| Author | Message | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 1781 Registered: 5-2003 |
A man is owed money by the government. He visits a bank to receive it. When he enters the office, the man is handed a broom and ordered to use it. He does so, and is given his money. Explain. | ||
| Pikachizzle (Pikachizzle)
New member Username: Pikachizzle Post Number: 418 Registered: 5-2009 |
Does the man use the broom as a prop? Does he know what the broom is for? Did he know that he was going to receive the broom? By 'broom', I'm assuming you mean a tool used for sweeping with a long handle and bristles (broomstick)? Does it matter what the broom is made of? Does he sweep with the broom? Does he use a dustpan? | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 1782 Registered: 5-2003 |
Does the man use the broom as a prop? Yesish. Does he know what the broom is for? Not at first, but very quickly. Did he know that he was going to receive the broom? No. By 'broom', I'm assuming you mean a tool used for sweeping with a long handle and bristles (broomstick)? Yes. Does it matter what the broom is made of? No. Does he sweep with the broom? No. Does he use a dustpan? No. | ||
| Galfisk (Galfisk)
New member Username: Galfisk Post Number: 540 Registered: 9-2009 |
Does the man often use brooms outside of this situation? Did he use the broom to show who he was? Could the same thing have happened if he went to a different bank? Is this a fictional story? True? Is he HAM? | ||
| Biograd (Biograd)
New member Username: Biograd Post Number: 498 Registered: 6-2008 |
Is the answer to this puzzle a "serious" situation? or is it a joke and/or play on a word or phrase? Is the purpose of using the broom to verify the man's identity? Is he famous for being able to do something unusual with a broom? | ||
| Peter365 (Peter365)
New member Username: Peter365 Post Number: 2291 Registered: 1-2007 |
Is the man's age or occupation relevant? I'm working on a theory so I'll ask if he's a circus performer or magician? Is the reason he is owed the money relevant? Is it compensation ? payment for services rendered? some sort of pension or salary? Is he expecting to collect the money in cash? a cheque? is it going to be wired to his bank account? Is this a normal retail bank or a central bank? Has the government requested that the Bank give the man the broom? Or did they think of doing it themselves? Is balancing the broom by the handle on the palm of one's hand relevant ( I was great at that as a kid)? Terrific puzzle statement by the way. Really lateral sounding | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 1785 Registered: 5-2003 |
Does the man often use brooms outside of this situation? Irr. Did he use the broom to show who he was? Yes. Could the same thing have happened if he went to a different bank? No. Is this a fictional story? True? This. Is he HAM? Yes. Is the answer to this puzzle a "serious" situation? Yes. or is it a joke and/or play on a word or phrase? No. Is the purpose of using the broom to verify the man's identity? Yes. Is he famous for being able to do something unusual with a broom? No. Is the man's age or occupation relevant? Yes. I'm working on a theory so I'll ask if he's a circus performer or magician? No. Is the reason he is owed the money relevant? Is it compensation ? payment for services rendered? some sort of pension or salary? Yes to all. Is he expecting to collect the money in cash? a cheque? is it going to be wired to his bank account? Irrelevant, but likely in the form of cash. Is this a normal retail bank or a central bank? The latter - ish. Has the government requested that the Bank give the man the broom? Or did they think of doing it themselves? The latter. Is balancing the broom by the handle on the palm of one's hand relevant ( I was great at that as a kid)? No. Terrific puzzle statement by the way. Really lateral sounding Thanks. I wasn't sure how to put it; I'm glad it's as intriguing as I hoped it'd be. | ||
| Tommyp (Tommyp)
New member Username: Tommyp Post Number: 595 Registered: 3-2004 |
Did the man have an ID? Was there a specific reason why using his ID wouldn't be enough? Was a broom the only thing he could use for proving his identity? | ||
| Noel (Noel)
New member Username: Noel Post Number: 1161 Registered: 7-2009 |
Did he dance with the broom? Use the broom to reach something? Measure his height against the broom? Do a physically challenging act with the broom? Use the broom as part of a costume? Make something out of the broom? Which part of the broom was important/useful: the handle? Or the bristles? Does it matter what the broom is made out of? | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 1788 Registered: 5-2003 |
Did the man have an ID? No. Was there a specific reason why using his ID wouldn't be enough? Was a broom the only thing he could use for proving his identity? Yes. Did he dance with the broom? Use the broom to reach something? Measure his height against the broom? Do a physically challenging act with the broom? This. Use the broom as part of a costume? Make something out of the broom? Which part of the broom was important/useful: the handle? This. Or the bristles? Does it matter what the broom is made out of? No. | ||
| Noel (Noel)
New member Username: Noel Post Number: 1162 Registered: 7-2009 |
walking on it like he would on a tight rope? Otherwise balancing on it? Breaking it? wrapping his body around it in an unusual way? Swallowing part of it (like a sword swallower)? | ||
| Tommyp (Tommyp)
New member Username: Tommyp Post Number: 599 Registered: 3-2004 |
Is the man owed money for something he did earlier, while using the broom? balance act? | ||
| Probably_monty_hall (Probably_monty_hall)
New member Username: Probably_monty_hall Post Number: 68 Registered: 10-2009 |
Is the man a government employee? Disability payment relevant? | ||
| Tommyp (Tommyp)
New member Username: Tommyp Post Number: 600 Registered: 3-2004 |
Title relevant? Did he earlier show an act of honesty? or is it the Government that is honest? | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 1789 Registered: 5-2003 |
walking on it like he would on a tight rope? Otherwise balancing on it? Breaking it? wrapping his body around it in an unusual way? Swallowing part of it (like a sword swallower)? None of these. Is the man owed money for something he did earlier, while using the broom? balance act? No to both. Is the man a government employee? No. Disability payment relevant? Possibly. Title relevant? Yes. Did he earlier show an act of honesty? or is it the Government that is honest? Neither. | ||
| Pikachizzle (Pikachizzle)
New member Username: Pikachizzle Post Number: 424 Registered: 5-2009 |
Does his job require him to do something similar to what he did with the broom? Is he fairly well-known? Is he known for the feat that he performed with the broomstick? Did he go to the bank to get paid for what his job is? | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 1792 Registered: 5-2003 |
Look out for FAs! Blooper: Is the man a government employee? No, but... Does his job require him to do something similar to what he did with the broom? No, but... Is he fairly well-known? No. Is he known for the feat that he performed with the broomstick? No. Did he go to the bank to get paid for what his job is? No, but... | ||
| Galfisk (Galfisk)
New member Username: Galfisk Post Number: 545 Registered: 9-2009 |
Was he hired by the government to do something? Would a broom handle have worked? A javelin? Sports relevant? Could it be said that he did it for his country? | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 1793 Registered: 5-2003 |
Yep, you guys definitely have an FA. Was he hired by the government to do something? No, but... Would a broom handle have worked? Probably. A javelin? Doubtful. Sports relevant? No. Could it be said that he did it for his country? No, but... | ||
| Tommyp (Tommyp)
New member Username: Tommyp Post Number: 602 Registered: 3-2004 |
He had to go to this particular bank to get the money? had he been there before? relevant? | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 1794 Registered: 5-2003 |
He had to go to this particular bank to get the money? Yes. had he been there before? Irr. relevant? | ||
| Pikachizzle (Pikachizzle)
New member Username: Pikachizzle Post Number: 426 Registered: 5-2009 |
Is the FA about his occupation? Is his age relevant? | ||
| Yojimbo (Yojimbo)
New member Username: Yojimbo Post Number: 96 Registered: 11-2009 |
sounds like the guy might be the janitor at Fort Knox, or something. anything like that relevant? or is he at the bank to cash his tax refund check? | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 1796 Registered: 5-2003 |
Is the FA about his occupation? Yesish. Is his age relevant? Yes. sounds like the guy might be the janitor at Fort Knox, or something. anything like that relevant? or is he at the bank to cash his tax refund check? No to all. | ||
| Tommyp (Tommyp)
New member Username: Tommyp Post Number: 604 Registered: 3-2004 |
Is "A man" = "he" = "he" = "the man" = "he" in the puzzle statement? Would he have been given his money even if he didn't use the broom? Did he start cleaning the florr with the broom? Was he given the broom solely for identifying purposes? was the bank instructed by the government to identify him this way? Did he know the government owed him money? had he fought for getting the money? Did he get his invitation to the money reception at the bank by post? | ||
| Pikachizzle (Pikachizzle)
New member Username: Pikachizzle Post Number: 431 Registered: 5-2009 |
Is he using a long broom? Short broom? Relevant? Does using the broom identify his AGE? Is he the: youngest man to do x and y? or the oldest man to do x and y? | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 1797 Registered: 5-2003 |
Is "A man" = "he" = "he" = "the man" = "he" in the puzzle statement? Yes. Would he have been given his money even if he didn't use the broom? There's a slight possibility, but assume no. Did he start cleaning the florr with the broom? No. Was he given the broom solely for identifying purposes? Yes. was the bank instructed by the government to identify him this way? No, it was the bank's idea. Did he know the government owed him money? Yes. had he fought for getting the money? Like in court? No. Did he get his invitation to the money reception at the bank by post? Doubtful. Is he using a long broom? Short broom? Irrelevant, though a shorter one might be preferable. Relevant? Possibly. Does using the broom identify his AGE? Yesish. Is he the: youngest man to do x and y? or the oldest man to do x and y? Irrelevant. | ||
| Tommyp (Tommyp)
New member Username: Tommyp Post Number: 605 Registered: 3-2004 |
Does he live at a steady address? or is he a bum? homeless? Is the money to be categorized as salary? gratification? compensation? pension? Was he the only person given this particular payment? or were there a group of people? many people? Was thr payment of money somehow announced? in a newspaper? radio? posters? Did he one way or another "earn" to get this money? years ago? months? days? just recently? When the man visited the bank, was the only reason to get the money? Was it a large sum? >$10,000? >1,000? >100? | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 1800 Registered: 5-2003 |
Does he live at a steady address? Yes. or is he a bum? homeless? No to both. Is the money to be categorized as salary? gratification? compensation? pension? Most likely this. Was he the only person given this particular payment? or were there a group of people? many people? This. Was thr payment of money somehow announced? Yes. in a newspaper? radio? posters? Possibly all three. Did he one way or another "earn" to get this money? Yes. years ago? This. months? days? just recently? When the man visited the bank, was the only reason to get the money? Yes. Was it a large sum? >$10,000? >1,000? I'd guess a few hundred to a few thousand, but I don't know for sure. Exact amount irrelevant. >100? | ||
| Tommyp (Tommyp)
New member Username: Tommyp Post Number: 608 Registered: 3-2004 |
So this is some sort of pension? is it really relevant for what he gets the money? does that have any connection to why the bank sees it as a good idea to identify him using the broom? Does the bank immediately get the idea of him identifying himself using the broom? or first after discovering he has no ID? does the same situation arise for other people? Is he >80 years old? >70? >60? relevant? Has he been a well-known person? is he still? | ||
| Pikachizzle (Pikachizzle)
New member Username: Pikachizzle Post Number: 432 Registered: 5-2009 |
Am I correct so far? Many people walk into a bank to collect money from their pensions. One particular man didn't bring any form of ID, and the bank cannot give him money. The bank then lets him use a short, broom handle to identify him. ________________ Are the other people able to collect their pension without trouble? Is anyone else in the same situation as the man? Is this man young? Middle aged? Old? Does using the broom directly prove his age? [i.e. He sings an old broom commercial jingle that only an old person would know.] Ages of the bank employees relevant? Anything special about the bank employees? Does it matter which person at the bank thought up the idea? Was it an employee? Was it someone in the group receiving pension? | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 1802 Registered: 5-2003 |
So this is some sort of pension? Yes. is it really relevant for what he gets the money? Yes. does that have any connection to why the bank sees it as a good idea to identify him using the broom? Yes. Does the bank immediately get the idea of him identifying himself using the broom? or first after discovering he has no ID? This. does the same situation arise for other people? Yes. Is he >80 years old? >70? >60? relevant? Everyone is at least in their 60s, and probably somewhere between 65 and 80. This is relevant. Has he been a well-known person? is he still? No to both. Am I correct so far? Aside from the fact that he isn't the only man in this situation (as noted above), yes. Many people walk into a bank to collect money from their pensions. One particular man didn't bring any form of ID, and the bank cannot give him money. The bank then lets him use a short, broom handle to identify him. ________________ Are the other people able to collect their pension without trouble? Very few of them. Is anyone else in the same situation as the man? Yes. Is this man young? Middle aged? Old? This. Does using the broom directly prove his age? Yes. [i.e. He sings an old broom commercial jingle that only an old person would know.] No, but OTRT. Ages of the bank employees relevant? No. Anything special about the bank employees? Yes. Does it matter which person at the bank thought up the idea? No. Was it an employee? Yes. Was it someone in the group receiving pension? No. | ||
| Pikachizzle (Pikachizzle)
New member Username: Pikachizzle Post Number: 433 Registered: 5-2009 |
Are the previous occupations of the employees relevant? Do other people do what the man does or is it only him? | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 1803 Registered: 5-2003 |
Are the previous occupations of the employees relevant? The bank employees? No. Do other people do what the man does As I said before, yes. or is it only him? | ||
| Tommyp (Tommyp)
New member Username: Tommyp Post Number: 612 Registered: 3-2004 |
Is it an "ordinary" bank? Is there a special reason why the people don't have ID's? Is this in USA? Are the people born in USA? Have they ever been abroad? relevant? | ||
| Pikachizzle (Pikachizzle)
New member Username: Pikachizzle Post Number: 434 Registered: 5-2009 |
Any wars relevant? | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 1805 Registered: 5-2003 |
Is it an "ordinary" bank? Noish. Is there a special reason why the people don't have ID's? Noish. To avoid an FA, I should say that even if they had IDs, it wouldn't help. Is this in USA? No. Are the people born in USA? No. Have they ever been abroad? Which ones? relevant? Yes. | ||
| Pikachizzle (Pikachizzle)
New member Username: Pikachizzle Post Number: 436 Registered: 5-2009 |
Any wars relevant? Did the bank give them the broom and then ask them to USE the broom? If yes, was the way they used the broom a conventional way of using it? Or did the way that the use the broomstick show that they were old? Sorry if my questions seem repetitive. :X | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 1807 Registered: 5-2003 |
Any wars relevant? Yes. Did the bank give them the broom and then ask them to USE the broom? Yes. If yes, was the way they used the broom a conventional way of using it? No. Or did the way that the use the broomstick show that they were old? The way they used the broom as instructed. Sorry if my questions seem repetitive. :X | ||
| Pikachizzle (Pikachizzle)
New member Username: Pikachizzle Post Number: 438 Registered: 5-2009 |
Is the group that went to collect pension a group of World War II veterans? I'm guessing it has something to do with an old war custom that involves a broom. OTRT? | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 1808 Registered: 5-2003 |
Is the group that went to collect pension a group of World War II veterans? No. I'm guessing it has something to do with an old war custom that involves a broom. OTRT? No. | ||
| Pikachizzle (Pikachizzle)
New member Username: Pikachizzle Post Number: 442 Registered: 5-2009 |
Time period relevant? Could this have happened today? | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 1812 Registered: 5-2003 |
Time period relevant? Yes. Could this have happened today? No. | ||
| Tommyp (Tommyp)
New member Username: Tommyp Post Number: 613 Registered: 3-2004 |
Was this in the 21st Century? 20th? 19th? 18th? earlier? North America? South America? Europe? Africa? Asia? Australia? Were the people getting paid earlier partaking in one special war? Were the people somehow injured in the war? and now getting a compensation pension? Nerve gas relevant? brain damage? | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 1813 Registered: 5-2003 |
Was this in the 21st Century? 20th? This. 19th? 18th? earlier? North America? South America? Europe? Africa? This. Asia? Australia? Were the people getting paid earlier partaking in one special war? If you mean, had they previously served in a particular war, then yes. Were the people somehow injured in the war? Irrelevant. and now getting a compensation pension? Yes. Nerve gas relevant? brain damage? No to both. | ||
| Tommyp (Tommyp)
New member Username: Tommyp Post Number: 614 Registered: 3-2004 |
Was it a Liberation War? Civil War? War between two African nations? more African nations? Are all that served in the war getting pension? | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 1814 Registered: 5-2003 |
Was it a Liberation War? Civil War? War between two African nations? more African nations? No to all. Are all that served in the war getting pension? Irr, assume yes. | ||
| Tommyp (Tommyp)
New member Username: Tommyp Post Number: 616 Registered: 3-2004 |
I don't particularly care for using LTPF lists, but... LTPF list of countries involved, please. | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 1819 Registered: 5-2003 |
Tanzania and Germany. | ||
| Tommyp (Tommyp)
New member Username: Tommyp Post Number: 619 Registered: 3-2004 |
Thanks. I believe I read a little about that in a travel magazine just a week or two ago... If I recall correctly Germany left Tanzania because their resources were needed for the First World War, correct? relevant? Is it Tanzanian people getting money? or Germans? Are the people getting money from Tanzanian government? German? other? Is the broom used to show the people know how to do something special? or that they have a special defect? | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 1823 Registered: 5-2003 |
If I recall correctly Germany left Tanzania because their resources were needed for the First World War, correct? No. relevant? But yes. Is it Tanzanian people getting money? This. or Germans? Are the people getting money from Tanzanian government? German? This. other? Is the broom used to show the people know how to do something special? Yes. or that they have a special defect? No. | ||
| Tommyp (Tommyp)
New member Username: Tommyp Post Number: 622 Registered: 3-2004 |
Was it anyway around the First World War Germany had to hand over Tanzania to other colonial powers? maybe at the end of the First World War? Is it relevant which countries came in charge after Germany? I believe Britain was one of those? Was it the German government that decided to pay money to Tanzanian citizens? Tanzanian? another colonial power? Were the pensions some sort of damages paid? for the murders they did during the rebellions? Were the payouts just after First World War? in the 30s? after Second World War? later? | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 1827 Registered: 5-2003 |
Was it anyway around the First World War Germany had to hand over Tanzania to other colonial powers? Yes. maybe at the end of the First World War? Yes. Is it relevant which countries came in charge after Germany? No. I believe Britain was one of those? That and Belgium, which got what are now Rwanda and Burundi. Was it the German government that decided to pay money to Tanzanian citizens? This. Tanzanian? another colonial power? Were the pensions some sort of damages paid? No. for the murders they did during the rebellions? No, and that was in Namibia. Were the payouts just after First World War? in the 30s? after Second World War? later? This. | ||
| Tommyp (Tommyp)
New member Username: Tommyp Post Number: 625 Registered: 3-2004 |
Of course a lot of people were killed in Namibia, but I remember reading about "The Maji Maji Rebellion" and that must have been in what is currently Tanzania. But enough OT... So no-one forced Germany to do this payouts? not even World Opinion? The Germans thought that even though they were no longer a colonial power in the country, they ought to pay this people? Was this partly thought of as some sort of relief/aid to Tanzania? | ||
| Tommyp (Tommyp)
New member Username: Tommyp Post Number: 626 Registered: 3-2004 |
Was it some sort of "Forced labour" during the colonial times that Germany now thought justified pension payouts to those involved and their families? | ||
| Pikachizzle (Pikachizzle)
New member Username: Pikachizzle Post Number: 444 Registered: 5-2009 |
So the bank is in Germany, correct? And the bank employees are German? And they know about the special skill that Tanzanian veterans possess? Was the skill something that was used during the war? If yes, I'm assuming it didn't involve a broom, but something of a similar shape and size? If yes, is it dynamite? | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 1828 Registered: 5-2003 |
Of course a lot of people were killed in Namibia, but I remember reading about "The Maji Maji Rebellion" and that must have been in what is currently Tanzania. But enough OT... Good point, forgot about that. But it's irrelevant. So no-one forced Germany to do this payouts? No. not even World Opinion? No. The Germans thought that even though they were no longer a colonial power in the country, they ought to pay this people? Yes. Was this partly thought of as some sort of relief/aid to Tanzania? No. Was it some sort of "Forced labour" during the colonial times that Germany now thought justified pension payouts to those involved and their families? No. So the bank is in Germany, correct? Yope. And the bank employees are German? Yes. And they know about the special skill that Tanzanian veterans possess? Yes. Was the skill something that was used during the war? Yes. If yes, I'm assuming it didn't involve a broom, but something of a similar shape and size? Yes. If yes, is it dynamite? No. | ||
| Yojimbo (Yojimbo)
New member Username: Yojimbo Post Number: 101 Registered: 11-2009 |
does the act with the broom represent a culturally-specific skill or familiarity? is it a martial skill? a sports skill? other game? does the skill call for high dexterity/extensive training/practice? would the pension be available to other Tanzanians who don't possess the skill or otherwise require the broom to receive payment? is the skill possessed by Tanzanians other than veterans seeking pensions? is the skill possessed by others besides Tanzanians? did they learn the skill from the Germans? if the skill is cultural, is it no longer (in present day) taught/learned/practiced -- i.e., is it obsolete (seems so...)? great puzzle -- Y | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 1830 Registered: 5-2003 |
does the act with the broom represent a culturally-specific skill or familiarity? For svv of culture, yes. is it a martial skill? Yes. a sports skill? Sometimes considered a sport. other game? No. does the skill call for high dexterity/extensive training/practice? Yes to all. would the pension be available to other Tanzanians who don't possess the skill or otherwise require the broom to receive payment? No. is the skill possessed by Tanzanians other than veterans seeking pensions? Yes. Good question. is the skill possessed by others besides Tanzanians? Yes. did they learn the skill from the Germans? Yes. if the skill is cultural, is it no longer (in present day) taught/learned/practiced -- i.e., is it obsolete (seems so...)? The skill is still used all over the world. great puzzle -- Y Thanks! | ||
| Pikachizzle (Pikachizzle)
New member Username: Pikachizzle Post Number: 445 Registered: 5-2009 |
Does the skill require the person to do something with their hands? | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 1835 Registered: 5-2003 |
Does the skill require the person to do something with their hands? Yes. | ||
| Yojimbo (Yojimbo)
New member Username: Yojimbo Post Number: 106 Registered: 11-2009 |
does the skill represent experience with a martial art? if so, a European/Western martial art? Asian? [I can only think of kendo and quarterstaff, and will not Google if I can help it...] was the skill taught to the Tanzanians as a martial technique? does familiarity/dexterity with the skill represent valid proof of entitlement (perhaps this Q has been asked, perhaps in another way -- seems obvious, sort of...)? although the skill is still used all over the world, is it no longer taught as a martial skill in the circumstances of this puzzle (i.e., by a government to its citizens or allies)? does having the skill verify that one learned it when it was taught long ago? does the situation work like this: "You want your money? let's see some ID." (...on second thought, ID's too easy to forge, for such an easy handout...) * clever Deutschebundesbank [I made that up, I think] staffer comes up with brilliant plan, and fetches a broom(stick?)* "Here -- if you really are who you say you are, you'll no doubt have learned [somewhat obsolete martial art involving sticks] from the German officers: let's see what you can do." Our Tanzanian HAM amazes them with his skill; he amazes himself, too, not having whirled such a stick for decades. "Clearly, this man is entitled to his pension, as he is so proficient with the stick. I haven't seen anyone as good at [SOMAIS] since my grandfather passed away. Did you see the way he handled that broom? Just like it was a (stick used in [SOMAIS])!" Rife with FAs, or not so bad? | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 1837 Registered: 5-2003 |
does the skill represent experience with a martial art? Martial art is probably too strong a term, but yesish. if so, a European/Western martial art? Western. Asian? [I can only think of kendo and quarterstaff, and will not Google if I can help it...] Neither. was the skill taught to the Tanzanians as a martial technique? Yesish. does familiarity/dexterity with the skill represent valid proof of entitlement (perhaps this Q has been asked, perhaps in another way -- seems obvious, sort of...)? Yes, it does. although the skill is still used all over the world, is it no longer taught as a martial skill in the circumstances of this puzzle (i.e., by a government to its citizens or allies)? It's still taught. does having the skill verify that one learned it when it was taught long ago? Yes, in conjunction with something else. Without that something else, no. does the situation work like this: "You want your money? let's see some ID." Not quite. (...on second thought, ID's too easy to forge, for such an easy handout...) This isn't the reason. * clever Deutschebundesbank [I made that up, I think] staffer comes up with brilliant plan, and fetches a broom(stick?)* Yep. "Here -- if you really are who you say you are, you'll no doubt have learned [somewhat obsolete martial art involving sticks] FAs. from the German officers: let's see what you can do." Not in so many words, but getting close. Our Tanzanian HAM amazes them with his skill; he amazes himself, too, not having whirled such a stick for decades. They don't have to be amazed -- he doesn't have to be all that good at it. He needs to demonstrate two things. "Clearly, this man is entitled to his pension, as he is so proficient with the stick. I haven't seen anyone as good at [SOMAIS] since my grandfather passed away. Did you see the way he handled that broom? Just like it was a (stick used in [SOMAIS])!" Close, except for no SOMAIS, and he doesn't have to be all that proficient. Rife with FAs, or not so bad? Not so bad. A couple minor FAs. You're getting close. | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 1838 Registered: 5-2003 |
Slight blooper: does familiarity/dexterity with the skill represent valid proof of entitlement (perhaps this Q has been asked, perhaps in another way -- seems obvious, sort of...)? Yes, it does, in conjunction with something else. | ||
| Pikachizzle (Pikachizzle)
New member Username: Pikachizzle Post Number: 446 Registered: 5-2009 |
Is ID even relevant? Or did the Tanzanians know that they had to do this trick with the stick in order to collect their money? | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 1841 Registered: 5-2003 |
Is ID even relevant? Not standard IDs, like a driver's license. But there are other things the veterans could show to prove their service, that most of them didn't have. Or did the Tanzanians know that they had to do this trick with the stick in order to collect their money? No. | ||
| Tommyp (Tommyp)
New member Username: Tommyp Post Number: 627 Registered: 3-2004 |
Should they handle the broom in a way they handled a weapon? a spear? a large knife? something larger than a knife but smaller (shorter) than a spear? Or is the broom not to represent a weapon? | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 1844 Registered: 5-2003 |
Should they handle the broom in a way they handled a weapon? Yes. a spear? a large knife? something larger than a knife but smaller (shorter) than a spear? This is closest, depending on the spear. Or is the broom not to represent a weapon? It does represent a weapon. | ||
| Yojimbo (Yojimbo)
New member Username: Yojimbo Post Number: 108 Registered: 11-2009 |
familiarity with the stick: the way they held it? a specific trick/manner of spinning/otherwise handling it? "demonstrate two things" - that they would understand the significance of the broom when it was handed to them, and that they would then know how to handle it properly, to demonstrate a skill they were taught as recruits/other? did these two things confer verification of ID/entitlement? (or FA...?) | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 1846 Registered: 5-2003 |
familiarity with the stick: the way they held it? a specific trick/manner of spinning/otherwise handling it? This. "demonstrate two things" - that they would understand the significance of the broom when it was handed to them, Not this. and that they would then know how to handle it properly, to demonstrate a skill they were taught as recruits/other? This. did these two things confer verification of ID/entitlement? (or FA...?) Yes. | ||
| Tommyp (Tommyp)
New member Username: Tommyp Post Number: 632 Registered: 3-2004 |
Do the demonstrate a defensive technique/parrying? Or an offensive technique? stabbing? swinging? cutting? Or more of a ceremonial technique? Other type of technique? show-off? | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 1847 Registered: 5-2003 |
Do the demonstrate a defensive technique/parrying? No. Or an offensive technique? No. stabbing? swinging? cutting? Or more of a ceremonial technique? Occasionally used for this purpose. Other type of technique? This. show-off? No. | ||
| Yojimbo (Yojimbo)
New member Username: Yojimbo Post Number: 109 Registered: 11-2009 |
marching band leader's batons? otherwise used to conduct music or keep time (as for marching/rowing/otherwise laboring)? ritually significant maneuvers with the stick? was the skill used originally as a means of establishing ID? or only in this context? | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 1848 Registered: 5-2003 |
marching band leader's batons? No. otherwise used to conduct music or keep time (as for marching/rowing/otherwise laboring)? No. ritually significant maneuvers with the stick? No. was the skill used originally as a means of establishing ID? No. or only in this context? Yes. | ||
| Yojimbo (Yojimbo)
New member Username: Yojimbo Post Number: 110 Registered: 11-2009 |
was the skill intended to be used in battle? was it ever used in battle (by the relevant Tanzanians)? was the original item used to learn/deploy(if rel) the skill a stand-in for something else, as a wooden stick might be for a sword? did the skill require both hands? Would anyone be able to assess one's skill with the broom/stick, or does it need to be one of these insiders (Tanzanian veterans, German bankers...)? demonstrate two things: that he knows how to hold it correctly? that he knows a certain maneuver with it? does the skill represent a physical motion from another context, like a swinging cut with a scthye, or chopping/threshing, or digging, or -- sweeping? | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 1849 Registered: 5-2003 |
was the skill intended to be used in battle? Yes. was it ever used in battle (by the relevant Tanzanians)? Yes. was the original item used to learn/deploy(if rel) the skill a stand-in for something else, as a wooden stick might be for a sword? No. did the skill require both hands? Yes. Would anyone be able to assess one's skill with the broom/stick, Doubtful. or does it need to be one of these insiders (Tanzanian veterans, German bankers...)? Yes. Possibly both, possibly just the banker. demonstrate two things: that he knows how to hold it correctly? Yesish, but this is combined with the next: that he knows a certain maneuver with it? Yes. IE, one of the relevant things is BOTH holding AND maneuvering it correctly. does the skill represent a physical motion from another context, like a swinging cut with a scthye, or chopping/threshing, or digging, or -- sweeping? I'm not sure I understand. The skill is specifically military. | ||
| Tommyp (Tommyp)
New member Username: Tommyp Post Number: 633 Registered: 3-2004 |
Rifles relevant? Bows? Is the original weapon (partly) made of wood? metal? plastic? other material? | ||
| Sundowner (Sundowner)
New member Username: Sundowner Post Number: 600 Registered: 6-2003 |
Was the broom to represent a ramrod? a rifle with bayonet? (I should note that the German army is not using bayonets, but this might have been different in Tanganyika.) Was the other relevant part they needed to indentify themselves to name the item correctly? to name the unit in which they served? to name in which battles they took part? to respond to orders in German language? The reason why normal IDs were useless: there was no official list of people who were entitled to receive this money? so anybody who could somehow prove to have served could claim it? | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 1850 Registered: 5-2003 |
Rifles relevant? Yes. Bows? No. Is the original weapon (partly) made of wood? Yes. metal? Yes. plastic? other material? Was the broom to represent a ramrod? a rifle with bayonet? This (dunno if the bayonet was required, though.) (I should note that the German army is not using bayonets, but this might have been different in Tanganyika.) That was nearly a hundred years ago; it might have been. Was the other relevant part they needed to indentify themselves to name the item correctly? No. to name the unit in which they served? No. to name in which battles they took part? No. to respond to orders in German language? Yes! The reason why normal IDs were useless: there was no official list of people who were entitled to receive this money? Yes. so anybody who could somehow prove to have served could claim it? Yes. | ||
| Sundowner (Sundowner)
New member Username: Sundowner Post Number: 601 Registered: 6-2003 |
Drill commands relevant? Das Gewehr - über. Das Gewehr - ab. Präsentiert das - Gewehr. | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 1852 Registered: 5-2003 |
Drill commands relevant? Yep! Good work! Can you finish it off now? | ||
| Yojimbo (Yojimbo)
New member Username: Yojimbo Post Number: 111 Registered: 11-2009 |
that must be it: to respond to orders auf Deutsch while manipulating the stand-in for the weapon. Ja? | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 1855 Registered: 5-2003 |
that must be it: to respond to orders auf Deutsch while manipulating the stand-in for the weapon. Ja? Ja! ************ Spoiler ******************* During WWI in German East Africa (now Tanzania), the German colonial army, the Schutzetruppe, fought the British throughout the war. While never defeated, they were forced to surrender when the war ended. The Schutzetruppe was composed mostly of black Africans, with German officers. While the Germans returned home, the African troops were left under British control, and were never paid for their service by the now bankrupt German government. In 1964, the West German government voted to pay pensions to the African survivors. A banker visited Tanzania and advertised for veterans of the Schutzetruppe. Hundreds responded, but it was discovered that almost none had documents to prove their service, other than the occasional scrap of uniform. So every time a man applied for a pension, he was handed a broomstick and ordered, in rapidfire German, to perform the manual of arms with it. Fifty-year-old Prussian discipline paid off, and every applicant passed the test. | ||
| Tommyp (Tommyp)
New member Username: Tommyp Post Number: 640 Registered: 3-2004 |
Didn't think at first that the solution would be that "useful"... | ||
| Yojimbo (Yojimbo)
New member Username: Yojimbo Post Number: 112 Registered: 11-2009 |
excellent puzzle, Jenburdoo. Perfect lateral setup/statement; very satisfying $poiler. thanks for an interesting and highly engaging one. -Y |
