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Finno (Finno)
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Username: Finno

Post Number: 69
Registered: 2-2009
Posted on Monday, March 16, 2009 - 8:48 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

He should have been careful.
He = H,A,M
Bolapara (Bolapara)
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Username: Bolapara

Post Number: 383
Registered: 12-2008
Posted on Monday, March 16, 2009 - 1:28 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is another party relevant? human?

Did an accident happen? one that he could have foreseen?
Finno (Finno)
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Username: Finno

Post Number: 71
Registered: 2-2009
Posted on Tuesday, March 17, 2009 - 4:33 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is another party relevant? Yes human? Yes

Did an accident happen? Yes one that he could have foreseen? Yope
Kaygee (Kaygee)
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Post Number: 296
Registered: 9-2008
Posted on Friday, March 20, 2009 - 1:41 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did the accident occur at home? at work? in a vehicle? in a public building? outside?

Is the number of other people involved relevant? If so, [insert positive numbers 1-1000]?

Was he injured? dead?
Finno (Finno)
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Post Number: 83
Registered: 2-2009
Posted on Friday, March 20, 2009 - 4:29 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did the accident occur at home? at work? in a vehicle? in a public building? outside? This

Is the number of other people involved relevant? Not Really, there were others; but they are not exactly responsible for what happened If so, [insert positive numbers 1-1000]?

Was he injured? Yes dead? Yes, later on
Hietek (Hietek)
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Post Number: 42
Registered: 2-2009
Posted on Saturday, March 28, 2009 - 2:48 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Was this a forseeable accident?
Finno (Finno)
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Post Number: 102
Registered: 2-2009
Posted on Monday, March 30, 2009 - 6:27 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Was this a forseeable accident? Noish
Davesnothere (Davesnothere)
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Username: Davesnothere

Post Number: 3
Registered: 3-2009
Posted on Monday, March 30, 2009 - 7:21 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Trying to clarify why he should have been careful given that the accident may not have been foreseeable -- will this be fruitful line of inquiry?

Had he been careful, would the accident likely been avoided?

Was he engaging in careless behavior that a reasonable person would have avoided?

Or, was he behaving in a normally prudent manner, but given the environment, he should have taken additional care?

His injuries led directly to his death? Or were there other contributors?

There is another human that is relevant. Just one?

Other than the human, are there other animals involved? Are there objects involved?

Was this event newsworthy? Did it actually happen? Did it happen in the past 20 years?

Regarding his accident -- was his injury due to:
Falling?
Excessive cold?
Excessive heat?
Collision?
Asphyxiation?
Puncture?
Poisoning?
Dismemberment?
Crushing?
Heart attack?

If we understand where this event occurred, will that help us?

Were the other people part of an audience?

Was the injured party a performer? Part of an act? Member of the audience? Bystander? Employee performing work duties?
Finno (Finno)
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Username: Finno

Post Number: 104
Registered: 2-2009
Posted on Tuesday, March 31, 2009 - 5:38 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Trying to clarify why he should have been careful given that the accident may not have been foreseeable -- will this be fruitful line of inquiry? Definitely

Had he been careful, would the accident likely been avoided? The accident could have happened, but he would not have lost his life definitely

Was he engaging in careless behavior that a reasonable person would have avoided? No

Or, was he behaving in a normally prudent manner, but given the environment, he should have taken additional care? Right

His injuries led directly to his death? Yes Or were there other contributors? None

There is another human that is relevant. Just one? There are more than one other people involved, but they can NOT be held responsible for his death. Just to clarify: this was NOT a murder.

Other than the human, are there other animals involved? No Are there objects involved? Yes, you may like to probe further on this

Was this event newsworthy? Yes Did it actually happen? Yes, true story Did it happen in the past 20 years? Yes

Regarding his accident -- was his injury due to:
Falling? No
Excessive cold? No
Excessive heat? No
Collision? Yesish
Asphyxiation? No
Puncture? No
Poisoning? No
Dismemberment? No
Crushing? No
Heart attack? No

If we understand where this event occurred, will that help us? May be, but that will take away the fun of problem solving

Were the other people part of an audience? Yes and no

Was the injured party a performer? How do you define performer? Part of an act? No Member of the audience? No Bystander? No Employee performing work duties? He was performing work duties, but 'employee' is a little crude term
Bolapara (Bolapara)
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Username: Bolapara

Post Number: 485
Registered: 12-2008
Posted on Wednesday, April 01, 2009 - 3:30 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Skiing accident involving a train?

Were any of the following directly involved in the accident?
Electricity
Motor Vehicles
Water
Ice
Heights
Circuses
Tigers
Guns/firearms
Knifes
fire
Chemicals
Hockey
Sports
Davesnothere (Davesnothere)
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Username: Davesnothere

Post Number: 7
Registered: 3-2009
Posted on Wednesday, April 01, 2009 - 5:22 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Regarding the activity engaged in by victim -- sports? art? music? Other esoteric activity not normally engaged in by people on a daily basis?

The objects involved -- did they injure him directly, or did they lead to his injury?

The collision, as to who ran into what -- did the victim collide with a stationary object, did the object collide with a stationary victim, or were both object and victim moving when they collided?

Event occured outside. Urban environment? Rural environment? Undeveloped environment?

Is the season relavent?

Was there a single collision, or multiple collisions?

You gave a yesish on the collision which says to me that the collision was atypical. Is that correct?

As to cause of death, was it due to blunt force trauma from the collision, or by some other mechanism?

Was the colliding object solid? Liquid? Gas?

Was he located at ground level at time of collision?

Was anything in this scenario moving faster than 50 mph? 100 mph? 500 mph?

You had mentioned that understanding where this event occurred will take away the fun of solving. Is this because knowing the venue will give away the puzzle too easily?

Reconfirming no animals involved. Was the event man-made versus natural? In other words, could the event have occured without manmade objects? (being slammed by a wave or a tree versus a bulldozer)
Finno (Finno)
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Username: Finno

Post Number: 106
Registered: 2-2009
Posted on Wednesday, April 01, 2009 - 5:25 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Skiing accident involving a train? No

Were any of the following directly involved in the accident?
Electricity
Motor Vehicles
Water
Ice
Heights
Circuses
Tigers
Guns/firearms
Knifes
fire
Chemicals
Hockey
Sports This
Finno (Finno)
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Username: Finno

Post Number: 107
Registered: 2-2009
Posted on Wednesday, April 01, 2009 - 5:38 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Regarding the activity engaged in by victim -- sports? This art? music? Other esoteric activity not normally engaged in by people on a daily basis?

The objects involved -- did they injure him directly Yes, or did they lead to his injury?

The collision, as to who ran into what -- did the victim collide with a stationary object, did the object collide with a stationary victim, or were both object and victim moving when they collided This?

Event occured outside Outside what? If outside home - then yes . Urban environment? Rural environment? Undeveloped environment? All irrelevant

Is the season relavent? No

Was there a single collision, or multiple collisions? Single

You gave a yesish on the collision which says to me that the collision was atypical. Is that correct? Yes, but somewhat irrelevant I think. The key point is that the incident involved a collision

As to cause of death, was it due to blunt force trauma from the collision I am not a medical expert - so can not definitely say what a blunt force trauma is; but the colliison was the only and direct reason for his death , or by some other mechanism?

Was the colliding object solid? This Liquid? Gas?

Was he located at ground level at time of collision? Yes

Was anything in this scenario moving faster than 50 mph? 100 mph? 500 mph? Can't comment on the speed, but one of the things was speedy enough. We can assume a speed of about 90 Kilometers per hour

You had mentioned that understanding where this event occurred will take away the fun of solving. Is this because knowing the venue will give away the puzzle too easily? Yes. I think so

Reconfirming no animals involved. Yes Was the event man-made versus natural? Completely man made In other words, could the event have occured without manmade objects? No (being slammed by a wave or a tree versus a bulldozer)
Finno (Finno)
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Username: Finno

Post Number: 108
Registered: 2-2009
Posted on Wednesday, April 01, 2009 - 5:40 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Just want to add something to my previous answer
You gave a yesish on the collision which says to me that the collision was atypical. Is that correct? Yes, but somewhat irrelevant I think. The key point is that the incident involved a collision which could have been expected with a relatively sufficient probability to be careful
Bolapara (Bolapara)
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Username: Bolapara

Post Number: 502
Registered: 12-2008
Posted on Wednesday, April 01, 2009 - 5:45 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Was it his job to pick up a discarded sports item (ie bat boys pick up baseball bats as soon as the hit as made) and he "collided" with a ball?

Hit in the head with a baseball? From a wild pitch? foul ball? over the fence homerun?

Shooting/Rifle range/archery? Stray bullet or arrow hitting him in the head?

Picking up golf balls?

Was he hit in the head? stomach? chest? somewhere else? With a key object in the sport? by a player's body?

Was he an umpire? Coach? referre? Directly involved with the sport? Grounds maintenance?
Finno (Finno)
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Username: Finno

Post Number: 109
Registered: 2-2009
Posted on Wednesday, April 01, 2009 - 5:54 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Was it his job to pick up a discarded sports item (ie bat boys pick up baseball bats as soon as the hit as made) No and he "collided" with a ball Yes?

Hit in the head Yes with a baseball No? From a wild pitch? foul ball? over the fence homerun? No to all

Shooting/Rifle range/archery? Stray bullet or arrow hitting him in the head? No to all

Picking up golf balls? No

Was he hit in the head This? stomach? chest? somewhere else? With a key object in the sport Yes? by a player's body No?

Was he an umpire? Coach? referre? Directly involved with the sport? This. He was a player. Grounds maintenance?

I think we are really close to the answer. But I am a bit surprised that the only sport involving a ball is thought to be baseball. Having a look at my nationality may prove useful at this point in time
Bolapara (Bolapara)
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Username: Bolapara

Post Number: 504
Registered: 12-2008
Posted on Wednesday, April 01, 2009 - 5:57 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

soccer?

Cricket?
Finno (Finno)
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Username: Finno

Post Number: 110
Registered: 2-2009
Posted on Wednesday, April 01, 2009 - 6:07 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

soccer? No

Cricket? YES
Bolapara (Bolapara)
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Username: Bolapara

Post Number: 506
Registered: 12-2008
Posted on Wednesday, April 01, 2009 - 6:16 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

90 miles an hour, so it must be the ball right?

Was he the pitcher (the one who throws the ball to the batter)? - sorry i've only seen one cricket game in my life, i don't know the names of the positions?

Should he have worn a helmet? Not stood so close to the batter?
Finno (Finno)
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Username: Finno

Post Number: 111
Registered: 2-2009
Posted on Wednesday, April 01, 2009 - 6:18 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

90 miles an hour, so it must be the ball right? Yes

Was he the pitcher (the one who throws the ball to the batter) No. By the way, the role you said is termed as bowler and the person who hits the ball with a bat is called batsman? - sorry i've only seen one cricket game in my life, i don't know the names of the positions?

Should he have worn a helmet? Yes Not stood so close to the batter? In cricket, some fielding positions require you to stay very close to the batsman - as close as 1 meter
Finno (Finno)
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Username: Finno

Post Number: 112
Registered: 2-2009
Posted on Wednesday, April 01, 2009 - 6:21 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I think Bolapara has cracked it
*******SPOILER*******
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raman_Lamba
Raman Lamba(January 2, 1960 in Uttar Pradesh February 23, 1998 in Dhaka) was an Indian cricket player. The former Indian Test player died in a Dhaka hospital, aged 38. Three days earlier he had been hit on the temple while fielding, without a helmet, at short leg in front of a substantial crowd during a match between Lamba's club Abahani and Mohammedan at the Bangabandhu Stadium. Lamba had only moved in from the outfield for that delivery and it was reported that he had already signalled for a helmet.

Batsman Mehrab Hossain hit the ball so hard that the ball rebounded to Khaled Mashud, the wicket keeper. Mohammad Aminul Islam, the former Bangladesh captain, recalled "I was the new man in and asked Raman if he was okay. He said, 'Bulli [Islam's nickname is Bulbul] main to mar gaya' [I am dead, Bulli]

Lamba walked off the field and the injury did not appear too serious, but he suffered an internal haemorrhage and his condition soon worsened dramatically. A neurosurgeon was flown in from Delhi but it was already too late. The news caused widespread grief in both India and Bangladesh.

Lamba was a popular cricketer in India, but in Bangladesh he was a legend.He first went there to play club cricket in 1991, and was a key figure in the revival of interest in the game there. "I am the Don of Dhaka," he would joke to his Indian friends.

Lamba was known to be fearless, as well as an exceptionally committed and enthusiastic player. The commitment sometimes went too far; he was banned for ten months after provoking Rashid Patel, who charged after him brandishing a stump in the 1990-91 Duleep Trophy final.
Noobdogg (Noobdogg)
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Username: Noobdogg

Post Number: 89
Registered: 3-2009
Posted on Wednesday, April 01, 2009 - 9:01 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Aah yes, I remember reading about this incident; truly unfortunate.

BTW, this particular kind of puzzle is quite fun, where we have to start off with near nothing and a lot of guesswork is involved.

My concern however is whether we lose the lateral nature of the puzzle amidst this "shooting in the dark", if you will. I may be wrong, but isn't there very little, or no laterality involved in solving such a puzzle?
Finno (Finno)
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Username: Finno

Post Number: 114
Registered: 2-2009
Posted on Wednesday, April 01, 2009 - 9:48 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

May be you are right ... but I don't think all lateral puzzles have to be 'weird' (Example: the classic gunman in the bar puzzle. Yes, the final solution to that puzzle is logical, but how many bartenders would hold a gun in the customer's face when he/she requests for a glass of water?) I agree that here the initial statement was too ambiguous. But that was taken care of by the 5th question itself where it was established that this happened in a sporting event.
In my view that is exactly how lateral puzzle solving should progress. You start with a statement that gives you a wide range of possibilities and then you keep on asking intelligent questions to narrow down the range of possibilities. If that is shooting in the dark, then I guess this phrase will apply to a lot of threads on this forum.
Noobdogg (Noobdogg)
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Username: Noobdogg

Post Number: 90
Registered: 3-2009
Posted on Wednesday, April 01, 2009 - 4:37 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Fair enough, while it is obvious that the groundwork is a huge part of it, there's usually a lateral leap, that I failed to spot in this puzzle, though that's most likely my own shortcoming rather than the puzzle's. :-)

I do hope you don't think I am being too judgmental, but it was just something I wanted to talk about.

Please feel free to host your puzzles the way you like! :-)
Noobdogg (Noobdogg)
Moderator
Username: Noobdogg

Post Number: 92
Registered: 3-2009
Posted on Wednesday, April 01, 2009 - 4:44 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

PS: Which IPL team are you going to be supporting? I'm rooting for the Mumbai Indians :-)
Finno (Finno)
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Username: Finno

Post Number: 115
Registered: 2-2009
Posted on Thursday, April 02, 2009 - 5:40 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Naah ... no issues at all.
Me too from Mumbai ... hence supporting Mumbai Indians :-), although I am quite disappointed with their player selection
Noobdogg (Noobdogg)
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Username: Noobdogg

Post Number: 94
Registered: 3-2009
Posted on Thursday, April 02, 2009 - 8:19 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Yeah that's true. Let's see how it turns out!

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