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Nimue (Nimue)
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Username: Nimue

Post Number: 5087
Registered: 8-2001
Posted on Sunday, January 24, 2010 - 11:18 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

In the mood for some criminal behavior? Then you'll want to think of Brunor's original and almost foolproof way to rob a bank. Computers are not involved. He could have used this method in 1950. What is it?
Kdoc (Kdoc)
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Post Number: 964
Registered: 7-2001
Posted on Sunday, January 24, 2010 - 11:29 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

is it correct to say that Brunor has a way to remove money? or other valuables? from a normal high street bank? a bank vault? so that he then had the money himself? and was not caught by the police? or not suspected?

assuming he committed the robbery:
would the robbery be detected while it was going on? would it only be detected afterwards? would it never be detected?
would someone know that the ban had been robbed but not know anything about the robber? would they know the robber was a man but not know it was Brunor? would they know it was Brunor but not be able to prove it? would they be able to prove it but for some reason would not pursue a conviction?
would Brunor actually be arrested? tried?
would Brunor actually have the gains form the robbery afterwards? be able to use it? spend it?

does the robbery invlove:
a member of bank staff? is brunor a memeber of bank staff?
is Brunor's occupation relevant? is it necessary to rob the bank? or useful? is he a policeman? a repairman? does he pretend to be? or pretend to be something else?

is disguise used? weapons? intimidation? sleight of hand? distraction? violence? humour?

does his method involve knwoing the layout of the bank? knowing the movements of the staff? having a relationship with a staff memeber?
Nimue (Nimue)
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Post Number: 5093
Registered: 8-2001
Posted on Monday, January 25, 2010 - 12:09 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Kdoc (Kdoc)
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Post Number: 964
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Posted on Sunday, January 24, 2010 - 11:29 pm: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)
is it correct to say that Brunor has a way to remove money? yes or other valuables? nofrom a normal high street bank? yesa bank vault? yes so that he then had the money himself? yes and was not caught by the police? yes or not suspected? probably

assuming he committed the robbery:
would the robbery be detected while it was going on?yes would it only be detected afterwards? no would it never be detected? no
would someone know that the ban had been robbed yesbut not know anything about the robber? no would they know the robber was a man but not know it was Brunor? yes would they know it was Brunor but not be able to prove it? no would they be able to prove it but for some reason would not pursue a conviction? no
would Brunor actually be arrested? unlikely tried? even more unlikely
would Brunor actually have the gains form the robbery afterwards? yes be able to use it? possiblyspend it? ditto

does the robbery invlove:
a member of bank staff?yesis brunor a memeber of bank staff? yes
is Brunor's occupation relevant? yesis it necessary to rob the bank? yes or useful? see previous answer is he a policeman?no a repairman? no does he pretend to be? noor pretend to be something else? no

is disguise used? no weapons? no intimidation? no sleight of hand? noishdistraction? yesishviolence? no humour? no

does his method involve knwoing the layout of the bank? yesknowing the movements of the staff? yeshaving a relationship with a staff memeber? See above. He is a staff member.
Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
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Post Number: 2202
Registered: 5-2003
Posted on Monday, January 25, 2010 - 12:40 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Would Brunor be able to use the money without being caught? Would he have to cross county, state or international lines at some point?
Nimue (Nimue)
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Post Number: 5096
Registered: 8-2001
Posted on Monday, January 25, 2010 - 1:43 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
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Post Number: 2202
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Posted on Monday, January 25, 2010 - 12:40 am: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)
Would Brunor be able to use the money without being caught? possibly Would he have to cross county, state or international lines at some point? no
Torquemada (Torquemada)
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Post Number: 16
Registered: 1-2010
Posted on Monday, January 25, 2010 - 2:56 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Does Brunor have a reason, in the normal course of his work, to handle money? The same money he steals? Does he have a legitimate reason to be in the vault? Relevant?

Does Brunor's method involve diverting attention? Of staff? Customers? So that he can access the money? So that he can get the money out of the bank?

Does this plan involve working on his own? With an accomplice? Several?
Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
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Post Number: 2210
Registered: 5-2003
Posted on Tuesday, January 26, 2010 - 4:34 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

If he'd only possibly be able to use the money, he possibly wouldn't be able to use it - thus chances are its use can be tracked - thus the foolproof bit is only in getting the money away undetected? Or is the type of currency relevant -- is it cash? Securities? Stocks? Bonds? Soft? Hard? Is this a savings bank he's robbing, or some other type? Does the money end up in his Swiss bank account? Relevant?

Is this an actual robbery, with a threat of violence involved, or is it more along the lines of white-collar crime?

Is the robbery committed during business hours? Is it a robbery of the same branch at which Brunor works?

Does the trick involve -

- how he gets into the bank? (Does he?)
- how he avoids detection? (Does he?)
- how he gets into the vault (Does he?)
- how he hides the money? (Does he?)
- how he avoids leaving traces? (Does he?)
- his alibi (Does he have one)?

Does the plot involve more than one person? Is anyone framed, or does someone otherwise "take the heat" off Brunor by distracting the cops or staff in some way?

Is Brunor a teller? Manager? Assistant manager? Messenger? Security person? Loan officer? Investment broker? LTPF list of other staff roles in a bank?
Nimue (Nimue)
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Username: Nimue

Post Number: 5101
Registered: 8-2001
Posted on Tuesday, January 26, 2010 - 8:42 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
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Post Number: 2210
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Posted on Tuesday, January 26, 2010 - 4:34 am: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)
If he'd only possibly be able to use the money, he possibly wouldn't be able to use it - thus chances are its use can be tracked - thus the foolproof bit is only in getting the money away undetected? yesOr is the type of currency relevant -- is it cash? yesSecurities? noStocks? no Bonds? no Soft?I don't even know what 'soft' & 'hard' mean in this contextHard? see previous answerIs this a savings bank he's robbing, yes or some other type? no Does the money end up in his Swiss bank account? possibly Relevant? ditto

Is this an actual robbery, with a threat of violence involved, or is it more along the lines of white-collar crime?the latterish

Is the robbery committed during business hours? yes Is it a robbery of the same branch at which Brunor works? yes

Does the trick involve -

- how he gets into the bank? no (Does he? yes)
- how he avoids detection? yes(Does he? unless he's VERY unlucky)
- how he gets into the vault no (Does he? possibly)
- how he hides the money?yes (Does he? yes)
- how he avoids leaving traces? yes (Does he? unless he's VERY unlucky)
- his alibi no (Does he have one)? noish

Does the plot involve more than one person? see next answer Is anyone framed, or does someone otherwise "take the heat" off Brunor by distracting the cops or staff in some way? yes

Is Brunor a teller? yes--& no to all other answers about his job Manager? Assistant manager? Messenger? Security person? Loan officer? Investment broker? LTPF list of other staff roles in a bank?
Peter365 (Peter365)
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Username: Peter365

Post Number: 2452
Registered: 1-2007
Posted on Wednesday, January 27, 2010 - 10:19 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Was the money in the safe protected by that dye stuff that blows up and destroys the money when you open the box?

Does the distraction involve someone feigning illness? creating a scene? complaining loudly? protesting about something? carrying out their own robbery? Is the person distracting staff etc. in on the plan ? or does Brunor just avail of an unexpected opportunity?
Nimue (Nimue)
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Username: Nimue

Post Number: 5107
Registered: 8-2001
Posted on Wednesday, January 27, 2010 - 10:38 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Peter365 (Peter365)
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Post Number: 2452
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Posted on Wednesday, January 27, 2010 - 10:19 am: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)
Was the money in the safe protected by that dye stuff that blows up and destroys the money when you open the box? No--I never even heard of that stuff

Does the distraction involve someone feigning illness? nocreating a scene? no complaining loudly? no protesting about something? nocarrying out their own robbery? { yesIs the person distracting staff etc. in on the plan ? no or does Brunor just avail of an unexpected opportunity? yes
Kdoc (Kdoc)
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Username: Kdoc

Post Number: 968
Registered: 7-2001
Posted on Friday, January 29, 2010 - 9:21 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

does brunor steal the money while an attempted robbery by someone else is happening?
does he somehow make it appear that someone else is the robber?
does his method require a diversion of some sort from the normal pattern of work in the bank? does it happen during working hours? at night? does he have relevant keys? passwords?
Nimue (Nimue)
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Username: Nimue

Post Number: 5118
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Posted on Friday, January 29, 2010 - 9:45 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Kdoc (Kdoc)
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Username: Kdoc

Post Number: 968
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Posted on Friday, January 29, 2010 - 9:21 pm: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)
does brunor steal the money while an attempted robbery by someone else is happening? yes
does he somehow make it appear that someone else is the robber? yes
does his method require a diversion of some sort from the normal pattern of work in the bank? see above does it happen during working hours? yesat night? no does he have relevant keys?if any are necessary passwords? if any necessary
Kdoc (Kdoc)
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Username: Kdoc

Post Number: 972
Registered: 7-2001
Posted on Friday, January 29, 2010 - 10:01 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

so Brunor robs the bank during a robbery by other people, using the fact that he is a bank employee?

do the other robbers know him? is he working with them? do they think he is? he is just being opportunistic?

do they give him some sort of instruction? tell him to get the money out of the safe?

does he somehow arrange it so that it looks like they get away with the money? but actually he gets it? do they think they have the money? do they get away? are they arrested?

does he swap something for the money? is there a relevant bag or receptacle for the money? do the other robbers actually see the money?
Nimue (Nimue)
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Username: Nimue

Post Number: 5121
Registered: 8-2001
Posted on Friday, January 29, 2010 - 11:14 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

New member
Username: Kdoc

Post Number: 972
Registered: 7-2001

Posted on Friday, January 29, 2010 - 10:01 pm: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)
so Brunor robs the bank during a robbery by other people, using the fact that he is a bank employee? yes

do the other robbers know him? nois he working with them? no do they think he is? nohe is just being opportunistic? yes

do they give him some sort of instruction? yes tell him to get the money out of the safe? yes

does he somehow arrange it so that it looks like they get away with the money? yope but actually he gets it? yope do they think they have the money? yes do they get away? yesare they arrested? irrel

does he swap something for the money? no is there a relevant bag or receptacle for the money? no do the other robbers actually see the money? yope
Galfisk (Galfisk)
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Username: Galfisk

Post Number: 1242
Registered: 9-2009
Posted on Saturday, January 30, 2010 - 12:02 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did the robbers get away with: all the relevant money? Or only some of it? Or only what they thought was money? Did he in reality take: all the relevant money? Most of it? Some of it? Did he get money from the robbers after they got away?
Nimue (Nimue)
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Username: Nimue

Post Number: 5123
Registered: 8-2001
Posted on Saturday, January 30, 2010 - 7:41 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Galfisk (Galfisk)
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Post Number: 1242
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Posted on Saturday, January 30, 2010 - 12:02 am: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)
Did the robbers get away with: all the relevant money? no Or only some of it? yesOr only what they thought was money? no--it really was money Did he in reality take: all the relevant money? no Most of it? no Some of it? yes Did he get money from the robbers after they got away? no
Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
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Post Number: 2231
Registered: 5-2003
Posted on Sunday, January 31, 2010 - 1:05 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

So somehow he pocketed money as he was fetching it for the robbers? And thus avoided suspicion? Did he do it on the spur of the moment or had it always been a possibility and he was just waiting for a robber to show up so he could try it?

I read a mystery story recently in which a man is found with the money of a murdered man. It turns out he had not killed the man, just found him dead, and took his money figuring the police would assume the murderer had taken it instead. Something like this?

By soft vs hard I meant "cold hard cash" vs. something that can't be spent immediately, which is considered "soft money."
Nimue (Nimue)
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Username: Nimue

Post Number: 5127
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Posted on Sunday, January 31, 2010 - 8:09 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
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Post Number: 2231
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Posted on Sunday, January 31, 2010 - 1:05 am: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)
So somehow he pocketed money as he was fetching it for the robbers? yes And thus avoided suspicion? yes Did he do it on the spur of the moment or had it always been a possibility and he was just waiting for a robber to show up so he could try it?could be either

I read a mystery story recently in which a man is found with the money of a murdered man. It turns out he had not killed the man, just found him dead, and took his money figuring the police would assume the murderer had taken it instead. Something like this? yes

By soft vs hard I meant "cold hard cash" vs. something that can't be spent immediately, which is considered "soft money." Then it's hard cash. (My only economics course was in high school, & the main thing I remember from it is that the USA has very strict rules about when manufacturers are allowed to call a product "tuna with noodles" & when they have to call it "noodles with tuns." I had to give a class report on this, & it struck me as so funny that I could barely finish the presentation.)

***SPOILER **************
Brunor is a bank teller who thinks he has a foolproof way to steal from his bank--provided that there is a conventional bank robber who asks him for money. All he has to do is lie about the amount & pocket the difference. Even if the robber is caught & confesses, why should anyone believe the robber about how much money he took? This is from a detective story, but Brunor gets caught. How? That's my next puzzle--at the bottom of the page.

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