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Nimue (Nimue)
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Posted on Wednesday, August 26, 2009 - 6:53 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I used to have a scrund that only liberals could have. Most liberals don't have it, but NO non-liberals do. What is it?
Noel (Noel)
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Posted on Wednesday, August 26, 2009 - 6:59 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is it a scrund about liberals? About conservatives? About the economy? About social welfare? About entitlement programs? About social interactions? About education? About health care?
Dropofahat (Dropofahat)
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Posted on Wednesday, August 26, 2009 - 7:12 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

About the environment?
Nimue (Nimue)
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Posted on Wednesday, August 26, 2009 - 7:53 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Noel (Noel)
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Is it a scrund about liberals?\B[yes} About conservatives? no or noishAbout the economy? no About social welfare? no About entitlement programs? noAbout social interactions? yopeAbout education? no About health care? no
Dropofahat (Dropofahat)
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About the environment? no
Dropofahat (Dropofahat)
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Posted on Wednesday, August 26, 2009 - 8:04 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

About marriage? About gay marriage?

Homosexuality relevant in general?
Nimue (Nimue)
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Posted on Wednesday, August 26, 2009 - 8:21 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Dropofahat (Dropofahat)
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About marriage? no About gay marriage? no

Homosexuality relevant in general? no
Noel (Noel)
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Posted on Wednesday, August 26, 2009 - 8:52 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

About liberals...education level? intelligence? financial status? likelihood of being racist? likelihood of being bigoted in another way?
Dlcygnet (Dlcygnet)
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Posted on Wednesday, August 26, 2009 - 9:07 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Any of the following relevant to this puzzle:
Newspaper? Television Media? Radio? Resources? Elections? Representative issues? Funding?

Abstinance? Abortion? <insert>? Zoological Studies?

Democrat vs. Republican relevant? Might I have this scrund if I were a member of the... Constitution Party? The Green Party? Women's Workers? Socialist Party? Communist Party? Libertarian Party? Terminator for Prez Party?
Dlcygnet (Dlcygnet)
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Posted on Wednesday, August 26, 2009 - 9:08 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

The "insert" above is supposed to be...

"insert alphabetical LTPF list of hot-button political issues, including Large Hadron Colliders, and ending in..."
Kdoc (Kdoc)
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Posted on Wednesday, August 26, 2009 - 9:32 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

the reason no non-liberals have this scrund:
because it relates to something they know so well they couldn't be mistaken about it? because it relates to something they wouldn't even think about? does the scrund require that you first have a correct belief? then have a second mistaken belief that follows on? and no non-liberal would believe the first thing? or no non-liberal would actually know the first thing?

does the scrund arise from a situation that no non-liberal would find themselves in?

the liberals who do not have this scrund - is this for the same reason that the non-liberals don't?

does the scrund arise from a situation where two or more liberals are interacting? and thus requires the presence of a liberal? or the absence of non-liberals?

does it relate to what people say to each other? what names they call each other? words used to describe social interactions? w

does it relate to a belief held by most liberals?
Ferrets101 (Ferrets101)
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Posted on Wednesday, August 26, 2009 - 9:39 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

By liberal do you refer to adherents of the political philosophy of liberalism? To members of the Liberal Political Party? Could an extreme liberal have this scurnd? A moderate liberal? Somebody who was barely liberal?
Nimue (Nimue)
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Posted on Wednesday, August 26, 2009 - 10:31 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Noel (Noel)
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About liberals...education level? intelligence? financial status? likelihood of being racist? likelihood of being bigoted in another way? no to all!!
Dlcygnet (Dlcygnet)
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Any of the following relevant to this puzzle:
Newspaper? possiblyTelevision Media? dittoRadio? ditto Resources? noElections? Representative issues? Funding? no

Abstinance? no Abortion? no <insert>? Zoological Studies? no

Democrat vs. Republican relevant? Well, no Republican would have this scrund & some Dems. wouldMight I have this scrund if I were a member of the... Constitution Party? I've never heard of that The Green Party? yesWomen's Workers? I've never heard of this, either Socialist Party? yes Communist Party? very unlikely Libertarian Party? noTerminator for Prez Party? noooooooo
Dlcygnet (Dlcygnet)
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Posted on Wednesday, August 26, 2009 - 9:08 pm: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)
The "insert" above is supposed to be...

"insert alphabetical LTPF list of hot-button political issues, including Large Hadron Colliders, and ending in..." NO particular issue is more relevant than any other issue that distinguishes liberals from non-liberals
Nimue (Nimue)
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Posted on Wednesday, August 26, 2009 - 10:37 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Kdoc (Kdoc)
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Posted on Wednesday, August 26, 2009 - 9:32 pm: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)
the reason no non-liberals have this scrund:
because it relates to something they know so well they couldn't be mistaken about it? yesbecause it relates to something they wouldn't even think about? nodoes the scrund require that you first have a correct belief? nothen have a second mistaken belief that follows on? noand no non-liberal would believe the first thing? or no non-liberal would actually know the first thing?

does the scrund arise from a situation that no non-liberal would find themselves in? noish

the liberals who do not have this scrund - is this for the same reason that the non-liberals don't? yes

does the scrund arise from a situation where two or more liberals are interacting? yesand thus requires the presence of a liberal? yesor the absence of non-liberals? yes. GOOOOOD question!!

does it relate to what people say to each other? yes what names they call each other? yesishwords used to describe social interactions? no w

does it relate to a belief held by most liberals?No, as the puzzle statement says, most liberrals DON'T have this scrund
Ferrets101 (Ferrets101)
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Posted on Wednesday, August 26, 2009 - 9:39 pm: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)
By liberal do you refer to adherents of the political philosophy of liberalism? yes To members of the Liberal Political Party? Where? What's called the Liberal Party in NY State is not very liberal Could an extreme liberal have this scurnd? yesA moderate liberal? yes Somebody who was barely liberal? unlikely
Biograd (Biograd)
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Posted on Thursday, August 27, 2009 - 10:13 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Does it matter whether the liberals are in the "modern" sense (e.g. the Democrats in the US) or the classical sense (what is now known as libertarian)?

Do the liberals need to hold certain views? or use the word "liberal" to describe themselves?
Noel (Noel)
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Posted on Thursday, August 27, 2009 - 2:56 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Related to biograd's question:
Are those with the scrund socially liberal? fiscally liberal? Both?
Nimue (Nimue)
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Posted on Thursday, August 27, 2009 - 7:11 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Biograd (Biograd)
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Does it matter whether the liberals are in the "modern" sense (e.g. the Democrats in the US) or the classical sense (what is now known as libertarian)?The puzzle definitely works for the former; I doubt that it works for the latter.

Do the liberals need to hold certain views? see next answer or use the word "liberal" to describe themselves? yes
Noel (Noel)
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Posted on Thursday, August 27, 2009 - 2:56 pm: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)
Related to biograd's question:
Are those with the scrund socially liberal? yesfiscally liberal? yesBoth? yes
Noel (Noel)
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Posted on Thursday, August 27, 2009 - 7:17 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is the scrund about the meaning of the actual word liberal?
Nimue (Nimue)
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Posted on Thursday, August 27, 2009 - 8:06 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Noel (Noel)
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Is the scrund about the meaning of the actual word liberal? yesish
Ohlala8 (Ohlala8)
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Posted on Thursday, August 27, 2009 - 9:05 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

So it's yesishly about the names liberals call each other... is this just about referring to each other as liberal? Or do they use another word that is (or they mistakenly believe is) synonymous with "liberal?" Is it about the derivation of the word "liberal?" How it relates to other words? The idea that one can be liberal in some areas and conservative in others?
Nimue (Nimue)
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Ohlala8 (Ohlala8)
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So it's yesishly about the names liberals call each other... is this just about referring to each other as liberal? yesishOr do they use another word that is (or they mistakenly believe is) synonymous with "liberal?" noIs it about the derivation of the word "liberal?" no How it relates to other words? noishThe idea that one can be liberal in some areas and conservative in others? no
Logician (Logician)
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Posted on Saturday, August 29, 2009 - 4:55 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is any of the following close to the scrund:

"If I believe x, then I'm a liberal"?
"If I'm a liberal, than I (probably) believe x"?
"If I believe x, then I'm not a liberal"?
"If I'm not a liberal, then I (probably) believe x"?
Nimue (Nimue)
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Posted on Sunday, August 30, 2009 - 8:48 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Logician (Logician)
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Posted on Saturday, August 29, 2009 - 4:55 pm: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)
Is any of the following close to the scrund:

"If I believe x, then I'm a liberal"? yes, where x is the scrund. But the puzzle statement already says this.
"If I'm a liberal, than I (probably) believe x"? No. Most liberals don't have this scrund.
"If I believe x, then I'm not a liberal" no
"If I'm not a liberal, then I (probably) believe x"? see first answer
Nimue (Nimue)
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Posted on Sunday, August 30, 2009 - 9:36 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

HINT: Follow up on my affirmative answer to Kdoc's GOOOOOOOD QUESTION, "Does the scrund require thee absence of non-liberals?"
Logician (Logician)
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Posted on Sunday, August 30, 2009 - 11:39 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is the scrund about non-liberals? (e.g. what they believe, who they are, etc.)

Do we need to know anything specific about what the liberal (or non-liberal?) position entails? Or what they believe it entails? Or is it enough to know that there is a group x (liberals) which distinguishes itself from a group y (non-liberals)?
Logician (Logician)
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Posted on Sunday, August 30, 2009 - 11:41 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Just to clarify, the "they" in the "what they believe it entails" means "what liberals believe..."
Nimue (Nimue)
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Posted on Sunday, August 30, 2009 - 9:36 pm: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)
HINT: Follow up on my affirmative answer to Kdoc's GOOOOOOOD QUESTION, "Does the scrund require thee absence of non-liberals?"
Logician (Logician)
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Is the scrund about non-liberals? (e.g. what they believe no, who they are yesish, etc.)

Do we need to know anything specific about what the liberal (or non-liberal? no) position entails? no Or what they believe it entails? no Or is it enough to know that there is a group x (liberals) which distinguishes itself from a group y (non-liberals)?You don't need to know the specifics of any political position, but you do need to find out something else about the liberals who holds this scrund.
Alex319 (Alex319)
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Posted on Monday, August 31, 2009 - 5:00 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is the scrund that everyone is liberal - that non-liberals don't exist?
Bentarm (Bentarm)
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Posted on Monday, August 31, 2009 - 3:32 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is the scrund something along the lines of "all people who have blue eyes are liberal", with "have blue eyes" replaced by something more sensible?

Something along the lines of "non-liberals all eat babies"? (with 'eat babies' replaced by something more sensible)
Kdoc (Kdoc)
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would the scrund be only held by liberals who do not interact with non-liberals?
would the scrund be revealed by the presence of a non-liberal? or would it never arise in the presence of non-liberals? something like - you could not have a scrund that all bears are brown in the presence of a polar bear? or you could not have a scrund that penguins don't exist in the presence of a penguin?
Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
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Can the scrund affect a wide variety of liberals? Or does it only affect liberals of a certain category? Say, from a certain region? Of a certain age?

The scrund is not about a particular issue -- is it about a place? A person/people? A thing? Is the scrund about something tangible? Quantifiable? About an emotion? Or quality? (I'm thinking here of words like "patriotism" and "honor.")

Is it common for liberals who have this scrund to become aware of their incorrect belief? Is President Obama likely to have (had) this belief? Or Ted Kennedy?

Was this scrund also present in past times? Would JFK-era liberals have had it? FDR-era liberals? Would a liberal who gradually became conservative (say, as he got older) still be likely to have it? Is it impossible for a conservative to have this scrund?

I know you said issues are irrelevant, but how about the general divide between moral issues and economic/military ones? Would a liberal who agrees with conservatives on moral issues (abortion, gaiety, etc) have this scrund? How about a liberal on moral issues who agrees with conservatives on economic or international policy? Would a Blue Dog Democrat or Log Cabin Republican have this scrund?
Nimue (Nimue)
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Posted on Tuesday, September 08, 2009 - 9:04 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

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Is the scrund that everyone is liberal - that non-liberals don't exist? Noish, but you're ORT. See below
Bentarm (Bentarm)
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Is the scrund something along the lines of "all people who have blue eyes are liberal", with "have blue eyes" replaced by something more sensible? no

Something along the lines of "non-liberals all eat babies"? (with 'eat babies' replaced by something more sensible You mean they don't??) no
Kdoc (Kdoc)
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would the scrund be only held by liberals who do not interact with non-liberals? yes. GOOOD question
would the scrund be revealed by the presence of a non-liberal? probably or would it never arise in the presence of non-liberals? yopesomething like - you could not have a scrund that all bears are brown in the presence of a polar bear? noish, because it's immediately obvious whether a bear is brown but not whether a person in your presence is liberal or you could not have a scrund that penguins don't exist in the presence of a penguin? see previous answer










Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
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Posted on Wednesday, September 02, 2009 - 5:18 am: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)
Can the scrund affect a wide variety of liberals? no Or does it only affect liberals of a certain category? yesSay, from a certain region? noishOf a certain age? no

The scrund is not about a particular issue -- is it about a place? noA person no/people yope? A thing? Is the scrund about something tangible? no Quantifiable? noAbout an emotion?
yesish Or quality? yesish(I'm thinking here of words like "patriotism" and "honor.")

Is it common for liberals who have this scrund to become aware of their incorrect belief? fairly commonIs President Obama likely to have (had) this belief? noOr Ted Kennedy?
no

Was this scrund also present in past times? yesWould JFK-era liberals have had it? ,yesFDR-era liberals? yesWould a liberal who gradually became conservative (say, as he got older) still be likely to have it? no Is it impossible for a conservative to have this scrund? yes

I know you said issues are irrelevant, but how about the general divide between moral issues and economic/military ones? irrelWould a liberal who agrees with conservatives on moral issues (abortion, gaiety, etc) have this scrund? no How about a liberal on moral issues who agrees with conservatives on economic or international policy? no Would a Blue Dog Democrat or Log Cabin Republican have this scrund? no
Kdoc (Kdoc)
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Posted on Wednesday, September 09, 2009 - 8:44 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

is the scrund that 'there are no people who believe X'? or 'no people who do not believe X'?
Nimue (Nimue)
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Kdoc (Kdoc)
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is the scrund that 'there are no people who believe X'? yesish or yope or 'no people who do not believe X'? yesish or yope
Markobr (Markobr)
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Posted on Sunday, September 13, 2009 - 8:08 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is the scrund of the form
- "Everybody knows X"?
- "Everybody wants X"?
- "Nobody wants X"?
- "Everybody believes X is morally good"?
- "Nobody believes X is morally good"?
- "Everybody will concede that X is at least possible"?
- "Everybody will concede that X is not necessarily true"?
- "Everybody will concede that we cannot be sure whether X is true"?
Nimue (Nimue)
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Markobr (Markobr)
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Post Number: 212
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Posted on Sunday, September 13, 2009 - 8:08 pm: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)
Is the scrund of the form
- "Everybody knows X"? noish
- "Everybody wants X"? yope
- "Nobody wants X"? yope
- "Everybody believes X is morally good"? This is the closest
- "Nobody believes X is morally good"? yope
- "Everybody will concede that X is at least possible"? no
- "Everybody will concede that X is not necessarily true"? no
- "Everybody will concede that we cannot be sure whether X is true"? no
Kdoc (Kdoc)
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Post Number: 928
Registered: 7-2001
Posted on Sunday, September 13, 2009 - 8:35 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

is the scrund that no intelligent people could be non-liberal?
that no non-liberal would admit to being such?
that everyone knows liberals are more morally good?
that all morally good people are liberals?
that all non-liberals are morally bad? or amoral?
Nimue (Nimue)
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Post Number: 4759
Registered: 8-2001
Posted on Sunday, September 13, 2009 - 8:52 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Kdoc (Kdoc)
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Username: Kdoc

Post Number: 928
Registered: 7-2001

Posted on Sunday, September 13, 2009 - 8:35 pm: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)
is the scrund that no intelligent people could be non-liberal? noish
that no non-liberal would admit to being such? no
that everyone knows liberals are more morally good? yope or yesish
that all morally good people are liberals? ditto
that all non-liberals are morally bad? ditto or amoral?ditto. You're very ORT, but keep in mind that we[ve already established that the scrund is about the WORD 'liberal'
Markobr (Markobr)
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Post Number: 214
Registered: 5-2009
Posted on Sunday, September 13, 2009 - 9:12 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is the scrund that the word "liberal" means "morally good"?
Kdoc (Kdoc)
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Post Number: 929
Registered: 7-2001
Posted on Sunday, September 13, 2009 - 9:14 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

is the scrund that everyone thinks a 'liberal' is a moral person? or that a 'liberal' political stance is automatically accepted as a moral one? or accepted as the most moral stance?
is the scrund that people would prefer to be called a liberal? that people would think the label 'liberal' refers to a more morally good person than non-liberal?

I had always assumed it is a good thing to be called a liberal - and was somewhat surprised to find that it was considered an insulting term by some in the US - is that the scrund?
Nimue (Nimue)
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Post Number: 4762
Registered: 8-2001
Posted on Sunday, September 13, 2009 - 9:22 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Markobr (Markobr)
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Post Number: 214
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Posted on Sunday, September 13, 2009 - 9:12 pm: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)
Is the scrund that the word "liberal" means "morally good"? yesish. See below
Kdoc (Kdoc)
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Username: Kdoc

Post Number: 929
Registered: 7-2001

Posted on Sunday, September 13, 2009 - 9:14 pm: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)
is the scrund that everyone thinks a 'liberal' is a moral person? yesish or that a 'liberal' political stance is automatically accepted as a moral one? yesish or accepted as the most moral stance? yesish
is the scrund that people would prefer to be called a liberal? yes that people would think the label 'liberal' refers to a more morally good person than non-liberal? yes

I had always assumed it is a good thing to be called a liberal - and was somewhat surprised to find that it was considered an insulting term by some in the US - is that the scrund? yes

******* SPOILER******************
I used to be reluctant to describe myself as "very liberal," because I thought that sounded like bragging, as if I were saying, "I'm a very good, generous person." This was partly because I had so little experience with non-liberals & partly because the word 'liberal' is in fact ambiguous between connoting a certain set of social & political views (which of course not everyone considers good) & really meaning something like 'generous,' as in "He's very liberal with his time."I'm very liberal with my puzzles, so I'm about to post a new one!
Noel (Noel)
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Username: Noel

Post Number: 454
Registered: 7-2009
Posted on Monday, September 14, 2009 - 5:38 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Good one! I've had that scrund at some point in my life. I've very recently been disabused of a similar one about the term "progressive," too.
Nimue (Nimue)
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Username: Nimue

Post Number: 4771
Registered: 8-2001
Posted on Monday, September 14, 2009 - 7:35 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

THANKS! CHECK OUT MY OTHERS!

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