyes completely, anything happen?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Tuesday, June 03, 2008 - 7:18 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

So, is it happening each time you breathe? You take another breath... no each time you blink? You blink... there it was again! You make a note however to hold your breath next time.

Try closing your eyes completely, anything happen? The liquid surrounds you. You experiment moving through it. You can swim in any direction you like but you still can't see anything. There's no sensation of weight which suggests there's no 'up' as such - everything's relative to you... nevertheless you decide to take a couple of strokes 'upwards' before you need to take another breath.
You open your eyes and breathe... and then you begin to wonder whether or not the hazy grey you'd just seen where your arms should be was real or not.
Unleashedllama (Unleashedllama)
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Posted on Wednesday, June 04, 2008 - 8:46 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Could you please close your eyes again and then put your hands in front of your eyes before opening them again. What do you see?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Wednesday, June 04, 2008 - 1:44 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Could you please close your eyes again and then put your hands in front of your eyes before opening them again. What do you see? There is definately a hazy grey where your hands (and arms) should be, but no real definition of shape to it. You're glad you see your body again but your not quite sure you like seeing it in this state.

The haziness makes you feel dizzy, or maybe its just that you haven't taken a breath in a while now. You open your eyes again.
Unleashedllama (Unleashedllama)
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Posted on Wednesday, June 04, 2008 - 1:56 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

As you became able to see more following your swim in an 'upwards' direction, you could try this again and see if things get any clearer.

If there's no joy, try wafting your hands in front of your tummy. Any cord there? I've got to rule this out!
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Wednesday, June 04, 2008 - 2:14 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

As you became able to see more following your swim in an 'upwards' direction, you could try this again and see if things get any clearer. You swim upwards further, just another few strokes, the same distance as before. Your arms are still grey and hazy but they have become brighter. They're a little bit more comfortable to look at.

If there's no joy, try wafting your hands in front of your tummy. Any cord there? No cord (: I've got to rule this out!
Unleashedllama (Unleashedllama)
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Posted on Wednesday, June 04, 2008 - 2:24 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

If you look 'up' now can you see the surface at all? Is there any light coming 'down'?

Other than being able to see a bit more, has anything changed from your original situation?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Wednesday, June 04, 2008 - 2:57 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

If you look 'up' now can you see the surface at all? Is there any light coming 'down'? This is odd. In every direction you look it's still all black... you can't see a light source anywhere.

Other than being able to see a bit more, has anything changed from your original situation? No, nothing else has changed. The only difference is that you can now see yourself; everything around you is still the same.
Unleashedllama (Unleashedllama)
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Posted on Wednesday, June 04, 2008 - 3:50 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Try closing just one eye...

Try closing your eyes and then pinching yourself (surely it won't be a dream, but I feel I'm running out of ideas a bit...
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Wednesday, June 04, 2008 - 4:42 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Try closing just one eye... Closing just one eye has no effect.

Try closing your eyes and then pinching yourself (surely it won't be a dream, but I feel I'm running out of ideas a bit... ow.

You're actually doing very well. You've learnt how to switch between the two states (one where you can breath, the other where you can move) and how to make yourself more visible.
Travis (Travis)
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Posted on Wednesday, June 04, 2008 - 11:10 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Does the degree to which you close your eyes (just barely vs. very tightly) affect your ability to see yourself (i.e., can you "see" sharper when you scrunch your eyes up?)
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Thursday, June 05, 2008 - 12:43 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Does the degree to which you close your eyes (just barely vs. very tightly) affect your ability to see yourself (i.e., can you "see" sharper when you scrunch your eyes up?) You try this... no, no difference.

good question though
Unleashedllama (Unleashedllama)
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Posted on Friday, June 06, 2008 - 8:29 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Could you try swimming up again please, so you can see yourself more clearly? Have a good look at your body. Other than being a bit hazy, anything else relevant?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Friday, June 06, 2008 - 3:06 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Could you try swimming up again please, so you can see yourself more clearly? You swim up another few strokes, as you suspected it has got brighter still. Have a good look at your body. Other than being a bit hazy, anything else relevant? The haziness makes it hard to look at but you study it all nevertheless, until looking at it starts to make you feel sick. You open your eyes and take a few breathes: it takes a while to shake the feeling. Then you think over what you've seen.
The first thing you noted was that there is actually more than one shade of grey, your body is more in 'greyscale', however the haziness makes them appear as if they're swirling into each other so you forgive yourself for not noticing it before. Also you observed that for all its apparent swirling the grey stays within the sharp crisp outline of your body.
You try again, repeating these efforts and breaks until you finally concede there's nothing more you can learn than what you've already noted.
Unleashedllama (Unleashedllama)
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Posted on Friday, June 06, 2008 - 3:32 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

This feels like some kind of progress...

Do you think you could be in hospital?

It's all sounding a little ultra-sound like, or like a liquid crystal dislay. Do you think this could be important?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Friday, June 06, 2008 - 4:12 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

This feels like some kind of progress...

Do you think you could be in hospital? You have no idea where you are, neither do you think it will help you to know.

It's all sounding a little ultra-sound like, or like a liquid crystal dislay. Do you think this could be important? Trying to work out how you could possibly be experiencing this in relation to those things and then again how that relates to you in your current state and what it implies about the degree of control you have over the situation is giving you a headache. You decide that you could float here and muse over these things all day and not get anywhere - there simply aren't enough clues. A better course of action would be to make do with the reality you've been given and exhaust all physical possibilities in this state first.
Unleashedllama (Unleashedllama)
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Posted on Saturday, June 07, 2008 - 3:02 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

If you touch your own body do you feel as you normally would?

Try swimming to one side (call it 'North' perhaps for ease) to see if there's anything to discover there.
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Saturday, June 07, 2008 - 10:01 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

If you touch your own body do you feel as you normally would? yes

Try swimming to one side (call it 'North' perhaps for ease) to see if there's anything to discover there. North suggest a compass direction, lets use 'forward' as that is relative to your position.
You swim forward and examine your arms again. Their still hazy but you shake the ill feeling it gives you and study them anyway. You think you see some colour there... You peer closer still to be sure and are relieved to discover you weren't just seeing things; you're no longer in greyscale! However the colours are very dull.

You begin to wonder whether or not it is really your swimming around that's causing this or if you're visibility is just naturally progressing with time...
Travis (Travis)
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Posted on Sunday, June 08, 2008 - 12:49 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Well, how about we just kick back for a little while and wait? If that doesn't help, keep swimming forward and see what happens.
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Sunday, June 08, 2008 - 2:59 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Well, how about we just kick back for a little while and wait? You wait... and wait... finally you get bored of waiting. Nothing has changed. If that doesn't help, keep swimming forward and see what happens. You take another few strokes forward and check again. You're now in full colour! However, this somehow makes the haziness of your appearence more stomach turning. You can barely look at yourself, it's making you feel ill.
Unleashedllama (Unleashedllama)
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Posted on Sunday, June 08, 2008 - 3:18 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

So would you say it seems that moving up and down controls the contrast and moving forwards and backwards controls the colour/brightness?

Perhaps you could try swimming right.
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Sunday, June 08, 2008 - 7:19 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

So would you say it seems that moving up and down controls the contrast and moving forwards and backwards controls the colour/brightness? Hmm, it does appear as if that's what's going on...

Perhaps you could try swimming right. You swim right, and check your state... nothing appears to have changed... :S

You open your eyes again to recover from the ill feeling the haziness gives you. It didn't seem to be any different this time however the ill feeling is lingering longer... but this could be due to the fact that you haven't really been giving yourself enough time to recover from each episode before you're checking your state again.
Unleashedllama (Unleashedllama)
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Posted on Sunday, June 08, 2008 - 7:36 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Relax for a while, allow time for some recovery.

Following your rest, have the ill feelings faded? Has anything about your body changed or has anything in your surroundings changed?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Sunday, June 08, 2008 - 7:50 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Relax for a while, allow time for some recovery.

Following your rest, have the ill feelings faded? Yes, it has all faded now. Has anything about your body changed or has anything in your surroundings changed? No, everything's still the same as far as you can tell.
Unleashedllama (Unleashedllama)
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Posted on Sunday, June 08, 2008 - 8:07 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

It's not easy trying to 'fine tune' a human being you can't see you know...

Maybe try swimming left now, but you'll obviously have to go a bit further this time to allow for the movement to the right you've previously made.

Anything to report?

By the way, does the liquid still feel the same? Is it still tasteless?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Sunday, June 08, 2008 - 9:00 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

It's not easy trying to 'fine tune' a human being you can't see you know... (:

Maybe try swimming left now, but you'll obviously have to go a bit further this time to allow for the movement to the right you've previously made. Good thinking (:
You swim a few strokes back left, and a few strokes again.


Anything to report? The haziness of your appearance has disappeared slightly...

By the way, does the liquid still feel the same? Is it still tasteless? The liquid feels and tastes as normal.
Unleashedllama (Unleashedllama)
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Posted on Sunday, June 08, 2008 - 9:09 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Have another little rest if you like, then continue left if possible to see if things continue to get less hazy.

When you look at yourself now, how 'normal' do you look? Anything need a bit more 'adjusting'?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Sunday, June 08, 2008 - 9:27 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Have another little rest if you like, then continue left if possible to see if things continue to get less hazy.

When you look at yourself now, how 'normal' do you look? The haziness fades even more. The swirling has stopped, you're just a bit blurry. Anything need a bit more 'adjusting'? You feel you have managed to get the brightness and colour levels perfect.
Unleashedllama (Unleashedllama)
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Posted on Sunday, June 08, 2008 - 9:36 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Could you try turning slowly around on the spot please? Anything change?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Sunday, June 08, 2008 - 10:15 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Could you try turning slowly around on the spot please? You try this Anything change? no effect
Travis (Travis)
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Posted on Sunday, June 08, 2008 - 11:34 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Now that we've got the color and sharpness correct, try swimming "up". If that doesn't work, go "down".
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Monday, June 09, 2008 - 12:30 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Now that we've got the color and sharpness correct, try swimming "up". If that doesn't work, go "down". It's brightness and colour that are correct, sharpness is the one which is out...

swimming up decreases the brightness. It appears that it's at its brightest on the level you were at and darkens as you move away from that level, in either direction... You swim back down.
Unleashedllama (Unleashedllama)
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Posted on Tuesday, June 10, 2008 - 9:24 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Try swimming left again until the sharpness is sorted.

Stop for a rest.

Now could you have a really good look at yourself and all around you. Any clues?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Tuesday, June 10, 2008 - 2:57 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Try swimming left again until the sharpness is sorted. You swim just a few more strokes left, they were all you needed - your sharpness, colour, and brightness are all correct.

Stop for a rest. You open your eyes to breathe again. However this time you open them to find yourself standing in a room. When you close your eyes now the liquid is gone and all you see is the darkness.

Now could you have a really good look at yourself and all around you. Any clues? With open eyes you examine your new surroundings. The room is fairly austere - it is lit by a candle on the wall behind you and adorned with a painting of a key on the wall to your left and a painting of a lock on the wall to your right. The wall ahead of you is bare.
Unleashedllama (Unleashedllama)
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Posted on Tuesday, June 10, 2008 - 3:04 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

The paintings: are they Murials? in frames? Can you walk up to them? If they're in frames, anything hidden under them on top of the frames etc?

If it's too dark, is the candle in a holder that can be picked up and carried with you?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Post Number: 103
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Posted on Tuesday, June 10, 2008 - 7:52 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

The paintings: are they Murials? murals*? yes in frames? Can you walk up to them? yes If they're in frames, anything hidden under them on top of the frames etc?

If it's too dark, is the candle in a holder that can be picked up and carried with you? It's not too dark but the candle is in a holder that can be picked up...
Unleashedllama (Unleashedllama)
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Posted on Wednesday, June 11, 2008 - 11:54 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Pick up the candle and take it with you.

Are the walls made of brick? If so, try pushing the bricks the key are painted on, then walk across the room and try pushing the bricks in the centre of the lock painting.

If there's been no joy, stucy the candle holder, any inscriptions? Anything else relevant?

Examine the floor, anything relevant?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Post Number: 104
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Posted on Wednesday, June 11, 2008 - 5:01 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Pick up the candle and take it with you. ok

Are the walls made of brick? yes If so, try pushing the bricks the key are painted on, then walk across the room and try pushing the bricks in the centre of the lock painting. no effect with each. However you got a weird feeling when you touched each painting...

If there's been no joy, stucy the candle holder, any inscriptions? none Anything else relevant? yes, there's more about this candle to be discovered

Examine the floor, anything relevant? no
Unleashedllama (Unleashedllama)
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Posted on Wednesday, June 11, 2008 - 6:22 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Could you try putting your hand on each picture again and describe the feeling if possible.

Does the candle look normal? feel normal? burn in the traditional way? Is it tall? short? fat? thin? anything else to report about the candle?
Travis (Travis)
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Posted on Wednesday, June 11, 2008 - 10:52 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Does the candle give off any certain aroma? (Be careful not to burn your nose!)
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Thursday, June 12, 2008 - 12:09 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Could you try putting your hand on each picture again and describe the feeling if possible. After a few minutes feeling each you eventually hit open an exact way to describe the sensation; they both feel like brick AND cold metal simultaneously...

Does the candle look normal? yes feel normal? yes burn in the traditional way? yes Is it tall? short? fat? thin? irr anything else to report about the candle? not at the moment


Does the candle give off any certain aroma? (Be careful not to burn your nose!) no
Unleashedllama (Unleashedllama)
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Posted on Thursday, June 12, 2008 - 4:46 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

(This may sound a bit mad but...) try heating up the painting of the key on the wall using the flame of the candle.
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Thursday, June 12, 2008 - 4:50 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

(This may sound a bit mad but...) try heating up the painting of the key on the wall using the flame of the candle. You hold the candle up to the painting of the key. Nothing appears to happen.
You feel the painting again. The sensation now is of warm brick and cold metal...
Unleashedllama (Unleashedllama)
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Posted on Thursday, June 12, 2008 - 4:59 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

If you touch the wall at a part of the wall where there's no painting do you still feel brick and metal?

Try feeling a bit on all four walls if possible.
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Thursday, June 12, 2008 - 8:04 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

If you touch the wall at a part of the wall where there's no painting do you still feel brick and metal? no

Try feeling a bit on all four walls if possible. All feels like brick - except for the paintings. As you touch the blank wall however you notice there are very faint green lines all over it but you can't make out if or what they represent. When you remove you hand you can't see them.
Arek_fu (Arek_fu)
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Posted on Thursday, June 12, 2008 - 8:07 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Can you try to heat up this wall with the candle? Maybe it is the heat from your hand that makes the green lines appear.

If it works, leave the candle close to the wall and take a few steps back and try to make out something.
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Thursday, June 12, 2008 - 9:11 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Can you try to heat up this wall with the candle? Maybe it is the heat from your hand that makes the green lines appear. Holding the candle near the wall does make the lines appear but it's still quite difficult to make out what they are.

If it works, leave the candle close to the wall and take a few steps back and try to make out something. You do this. The lines are very faint and so it's a significant mental effort to try and remember where they are each time you manage to pick them out.
Then you blink and see a flash of green. As your eyes open again you realise that the lines are the outlines of the letters that form the words that you can only see clearly in the candlelight, with your eyes shut.
Even though the candles flame lights the whole room when your eyes are open it only illuminates a smaller area of the green lettering when your eyes are closed. You pick it up and carefully, as you close your eyes, you move it in front of the wall. The message reads:

CLOSE YOUR EYES

ah, so you have to close your eyes to read the message... that instructs you to close your eyes...... hmm... that seems a bit pointless...
Arek_fu (Arek_fu)
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Posted on Thursday, June 12, 2008 - 9:44 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Indeed it does (:

Pick up the candle and stand in front of the paintings. Blink several times. Do you notice anything strange? Now try to close your eyes. Any difference?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Thursday, June 12, 2008 - 10:10 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Indeed it does (:

Pick up the candle and stand in front of the paintings. Blink several times. Do you notice anything strange? No; eyes open, candle or no candle, the paintings stay the same. Now try to close your eyes. Any difference? Eyes closed, candle or no candle, when looking at the paintings all you see is black. (:
Arek_fu (Arek_fu)
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Posted on Thursday, June 12, 2008 - 10:40 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Can you explore the rest of the room with your eyes closed? I don't mean that you should go around walking into things and walls... just walk to a corner with the candle in your hand and have a look with your eyes closed (whatever that means). Do it along all the perimeter of the room. Oh, and don't forget the floor and the ceiling.

What happens if you close your eyes and touch the paintings? Do you still feel the brick and the metal?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Friday, June 13, 2008 - 12:55 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Can you explore the rest of the room with your eyes closed? I don't mean that you should go around walking into things and walls... just walk to a corner with the candle in your hand and have a look with your eyes closed (whatever that means). Do it along all the perimeter of the room. Oh, and don't forget the floor and the ceiling. nothing else. Ceiling is too high but you wave the candle above your head. Nothing to tell.

What happens if you close your eyes and touch the paintings? Do you still feel the brick and the metal? You try the painting of the lock first; with your eyes closed you only feel the cold metal and the lock seems strangely real somehow. The illusion disappears when you open your eyes again.

You try the key next. The same thing happens - you can feel the cold metal... and the key seems rounded somehow, you wonder where the tips of your fingers would be in relation to the wall if you opened your eyes now, but you don't; you continue to feel the surface of the key... you check to see how far back the illusionary curvature extends around the key. It just keeps going...

Suddenly your hand is completely wrapped around the key. For a moment you consider opening your eyes but don't really want to see (or feel) your hand somehow stuck in the wall.
You can feel the weight of the key... you pull it towards you and as you do so you wonder if this could be real... You purposefully let the key drop.

You hear it clatter as it lands on the stone floor. You open your eyes to see a blank wall ahead of you where the painting used to be and a key laying on the floor. You pick up the key.

Finally, something for your inventory (:
Travis (Travis)
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Posted on Friday, June 13, 2008 - 3:59 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Walk over to the painting of the lock. Take the key, close your eyes, reach into the painting, and see if you can fit the key in the lock. If so, turn the key. If not, try taking the lock out as you did the key.
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Friday, June 13, 2008 - 2:42 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Walk over to the painting of the lock. Take the key, close your eyes, reach into the painting, and see if you can fit the key in the lock. If so, turn the key. If not, try taking the lock out as you did the key. The key fits into the lock and turns. When you open your eyes again they're met by the curious sight of half a key protruding out of the wall from a painted lock.

You look around you to see what could be 'unlocked' and discover it on the opposite wall (where the key was originally) or rather you discover the lack of that wall. In its place as a plane of glass behind which is a room of the exact same size as the one you're standing in.

Facing in the direction of the glass you see: a blank wall to the left of the room and a wall with a giant lever on it to the right. You can't see the far wall due to a large metal cylinder, that stretches from floor to ceiling, occupying the centre of the room.
Due to your keen eye for detail (developed over years of solving tough lateral puzzles) you also spot a few discrepancies with the reflection in the glass; the lock and key and the holder on the wall in which the candle had sat are missing...
Unleashedllama (Unleashedllama)
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Posted on Friday, June 13, 2008 - 2:51 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Try putting your hands on the glass. Try with eyes open as well as closed.

Try putting the candle up to the glass too.
Arek_fu (Arek_fu)
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Posted on Friday, June 13, 2008 - 2:58 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Do you see yourself in the other side of the room? Pretend the glass is a mirror and walk to the place where the lever should be to be reflected where you see it. Move your arm as if you were trying to pull the lever. If it doesn't work, try with your eyes closed.
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Friday, June 13, 2008 - 4:00 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Try putting your hands on the glass. Try with eyes open as well as closed. No difference eyes open or closed. Your reflection does what you do...

Try putting the candle up to the glass too. You hold the candle near the glass - no effect. However you pass it close by the side of the room nearest the wall it came from and on the adjacent wall (beyond the glass) you spot a flash of fine green lines...


Do you see yourself in the other side of the room? yes Pretend the glass is a mirror and walk to the place where the lever should be to be reflected where you see it. Move your arm as if you were trying to pull the lever. your reflection's hand passes right through it If it doesn't work, try with your eyes closed. You close your eyes and your hand comes into contact with an illusion of the lever... you pull it down sharply and open your eyes.

You notice a few things; the lever on the other side has moved down too, your reflection is smiling back at you, and the metal cylinder in the centre of the room now appears to be made from a thick transparent plastic. There's a big green button on a panel on the inside but no obvious method of getting inside. Hidden behind the cylinder was a giant battery... The wall beyond that is blank.

well done (:
Unleashedllama (Unleashedllama)
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Posted on Friday, June 13, 2008 - 4:08 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Walk to the other side of the room, so that you're where the battery would be in the reflection. Try closing your eyes and touching the battery. Is it warm or vibrating as if it's in use? If not, can you feel a way to turn it on?

How big is it? Could you pick it up or drag it towards the reflection cylinder? If so would you be able to climb on it and then up into the cylinder (all with your eyes closed!)
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Friday, June 13, 2008 - 4:40 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Walk to the other side of the room, so that you're where the battery would be in the reflection. Try closing your eyes and touching the battery. Is it warm or vibrating as if it's in use? If not, can you feel a way to turn it on? It is standing by itself, connected to nothing, doing nothing.

How big is it? As high as your waist Could you pick it up or drag it towards the reflection cylinder? If so would you be able to climb on it and then up into the cylinder (all with your eyes closed!) You can't see what this would accomplish. The cylinder stretches from floor to ceiling; there is no opening.
Unleashedllama (Unleashedllama)
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Posted on Friday, June 13, 2008 - 4:44 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Oh yes, sorry. Try walking to the centre of where the cylinder would be and close your eyes. Put out your hands and feel around. Are you inside the cylinder?

If so, try to locate and press to button.
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Friday, June 13, 2008 - 5:16 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Oh yes, sorry. Try walking to the centre of where the cylinder would be and close your eyes. Put out your hands and feel around. Are you inside the cylinder? Yes

If so, try to locate and press to button. You push the button... you feel as if you're being lifted up, then the feeling stops. You open your eyes again. Everything's changed! :S

The first thing you notice is that your 'reflection' is now solid.
There's an open doorway into the tube and a red button inside.
Behind you is a red door with a handle but no lock.
Behind your 'reflection' (and the cylinder) is a red door with a lock but no handle.

Everything else is gone.
Unleashedllama (Unleashedllama)
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Posted on Friday, June 13, 2008 - 5:49 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

As you move does your 'reflection' still move as you'd expect a reflection to?

Try going to the red door. Try to open it both with eyes open and then closed.
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Friday, June 13, 2008 - 7:00 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

As you move does your 'reflection' still move as you'd expect a reflection to? yes

Try going to the red door. Try to open it both with eyes open and then closed. It won't open. Firmly locked.
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Sunday, June 15, 2008 - 9:43 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

hint: "Everything else is gone."
Arek_fu (Arek_fu)
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Posted on Sunday, June 15, 2008 - 10:18 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I am not sure I understand the new layout of the room. Can you please re-describe it?

Oh, and what do you mean when you say that "your reflection is now solid"?
Unleashedllama (Unleashedllama)
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Posted on Monday, June 16, 2008 - 12:32 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Try pressing the red button.
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Monday, June 16, 2008 - 10:06 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I am not sure I understand the new layout of the room. Can you please re-describe it? The dimensions are exactly the same as the previous room.
The cylinder is still present but with an open doorway leading into it and there's a red button inside.
Behind you is a red door with a handle but no lock.
Behind your 'reflection' (and the cylinder) is a red door with a lock but no handle.

Other than this the room is bare.


Oh, and what do you mean when you say that "your reflection is now solid"? Your reflection now has a tangible, opaque, solid body...


Try pressing the red button. Personally? Or by manipulating your reflection?
Personally - your unable to cross to the other half of the room as your 'reflection' mirrors your every move exactly and blocks your path as it simultaneously attempts to cross to your side of the room.
By reflection - you position yourself such that your reflection is inside the cylinder and pushing the red button, however nothing happens; you think you've forgotten something...
Arek_fu (Arek_fu)
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Posted on Monday, June 16, 2008 - 10:52 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Closing your eyes? Try to push the button with your eyes closed.

Or rather, stand in front of your reflection, close your eyes and extend an arm. Can you touch your mirror image? If not, walk through it by taking a few steps forward, open your eyes again and see if you're on the other side. If so, go press the red button.
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Tuesday, June 17, 2008 - 10:57 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Closing your eyes? Try to push the button with your eyes closed.

Or rather, stand in front of your reflection, close your eyes and extend an arm. Can you touch your mirror image? If not, walk through it by taking a few steps forward, open your eyes again and see if you're on the other side. If so, go press the red button. I'll answer these questions in reverse;

Eyes closed or not your 'reflection' is solid.

Positioning self as before and closing eyes to press the button is successful. You feel yourself sinking. The feeling stops. You open your eyes. You're back in the first room (with the green button etc).
Unleashedllama (Unleashedllama)
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Posted on Tuesday, June 17, 2008 - 11:20 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Right, so we need to work out a way to get through that red door, do you think that's the best way to go?

First, try closing your eyes and pressing the green button so you back up again.

Then, if you can manpulate your reflection to the door in some way, try this and see if you can get the reflection to open the door. Try with eyes open and closed.

If this doesn't work and it's completely locked, we'll need a key from somewhere, what are your thoughts?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Tuesday, June 17, 2008 - 2:59 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Right, so we need to work out a way to get through that red door, do you think that's the best way to go? correct - (however there are two red doors)

First, try closing your eyes and pressing the green button so you back up again. this is successful

Then, if you can manpulate your reflection to the door in some way, try this and see if you can get the reflection to open the door. Try with eyes open and closed. Eyes open your reflection's hand is stopped by the presence of the lock. Eyes closed you can feel the lock yourself. The door doesn't push open, you try to get a grip on the lock - it doesn't pull open either. The door has no handle.

If this doesn't work and it's completely locked, we'll need a key from somewhere, what are your thoughts? correct - you'll need a key...
Unleashedllama (Unleashedllama)
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Posted on Tuesday, June 17, 2008 - 3:24 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Would you say it doesn't seem worth trying to retrieve the previous key (the one you got out of the stone wall) as it may be too big or we may have changed too much for it still to be obtainable?

That battery, was there any key attatched to that?

If you can't remember, go back to the red button, press it and then (when you've gone back down (again)) walk around to check out that battery both with eyes open and closed.

Have you still got the candle in its holder by the way? Do you think this candle may be of more help?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Tuesday, June 17, 2008 - 6:42 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Would you say it doesn't seem worth trying to retrieve the previous key (the one you got out of the stone wall) as it may be too big or we may have changed too much for it still to be obtainable? Everything's worth a try. Do you want to try?

That battery, was there any key attatched to that? no

If you can't remember, go back to the red button, press it and then (when you've gone back down (again)) walk around to check out that battery both with eyes open and closed. In the previous room you cannot cross to the other side due to the pane of glass. However with your eyes closed you can feel the objects on the opposite side. - You do this and decide the battery is just a battery, albeit very large, and there is nothing near or attached to it.

Have you still got the candle in its holder by the way? no. but perhaps it's retrievable? Do you think this candle may be of more help? Again, everything's worth a try.
Unleashedllama (Unleashedllama)
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Posted on Wednesday, June 18, 2008 - 8:39 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Let's try and get that key then. Is the key still sticking out of the picture of the lock on the wall in the bottom room?

If so close your eyes and try removing it (I'm not sure if this means we'll have to re-lock it, or whether we can remove it like when you have unlocked a door, but if you can leave it unlocked please do, as I fear we may get the wall back, rather than the pane of glass if we re-lock it). Sorry that was so 'wordy'.

Now, I don't know where we left that candle, do you remember? If so, could you please collect it again too.
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Wednesday, June 18, 2008 - 4:05 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Let's try and get that key then. Is the key still sticking out of the picture of the lock on the wall in the bottom room? It is.

If so close your eyes and try removing it (I'm not sure if this means we'll have to re-lock it, or whether we can remove it like when you have unlocked a door, but if you can leave it unlocked please do, as I fear we may get the wall back, rather than the pane of glass if we re-lock it). Sorry that was so 'wordy'. It won't come out unless it's "re-locked". You re-lock it and remove the key. Opening your eyes again you see the wall has reappeared.

Now, I don't know where we left that candle, do you remember? If so, could you please collect it again too. The candle's here too. You pick it up.
Unleashedllama (Unleashedllama)
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Posted on Wednesday, June 18, 2008 - 5:02 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is the cylinder with the open door still there?

If so, try go in and pressing the green button.

Now go to the red door and try the key in the lock with eyes open and closed. I am worried you'll be missing your reflection by now though, am I right?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Wednesday, June 18, 2008 - 5:08 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is the cylinder with the open door still there? The cylinder with the open door is on the other floor.

If so, try go in and pressing the green button.

Now go to the red door and try the key in the lock with eyes open and closed. I am worried you'll be missing your reflection by now though, am I right? FA
Zenith (Zenith)
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Posted on Thursday, June 19, 2008 - 1:39 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Ok, confirming I have the layout of the rooms right: 'Green' room, with the green button: has a key and a candle in the physical side, and a cylinderical 'lift' and a battery in the mirror side, which are tangible when your eyes are closed. 'Red' room, with the red button has two doors: on on the physical side with a Handle but no lock, and one on the mirror side with a lock, but no handle. Also, here your reflection is semi-tangible, you and it move lock-step, wheras before you could 'move your reflection through walls' so to speak.

In that case, please go to the green room and examine the battery as best you can (eyes open and closed) Is it connected to something? can you determine which poles are which? can it be moved? If it appears to be disconnected and portable, try moving it into the cylinder and taking it to the 'red' room. Also see if anything is beneath it.
Zenith (Zenith)
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Posted on Thursday, June 19, 2008 - 1:56 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

That is assuming you can with the wall there again.

IF you can remember where the green button should be and are still able to manipulate it when there is no reflection, try taking the key to the red room. If you can use the key while your eyes are closed, try it in the lock and see if it unlocks the door.

IF you cannot manipulate any of the objects when you cannot see their reflection, and hence cannot perform the above request (examining the battery) please unlock the reflection and try again.

After examining the battery, try and examine the lever some more. Can it be broken off? Does it appear to be metal? Could it be used to conduct electricty? If it can be broken, try using it to smash the glass, assuming this would mean you would have open access to both halves of the rooms.
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Thursday, June 19, 2008 - 4:58 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Welcome to the puzzle. Excellent posts. (:

Ok, confirming I have the layout of the rooms right: 'Green' room, with the green button: has a key and a candle in the physical side, and a cylinderical 'lift' and a battery in the mirror side, which are tangible when your eyes are closed. 'Red' room, with the red button has two doors: on on the physical side with a Handle but no lock, and one on the mirror side with a lock, but no handle. Also, here your reflection is semi-tangible, you and it move lock-step, wheras before you could 'move your reflection through walls' so to speak. Correct. (:

In that case, please go to the green room and examine the battery as best you can (eyes open and closed) Is it connected to something? no can you determine which poles are which? yes, it is one of the normal, big, fat round ones... C or D type (there's no label), but much larger. can it be moved? It can, but it's very heavy. If it appears to be disconnected and portable, try moving it into the cylinder and taking it to the 'red' room. With your eyes closed the battery is tangible, as are the walls of the cylinder. You cannot put it inside. Also see if anything is beneath it. There is nothing beneath it.


That is assuming you can with the wall there again. Yes, you are able to feel the 'mirror side', when your eyes are closed, still - even though the wall is there.

IF you can remember where the green button should be and are still able to manipulate it when there is no reflection, try taking the key to the red room. If you can use the key while your eyes are closed, try it in the lock and see if it unlocks the door. You can take the key to the 'red room' fine.

BLOOPER: In the 'Red room', with your eyes closed, you CANNOT feel the other side. Closing your eyes has no effect in this room other than making the button work.


IF you cannot manipulate any of the objects when you cannot see their reflection, and hence cannot perform the above request (examining the battery) please unlock the reflection and try again.

After examining the battery, try and examine the lever some more. Can it be broken off? Does it appear to be metal? Could it be used to conduct electricty? If it can be broken, try using it to smash the glass, assuming this would mean you would have open access to both halves of the rooms. You leave the key (and the candle - which you're still holding) in the 'red room' and go back to the 'green room'. Stumbling around with your eyes closed you eventually find the lever. It feels like metal. You cannot break it off. You don't know whether or not it is a good conductor*.

*I will not answer any question(s) which you do not/ cannot determine for yourself through a clear action.
Zenith (Zenith)
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Posted on Friday, June 20, 2008 - 10:13 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Go back to the green room. Can you open the battery?

When you have your eyes closed, can you fell the key when you have it in your hand?

In the Red room, close your eyes and try to touch your reflection. Try giving your reflection the key.
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Friday, June 20, 2008 - 11:47 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Go back to the green room. Can you open the battery? no

When you have your eyes closed, can you fell the key when you have it in your hand? yes

In the Red room, close your eyes and try to touch your reflection. Your reflection is solid Try giving your reflection the key. How? Reaching out to put it in their hand results only in your hands touching...
Zenith (Zenith)
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Posted on Saturday, June 21, 2008 - 4:54 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Trying with eyes open and closed, throw the key at the 'mirror'. Does it pass through?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Saturday, June 21, 2008 - 5:28 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Trying with eyes open and closed, throw the key at the 'mirror'. Does it pass through? Not sure what you mean. In the green room it's a pane of glass. In the red room there is no barrier. I will therefore assume you're referring to the pane of glass(?)

You through the key at the glass. No effect.
Zenith (Zenith)
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Posted on Sunday, June 22, 2008 - 5:12 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

There is no barrier in the red room? then try the same idea there. Toss the key past the centre line, and attempt to use your doppelgänger to pick up the keys. I assume you will need to close your eyes to do so, but you may not.
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Sunday, June 22, 2008 - 12:19 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

There is no barrier in the red room? then try the same idea there. Toss the key past the centre line, and attempt to use your doppelgänger to pick up the keys. I assume you will need to close your eyes to do so, but you may not. This is successful, thankfully you do not have to close your eyes for it to work.
Zenith (Zenith)
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Posted on Sunday, June 22, 2008 - 1:12 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Ok, Now your doppelgänger has the key, try miming unlocking the red door with the lock at the red door with the handle. If it unlocks, try turning the handle and opening the door.
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Sunday, June 22, 2008 - 6:45 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Ok, Now your doppelgänger has the key, try miming unlocking the red door with the lock at the red door with the handle. If it unlocks, try turning the handle and opening the door.Good work

The key turns in the lock. You try your door again... it opens! As does the opposite door... Your 'doppelgänger' smiles and waves at you then runs off through the door into a long corridor, closing it behind him. Looking through your door you see a similar corridor.

The corridor is long and narrow with yellow walls and black ceiling and floor. The side walls are bare, the floor also for the most part, the ceiling has a long row of dome shaped lights along its length. The far wall is the most interesting; it is yellow also but has two black spirals radiating from a small hole in the centre and twisting round each other. On the floor at the far end stands a small black bottle with a yellow stopper in it.
Unleashedllama (Unleashedllama)
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Posted on Sunday, June 22, 2008 - 7:11 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Try walking to the far wall.

Try putting your eye up to the hole in the wall. Can you see anything through it?

Could you pick up the bottle please. Does it contain anything?
Arek_fu (Arek_fu)
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Posted on Sunday, June 22, 2008 - 10:47 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Try also to close your eye while peeping through the hole. Have a look at the corridor with your eyes closed. Yes, I do feel stupid saying that.
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Tuesday, June 24, 2008 - 1:37 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Try walking to the far wall. You do this

Try putting your eye up to the hole in the wall. Can you see anything through it? no

Could you pick up the bottle please. Does it contain anything? You pick up and examine the bottle. Without opening it, you can't see anything but black. Do you want to open it?


Try also to close your eye while peeping through the hole. Have a look at the corridor with your eyes closed. Yes, I do feel stupid saying that. Closing your eyes here doesn't appear to have any effect at all.
Unleashedllama (Unleashedllama)
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Posted on Friday, June 27, 2008 - 11:36 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Ok then, please open the bottle. Can you tell if there's anything it the bottle?

Try smelling it.

If there's liquid in there try tasting a little.

Once again if there's liquid, or even if there isn't try stick the end of the bottle through the hole in the far wall.
Crazypalpig (Crazypalpig)
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Posted on Sunday, June 29, 2008 - 2:31 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

OK, I've been away for around a month, so I'll join this!

Erm... You still have the candle, right? Does anything happen when you put your flame next to the contents of the bottle? Examine the room, eyes closed please. What do the spirals look like with your eyes closed? Put your hand on the wall, does anything happen this time?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Tuesday, July 01, 2008 - 12:15 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Ok then, please open the bottle. Can you tell if there's anything it the bottle? As you release the stopper from the bottle a black substance oozes out of it. It doesn't stop growing.

Try smelling it. The substance has a strange metallic smell.

If there's liquid in there try tasting a little. You decide against this; it doesn't look like it would taste that nice.

Once again if there's liquid, or even if there isn't try stick the end of the bottle through the hole in the far wall. You hold the bottle through the hole in the wall. The floor beneath you feels ands sounds as if it is buzzing.


OK, I've been away for around a month, so I'll join this! Welcome (:

Erm... You still have the candle, right? yes Does anything happen when you put your flame next to the contents of the bottle? The black substance reacts to the light; moving away as if it's trying to escape it. Examine the room, eyes closed please. With your eyes closed the colours of the room switch; black becomes yellow and yellow becomes black. The substance/ bottle has turned yellow. You cannot see yourself. What do the spirals look like with your eyes closed? Aside from the switching of black and yellow there is no difference. You note the view through the hole in the centre is still black however. Put your hand on the wall, does anything happen this time? no
Biograd (Biograd)
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Posted on Tuesday, July 01, 2008 - 3:12 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

The buzzing sound when you put the bottle in the hole, and the fact that the liquid smells metallic, suggests that there might be some electric current flowing. Is there any way to go back and retrieve the battery from the other room? Maybe you can charge it or something like that.
Crazypalpig (Crazypalpig)
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Posted on Tuesday, July 01, 2008 - 11:21 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

How big is the hole? Will the battery fit into it? The black stuff oozes out? Try dropping a drop onto the candle (Doubt this'll work)
Do the yellow lights also turn black?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Tuesday, July 01, 2008 - 5:12 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

The buzzing sound when you put the bottle in the hole, and the fact that the liquid smells metallic, suggests that there might be some electric current flowing. Is there any way to go back and retrieve the battery from the other room? Maybe you can charge it or something like that. Can't answer this. You would have to test ideas for yourself to find out.


How big is the hole? Roughly the size of your head. Will the battery fit into it? no The black stuff oozes out? Of the bottle, yes... there's worryingly a lot of it now. You tip it upside down to avoid having to touch it, thankfully this has no effect on how much oozes out from it. Try dropping a drop onto the candle (Doubt this'll work) It does not drip. However, with your eyes closed the yellow substance is attracted by the flame.
Do the yellow lights also turn black? The lights weren't/aren't yellow...
Crazypalpig (Crazypalpig)
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Posted on Tuesday, July 01, 2008 - 7:08 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Whoops. Can you get back out the passageway? Is your Dopperganger still there? Have him press the red button again, and retrieve the battery please. Go back up, and to the corridor. Put the oozing stuff over the battery. Close eyes again, and smell the stuff again (Reasoning that since the substance changed what it wanted to do with closed eyes it might've actually changed)
Biograd (Biograd)
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Posted on Tuesday, July 01, 2008 - 9:12 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

"It does not drip. However, with your eyes closed the yellow substance is attracted by the flame."

Does it actually reach and touch the flame (with eyes closed of course), or just get close and then stop? If it actually contacts the flame, is it flammable?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Wednesday, July 02, 2008 - 8:50 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Whoops. Can you get back out the passageway? The door has locked itself Is your Dopperganger still there? Have him press the red button again, and retrieve the battery please. Go back up, and to the corridor. Put the oozing stuff over the battery. Close eyes again, and smell the stuff again (Reasoning that since the substance changed what it wanted to do with closed eyes it might've actually changed) Smells sweet


"It does not drip. However, with your eyes closed the yellow substance is attracted by the flame."

Does it actually reach and touch the flame (with eyes closed of course), or just get close and then stop? It seems to move towards the flame more slowly the closer it gets, which is good as you don't think you really want it touching the flame as it could smother it and put it out. If it actually contacts the flame, is it flammable?
Unleashedllama (Unleashedllama)
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Posted on Wednesday, July 02, 2008 - 9:18 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

How big is the bottle? Would it fit through the hole in the wall?

With the hole in the wall, can you try putting your arm through and feeling around. Anything to report?

Try holding the bottle through the hole (assuming it does fit) and looking through the hole, both with eyes open and with them closed.

Next try holding the the candle (and not the bottle) through the hole and looking through the hole, both with eyes open and with them closed.

Next try holding the the candle and bottle through the hole together and looking through the hole, both with eyes open and with them closed.
Crazypalpig (Crazypalpig)
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Posted on Wednesday, July 02, 2008 - 11:29 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

{The door locked itself? Why did you close it? I'm kidding...}

Does it seem OK to taste with eyes closed?
Does the flame seem hot with eyes closed? Does anything change properties besides color with eyes closed?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Wednesday, July 02, 2008 - 9:07 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

How big is the bottle? Smaller than your head Would it fit through the hole in the wall? Yes

With the hole in the wall, can you try putting your arm through and feeling around. Anything to report? Nothing to report... as far as you can reach it is all empty space.

Try holding the bottle through the hole (assuming it does fit) and looking through the hole, both with eyes open and with them closed. The bottle appears as it was. The only difference is the vibrating and buzzing of the floor beneath you.

Next try holding the the candle (and not the bottle) through the hole and looking through the hole, both with eyes open and with them closed. No change. The floor is still.

Next try holding the the candle and bottle through the hole together and looking through the hole, both with eyes open and with them closed. They behave as they do when together on this side of the hole. The only difference is the vibrating and buzzing of the floor beneath you.


The door locked itself? Why did you close it? I'm kidding... It closed itself too (:

Does it seem OK to taste with eyes closed? Yes. It tastes almost like honey. :P
Does the flame seem hot with eyes closed? yes Does anything change properties besides color with eyes closed? Nothing apparent so far.
Biograd (Biograd)
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Posted on Wednesday, July 02, 2008 - 9:44 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

What happens if you put the stopper back in the bottle? Does the liquid that has already escaped change at all when separated from the rest of the liquid still in the bottle?
Biograd (Biograd)
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Posted on Wednesday, July 02, 2008 - 9:56 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Also, was there any specific reason you avoided touching the liquid before? Did something unpleasant happen when you tried, or were you just trying to avoid a mess? If it is possible to put some of the liquid on your finger, try "painting" a line on the wall (the one with the hole and spirals) with it. Assuming the liquid doesn't "run away" from your finger, and that it maintains its color on the wall, does anything happen if you use a line to bridge two regions of one color by crossing an area of the opposite color?
Crazypalpig (Crazypalpig)
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Posted on Thursday, July 03, 2008 - 11:34 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

With eyes closed, does the oozing stop? Is there a keyhole to unlock the locked door? If you put your arm through the hole with the candle, is the space beyond lighted up? Feel through the hole with just your arm, and tell us what you feel.
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Thursday, July 03, 2008 - 3:26 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

What happens if you put the stopper back in the bottle? Does the liquid that has already escaped change at all when separated from the rest of the liquid still in the bottle? The stopper will not go back on the bottle, the substance is coming out too fast...


Also, was there any specific reason you avoided touching the liquid before? Did something unpleasant happen when you tried, or were you just trying to avoid a mess? More this, it doesn't look very nice If it is possible to put some of the liquid on your finger, try "painting" a line on the wall (the one with the hole and spirals) with it. Assuming the liquid doesn't "run away" from your finger, and that it maintains its color on the wall, does anything happen if you use a line to bridge two regions of one color by crossing an area of the opposite color? Good thinking but the substance will not stick to the wall although it does to your finger...


With eyes closed, does the oozing stop? It does not stop Is there a keyhole to unlock the locked door? No If you put your arm through the hole with the candle, is the space beyond lighted up? Either it is not or it is infinite darkness Feel through the hole with just your arm, and tell us what you feel. Nothing... unless you bend your arm round of course... then you can feel the wall... anticipating the question you feel as much of the wall as you can reach; all brick.
Biograd (Biograd)
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Posted on Thursday, July 03, 2008 - 7:27 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Since the liquid does stick to your finger, does it change color while on there (or on any other thing to which it sticks) when you open/close your eyes, or only in the bottle? In other words, if you were to touch it using one finger with your eyes open and using another while keeping them closed, would your fingers end up the same or different colors?
Crazypalpig (Crazypalpig)
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Posted on Thursday, July 03, 2008 - 8:49 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Again, since the liquid sticks, try putting it on in the sweet form, then opening your eyes and smearing the stuff on the rim of the hole? Speaking of which, how thick is the hole? I feel there's something important about those spirals somehow. Try smearing the stuff on the tips of the spirals.

*Lightbulb pops over head*

Those spirals... Could they be the +- sides of a battery? Try smearing a line on the wall connecting the two spirals please.
Biograd (Biograd)
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Posted on Thursday, July 03, 2008 - 10:47 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

"Try smearing a line on the wall connecting the two spirals please."

That's essentially what I was thinking, but Liquizt said that the stuff does NOT stick to the wall, only to your finger, and so making a line would be impossible.
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Friday, July 04, 2008 - 12:50 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Since the liquid does stick to your finger, does it change color while on there (or on any other thing to which it sticks) when you open/close your eyes, or only in the bottle? Touching the substance has no effect on colour. You cannot remove your finger from the substance...! In other words, if you were to touch it using one finger with your eyes open and using another while keeping them closed, would your fingers end up the same or different colors? No difference, except now you have two trapped fingers...


Again, since the liquid sticks, try putting it on in the sweet form, then opening your eyes and smearing the stuff on the rim of the hole? You decide to put your whole hand into the substance and try to place it around the hole but it will stick to nothing but you... the liquid is moving around by your feet, if you're not careful they'll get stuck too. Speaking of which, how thick is the hole? About two widths of normal housebricks. I feel there's something important about those spirals somehow. Try smearing the stuff on the tips of the spirals. This does not work.

*Lightbulb pops over head* The lightbulb drops and hits you on the head. It bounces off and sinks into the liquid.

Those spirals... Could they be the +- sides of a battery? Try smearing a line on the wall connecting the two spirals please. Biograd is correct in his last post.
Biograd (Biograd)
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Posted on Friday, July 04, 2008 - 6:45 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

"*Lightbulb pops over head* The lightbulb drops and hits you on the head. It bounces off and sinks into the liquid."

I hope that's a joke...

Anyway, can you "unstick" your fingers by using the candle to repel the liquid from them (with your eyes open)?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Friday, July 04, 2008 - 2:12 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

"*Lightbulb pops over head* The lightbulb drops and hits you on the head. It bounces off and sinks into the liquid."

I hope that's a joke... ;)

Anyway, can you "unstick" your fingers by using the candle to repel the liquid from them (with your eyes open)? Very clever (: This will work. You're unstuck. The liquid is still seeping around your feet... you use the candle here too and step back from it... images of the room filling up with the stuff and you drowning in it fill your mind but it is quite a large, long room and would take ages to fill up at this rate... somehow that realisation doesn't make you feel any better.

Continuing down this track you realise the hole would act as a drain before it got that bad... however you don't think you'd be able to free yourself from the liquid with the candle when it's upto your waist...
However, before then the spirals will be connected by the liquid... if anything would happen in that situation you realise it inevitably will, but if nothing should happen (or rather nothing beneficial to you) it would still be difficult to do much with the liquid around your ankles. Is it worth the risk waiting?

Your conclusion: you need to do something about this stuff fast...
Arek_fu (Arek_fu)
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Posted on Friday, July 04, 2008 - 2:31 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Start by putting the bottle through the hole. This should stop the room from getting full of the oozing stuff. Next, can you look through the hole while keeping the bottle there? If you can put your head and one of the shoulders through the hole it should not be a problem. I would like you to try both with your eyes open and with your eyes closed. I expect the stuff from the bottle might illuminate the space on the other side of the hole if you look at it with your eyes closed.
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Saturday, July 05, 2008 - 12:26 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I tried to reply to this a couple of hours ago but something happened to the page when i was trying to preview the post X) And it was quite long last time so I've taken a break and here goes for the second attempt!

Start by putting the bottle through the hole. This should stop the room from getting full of the oozing stuff. You hold the bottle through the hole. The floor starts buzzing. The liquid on your side of the wall is pulled through to the other side due to the increasing mass of the liquid being produced on that side and the seemingly infinite elasticity of the substance.
As the liquid slides through the hole it passes over the spirals. You feel, hear and see nothing happen.
Next, can you look through the hole while keeping the bottle there? If you can put your head and one of the shoulders through the hole it should not be a problem. You cannot put your head through and hold the bottle on the other side at the same time. However you can still see through to the other side with the bottle there. I would like you to try both with your eyes open and with your eyes closed. I expect the stuff from the bottle might illuminate the space on the other side of the hole if you look at it with your eyes closed. When your eyes are closed the substance is yellow but not luminous. (Although yellow is easier to see against the black background of the surrounding darkness than black.)

You hold the candle through the hole with your spare hand to see it more clearly. The liquid appears to be flowing out of the bottle at a faster rate than it was on this side of the wall and it is falling directly down for as far as you can see... except of course for a growing bulge in the direction of the candle's flame.

You remove the candle and put it on the floor on your side of the wall. As you do so you happen to glance back down the corridor and notice two things: firstly, but you're not sure of this one, is that the corridor appears to be longer than you remember it; secondly, the door at the other end, to the red room, is wide open!
Incidently, looking through the open doorway, the door on the opposite side of the red room has remained shut.
Biograd (Biograd)
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Posted on Saturday, July 05, 2008 - 10:41 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is there anything you can rest the bottle on, so that you can walk back into the red room without having to make the liquid start flowing back toward your feet?

Also, can I assume, that since you did not mention the door being open before when the bottle was placed in the hole, that the door opened because of the liquid touching the spirals? Or would you have mentioned the door opening earlier had we explicitly asked about it?

I'm confused, because, on the one hand you said nothing happened when the liquid touched the spirals, but on the other hand all other actions you responded to in your last reply (placing the bottle through the hole, placing the candle through the hole, checking to see how they interacted on the other side) had been carried out before.
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Saturday, July 05, 2008 - 11:48 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is there anything you can rest the bottle on, so that you can walk back into the red room without having to make the liquid start flowing back toward your feet? Yope; you can rest it inside the hole but then the liquid will either spill evenly on both sides or it will become heavier on one side and the bottle will be pulled towards that side.

Also, can I assume, that since you did not mention the door being open before when the bottle was placed in the hole, that the door opened because of the liquid touching the spirals? Better not to assume when you can test. Or would you have mentioned the door opening earlier had we explicitly asked about it? Possibly - You only noticed it when you did because you happened to look in that direction when you were putting the candle down.

I'm confused, because, on the one hand you said nothing happened when the liquid touched the spirals, but on the other hand all other actions you responded to in your last reply (placing the bottle through the hole, placing the candle through the hole, checking to see how they interacted on the other side) had been carried out before. Nothing happened so far as you were aware - however in the same post I did give you fresh information... which by the process of elimination would suggest the spirals were the cause... if that makes sense.
Nevertheless you also on witnessed these effects becuase you happened to be looking in the right direction at the right time - who's to say they didn't occur before but you did not notice them? A bit sneaky yes, but then I've kept all the rooms fairly simple so it won't take long to try everything.

Also, just so you're aware, it's impossible to get stuck.
(:
Biograd (Biograd)
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Posted on Monday, July 07, 2008 - 8:28 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I guess I'll ask some more. I was kind of waiting for someone else to test some things, but I guess nobody is jumping in.

Anyway, use the candle to momentarily clear off the spirals, to make sure that's what's making the door open.

Assuming it is, let a little liquid accumulate on your side, then rest the bottle in the hole and try to make the liquid fall evenly. In this case, from what you said, either the bottle should stay put, or it will fall on your side, and either way you should be able to retrieve it (am I right?). Hopefully, some liquid will touch the spirals in this case, even when you're not actively holding the bottle.

Now that you know you can clear the floor of liquid by sticking the bottle through the hole and "sucking" it out, you should hopefully have enough time to at least run back to the red room and take a peek before either the liquid breaks contacts with the spirals (and the door closes, if my assumption was correct) or the corridor floods. If this in fact looks to be possible, let me know if there is anything new about the red room that might suggest a way out.
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Tuesday, July 08, 2008 - 12:31 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I guess I'll ask some more. I was kind of waiting for someone else to test some things, but I guess nobody is jumping in.

Anyway, use the candle to momentarily clear off the spirals, to make sure that's what's making the door open. The spirals are clear... the substance had moved over them already and disappeared completely to the other side of the hole, leaving no trace. Hence you can not be certain of whether or not it was the spirals which opened the door.

Assuming it is, let a little liquid accumulate on your side, then rest the bottle in the hole and try to make the liquid fall evenly. In this case, from what you said, either the bottle should stay put, or it will fall on your side, and either way you should be able to retrieve it (am I right?). Hopefully, some liquid will touch the spirals in this case, even when you're not actively holding the bottle. You manage to set it up such that the liquid falls evenly from the bottle on both sides. You check the door constantly whilst doing this.
Unfortunately it closes. Fortunately, you believe you know why; the door closed when you moved the bottle into the hole itself: the moment it was not completely on the other side the door shut itself and you strongly suspect locked itself also.


Now that you know you can clear the floor of liquid by sticking the bottle through the hole and "sucking" it out, you should hopefully have enough time to at least run back to the red room and take a peek before either the liquid breaks contacts with the spirals (and the door closes, if my assumption was correct) or the corridor floods. If this in fact looks to be possible, let me know if there is anything new about the red room that might suggest a way out. You have enough time to run to the other end of the corridor and confirm the door has indeed locked itself and run back. However the journey back appears to have taken longer - you look back down to the red door, it's moving away from you... the corridor is growing!

You've also got another problem... the candle is buried under the substance - marked by a small bump where the substance is trying to avoid the flame and the bottle is out of your reach... The substance meanwhile continues to seep towards your feet.
Biograd (Biograd)
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Posted on Tuesday, July 08, 2008 - 2:50 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Wait a minute... I assumed you would take the candle with you to investigate the room, rather than leave it sitting on the floor where it could be smothered out or fall over. I guess I should have been clearer.

Anyway, so now I gather that before you looked back at the door while your arm was still holding the bottle fully through the hole--am I not reading correctly, given your "you believe you know why" statement?

Even if this is correct, I am now at a complete loss as to what to do. With the door locked and both the candle and bottle out of reach, it seems there is nothing to do.
Arek_fu (Arek_fu)
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Posted on Tuesday, July 08, 2008 - 11:23 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Why, you can always close your eyes and wade your way through the honey...
Crazypalpig (Crazypalpig)
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Posted on Tuesday, July 08, 2008 - 3:05 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Not a good idea, the honey will just smother can candle once it's attracted to it! You don't happen to have matches do you? If you cannot retrieve any item any way we tried, just wait to see if the corridor will stop moving, or if it keeps moving, see if anything else happens while its moving
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Tuesday, July 08, 2008 - 6:46 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Wait a minute... I assumed you would take the candle with you to investigate the room, rather than leave it sitting on the floor where it could be smothered out or fall over. I guess I should have been clearer. I'll allow for a minor temporal fluctuation to allow the candle to remain in your possession as it was your intention - unless of course you'd rather see if you can solve this extra 'mini-puzzle' (: - there is a nice little lateral solution I've planned for this situation based on things you've already discovered.

It's your choice, just let me know which one you opt for.
(:


Anyway, so now I gather that before you looked back at the door while your arm was still holding the bottle fully through the hole--am I not reading correctly, given your "you believe you know why" statement? I do tend to leave everything exactly how it was if possible other than what you instruct me to change...
So yes, from when you asked for the bottle to be held through the hole it was not removed until my last post in which you were watching the door to see what effect removing the bottle had. I hope that clarifies things.
(:


Even if this is correct, I am now at a complete loss as to what to do. With the door locked and both the candle and bottle out of reach, it seems there is nothing to do. There is always something to do - I will intervene if you attempt an action that is both irreversible and not the correct way to progress. However I believe I constructed this adventure in such a way that I would never have to do this, i.e. such that "it's impossible to get stuck"... The very lateral among you will be able to work out what this means in terms of how to progress. ;)


Why, you can always close your eyes and wade your way through the honey... The 'honey' is just as sticky as the substance is when black - you will be unable to wade...

Perhaps I should try to explain this substance more precisely... Imagine a solid sphere made from the substance. Wherever you touch its surface you will be stuck to it. If you move your arm or hand the ball moves with it, such that your hand stays in the exact same position on the sphere.
Now imagine it's a rope, wherever you touch the rope your hand is stuck in the same manner, however this time, as you move your hand around the rope bends and snakes.
Now imagine the rope is elastic... unless it's held at a second point it will behave exactly like the first rope.

The substance behaves a lot like that second rope albeit in a weird shape and constantly growing. The only forces acting on it are gravity and the ones you introduce as it sticks to nothing else.

Hopefully that clarifies why you cannot wade in it, and how you can interact with it. If you're still unsure, try thinking about it as super-super-glue with an incredibly high viscosity.



Not a good idea, the honey will just smother can candle once it's attracted to it! This is also correct. (: You don't happen to have matches do you? no If you cannot retrieve any item any way we tried, just wait to see if the corridor will stop moving, or if it keeps moving, see if anything else happens while its moving Nothing else happens. You're fairly certain it's not going to stop anytime soon.
Crazypalpig (Crazypalpig)
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Posted on Wednesday, July 09, 2008 - 12:55 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

It's impossible to get stuck eh? Then try wading through it... Is that laterally or literally anyhow? (: How big is the radius of the clear area made by the candle? Is that getting bigger too? Can you climb up a wall and drop to that hole by any chance? And if the hole is expanding, just step to the very edge of the goo and wait for the circle to catch up with you :D
Biograd (Biograd)
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Posted on Wednesday, July 09, 2008 - 1:27 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I guess I'll excuse your misunderstanding, and let the candle remain in the goo. That was not what I had intended, but I'm curious as to the way out, so I won't kill the opportunity to learn the answer by going back in time--especially since someone else has already made some suggestions based on that possibility.
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Wednesday, July 09, 2008 - 3:26 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

It's impossible to get stuck eh? Then try wading through it... This is one of the situations in which I will intervene... You consider attempting to wade through the substance but you decide against it as you can't see at the moment how that could possibly help the situation. Is that laterally or literally anyhow? (: Laterally :P How big is the radius of the clear area made by the candle? Is that getting bigger too? Can you climb up a wall and drop to that hole by any chance? And if the hole is expanding, just step to the very edge of the goo and wait for the circle to catch up with you :D The liquid that is falling on this side of the hole is falling over the candle - hence the candle is partially buried beneath a dome of the substance.... the dome is growing, however you feel it's probably just the substance growing over it rather than some growing power of the flame.


I guess I'll excuse your misunderstanding, and let the candle remain in the goo. That was not what I had intended, but I'm curious as to the way out, so I won't kill the opportunity to learn the answer by going back in time--especially since someone else has already made some suggestions based on that possibility. Okay (: But I would have volunteered my solution if you had decided to skip this 'mini-puzzle'.
Biograd (Biograd)
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Posted on Thursday, July 10, 2008 - 3:36 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I guess I'll excuse your misunderstanding, and let the candle remain in the goo. That was not what I had intended, but I'm curious as to the way out, so I won't kill the opportunity to learn the answer by going back in time--especially since someone else has already made some suggestions based on that possibility. Okay (: But I would have volunteered my solution if you had decided to skip this 'mini-puzzle'.

OK, in that case I will let Crazypalpig decide which way to go, since he's the only other person who has made any suggestions. I don't care either way anymore.
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Thursday, July 10, 2008 - 3:45 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

OK, in that case I will let Crazypalpig decide which way to go, since he's the only other person who has made any suggestions. I don't care either way anymore. Okay (:

Crazypalpig - the puzzle can't continue without you :P

Unless we assume we're continuing with the candle in its current state until Crazypalpig has decided - you might even be able to find a/the solution before his next post :P
Biograd (Biograd)
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Posted on Thursday, July 10, 2008 - 9:34 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Let's do what you suggested in the italicized sentence. I can't really think of how to proceed right now, though. Maybe someone else will.

Let me get straight the exact situation. So you say the candle is "partially" buried... Does this mean that the dome does not fully cover the candle? If not, is there a way to get any part of your body in through the "hole" (i.e. not the real hole in the wall, but the gap in the dome, if it exists)?
Crazypalpig (Crazypalpig)
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Posted on Thursday, July 10, 2008 - 1:07 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

OK, here's my very weird idea.

Close your eyes, and just as you think the candle is about to be smothered, open your eyes again. I'm hoping that the closeness will blast the goo away like two magnets close together
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Thursday, July 10, 2008 - 1:54 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Let's do what you suggested in the italicized sentence. I can't really think of how to proceed right now, though. Maybe someone else will.

Let me get straight the exact situation. So you say the candle is "partially" buried... Does this mean that the dome does not fully cover the candle? If not, is there a way to get any part of your body in through the "hole" (i.e. not the real hole in the wall, but the gap in the dome, if it exists)? You can't see how, the gap does exist, however it is behind the candle, right up against the wall (if you can picture that) - I included it really so that the candle wouldn't be smothered. (:


OK, here's my very weird idea.

Close your eyes, and just as you think the candle is about to be smothered, open your eyes again. I'm hoping that the closeness will blast the goo away like two magnets close together Very creative... :P You do this - the substance rapidly swells to a larger dome shape before falling back onto the candle more or less how it was before... unfortunately the infinite elasticity of the stuff makes it impossible to break any of it off or make any holes in it - it's one large sticky blanket.
Unleashedllama (Unleashedllama)
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Posted on Thursday, July 10, 2008 - 5:17 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is the candle against the wall with the hole in it? If so, could you try putting yourarm through the hole, and maybe try closing your eyes and bending the arm back 'through' the wall to where the candle is.

Does talking affect anything in this room by the way? Try saying 'please give me my candle back, you horrible sticky gunk' out loud. If this doesn't work, perhaps try asking nicely.
Crazypalpig (Crazypalpig)
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Posted on Thursday, July 10, 2008 - 8:17 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Do you still have the stopper? I don't know what good it'll do but... you never know. It only sticks onto you, right? Does it also stick to clothes? Or just skin? If just skin, trying bringing your entire body inside your clothes so no skin can come in contact and touching the stuff. If you don't get stuck, by all means, go in there!
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Thursday, July 10, 2008 - 10:35 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is the candle against the wall with the hole in it? Yes If so, could you try putting yourarm through the hole, and maybe try closing your eyes and bending the arm back 'through' the wall to where the candle is. No. The hole is out of reach.

Does talking affect anything in this room by the way? You don't know Try saying 'please give me my candle back, you horrible sticky gunk' out loud. If this doesn't work, perhaps try asking nicely. These don't work.


Do you still have the stopper? Yes I don't know what good it'll do but... you never know. It only sticks onto you, right? It certainly seems to be the case... Does it also stick to clothes? Or just skin? If just skin, trying bringing your entire body inside your clothes so no skin can come in contact and touching the stuff. If you don't get stuck, by all means, go in there! you take off a sock and try it... it sticks to clothes too (:
Crazypalpig (Crazypalpig)
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Posted on Friday, July 11, 2008 - 1:19 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

... There goes another idea... If you put the stopper in the goo, does anything happen?
Is the room still expanding? Is there goo coming from anywhere except near the bottle? Is there any way you can climb the walls? Seeing as you have nothing else to do, try running to the door again and see if there's anything unusal.
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Friday, July 11, 2008 - 1:57 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

... There goes another idea... If you put the stopper in the goo, does anything happen? Yes, it sinks in and disappears.
Is the room still expanding? yes Is there goo coming from anywhere except near the bottle? no, all the substance appears to be coming from the mouth of the bottle. Is there any way you can climb the walls? You examine the walls - they're fairly smooth, you doubt you could climb them... you examine the width of the corridor... maybe, if you straddle the corridor you can support yourself between the walls, switching between hands and feet you could move up down, forward and back like this. However you're unsure how long you'll be able to hold yourself up there. Seeing as you have nothing else to do, try running to the door again and see if there's anything unusal. You reach the door, it was bit of an effort as the corridor is still growing but you can run faster then the rate at which it's expanding which appears to be constant. Nothing unusual here other than that. You wait a while, the door is creeping away from you slowly, as is the wall down the other end.
Crazypalpig (Crazypalpig)
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Posted on Friday, July 11, 2008 - 1:10 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

So, the stopper's not needed ;-)

Does the goo bubble reach the ceiling? Can you bring yourself over the gigantic bubble if it's not and aim for the direct center? If you can get the candle, remove the goo from yourself (:
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Friday, July 11, 2008 - 5:32 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Does the goo bubble reach the ceiling? It did not. Can you bring yourself over the gigantic bubble if it's not and aim for the direct center? If you can get the candle, remove the goo from yourself (: You reflect on this idea... from what you know about the behaviour of this substance you decide this would be like throwing yourself at fly-paper... - you decide against it.
Crazypalpig (Crazypalpig)
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Posted on Friday, July 11, 2008 - 11:32 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Hmmm... We have nothing that can be used, and closing our eyes always seems to be the answer, and we definitely can't get through the bubble... Close your eyes!! Wait for the goo to dissapate from the candle and deflate the bubble, then retrieve the candle, preferrably without touching the stuff. Does the candlestick still repel the goo?
Crazypalpig (Crazypalpig)
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Posted on Friday, July 11, 2008 - 11:33 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Hmmm... We have nothing that can be used, and closing our eyes always seems to be the answer, and we definitely can't get through the bubble... Close your eyes!! Wait for the goo to dissapate from the candle and deflate the bubble, then retrieve the candle, preferrably without touching the stuff. Does the candlestick still repel the goo?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Saturday, July 12, 2008 - 12:01 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Hmmm... We have nothing that can be used, and closing our eyes always seems to be the answer, and we definitely can't get through the bubble... Close your eyes!! Wait for the goo to dissapate from the candle and deflate the bubble, then retrieve the candle, preferrably without touching the stuff. Does the candlestick still repel the goo? As the substance nears the candle flame it moves towards it slower, as a result it will never reach it and will therefore not expose the candle.

My solution for this is fairly simple... You may still give up on this predicament at anytime and automatically perform my solution - this is not a progressive stage of the puzzle and I'm aware that the longer it continues the more the various hints I've supplied for progressing in this puzzle are slipping away deeper into the puzzle's history. :P

However, if you're determined to go on and solve this for yourselves: look back through all my recent posts since this predicament began - I've tried to give a few hints. There's nothing new you need to learn - everything you need to know to solve this is already there.

As you read through previous posts imagine yourself in the corridor in this predicament... this will help you appreciate the situation better. What would YOU do?
Biograd (Biograd)
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Posted on Wednesday, July 16, 2008 - 9:55 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

How about you just give your solution to this sticky situation (pun intended). It seems this puzzle is dying, even though in my opinion it's one of the better lateral adventures, so I think it's better to move on before everyone forgets what the story is.
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Wednesday, July 16, 2008 - 11:45 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

How about you just give your solution to this sticky situation (pun intended). It seems this puzzle is dying, even though in my opinion it's one of the better lateral adventures, so I think it's better to move on before everyone forgets what the story is. Thanks (: Very well.

Suddenly it occurs to you that if you reach down and surrender one hand to the substance you can use its elastic/blanket like properties to pull it to one side and off the candle... then you can use the candle to free your hand.

To tidy up the substance before it slowly seeps back to where you're standing you move closer to the hole in the wall, take the bottle and hold it through the hole, upside-down, as you did before.
Once again the growing mass of the substance being produced on that side pulls the substance from your side through.

Lastly you notice that once the substance is no longer touching the wall with the hole in it (and thus connecting the spirals) the corridor stops growing.

Clues still relevant for progression; "it's impossible to get stuck."

Would anyone like a recap? Or would someone like to attempt a recap of their own to just confirm they've understood everything correctly?
Biograd (Biograd)
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Posted on Thursday, July 17, 2008 - 5:33 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Thanks. I would never have gotten that solution--I would have assumed that you could not reach anywhere near the candle to free it with your hand, or at least even if you could there would still be enough stuck to the candle that you couldn't pick it up without getting your other hand stuck too.

Anyway, I will attempt a
------RECAP-------------

You are at the end of a corridor, and the wall at the end has a hole in the center of it with two black spirals painted on it.

You have an un-resealable bottle from which there oozes a very sticky and infinitely elastic substance. With your eyes open, the liquid is black, smells metallic, and is repelled by the flame of your candle. With your eyes closed, the liquid has the same consistency, but is yellow, smells and tastes like honey, and is attracted to the flame. In addition, the colors of the spirals invert when you close your eyes.

When the bottle is held completely through the hole, the floor makes a buzzing sound and the door at the far end opens. With the bottle in this position, the liquid appears to fall endlessly on the other side of the hole, and sucks the liquid on your side through with it. When the liquid connects the spirals on the wall, this makes the corridor increase in length.
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Thursday, July 17, 2008 - 12:35 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Thanks. I would never have gotten that solution--I would have assumed that you could not reach anywhere near the candle to free it with your hand, or at least even if you could there would still be enough stuck to the candle that you couldn't pick it up without getting your other hand stuck too.

Anyway, I will attempt a
------RECAP-------------
This is an excellent recap - all correct. Additions are just for clarification, for newly interested puzzlers.

You are at the end of a corridor, and the wall at the end has a hole in the center of it with two black spirals painted on it. The spirals end at the hole in the centre and spiral outwards (anticlockwise - irrelevant) around each other until they reach the edge of that wall.

You have an un-resealable bottle from which there oozes a very sticky and infinitely elastic substance. However, the substance only sticks to you, your clothes and presumably the inside of the bottle. It does not stick to the walls, the candle (and its holder), or the outside of the bottle. In addition, any loose objects dropped into the liquid are absorbed and irrecoverable. With your eyes open, the liquid is black, smells metallic, and is repelled by the flame of your candle; an effect you can use to 'unstick' yourself from the substance, providing you are not so trapped that you cannot pass the candle close enough to the areas where you are stuck to it. With your eyes closed, the liquid has the same consistency, but is yellow, smells and tastes like honey, and is attracted to the flame. In addition, the colors of the spirals invert when you close your eyes but this does not appear to have any effect on their behaviour (described below).

When the bottle is held completely through the hole, the floor makes a buzzing sound and the door at the far end opens. This door connects to the previous rooms, containing elements, which although still relevant, knowledge of them is not required for progression. Nevertheless, the newly interested may benefit from reading over those posts. With the bottle in this position, the liquid appears to fall endlessly on the other side of the hole at a much faster rate, and sucks the liquid on your side through with it. When the liquid connects the spirals on the wall, this makes the corridor increase in length. The only time this happens appears to be when the bottle is placed or held beyond the opening of the hole (which is two standard bricks widths wide) as this is the only situation in which the liquid has no choice but to pass over the spirals on the wall - either falling into the room on your side [when the bottle is rested inside the hole] or as the liquid on your side is 'sucked' through to the other side [for a short while, each time the bottle passes through the hole and is held on that side].
Biograd (Biograd)
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Posted on Thursday, July 17, 2008 - 6:19 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I didn't realize that the rate at which the liquid oozed out of the bottle was different depending on which side of the wall it was on. This could be relevant.
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Friday, July 18, 2008 - 11:28 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I didn't realize that the rate at which the liquid oozed out of the bottle was different depending on which side of the wall it was on. This could be relevant. Possibly
Crazypalpig (Crazypalpig)
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Posted on Friday, July 18, 2008 - 11:32 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Sorry about not being on here, was at camp for the past 5 days :P

Interesting solution... I like it :D
Can you do whatever you did to make the door open again? Is the corridor still the same length as it was or is it shrinking?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Saturday, July 19, 2008 - 10:23 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Sorry about not being on here, was at camp for the past 5 days :P Fun? (:

Interesting solution... I like it :D (:
Can you do whatever you did to make the door open again? You hold the bottle on the other side of the hole. Is the corridor still the same length as it was or is it shrinking? Its length is not changing; it has stayed at its extended length.
Biograd (Biograd)
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Posted on Sunday, July 20, 2008 - 1:38 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

First, try sticking your arm through the hole, without the bottle in your hand, and watch the door as you do so (the reason will become clear below)

Then, if the door does NOT open when you do this, try throwing the bottle through the hole (or equivalently, sticking it all the way through and dropping it). This should keep the door open so you can exit the corridor: the "arm check" was to verify it is the bottle being on the other side that is operating the door, not your arm sticking through the hole, in which case throwing the bottle through would do nothing more than make you lose it.
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Sunday, July 20, 2008 - 3:25 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

First, try sticking your arm through the hole, without the bottle in your hand, and watch the door as you do so (the reason will become clear below) The door remains locked/closed

Then, if the door does NOT open when you do this, try throwing the bottle through the hole (or equivalently, sticking it all the way through and dropping it). This should keep the door open so you can exit the corridor: the "arm check" was to verify it is the bottle being on the other side that is operating the door, not your arm sticking through the hole, in which case throwing the bottle through would do nothing more than make you lose it. I was waiting for this. (:

You hold the bottle on the other side of the hole and then drop it.
Rather than falling as you would expect it to, it drifts away from you as if floating in space. The substance stops falling and drifts also, rising and becoming one large swirling mass.
The floor beneath your feet stops buzzing and starts moving towards the wall with the hole, as if it is one large conveyor belt.

You know better than to wait around; you grab your candle and run for the door, against the direction of the floor - which is slowly accelerating. At the midpoint of the corridor the floor stops accelerating and continues moving towards the spiral wall with a constant velocity. You push on: your progress is slow but definite.

You glance back, just for a moment, to see what has happened with the substance.
It has drifted back towards the hole and completely filled it, closing you off from the other side of the wall. Next it begins to move through the hole and exiting on your side spreads evenly in all directions until it has completely covered that wall: apparently no longer responding to gravity.

A horrific thought occurs to you and you turn back to look at the door. It takes a while for you to be sure of what you're seeing, considering the floor was moving you away from the door in the first place, but it is clear that it is now receding at a much faster rate; the spirals have been connected, the corridor is getting longer!

You glance back again. The substance is moving towards you like a large black wall, it's relatively slow but it is gaining on you. You don't have long to decide your course of action!

There's no way you feel you could outrun all these hinderances (the lengthing corridor, the moving floor and the wall of substance), furthermore you're beginning to tire; the situation looks hopeless!
Biograd (Biograd)
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Posted on Sunday, July 20, 2008 - 7:28 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I assume, even though you didn't spell it out, that the door is open now. Is that correct?

Also, the fact that the buzzing stopped indicates that this resulted from something other than the bottle being through the hole. Since before you had your arm through the hole, there was a path between the bottle of liquid on the other side and the floor, through your body, I guess that could have something to do with it. So let's try this:

Reach toward the substance and get your finger stuck at one point only. If necessary, you should be able to use the candle with your eyes closed to attract a "finger" of the liquid toward you, to facilitate this. If this does nothing, you can free yourself with the candle. If this completes some circuit and makes the floor change direction, or something like that, then don't unstick yourself. If I understand the substance's properties correctly, you should be able to run as fast as you like while maintaining contact with the substance at that point, allowing a long string of the substance to grow indefinitely behind you as you run, and that string should not break due to the infinite elasticity.
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Monday, July 21, 2008 - 1:59 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I assume, even though you didn't spell it out, that the door is open now. Is that correct? That is correct. Sorry for missing that detail.

Also, the fact that the buzzing stopped indicates that this resulted from something other than the bottle being through the hole. Since before you had your arm through the hole, there was a path between the bottle of liquid on the other side and the floor, through your body, I guess that could have something to do with it. So let's try this:

Reach toward the substance and get your finger stuck at one point only. If necessary, you should be able to use the candle with your eyes closed to attract a "finger" of the liquid toward you, to facilitate this. If this does nothing, you can free yourself with the candle. If this completes some circuit and makes the floor change direction, or something like that, then don't unstick yourself. If I understand the substance's properties correctly, you should be able to run as fast as you like while maintaining contact with the substance at that point, allowing a long string of the substance to grow indefinitely behind you as you run, and that string should not break due to the infinite elasticity. You reach out and touch the liquid, you can just about manage this - running backwards to prevent any part of yourself but your finger from touching it.

The floor does not change direction or velocity or begin to buzz (or behave in any other way different to how it was before you touched the wall of substance). You believe the buzzing to have been merely an indication that the floor could move/ had a more important role to be discovered.

You free yourself from the substance and start running properly again. The door is like a small white square in the distance; you can't see how you could possibly reach it now.
Biograd (Biograd)
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Posted on Monday, July 21, 2008 - 3:53 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I am almost completely at a loss now as far as what to do. Does closing your eyes do anything whatsoever at this point, aside from reversing the colors?

Also, how wide or high is this corridor? I remember that the floor and ceiling are one color, and the walls are another. Is it possible to reach the ceiling? To reach out and touch the two walls simultaneously? If either or both of these is possible, try them, both with your eyes open and closed.
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Monday, July 21, 2008 - 4:13 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I am almost completely at a loss now as far as what to do. Does closing your eyes do anything whatsoever at this point, aside from reversing the colors? The solution to this stage is bit of a lateral leap but just try everything (there aren't that many options - although it has been interesting reading your attempts and the effects you expect/hope them to have) and you'll get there. And remember, "it's impossible to get stuck".

If it still looks like your getting nowhere, to save the puzzle from dying, I will try to direct your thoughts a little.


Yes, the yellow wall of substance moves towards you (or rather the candle you're holding) much faster.


Also, how wide or high is this corridor? I remember that the floor and ceiling are one color, and the walls are another. Is it possible to reach the ceiling? To reach out and touch the two walls simultaneously? If either or both of these is possible, try them, both with your eyes open and closed. The gap from ceiling to floor is too large to touch both simultaneously. You can touch both walls simultaneously but this has no effect.
Crazypalpig (Crazypalpig)
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Posted on Monday, July 21, 2008 - 5:34 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Wonderful. Now, we have a big ball of goo, a floor moving the wrong way, and a door that's moving. That's great...

Try what you did earlier, and let the honey get really close to the candle then open your eyes again. Do you get moved at all? If this has no effect, try moving by pressing against the walls...
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Monday, July 21, 2008 - 10:01 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Wonderful. Now, we have a big ball of goo, a floor moving the wrong way, and a door that's moving. That's great...

Try what you did earlier, and let the honey get really close to the candle then open your eyes again. Do you get moved at all? As you close your eyes the substance quickly covers the distance you'd put between it and yourself (and the candle). You open your eyes and it explodes back down the corridor away from you, but not quite as far away as it had been, before pursuing you again. If this has no effect, try moving by pressing against the walls... Walking close to the wall? The entire floor is moving... there is no small non-moving 'ledge' you can move along. You do not see how moving like this could help.
Crazypalpig (Crazypalpig)
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Posted on Tuesday, July 22, 2008 - 12:06 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Not like that, but pushing against both walls (As in the non gooey ones)
Biograd (Biograd)
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Posted on Tuesday, July 22, 2008 - 7:23 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Before giving away the answer, if it gets to the point where you are tempted to do so, let us know first if we have discovered all the relevant properties of the objects in the room. That way, we would be able to focus either on combining the things we already know we can do, or trying to interact with things in a new way (like my suggestion about touching the walls together).
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Tuesday, July 22, 2008 - 8:16 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Not like that, but pushing against both walls (As in the non gooey ones) I assume you mean straddling the corridor as suggested was possible earlier. - By alternating supporting yourself between your hands and feet you're able to move in the corridor without touching the floor. Moving like this is faster as it allows you to avoid the floor, but much more tiring and not quite fast enough to contend with the speed at which the corridor is lengthening and the substance gaining on you.

Before giving away the answer, if it gets to the point where you are tempted to do so, let us know first if we have discovered all the relevant properties of the objects in the room. That way, we would be able to focus either on combining the things we already know we can do, or trying to interact with things in a new way (like my suggestion about touching the walls together). You have already discovered all the relevant properties of this room except arguably one of one 'object', however this will become apparent in natural course through the exploration of existing object properties.

Also I will not give away the answer for any stage of this puzzle, only direction/hints. (The previous situation was not an originally intended obstacle and hence an exception.)
Biograd (Biograd)
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Posted on Tuesday, July 22, 2008 - 9:41 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

How much does the candle repel this substance? If you were to place the candle on the floor and let yourself and the candle (together) drift toward the wall of substance as the floor moves, would the substance be repelled up to the ceiling, leaving a space underneath for you to fit in and get back to the hole to do something?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Wednesday, July 23, 2008 - 2:30 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

How much does the candle repel this substance? If you were to place the candle on the floor and let yourself and the candle (together) drift toward the wall of substance as the floor moves, would the substance be repelled up to the ceiling, leaving a space underneath for you to fit in and get back to the hole to do something? You crouch down low and hold the candle as close as you dare, watching the substance wall as it draws closer... As the candle nears the wall it appears to slow. Barely a metre from it, it appears to not be moving at all: although in reality it is simply receeding from you at the same velocity as the floor is moving.

You stand up and hold the candle out ahead of you, beginning to believe that simply by waiting like this you could force the substance right back to the spiral wall, but then you notice the top of the substance wall isn't as much affected as the bottom and the substance is gradually curving and towering over you...

You hold the candle up to the substance and it stretches above you and flows down the other side between you and the door. It touches the floor and you find yourself trapped inside a large, black, 'substance cave'.

'How much further was it to the spiral wall?' You've no idea, the stretching of the corridor has made it practically impossible to estimate.

The cave begins to shrink, collapsing in on you, but surely it will never touch you, not whilst you have the candle...
You look down at the candle, the flame is dying. There is not enough oxygen for it! You begin to feel dizzy from the lack of oxygen yourself. You can't stay here, you have to act fast... no oxygen for you means you'll weaken and won't be able to act and no oxygen for the candle means this cave will bury you. But no oxygen for you could also mean no conciousness and the moment you close your eyes you wouldn't stand a chance... You have to get out. You run against the moving floor, holding the failing candle out ahead of you.

'How long ago had the substance come down to the floor on this side?' It seems like you've further to go to lift it again.

You struggle onwards, holding your breath as much as possible to conserve oxygen for the candle. Your lungs are on fire and you stumble, ready to collapse when suddenly the ambient glow of the ceiling lights floods in through a narrow slit between the substance ahead of you and the floor. Cool, oxygen-rich air rapidly diffuses into your cave and the candle burns brightly again.
The sudden burst of extra strength in the candle causes the substance to errupt back and over your head and you find yourself in exactly the same position as when you started...
Crazypalpig (Crazypalpig)
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Posted on Wednesday, July 23, 2008 - 2:27 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

So let me get this straight: Whenever you open the door, the floor moves and corridor stretches? If you move the bottle again, is it possible to get to the end of the corridor and throw it back into the hole again?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Wednesday, July 23, 2008 - 3:17 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

So let me get this straight: Whenever you open the door, the floor moves and corridor stretches? If you move the bottle again, is it possible to get to the end of the corridor and throw it back into the hole again? No, none of this is correct, sorry. (:

The bottle is lost on the other side of the hole. The bottle's presence on the other side causes the door to open, and that it is not being held on the other side causes the floor to be moving.

The bottle is also still producing the substance which has found its way back through the hole and spread itself evenly over the spiral wall - connecting the spirals has caused the corridor to stretch. The substance meanwhile is expanding down the corridor towards you in the form of a large black wall of substance.

The substance also appears to be reacting much more strongly to the candle's flame which can push the entire wall back a considerable distance but only to a point where the pressure becomes too great and it spills over above you (where the force of the candle is weakest). With your eyes closed it can pull the wall towards itself alarmingly fast.

Using what you know about the behaviour of the room and its objects you are to find a way to progress. However you have also been told that the way forward will be bit of a lateral leap - and because of the nature of the leap I'm not sure if you'll be able to discover it, but then you don't have many options available to you.
The corridor is stretching, the floor is moving away from an open door and towards a wall which itself is moving towards you, you yourself are tiring from your attempts to escape it, you don't have long to decide how to act.

I hope this is clear enough. (:
Crazypalpig (Crazypalpig)
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Posted on Wednesday, July 23, 2008 - 10:00 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

So it's the connecting of the two spirals...

Let the conveyor belt get you to the spiral-wall. Put the candle next to the spirals and let it repulse the goo. Does it work?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Wednesday, July 23, 2008 - 11:15 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

So it's the connecting of the two spirals...

Let the conveyor belt get you to the spiral-wall. Put the candle next to the spirals and let it repulse the goo. Does it work? This will not work. Please read my reply to Biograd's post: Wednesday, July 23, 2008 - 2:30 am (the hole being in the spiral wall)
Biograd (Biograd)
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Posted on Thursday, July 24, 2008 - 9:03 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Let me try to recap what we know, specifically relating to what happens when what touches what, so that I can verify...

There are essentially 8 "things" in the picture:
1. The gooey substance
2. The bottle
3. The candle
4. The wall with the spirals
5. The floor
6. The ceiling
7. The side walls (presumed equivalent, as no evidence to the contrary)
8. Yourself

-The substance has always been in contact with the bottle, and always will be. Therefore, the effect of this is moot.
-The substance also never touches the candle, or at least it might if your eyes were closed, but you'd better avoid this, or the candle would be smothered. When not touching, the substance is either attracted or repelled by the flame (depending on your eyes).
-As far as the walls go, the only one that does something when contacted by the liquid is the one with the spirals, and this makes the corridor grow longer. The substance has contacted the floor many times, without effect. If it could be made to touch the ceiling, it would already have, again without effect, and it must have touched the side walls, or you could get by it.
-The substance touching yourself does nothing but get you stuck to it.

Now on to the bottle...
-When you hold the bottle, nothing happens until you place it completely through the hole in the wall with the spirals
-At this point, if you are still holding it, the floor buzzes but does not move. This touching must be direct--contacting it indirectly through the liquid does nothing. The door opens.
-If you let it go, the floor moves toward the spiral wall. The direction is independent of whether your eyes are open or closed. The door remains open.
-The bottle has clearly touched the floor, but to my knowledge has not been touched to the side walls. This might be something to try, except at this point the bottle is well out of reach.

-As for the walls, of course they don't touch each other directly, except for at the corners. You cannot touch the ceiling, and you are always touching the floor with your feet. Touching the side walls does nothing. Also, you touched the wall with the spirals when trying to draw a line, without effect. In other words, the only way in which your body itself causes anything to happen to the room is when it is touching the bottle on the other side of the hole.

If all of this is correct, I see nothing new to try, that can be tried.
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Thursday, July 24, 2008 - 10:29 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

This is a response to the above post however as my only reply was to be posted at the end of it I decided not to repost it as it was quite long. (:

Actually you haven't touched the ceiling... which you could do by putting enough space between you and the substance to give yourself enough time to climb up between the walls to reach it. However I can volunteer that this would have no effect. (:

As for your list of points, they are all completely correct... except for one, which contains a FA... unfortunately it's against my own rules for this puzzle to indicate which one as everything you learn has to be through experimentation...
Biograd (Biograd)
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Posted on Friday, July 25, 2008 - 9:04 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Well, since we are not stuck, the FA cannot have to do with the bottle or spiral wall, since these are out of reach and therefore untestable, right?

Let me verify that you have, in fact, observed the substance touch all 5 "walls" (i.e. all walls except the door, and the floor and ceiling)--or am I misinterpreting something you said?

As a rather random guess as to what the FA could be, does anything new happen when you close just ONE eye? Does half of the substance look (and "behave") black and the other half yellow?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Friday, July 25, 2008 - 2:24 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Well, since we are not stuck, the FA cannot have to do with the bottle or spiral wall, since these are out of reach and therefore untestable, right? correct

Let me verify that you have, in fact, observed the substance touch all 5 "walls" (i.e. all walls except the door, and the floor and ceiling)--or am I misinterpreting something you said? The substance is touching both side-walls, the ceiling and the floor and completely covers the spiral wall.

As a rather random guess as to what the FA could be, does anything new happen when you close just ONE eye? Does half of the substance look (and "behave") black and the other half yellow? No. It seems that the substance only becomes yellow when both eyes are completely closed.
Biograd (Biograd)
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Posted on Friday, July 25, 2008 - 11:22 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

How about touching the floor with your hands instead of just your feet? Also, does anything happen if you touch the side walls in sequence rather than simultaneously?

Ignoring those are the only other assumptions I can see that I have made. Everything else comes from something you said explicitly.
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Saturday, July 26, 2008 - 9:10 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

How about touching the floor with your hands instead of just your feet? nothing happens Also, does anything happen if you touch the side walls in sequence rather than simultaneously? no

Ignoring those are the only other assumptions I can see that I have made. Everything else comes from something you said explicitly. Hmm.. no there is another FA.

Would you like a hint?
Biograd (Biograd)
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Posted on Sunday, July 27, 2008 - 12:46 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Let me go over the things again, omitting everything to do with the bottle and spiral wall, and quote the times of the posts (in italics). I think there may be a simple verbal misunderstanding:

-The substance also never touches the candle, or at least it might if your eyes were closed, but you'd better avoid this, or the candle would be smothered. When not touching, the substance is either attracted or repelled by the flame (depending on your eyes). (July 02, 2008 - 8:50 am)
-If [the substance] could be made to touch the ceiling, it would already have, again without effect, and it must have touched the side walls, or you could get by it. (verified at July 25, 2008 - 2:24 pm, it has clearly been happening all along)
-The substance touching yourself does nothing but get you stuck to it. (July 21, 2008 - 1:59 am: The floor not reacting is spelled out. If the corridor had stopped growing, the door should not look "like a small white square in the distance", since you are already canceling the velocity of the floor by running to keep ahead of the substance wall. The only other possible effect is the door closing, which wouldn't help us)

-...the floor moves toward the spiral wall. The direction is independent of whether your eyes are open or closed. The door remains open. (July 21, 2008 - 4:13 pm)

-As for the walls, of course they don't touch each other directly, except for at the corners. (how else?) You cannot touch the ceiling (clarified at July 24, 2008 - 10:29 pm), and you are always touching the floor with your feet (how else??). Touching the side walls does nothing (same as previous, plus July 21, 2008 - 4:13 pm). In other words, the only way in which your body itself causes anything to happen to the room is when it is touching the bottle on the other side of the hole. (by exhaustive attempts at touching everything)

If there is STILL a FA, then give me a hint.
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Sunday, July 27, 2008 - 1:55 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

There IS still an FA.

Hint: As I've often repeated, "
it's impossible to get stuck" and as I once explained, "I will intervene if you attempt an action that is both irreversible and not the correct way to progress."
I even hinted in the same post that the "
very lateral among you will be able to work out what this means in terms of how to progress" and it is this direction of thought I will now volunteer;

Just how stuck could you get if you tried?
Zenith (Zenith)
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Posted on Sunday, July 27, 2008 - 2:28 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

When your eyes are closed, does the 'wall of goo' travel faster then the corridor is lengthening? Is it possible for you to imbed yourself into this wall: whilst keeping the goo from your face with the candle, then alternating closing your eyes and opening them to transport yourself to the door, yet remining able to breathe?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Sunday, July 27, 2008 - 1:57 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

When your eyes are closed, does the 'wall of goo' travel faster then the corridor is lengthening? yope, it travels faster when your eyes are closed but the speed at which it travels is dependent on its distance from the candle. Within an armslength it does not travel as fast as the corridor is expanding.. Is it possible for you to imbed yourself into this wall: whilst keeping the goo from your face with the candle, then alternating closing your eyes and opening them to transport yourself to the door, yet remining able to breathe? ..so this will not work.
Unleashedllama (Unleashedllama)
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Posted on Thursday, July 31, 2008 - 8:36 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

If it's impossible to get stuck, try diving headlong into the goo with your eyes closed (only if you think this may help)
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Thursday, July 31, 2008 - 3:03 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

If it's impossible to get stuck, try diving headlong into the goo with your eyes closed (only if you think this may help) This would most likely result in half of you trapped inside the substance and the other half (probably your feet) sticking out. Is this the most stuck you could get?
Unleashedllama (Unleashedllama)
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Posted on Thursday, July 31, 2008 - 3:29 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

How about putting the candle down, or even throwing it away and staying still and waiting for the goo to totally engulf you? Would this happen or would you stick to the surface?

If this wouldn't work, I'm trying to think of a way of you bombing into the gunk, like you're not allowed to do at the swimming pool.
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Thursday, July 31, 2008 - 7:39 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

How about putting the candle down, or even throwing it away and staying still and waiting for the goo to totally engulf you? If complete submersion is what you're after you would probably want to try a faster approach, given that you're already aware that you cannot breathe when only partially stuck in the substance... Would this happen or would you stick to the surface? ...and you will probably just get stuck to the surface. You suspect the substance would slowly creep round you but most of its force would contribute to gradually pushing you down the corridor.

If this wouldn't work, I'm trying to think of a way of you bombing into the gunk, like you're not allowed to do at the swimming pool. (:
Arek_fu (Arek_fu)
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Posted on Thursday, July 31, 2008 - 10:44 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

A faster way to get stuck would be to start digging into the goo with your hands and feet, rolling yourself in it as you proceed... I suppose you would eventually end up with the substance covering every bit of your body, but for some reason that doesn't sound very attractive.

A few gazillion posts ago you mentioned lights in the corridor, I think. Are they still there? How do they look? Have they changed in any respect since you entered the corridor? Is the substance repelled/attracted by the lights? Can you touch them? Do they look the same with your eyes open and closed?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Friday, August 01, 2008 - 7:04 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

A faster way to get stuck would be to start digging into the goo with your hands and feet, rolling yourself in it as you proceed... I suppose you would eventually end up with the substance covering every bit of your body, but for some reason that doesn't sound very attractive. Actually you'll probably get as far as getting your arms stuck and then finding you can no longer move.

A few gazillion posts ago you mentioned lights in the corridor, I think. Are they still there? yes How do they look? like lights Have they changed in any respect since you entered the corridor? no Is the substance repelled/attracted by the lights? no Can you touch them? By climbing up between the walls to the ceiling yes - it has no effect Do they look the same with your eyes open and closed? yes
Unleashedllama (Unleashedllama)
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Posted on Tuesday, August 05, 2008 - 8:26 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Earlier you managed to get the gunk to go over you like a wave using the candle. Your problem with this last time was that you were trying not to get stuck, so you were in a constant battle for air with the candle that you desparate to keep lit.

With this in mind could you try getting a wave of gunk over yourself again, only this time, once the crest of the wave is beyond 'tipping point' snuff out the candle with you dampened fingers so the goo will fall and quickly submerge you
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Tuesday, August 05, 2008 - 1:59 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Earlier you managed to get the gunk to go over you like a wave using the candle. Your problem with this last time was that you were trying not to get stuck, so you were in a constant battle for air with the candle that you desparate to keep lit.

With this in mind could you try getting a wave of gunk over yourself again, only this time, once the crest of the wave is beyond 'tipping point' snuff out the candle with you dampened fingers so the goo will fall and quickly submerge you Excellent solution. (You could have also used the attractive ability of the candle when your eyes are closed to force the substance to move faster: placing the candle away from yourself so that the substance doesn't slow as it gets closer to you. However this is sufficient.)

The substance completely envelopes you and you're suddenly hit by a wave of air.
You're falling very fast throw the darkness which reminds you of the darkness you were surrounded by at the beginning however, in this darkness, you can still see yourself clearly and move.

Up above you, you can see a giant concrete shape which appears to be the outside of the two previous rooms and the corridor which now seems as short as it was when you first stepped into it. You can also see the small round hole at the end of the corridor and the lights on the ceiling: it is as if you've been sucked through the hole and the bottle and the substance completely vanished.

You wonder how long you're going to fall for, the rooms have almost shrunk to nothing, when suddenly you hit a surface that feels like the substance again. The force with which you hit it is enough to push you deep down into it and once more it completely envelopes you - then you emerge from the other side.

You fall into a giant room, landing on a giant marshmellow.
The ceiling above you is a glossy black and reminds you of the substance from the corridor but here it does not move.
You climb off the marshmellow and take in your surroundings.

There are a pair of giant curtains on one wall. Against the next is a giant balance (with one side almost touching the floor) and standing next to that (on the end/side of the balance which is raised) with its back to the next wall, is a giant bookshelf filled with giant books (there's one on the top shelf partly sticking out but you can't see what it is), and in the centre of the room is a giant cymbal-banging monkey toy (currently stationary). The final wall is bare.

Finally, in addition to these things there are a few small objects scattered on the floor; an empty bottle, a broken lightbulb, a stopper and an unlit candle. All very familiar. ;)
Unleashedllama (Unleashedllama)
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Posted on Thursday, August 07, 2008 - 8:27 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Try looking behind the curtains (if they can be reached) and the balance. Anything to report behind them?

This giant cymbal-bashing monkey: it's not opperating at the moment, but can you see how it does? Does it require a battery? If not, is it mechanical? If you can wind it up, please do so.
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Thursday, August 07, 2008 - 1:28 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Try looking behind the curtains (if they can be reached) and the balance. Anything to report behind them? The curtains extend to the floor. You walk behind them and discover a giant window through which you can see a view you recognise; it is the same view as from your bedroom window. There is a bus waiting on the road...

There is nothing to report behind the balance, however when you got closer you could see that there is a large rock in the lowered cup.


This giant cymbal-bashing monkey: it's not opperating at the moment, but can you see how it does? There's a switch here on it... you move it but nothing happens. You move it back, still nothing. Does it require a battery? It appears to; there is a covered battery compartment here on the back... The screw is lose but just out of reach.If not, is it mechanical? It is not mechanical If you can wind it up, please do so.
Biograd (Biograd)
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Posted on Thursday, August 07, 2008 - 11:16 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is the rock big enough to break the window if thrown at it (and small enough to pick up)? Does this look like it would accomplish anything--i.e. are you a long way above the street outside, or would there be hope to get out, possibly hanging from something?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Friday, August 08, 2008 - 12:06 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is the rock big enough to break the window if thrown at it (and small enough to pick up)? The window looked very thick (it was to scale) - you don't think you could break it. The rock is small enough to pick up but very heavy, you don't think you could throw it either. Does this look like it would accomplish anything--i.e. are you a long way above the street outside, or would there be hope to get out, possibly hanging from something? You are too high up to jump, you can't see any way of escaping by the window.
Biograd (Biograd)
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Posted on Wednesday, August 13, 2008 - 10:14 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is the lowered cup of the balance low enough for you to climb onto it? If so, try doing so, and then walk across the balance to the raised cup. Is your weight enough to tip the balance?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Thursday, August 14, 2008 - 8:30 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is the lowered cup of the balance low enough for you to climb onto it? Yes If so, try doing so, and then walk across the balance to the raised cup. Is your weight enough to tip the balance? The cup has lowered to the ground due to your extra weight, the arm is too steep to climb.
Crazypalpig (Crazypalpig)
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Posted on Friday, August 15, 2008 - 2:25 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Interesting... what does the empty bottle look like now? Can you reach the bookshelf? Can you climb the bookshelf?

Oh bother, I just realized we now need the battery... And where did the light bulb come from? Can you light the candle again using the sunlight and the glass bottle? Is there anything heavier than you in this room? Can you lift any of it?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Sunday, August 17, 2008 - 2:44 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Interesting... what does the empty bottle look like now? A clear glass conical flask Can you reach the bookshelf? no Can you climb the bookshelf? so no

Oh bother, I just realized we now need the battery... And where did the light bulb come from? see Friday, July 04, 2008 - 12:50 am Can you light the candle again using the sunlight and the glass bottle? Inventive, however the glass doesn't focus the sunlight well enough. Is there anything heavier than you in this room? The bookshelf, the books, the monkey and the balance. Can you lift any of it? No: all you are able to lift at the moment are the flask, the broken lightbulb, the stopper, the candle, and the rock in the balance.
Crazypalpig (Crazypalpig)
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Posted on Monday, August 18, 2008 - 2:14 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Oh right. Lol.

Stand on the rock. Can you reach the screw now? If you can, please unscrew it. Will the battery from earlier fit in there? And let me get this straight: The marshmellow is the floor of the room, right? Eat some, maybe the sugar will do you some good ;)
Can you throw anything up to the other side of the balance? Try throwing a small piece of marshmellow up there. Does it come down?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Monday, August 18, 2008 - 2:59 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Oh right. Lol.

Stand on the rock. Can you reach the screw now? you take the rock from the balance and watch as the balance arm levels itself above you. Placing the rock beneath the panel on the back of the monkey you discover you are able to reach the screw loosely holding it in place. If you can, please unscrew it. you unscrew it and remove the panel. You're hit by a sudden avalanche of small rocks that were concealled in the compartment. However you manage to avoid the worst of it. Will the battery from earlier fit in there? You clear out the remaining rocks and examine the size of the compartment... you decide the battery you saw earlier (in the green room) would fit perfectly in here. And let me get this straight: The marshmellow is the floor of the room, right? no; it is just another object in the room, about the size of a mattress but suprisingly heavy. I should have included it in the list of heavier-than-you objects in my previous post. Eat some, maybe the sugar will do you some good ;) It's difficult to bite, it just gets very sticky and doesn't taste that nice...
Can you throw anything up to the other side of the balance? Probabily, it's not too high anymore. Try throwing a small piece of marshmellow up there. Does it come down? You try to rip a small bit off the marshmellow but find it too tough. You look around you for an alternative... the rocks look like they'll do. You select one of the smallest and throw it up. You miss the cup the first time but get it in your second attempt. The arm slowly lowers...
Crazypalpig (Crazypalpig)
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Posted on Monday, August 18, 2008 - 6:24 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Interesting. Do all the rocks combined weigh to the same amount as you?

Can you throw rocks from one side of the beam to the other? Go to the lowered end (nearest the bookshelf) and stand inside it with all the rocks, and throw them into the other side. Can you reach the book now?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Monday, August 18, 2008 - 8:55 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Interesting. Do all the rocks combined weigh to the same amount as you? Possibly, maybe more.

Can you throw rocks from one side of the beam to the other? yes Go to the lowered end (nearest the bookshelf) and stand inside it with all the rocks, and throw them into the other side. Can you reach the book now? yes (:

The book has a picture of a door on it which looks almost real... you reach out to touch it but as you do the door swings open and your doppelgänger steps out and to the side to let you through. Behind him, through the doorway you see the corridor from the red room that your doppelgänger had taken...
Biograd (Biograd)
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Posted on Monday, August 18, 2008 - 9:20 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

So the book is so big that it has a picture of a door on the cover that is large enough you could walk through it?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Monday, August 18, 2008 - 9:59 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

So the book is so big that it has a picture of a door on the cover that is large enough you could walk through it? ..yes :P
Unleashedllama (Unleashedllama)
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Posted on Monday, August 18, 2008 - 10:17 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I'm guessing it's time to go and get that battery then? Is there a problem with moving that battery? Is the problem weight related, or is it fixed to something?

If it's a weight problem, is your doppelgänger the same size as you? If he happens to be be bigger could he move the battery?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Tuesday, August 19, 2008 - 1:27 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I'm guessing it's time to go and get that battery then? It could help Is there a problem with moving that battery? I think you're getting ahead of yourself... Is the problem weight related, or is it fixed to something?

If it's a weight problem, is your doppelgänger the same size as you? If he happens to be be bigger could he move the battery?
Crazypalpig (Crazypalpig)
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Posted on Tuesday, August 19, 2008 - 1:32 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Oh no. Just a second, can you give us a view of the room with your doppleganger as it is now, if you can step inside the book?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Tuesday, August 19, 2008 - 2:54 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Oh no. Just a second, can you give us a view of the room with your doppleganger as it is now, if you can step inside the book? You can step 'inside the book' through the door - through the door is the corridor your doppelgänger took leading from the red room (Sunday, June 22, 2008 - 6:45 pm).
The corridor is long and narrow with blue walls and black ceiling and floor. The side walls are bare, the floor also, the ceiling has a long row of dome shaped lights along its length.
Crazypalpig (Crazypalpig)
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Posted on Tuesday, August 19, 2008 - 6:06 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Close your eyes... Is this corridor similar(at least dimensions-wise) to the other corridor with the ooze stuff? Your doppelgänger is there with you correct? Can you talk to him?(That'd be weird...)
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Wednesday, August 20, 2008 - 12:17 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Close your eyes... Is this corridor similar(at least dimensions-wise) to the other corridor with the ooze stuff? With eyes closed all you see is black. This corridor possesses the same dimensions the last corridor had when you first entered it. Your doppelgänger is there with you correct? correct, it's following you. Can you talk to him?(That'd be weird...) You don't know what to say to it... you try 'hello', it just smiles back at you.
Crazypalpig (Crazypalpig)
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Posted on Wednesday, August 20, 2008 - 12:06 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Can you go back and get the bottle? I want to see if it will do anything here...
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Wednesday, August 20, 2008 - 1:14 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Can you go back and get the bottle? I want to see if it will do anything here... You make everything sound so easy! :P
Go back and get the bottle how?
Crazypalpig (Crazypalpig)
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Posted on Wednesday, August 20, 2008 - 9:14 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Ack not again...

Will your Doppelganger go through the door with you? If he will, try putting both of you into the balance, then both get out and hope the floor survives the impact of the rocks ;) If you can't do that, are there any books on the shelf you can move?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Wednesday, August 20, 2008 - 9:39 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Ack not again...

Will your Doppelganger go through the door with you? If he will, try putting both of you into the balance, then both get out and hope the floor survives the impact of the rocks ;) If you can't do that, are there any books on the shelf you can move? your doppelgänger refuses to step into the balance cup. The books are too heavy to move.
Crazypalpig (Crazypalpig)
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Posted on Wednesday, August 20, 2008 - 10:04 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I know! Jump into the marshmellow again (Don't miss. It'll hurt.)
Biograd (Biograd)
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Posted on Thursday, August 21, 2008 - 1:48 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is the door into the red room from the corridor locked? If not, try walking through it.
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Thursday, August 21, 2008 - 4:40 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I know! Jump into the marshmellow again (Don't miss. It'll hurt.) It's too far from the edge to jump to...


Is the door into the red room from the corridor locked? If not, try walking through it. You nervously walk down the corridor, hoping you don't get accidently trigger anything and get stuck in here for almost 100 [96] posts.
Tentatively you reach out and touch the red door...

It opens for you and you step back into the red room on the side your doppelgänger stood - speaking of which, you turn round to find him waiting in the corridor. It seems he does not want to come into this room again.

The door opposite to you is closed and posesses a handle. The door you just stepped through has a lock on it from which a key protrudes.
There is a thick, clear, plastic tube in the centre of the room stretching from floor to ceiling with a small doorway in it. Inside there is a red button.

You cast your mind back and remember how you had got to this room from the one below by having your reflection press a similar button whilst having your eyes closed and how you seemed to pass up through the floor to a spot on the other side of this room that mirrors the position of the tube on this side.
Crazypalpig (Crazypalpig)
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Posted on Thursday, August 21, 2008 - 9:11 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Oh, there was a door? Oops...

So... Close your eyes again... Which side is the door on anyhow? If it's already on your side, go in and press the red button. If not... No idea yet
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Thursday, August 21, 2008 - 9:52 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Oh, there was a door? Oops...

So... Close your eyes again... Which side is the door on anyhow? There are two doors... I'm not sure I completely understand your question... If it's already on your side, go in and press the red button. If not... No idea yet
Crazypalpig (Crazypalpig)
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Posted on Friday, August 22, 2008 - 11:34 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Sorry, the door in the plastic tube
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Friday, August 22, 2008 - 5:07 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Sorry, the door in the plastic tube ah, the doorway...

So... Close your eyes again... Which side is the door on anyhow? The tube (and therefore the door way) are all on your side of the room...

__''__<1
__ __<2
__O__<3
__,,__<4


*1. red door with handle
*2. opposite side, no tube. This half of THIS room IS accessible.
*3. the side of the room you are on. O = tube with door way leading into it and red button inside.
*4. red door (with lock and key) that you came through.

If it's already on your side, go in and press the red button. If not... No idea yet Assuming you were unsure of the accessibility of the button but would like to press it: you enter the tube and press the red button, suddenly... nothing happened...
Crazypalpig (Crazypalpig)
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Posted on Saturday, August 23, 2008 - 10:35 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Try to bring your doppelgänger into the tube, get him to press it...
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Saturday, August 23, 2008 - 10:12 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Try to bring your doppelgänger into the tube, get him to press it... it refuses to follow you and resists your pushing, pulling, proding and begging.
Crazypalpig (Crazypalpig)
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Posted on Sunday, August 24, 2008 - 12:16 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Go to the other side of the room, and open the door. Still the same?
Now that you're on that side, can you make your doppelganger mirror you?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Sunday, August 24, 2008 - 12:32 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Go to the other side of the room, and open the door. Still the same? This door will not open
Now that you're on that side, can you make your doppelganger mirror you? Your doppelgänger refuses to come into the room and waits in the corridor.
Crazypalpig (Crazypalpig)
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Posted on Monday, August 25, 2008 - 2:14 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Arg... So we are stuck with trying to make him copy you... I'm positive that's what we have to do. I hope.

Close your eyes again, then try making him mirror you.

Take the key out of the door? Does that do anything?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Monday, August 25, 2008 - 6:55 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Arg... So we are stuck with trying to make him copy you... I'm positive that's what we have to do. I hope.

Close your eyes again, then try making him mirror you. With your eyes closed you cannot see your doppelgänger

Take the key out of the door? You take the key Does that do anything? nothing happens spontaneously
Crazypalpig (Crazypalpig)
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Posted on Tuesday, August 26, 2008 - 1:09 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Now can you open the locked door?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Tuesday, August 26, 2008 - 3:18 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Now can you open the locked door? There is no lock on the door to unlock it with
Biograd (Biograd)
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Posted on Tuesday, August 26, 2008 - 10:16 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did you try pressing the red button with your eyes closed? If not, try it.
Crazypalpig (Crazypalpig)
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Posted on Tuesday, August 26, 2008 - 10:52 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

No, I meant the door to the extending room, on wall 1... You said there was a handle on it.
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Wednesday, August 27, 2008 - 1:51 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did you try pressing the red button with your eyes closed? If not, try it. You close your eyes and press the button. Immediately you feel the familiar sinking sensation as you pass through the floor and into the room below. When you stop moving you open your eyes to find yourself inside a solid, transparent, plastic tube, standing beside a green button. Outside of the tube you can see a giant battery, a lever on the wall, a picture of a lock painted on the wall in the other half of the room and a pane of glass between the two halves... and your reflection in the glass... except... it appears to be doing whatever it wants and is freely wandering around its half of the room...


No, I meant the door to the extending room, on wall 1... You said there was a handle on it. Okay. It would have still been locked
Biograd (Biograd)
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Posted on Wednesday, August 27, 2008 - 2:39 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

So you are now on the side of the green room that was previously inaccessible?

Does your "reflection" respond at all if you try to get its attention by waving, speaking, etc.?
Crazypalpig (Crazypalpig)
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Posted on Wednesday, August 27, 2008 - 2:14 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Darn, I forgot to do that...

You're on the side with the battery, (I think?) So try to pick up the battery and bring it to the tube please
If you can't, close your eyes, and try doing what Biograd said
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Thursday, August 28, 2008 - 2:52 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

So you are now on the side of the green room that was previously inaccessible? yes

Does your "reflection" respond at all if you try to get its attention by waving, speaking, etc.? It waves back at you when you wave


Darn, I forgot to do that...

You're on the side with the battery, (I think?) So try to pick up the battery and bring it to the tube please you'll need to get out of the tube yourself first... there's no doorway here.
If you can't, close your eyes, and try doing what Biograd said you close your eyes and speak to the 'reflection' you can't see. It doesn't respond. You try waving at it... you suspect it may wave back again however you can't observe this with your eyes closed... what you do notice is that you can wave your arm further than you could when your eyes were open, the tube is no longer solid. You step outside of it and open your eyes again.

Your reflection is smiling at you. You pick up the battery, which is fairly heavy but liftable, and close your eyes to try putting it into the tube but it appears only you can pass through the walls of the tube (when your eyes are closed) and the battery cannot (when your eyes are open or closed; you tried).
Biograd (Biograd)
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Posted on Thursday, August 28, 2008 - 9:00 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is the pane of glass dividing the two halves of the room solid with your eyes closed? If not, can you push the battery through it?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Friday, August 29, 2008 - 6:07 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is the pane of glass dividing the two halves of the room solid with your eyes closed? It is solid for all objects eyes open or closed If not, can you push the battery through it?
Crazypalpig (Crazypalpig)
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Posted on Friday, August 29, 2008 - 11:06 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Can you break the glass? If not, go back up the tube and... throw the key on the place where the tube would've been on the other half. Anything happen?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Saturday, August 30, 2008 - 4:34 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Can you break the glass? no If not, go back up the tube and... throw the key on the place where the tube would've been on the other half. Anything happen? You're back in the red room. The key lands on the place where the tube would've been on the other half.
Crazypalpig (Crazypalpig)
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Posted on Sunday, August 31, 2008 - 1:28 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

So you definitely cannot get your doppelganger in the hallway to move? Is there a place where a key might go besides the door and the lock? I'm confused on what's on the other side of the glass. Can you explain? Is the tube there?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Sunday, August 31, 2008 - 2:29 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

So you definitely cannot get your doppelganger in the hallway to move? That certainly appears to be the case Is there a place where a key might go besides the door and the lock? You have not seen any other lock apart from that on the door and on the wall in the green room I'm confused on what's on the other side of the glass. Can you explain? Is the tube there? The green room:

The green room is divided into two halves of equal area seperated by a tough pane of glass.
On one side, the side you can now access, there is a transparent tube whose walls you can walk through when your eyes are closed and whose inside possesses a green button that brings you back up to the red room. On that same side of the room there is also a giant battery (which cannot pass through the walls of the tube) and a lever (which you had your reflection pull for you much earlier in the puzzle - the effect of pulling that lever was to make the tube, which had then appeared to be made of metal, become transparent).
On the other side of the green room there is nothing but the painting of the lock on the wall and your 'reflection' which, when you last saw it, was listening to the walls.
Noobdogg (Noobdogg)
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Posted on Sunday, August 31, 2008 - 2:36 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Can you please pull the lever back to the 'metal' position. Also note what effect this has on the tube, you, the other objects in the room (on both sides of the pane) and your delightful doppelgänger.

Remember to do / observe everything both with eyes open and closed.
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Sunday, August 31, 2008 - 2:55 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Can you please pull the lever back to the 'metal' position. Also note what effect this has on the tube, you, the other objects in the room (on both sides of the pane) and your delightful doppelgänger. You pull the lever, watching the tube as you do so, a thin metal tube rises out of the floor around the plastic one. Pulling the lever has no effect on the other objects in the room or yourself but your 'reflection' doesn't look happy with you.

Remember to do / observe everything both with eyes open and closed. You repeat the actions with your eyes closed - there is no difference.
Noobdogg (Noobdogg)
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Posted on Sunday, August 31, 2008 - 3:20 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Yikes we'd better not tick him off!
Pull the lever back to transparent position.

Can you please go back up to the red room and retrieve the key?

Now come to the green room and step outside the tube with your eyes closed.

Is the doppelgänger actually 'listening to the walls'? If so, try that on your side of the room.

I think you have to try and get the key to open the lock painted on the wall on the other side. Do you think this might be useful? Does it appear that our doppelgänger will co-operate in anyway? When you close your eyes, can you see the doppelgänger? If so, find out if he is acting any different.
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Sunday, August 31, 2008 - 7:13 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Yikes we'd better not tick him off!
Pull the lever back to transparent position. Done

Can you please go back up to the red room and retrieve the key? Error... I'd assumed you picked up the key again when you looked round the red and green room, unsuccessfully, for another lock to try it in.

Now come to the green room and step outside the tube with your eyes closed. Done

Is the doppelgänger actually 'listening to the walls'? It was... now it's just staring at the ceiling If so, try that on your side of the room. The walls say "don't listen to the walls!"

I think you have to try and get the key to open the lock painted on the wall on the other side. Do you think this might be useful? This is for you to discover Does it appear that our doppelgänger will co-operate in anyway? There's no telling what it will do When you close your eyes, can you see the doppelgänger? no If so, find out if he is acting any different.
Biograd (Biograd)
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Posted on Monday, September 01, 2008 - 1:53 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

In his aimless(?) meanderings, does the doppelganger ever stand on the spot directly opposite where the tube is? If so, try pressing the green button at precisely one such moment.
Biograd (Biograd)
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Posted on Monday, September 01, 2008 - 1:59 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

If what I last recommended doesn't work, try doing what Crazypalpig suggested earlier, namely putting the keys on the floor directly opposite the tube in the red room. However, this time, get back in the tube and go down to the green room. Are the keys transported down, like you were transported up earlier when your "reflection" ascended in the tube?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Monday, September 01, 2008 - 2:44 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

In his aimless(?) meanderings, does the doppelganger ever stand on the spot directly opposite where the tube is? If so, try pressing the green button at precisely one such moment. You stand in the tube watching him and he watches you watching him... being very careful not to step on that spot... You begin to think he may have access to your thoughts!

If what I last recommended doesn't work, try doing what Crazypalpig suggested earlier, namely putting the keys on the floor directly opposite the tube in the red room. However, this time, get back in the tube and go down to the green room. Are the keys transported down, like you were transported up earlier when your "reflection" ascended in the tube? The key descends with you into the green room and you watch as your reflection snatches it up. You wish to yourself it'd try the key in the lock and as if it heard you it does so... a wall slams up out of the floor and hides the pane of glass and the other half of the room at the same time as the tube drops into the floor leaving the space open.
Biograd (Biograd)
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Posted on Monday, September 01, 2008 - 8:33 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I thought one of those would have to work...

Anyway, so now you can move the battery anywhere you want (except to the other side of the room of course), I'm assuming. Right?

Assuming I'm understanding this correctly, try moving the battery into the space where the tube was before, and stand there with it. If this by itself doesn't make the tube reappear, then try to re-lock the lock with your thoughts by imagining it happening (I know that sounds weird, but it seems as if you might be able to do such things here).
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Monday, September 01, 2008 - 3:40 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I thought one of those would have to work...

Anyway, so now you can move the battery anywhere you want (except to the other side of the room of course), I'm assuming. Right? correct

Assuming I'm understanding this correctly, try moving the battery into the space where the tube was before, and stand there with it. If this by itself doesn't make the tube reappear, then try to re-lock the lock with your thoughts by imagining it happening (I know that sounds weird, but it seems as if you might be able to do such things here). Your understanding of this world is excellent :P ...imagining the lock being turned again is exactly what you needed to do - the wall drops and the tube appears... thinking ahead you realised the only way you could fit in the tube with the battery is if you stood on top of it, unfortunatly there clearly must be more to this than that as the button inside the tube is akwardly positioned - projecting from a box-like panel inside the tube - and does not allow the battery to remain standing on the floor; it pushes it (and you) up towards the ceiling... fortunately you manage to dive off the battery before it slams into the ceiling.

You look up at the cracked ceiling and hope this won't effect your ability to exit this room.
Your 'reflection' is staring at the battery and the tube which doesn't quite reach the ceiling.
Smoke is pouring from the base of the tube and you here a repeatative clunking noise as the tube continues to attempt to close properly... the battery doesn't look like it will give but right now it's the tube you're worried about... your only way to exit this room... you start to feel a little claustrophobic.
The walls are laughing at you...
Biograd (Biograd)
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Posted on Tuesday, September 02, 2008 - 5:06 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Let me try and get this straight, as I'm not sure I understand what you're describing.

So the battery is too big to fit between the panel with the button and the opposite wall of the tube? and the tube "appears" not by suddenly materializing, but by rising out of the floor? so the panel lodged against the battery from below as the wall was rising and lifted it?

I assume you escaped the tube by closing your eyes and jumping through the walls, correct? or is the panel near the top of the tube, and so the battery got lodged long before the walls had risen to near the ceiling?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Tuesday, September 02, 2008 - 3:09 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Let me try and get this straight, as I'm not sure I understand what you're describing.

So the battery is too big to fit between the panel with the button and the opposite wall of the tube? and the tube "appears" not by suddenly materializing, but by rising out of the floor? so the panel lodged against the battery from below as the wall was rising and lifted it? This is all correct, yes

I assume you escaped the tube by closing your eyes and jumping through the walls, correct? no or is the panel near the top of the tube, and so the battery got lodged long before the walls had risen to near the ceiling? yes. The current situation is that the length of the tube from the top rim down to the panel is shorter than the height of the battery... so the battery is preventing the top rim of the tube from reaching the ceiling... and the tube looks and sounds as if it could be breaking as a result... which would leave you trapped here in the green room.
Biograd (Biograd)
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Posted on Tuesday, September 02, 2008 - 7:25 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Thanks for the clarification--I had the image that the tube just appeared and disappeared by "fading" in and out, and also had the wrong idea of how high the button was relative to the top rim.

Can you get in the tube under the battery (by closing your eyes) and press the button? Again I may be totally wrong, but I was assuming that the tube functions kind of like a normal elevator, and that the ceiling would have to move up with you as you ascend, just like the floor, or at least move out of the way. This would allow the battery to move up into the red room, and possibly fall out of the open doorway before crashing into the second ceiling.

If this doesn't work, then you should at least be able to stop the tube from smoking by unlocking the lock (again by imagining), causing it to drop back into the floor. Of course, do this while out of the tube so the battery doesn't fall on you!
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Tuesday, September 02, 2008 - 7:35 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Thanks for the clarification--I had the image that the tube just appeared and disappeared by "fading" in and out, and also had the wrong idea of how high the button was relative to the top rim.

Can you get in the tube under the battery (by closing your eyes) and press the button? yes, you can. You try this however the button doesn't appear to work when the tube is not properly in place... Again I may be totally wrong, but I was assuming that the tube functions kind of like a normal elevator, and that the ceiling would have to move up with you as you ascend, just like the floor, or at least move out of the way. This would allow the battery to move up into the red room, and possibly fall out of the open doorway before crashing into the second ceiling.

If this doesn't work, then you should at least be able to stop the tube from smoking by unlocking the lock (again by imagining), causing it to drop back into the floor. Of course, do this while out of the tube so the battery doesn't fall on you! You turn the lock again and the wall shoots up out of the floor and the tube drops into the floor. The battery falls over and rolls across the room.
You've bought yourself time to think.
Crazypalpig (Crazypalpig)
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Posted on Saturday, September 06, 2008 - 12:07 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Oh, now you can access the side you were able to before? Great! (I was going to try that, but my post got messed up and I didn't try to type it again)
Roll the battery over to the other side. The first tube on the side you were on first is there, correct? Put the battery in the tube, then press the button.
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Saturday, September 06, 2008 - 12:46 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Oh, now you can access the side you were able to before? Great! (I was going to try that, but my post got messed up and I didn't try to type it again)
Roll the battery over to the other side. The first tube on the side you were on first is there, correct? Put the battery in the tube, then press the button. I think one of us doesn't understand the other... I'm not sure which so I'll try make myself clearer:

You are presently in the green room, on the side of the glass with the tube (although the tube is currently concealed in the floor). The pane of glass is currently hidden between a pair of thin walls on each side and is not transversable.
Biograd (Biograd)
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Posted on Sunday, September 07, 2008 - 9:29 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

And the "tube" on the side accessible before (but inaccessible now) is not a tube at all, simply the equivalent spot on the floor--reflected through the plane of the glass--that as far as we know always moves up and down in sync with anything in the tube, correct?

How about imagining your reflection closing his eyes? I remember that before you could feel the objects on the tube side when closing your eyes on the other side, and possibly could manipulate them. Maybe it would help you (I don't know quite how yet) if you had two sets of hands over on the tube side.
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Tuesday, September 09, 2008 - 10:35 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

And the "tube" on the side accessible before (but inaccessible now) is not a tube at all, simply the equivalent spot on the floor--reflected through the plane of the glass--that as far as we know always moves up and down in sync with anything in the tube, correct? correct (:

How about imagining your reflection closing his eyes? I remember that before you could feel the objects on the tube side when closing your eyes on the other side, and possibly could manipulate them. Maybe it would help you (I don't know quite how yet) if you had two sets of hands over on the tube side. This doesn't work, you decide your imagining of your reflectiong doing things is more a question than an instruction - that is to say your reflection can hear your thoughts but will only do what it wants...
Crazypalpig (Crazypalpig)
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Posted on Wednesday, September 10, 2008 - 8:23 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Close your eyes again. Are the walls in the middle any different? If you keep bashing the battery against the ceiling, would the ceiling or battery break first?

Note that I have 1 on each of yours now ;)
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Wednesday, September 10, 2008 - 11:49 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Close your eyes again. Are the walls in the middle any different? no If you keep bashing the battery against the ceiling, would the ceiling or battery break first? hold on.......... neither apparently... they're both doing quite well

Note that I have 1 on each of yours now ;) Well done (:
Biograd (Biograd)
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Posted on Thursday, September 11, 2008 - 9:16 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is the surface of the pane of glass "truly" reflective at all (as opposed to the pseudo-reflection you see looking straight on, which is in fact another room), at any viewing angle?

In other words, would it be possible to place yourself and the battery in positions such that you see the battery reflected in the glass when looking at the proper angle, possibly with both you and the battery almost up against the glass? I'm wondering if, by setting up an optical situation where the battery appears to be on the other side (as a virtual image), if it will actually be there temporarily.

I know this is far-fetched, but I think we're all stuck here.
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Friday, September 12, 2008 - 11:37 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is the surface of the pane of glass "truly" reflective at all (as opposed to the pseudo-reflection you see looking straight on, which is in fact another room), at any viewing angle? It is truly reflective... but also selective... the only thing it reflects currently is you and your 'reflection' isn't even behaving as it should (i.e. only mirroring your movements).
It is probably easier to think of it as not being reflective at all.


In other words, would it be possible to place yourself and the battery in positions such that you see the battery reflected in the glass when looking at the proper angle, possibly with both you and the battery almost up against the glass? I'm wondering if, by setting up an optical situation where the battery appears to be on the other side (as a virtual image), if it will actually be there temporarily. So unfortunately this will not work.

I know this is far-fetched, but I think we're all stuck here. Make a list of everything available to you in the room, every state it can be put into, and every action (within reason) that you can make that could/has/or would otherwise appear to progress you.
Now rule out everything already tried, perhaps making notes on how it was/was not successful.
Once you've ruled out everything on your list, THEN you're stuck.

For this room that list shouldn't be too long (:
Crazypalpig (Crazypalpig)
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Posted on Friday, September 12, 2008 - 2:29 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

There's actually 2 rooms to worry about... But I assume we don't need the red room. Close your eyes and do the same thing that failed earlier. Can you sense your doppelganger's thoughts as well by any chance?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Friday, September 12, 2008 - 3:26 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

There's actually 2 rooms to worry about... But I assume we don't need the red room. correct, at the moment you only need to concetrate on the green room Close your eyes and do the same thing that failed earlier. many things failed earlier... can you be more specific? Can you sense your doppelganger's thoughts as well by any chance? no
Crazypalpig (Crazypalpig)
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Posted on Friday, September 12, 2008 - 7:07 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I meant... put the battery back on the tube spot and try turning the key and pressing the button again keeping your eyes shut
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Friday, September 12, 2008 - 7:13 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I meant... put the battery back on the tube spot and try turning the key and pressing the button again keeping your eyes shut You place the battery back on the spot where the tube will appear. and closing your eyes this time mentally instruct your 'reflection' to turn the key in the lock, which it does. The tube rises out of the floor and the battery becomes stuck in it as it had done before. You, keeping your eyes closed move beneath it and try the button. The button still does not work.
You climb out from under the battery.
Alanlin (Alanlin)
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Posted on Saturday, September 13, 2008 - 7:33 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

hmmm, ok, we've never tried pulling the lever while the tube is gone, so let's try that. Instruct your reflection to turn the key again and then pull the lever.
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Saturday, September 13, 2008 - 1:04 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

hmmm, ok, we've never tried pulling the lever while the tube is gone, so let's try that. Instruct your reflection to turn the key again and then pull the lever. You do this. You hear a "clunk" noise.
Alanlin (Alanlin)
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Posted on Saturday, September 13, 2008 - 9:12 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Instruct your reflection to turn the key once more. Is there anything different on either side of the room?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Saturday, September 13, 2008 - 9:38 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Instruct your reflection to turn the key once more. Is there anything different on either side of the room? The walls disappear and the tube rises out of the floor once more, except this time it has its metal outer-shell and rises right to the ceiling with the battery inside.
Biograd (Biograd)
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Posted on Saturday, September 13, 2008 - 9:58 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Can you still go in/out of the tube with your eyes closed, when it has the shell on it?
Alanlin (Alanlin)
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Posted on Sunday, September 14, 2008 - 3:12 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

If not, then pull the lever again and enter it. Hopefully the battery is somehow underneath the panel now. If it is, close your eyes and press the button.
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Sunday, September 14, 2008 - 9:24 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Can you still go in/out of the tube with your eyes closed, when it has the shell on it? no


If not, then pull the lever again and enter it. Hopefully the battery is somehow underneath the panel now. If it is, close your eyes and press the button. You pull the lever again. As you correctly suspected the battery is now sitting comfortably below the panel. You close your eyes and climb into the tube and on top of the battery and press the button.

You are now in the red room with the battery. Fortunately the doorway here is just wide enough to squeeze the battery out of the tube! (:
Biograd (Biograd)
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Posted on Sunday, September 14, 2008 - 11:17 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Now, bring the battery out through the corridor, place it in the raised cup of the balance, and stand on top of it. Hopefully, with the extra weight from the battery, you can lower yourself down again.
Crazypalpig (Crazypalpig)
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Posted on Monday, September 15, 2008 - 11:48 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Good job! I'd never think of that
Is there any unexpected resistance in the red room this time? Or in the corridor?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Monday, September 15, 2008 - 6:26 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Now, bring the battery out through the corridor, place it in the raised cup of the balance, and stand on top of it. Hopefully, with the extra weight from the battery, you can lower yourself down again. (: You are now at ground level inside the cup of the balance closest to the bookshelf and with the battery.


Good job! I'd never think of that
Is there any unexpected resistance in the red room this time? Or in the corridor? Neither, thankfully but good question (:
Crazypalpig (Crazypalpig)
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Posted on Monday, September 15, 2008 - 8:24 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Get a rock out again, open the battery compartment, and put the battery inside. Try to put it in the right way. ;)
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Monday, September 15, 2008 - 8:29 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Get a rock out again, open the battery compartment, and put the battery inside. Try to put it in the right way. ;) Getting ahead of yourself again (:

How are you planning to get out of the cup of the balance WITH the battery? Think about what will happen...
Crazypalpig (Crazypalpig)
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Posted on Monday, September 15, 2008 - 10:15 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I thought you had something planned. Again.

Actually this is quite easy. Jump out, and run to the other side and unload rocks until it tips again. Then do as before mentioned.
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Monday, September 15, 2008 - 11:47 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I thought you had something planned. Again. ;)

Actually this is quite easy. Jump out, and run to the other side and unload rocks until it tips again. Then do as before mentioned. This would work if it weren't for the arm rising ever so slightly with each rock you remove... lifting each time further from your reach...
Crazypalpig (Crazypalpig)
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Posted on Tuesday, September 16, 2008 - 2:47 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Would throwing the rocks at the battery damage it? If not, throw the ones you get out into the other side.
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Tuesday, September 16, 2008 - 11:07 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Would throwing the rocks at the battery damage it? It was repeatedly smashd into a ceiling and seemingly acquired no damage ;) If not, throw the ones you get out into the other side. You'd do this if you thought you had enough rocks already to lower it into your reach but you don't.
Crazypalpig (Crazypalpig)
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Posted on Tuesday, September 16, 2008 - 2:23 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

*sighs*
Alrighty, can the doppelganger in the corridor sense your thoughts? Think about him coming into the cup.
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Tuesday, September 16, 2008 - 2:39 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

*sighs*
Alrighty, can the doppelganger in the corridor sense your thoughts? Think about him coming into the cup. Your doppelgänger climbs into the cup but apparently doesn't weigh anything
Crazypalpig (Crazypalpig)
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Posted on Tuesday, September 16, 2008 - 9:05 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

...... Oh great.
Jump into the side with the rocks. Throw out the rocks until you have enough, then drop to the ground. Think about your double getting back out, and throw the rocks as before mentioned.
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Tuesday, September 16, 2008 - 9:49 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

...... Oh great.
Jump into the side with the rocks. Throw out the rocks until you have enough, then drop to the ground. Think about your double getting back out, and throw the rocks as before mentioned. With each rock you throw out the cup rises... after a few rocks (which is not enough) you realise you'll soon have the arm too high for you to safely drop out of. You drop out of the cup at its current, safer height and throw the rocks back in whilst you think this one through a bit more...
Biograd (Biograd)
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Posted on Tuesday, September 16, 2008 - 10:18 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

How about this:
Get your doppelganger to stand back in the cup, and keep throwing him rocks until the balance tips again toward his side (with the battery). Then, have him take out the battery (if he will do so), causing the balance to tip back to your side. Then, his side will be raised, letting him climb back out, while your side will be low, letting you get out as well (his getting out shouldn't affect you if he is weightless).
Alanlin (Alanlin)
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Posted on Tuesday, September 16, 2008 - 10:47 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Can you move the marshmallow? If so, use it to weigh down the arm of the balance while you clear out the rocks and then remove the marshmallow once you are done. If that doesn't work, could you try the same thing with the larger rock? I don't think it's currently on the balance.
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Wednesday, September 17, 2008 - 9:19 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Get your doppelganger to stand back in the cup, and keep throwing him rocks until the balance tips again toward his side (with the battery). Then, have him take out the battery (if he will do so), causing the balance to tip back to your side. Then, his side will be raised, letting him climb back out, while your side will be low, letting you get out as well (his getting out shouldn't affect you if he is weightless). If he does not want to take out the battery you will be stranded... you test mentally asking him to take the battery out and putting it on the shelf. He refuses/ ignores you.


Can you move the marshmallow? no If so, use it to weigh down the arm of the balance while you clear out the rocks and then remove the marshmallow once you are done. If that doesn't work, could you try the same thing with the larger rock? This WOULD allow you to clear out the smaller rocks however you won't be able to remove this rock without climbing inside the cup yourself, which was fine when the other cup was empty but in this case would cause your cup to rise. You also figure that the small rocks in total, the large rock, the battery and yourself all weigh roughly the same. If you threw out the large rock from inside the cup you'd be raised to 'halfway' which is too high for you to drop from. I don't think it's currently on the balance. It is not
Alanlin (Alanlin)
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Posted on Wednesday, September 17, 2008 - 11:16 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

If you're strong enough to be able to 'throw out the large rock from inside the cup' couldn't you just hold the large rock and jump out of the cup along with it? If that's impossible, or likely to result in injury, leave the large rock in the balance and jump out yourself. Now you can toss the small rocks onto the side with the battery without worrying about being stranded on the balance. Once that side of the balance reaches the ground, you should be able to remove the battery, and since the small rocks are still there, you shouldn't be raised too high to get down. Then just jump off. The only problem I see with this approach is that it would render the rocks inaccessible, and it seems we might still need them, if only to access the monkey's battery compartment.
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Thursday, September 18, 2008 - 12:30 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

If you're strong enough to be able to 'throw out the large rock from inside the cup' couldn't you just hold the large rock and jump out of the cup along with it? If that's impossible, or likely to result in injury, leave the large rock in the balance and jump out yourself. Now you can toss the small rocks onto the side with the battery without worrying about being stranded on the balance. Once that side of the balance reaches the ground, you should be able to remove the battery, and since the small rocks are still there, you shouldn't be raised too high to get down. Then just jump off. This would work but... The only problem I see with this approach is that it would render the rocks inaccessible, and it seems we might still need them, if only to access the monkey's battery compartment. ...this is a problem... (: You proceed to lower the battery to the ground however with the small rocks but leave the battery where it is for the moment whilst you consider how to go about this... Your doppelgänger climbs out of the cup and goes and stands beside the monkey.
Crazypalpig (Crazypalpig)
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Posted on Thursday, September 18, 2008 - 12:34 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Ummm sit on your doppelgänger's shoulders and put the battery in?

I'm confused, why are the rocks inaccessible?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Thursday, September 18, 2008 - 12:58 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Ummm sit on your doppelgänger's shoulders and put the battery in? The battery is very heavy... this is sure to hurt one of you...

I'm confused, why are the rocks inaccessible? Alanlin is quite correct; if you removed the battery from the cup the small rocks would balance the large rock lifting them all out of reach.
Alanlin (Alanlin)
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Posted on Thursday, September 18, 2008 - 7:48 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Would your doppelganger consent to getting back in the cup with the small rocks and tossing them down to you (after removing the battery), or is he going to be uncooperative again? Can he even pick anything up at all?
Crazypalpig (Crazypalpig)
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Posted on Thursday, September 18, 2008 - 9:35 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Ah. Easy enough. I think. Jump out. If the big rocks equals all the small rocks then surely with you out of the cup the battery will come to the ground with all the small rocks... So do that, then take out several small rocks first, then the battery. The big rock should come to the ground, and is therefore accessible :D
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Thursday, September 18, 2008 - 9:38 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Would your doppelganger consent to getting back in the cup with the small rocks and tossing them down to you (after removing the battery), or is he going to be uncooperative again? It doesn't appear to be interested in the cup at all. It seems more interested in the monkey. Can he even pick anything up at all? It opened the door earlier... maybe it can only push things? It seems to have no interest in picking anything up.
Crazypalpig (Crazypalpig)
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Posted on Friday, September 19, 2008 - 2:08 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Darn. We cross posted. Mine please?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Friday, September 19, 2008 - 11:26 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Ah. Easy enough. I think. Jump out. If the big rocks equals all the small rocks then surely with you out of the cup the battery will come to the ground with all the small rocks... So do that, then take out several small rocks first, then the battery. The big rock should come to the ground, and is therefore accessible :D With each small rock you take out the cup rises by small amounts. When you reach the height you only just feel safe dropping from you stop and consider pushing the battery out now but realise with that you'll end up more or less balancing with the large rock and be stranded. You drop from the cup and throw the small rocks back in to lower it and the battery back down to the ground again while you try to think of something else. There must be another way...
Biograd (Biograd)
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Posted on Friday, September 19, 2008 - 9:00 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

When you stand on top of the battery, how much of a height advantage do you get? How does this compare to the level at which the two cups are placed when they balance?

I'm having a bit of trouble visualizing how everything works and looks in relation to everything else, and maybe that is preventing some of us from getting the solution you are looking for. We've already established that this balance tips different amounts depending on the difference in weight, unlike some balances that are either level when the weights are very similar, and then tip fully to one side at a critical imbalance. I don't really know how much, though. In other words, if you had the big rock on one side and a pile of rocks with half the weight on the other side, would the big rock be on the ground? would it be low enough to reach? too high to reach, but low enough to jump off of? even too high to jump?
Crazypalpig (Crazypalpig)
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Posted on Saturday, September 20, 2008 - 12:06 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Could your double roll the battery off the scale if he could reach it? Which is heavier, you or the battery? You and the small rocks or the battery?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Tuesday, September 23, 2008 - 5:22 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

...I regret to say you've discovered a flaw in my calculations X)... which is why these posts have been unanswered for so long - very unlike myself.

I knew what solution I wanted you to find and more or less what shouldn't work but when I took a second look at my figures I found them inconforming. So I set about writing out all the algebraic inequalities necessary to preserve the behaviour of the balance... already forfeiting the idea that all the objects and yourself could be roughly equal in weight and introducing three fractions the weights either side must satisfy relative to each other for the purposes of; tipping the balance to the floor, placing a cup just in your reach, and the point at which you're able to drop. After this I subsequentially gave the cups weight, even considering unfair weighting of the cups... I messed around with all the figures but found my inequalities stating that the balance is impossible... or rather, the only way it can exist is if both cups are constantly resting on the floor... X)

I apologise for the trouble it has given you over these last few posts and am as sorry as you all are no doubt that it didn't work.


The balance, realising it cannot possibly exist, collapses to the floor into its constituent parts (which all fortunately can exist by themselves) leaving you with access to (almost) all the rocks and the battery! (: Lets get this finished! :

Your doppelgänger loses interest in the monkey as the balance starts to tip and the various connections between its part groan and snap. It climbs up on top of the giant marshmellow and lies down out of view. The heavy balance arm crashes to the floor, narrowly missing you (Liquizt contemplates what he could have done with a shifting balance arm...) and a heavy cup falls upside down over the small rocks: a deafing ringing noise echoes about the room, soon after replaced by an equally deafening silence. Your heart stops for a moment as you realise the cup that has tipped over was the one containing the battery... but you're relieved to see it roll lazily from behind the cup and to a halt when it hits the bookshelf.
Biograd (Biograd)
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Posted on Wednesday, September 24, 2008 - 2:10 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

If you use the big rock, as before, to reach the battery compartment, is the battery light enough for you to pick up as you climb on the rock?

If not, can you get to the small rocks by lifting the cup, or is it too heavy?
Crazypalpig (Crazypalpig)
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Posted on Wednesday, September 24, 2008 - 2:53 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

... Was the balance collapse planned by any chance?
Your doppelganger is going to need a shower after lying down on a marshmallow :P.
Is there another problem ahead? With no further information about how to escape, I suggest we just put the battery in the compartment then stand back away from the monkey. Is it possible that the noise from the cymbals will "wake" you up??
Biograd (Biograd)
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Posted on Wednesday, September 24, 2008 - 4:45 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

"I suggest we just put the battery in the compartment"

It would be great if it were that simple, but I suspect it might not be...that's why I asked if it is possible to lift the battery and climb up on the rock at the same time.
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Wednesday, September 24, 2008 - 9:00 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

If you use the big rock, as before, to reach the battery compartment, is the battery light enough for you to pick up as you climb on the rock? Well with the collapse of the balance the weight of everything became questionable... the battery is light enough to lift and manoeuvre when standing on top of the large rock.

If not, can you get to the small rocks by lifting the cup, or is it too heavy? The cup is too heavy to lift.


... Was the balance collapse planned by any chance? I'd like to say yes but.. no. Though I have made the most of it as you will find out.
Your doppelganger is going to need a shower after lying down on a marshmallow :P.
Is there another problem ahead? CA: same rule as earlier... if you can discover it for yuorself... With no further information about how to escape, I suggest we just put the battery in the compartment then stand back away from the monkey. Is it possible that the noise from the cymbals will "wake" you up?? CA: see above


"I suggest we just put the battery in the compartment"

It would be great if it were that simple, but I suspect it might not be...that's why I asked if it is possible to lift the battery and climb up on the rock at the same time. Nope, I'm not going to make you fashion stairs from the rocks :P and I'm sorry if I disappoint but on this occassion it is that simple.

You put the battery into the compartment and stand back... nothing. Maybe there IS more to it?
Biograd (Biograd)
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Posted on Wednesday, September 24, 2008 - 10:51 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

You said earlier that there was a switch on the monkey toy. Did you remember to switch it this time?
Biograd (Biograd)
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Posted on Wednesday, September 24, 2008 - 10:56 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

p.s.--just wondering: do you actually have a battery-powered toy monkey that inspired this, or is this totally FYOI? (not that I wish to make fun of people with toy monkeys)
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Thursday, September 25, 2008 - 3:23 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

You said earlier that there was a switch on the monkey toy. Did you remember to switch it this time? No, you forgot the switch... you flick the switch and wait... still nothing. There must be something else you're forgetting!?

p.s.--just wondering: do you actually have a battery-powered toy monkey that inspired this, or is this totally FYOI? (not that I wish to make fun of people with toy monkeys) From my own imagination/ from things I've seen. I actually find clapping cymbal monkeys annoying so don't think I'll ever get one.
Crazypalpig (Crazypalpig)
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Posted on Thursday, September 25, 2008 - 9:34 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

OK, so we now have: A monkey with a battery and a switch but won't move. Great.

Screw the battery hatch closed again? Then try? Get you doppelganger to put the battery in? CLOSE YOUR EYES?!? :-) Put the battery in the other way?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Friday, September 26, 2008 - 11:08 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

OK, so we now have: A monkey with a battery and a switch but won't move. Great.

Screw the battery hatch closed again? You climb back up on the rock with panel and screw. You place the panel over the compartment and reach up to connect the screw but the moment you do the monkey comes to life and starts banging it's symbols and marching away from you. It's very difficult to hold the screw in place let alone turn it. The monkey marches off with the screw hanging off it's back. It gets a little distance before the screw wobbles out of place and drops to the floor with the panel, the monkey stops. Then try? Get you doppelganger to put the battery in? CLOSE YOUR EYES?!? :-) Put the battery in the other way?
Crazypalpig (Crazypalpig)
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Posted on Friday, September 26, 2008 - 8:13 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Oh wow... Which direction does it head in? Can you keep just putting the screw back in over and over until it hits something?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Friday, September 26, 2008 - 9:19 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Oh wow... Which direction does it head in? Are far as you could tell just forward but who knows it could be walking at the slightest of angles. Can you keep just putting the screw back in over and over until it hits something? That could take some time... it didn't really get so far, just far enough away that you'll have to move the rock closer again and the wall ahead of it is quite some distance away.
Biograd (Biograd)
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Posted on Friday, September 26, 2008 - 10:57 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Just turn the switch off, screw the cover on, and then turn the switch on again. Is there something wrong with that?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Saturday, September 27, 2008 - 8:44 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Just turn the switch off, screw the cover on, and then turn the switch on again. Is there something wrong with that? Nope. That's perfect. :) The monkey starts marching around the room banging together its cymbals. It seems to be moving in a random fashion, going nowhere in particular but remarkably avoiding every obstacle.
Biograd (Biograd)
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Posted on Saturday, September 27, 2008 - 9:41 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is it moving slow enough for you to trap it in a corner, possibly using rocks and some pieces of the broken balance? I don't know if this would accomplish anything, but it's worth a try.
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Saturday, September 27, 2008 - 10:09 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is it moving slow enough for you to trap it in a corner, possibly using rocks and some pieces of the broken balance? I don't know if this would accomplish anything, but it's worth a try. It is moving slow but not as slow as you would be when attempting to move them objects.
Biograd (Biograd)
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Posted on Tuesday, September 30, 2008 - 9:15 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Does your doppelganger show any interest in the monkey, now that it's moving?

What happens if you close your eyes?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Wednesday, October 01, 2008 - 9:00 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Does your doppelganger show any interest in the monkey, now that it's moving? You haven't seen your doppelgänger since it climbed up on top of the giant marshmellow...

What happens if you close your eyes? When you close your eyes everything is dark, as you expect, except for light coming off something glowing brightly on top of the marshmellow but whatever it is it's out of view. You open your eyes again and can no longer see the light.
Crazypalpig (Crazypalpig)
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Posted on Wednesday, October 01, 2008 - 9:34 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Climb the marshmellow. Maybe its your doppelgänger shining? Are the cymbals making any noise? Look at your DG with closed eyes.
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Thursday, October 02, 2008 - 7:39 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Climb the marshmellow. okay Maybe its your doppelgänger shining? It's not here... Are the cymbals making any noise? Yes. They sound like bells. Look at your DG with closed eyes. Although it's not here you close your eyes and a rough outline of you (or your DG) lying down, glows before you.
Crazypalpig (Crazypalpig)
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Posted on Thursday, October 02, 2008 - 9:50 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Lie in that exact position
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Thursday, October 02, 2008 - 11:06 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Lie in that exact position the light is solid... you open your eyes and lie down roughly where you thought it was. The marshmellow is very comfy but nothing happens.
Crazypalpig (Crazypalpig)
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Posted on Friday, October 03, 2008 - 3:24 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Close your eyes again?
Liquizt (Liquizt)
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Posted on Friday, October 03, 2008 - 10:22 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Close your eyes again? You close your eyes. The light appears around you and then fades away leaving you in the dark listening to the sound of the monkey clashing together its cymbals.
Your senses suggest this is like being at home in bed with the alarm clock ringing and when you open your eyes that is exactly where you are.

You look at the time on the clock (which has been misset) and realise you're an hour late!

'Disorientation' was a dream afterall... it's a horrible ending I know, the worst possible ending imaginable... as it leaves the reader(/puzzler) with a sense of nothing actually being accomplished, but that's why I chose it; I'm evil... :P
I didn't realise this puzzle would turn out quite as popular as it did and noticably some parts worked better than others but you all did an excellent job, and I would like to give a special mention to every contributor as you all gave something that progressed the puzzle but I don't think that's allowed so I'm going to have to give it to the top contributors;

Unleashedllama - (particularly) for getting you out of the dark,
Biograd - for his excellent work in the corridor (with the goo that was stickier than even I could imagine it would be!) and with the incooperative scales, and
Crazypalpig - who stuck with the puzzle right to the end since his return to the forum in June... has it really been that long(!?) :
)

*****SPOILER*****
Biograd (Biograd)
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Posted on Friday, October 03, 2008 - 10:43 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Thanks for the honor, that part was fun--though I think some credit must be given to Unleashedllama for actually getting us out of there. I was stuck assuming the solution had to involve making electrical contacts with the goo, where the real solution was to "brute force" it.
Unleashedllama (Unleashedllama)
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Posted on Saturday, October 11, 2008 - 6:02 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Thanks so much. I really enjoyed this puzzle and even at times when I wasn't contributing I would still read it every day or so to see what the latest was.

A dream though? So what did it all mean? ;)

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