| Author | Message | ||
| Nimue (Nimue)
New member Username: Nimue Post Number: 5128 Registered: 8-2001 |
My puzzle "Where the money is" involved Brunor, a bank teller who robs his own bank by taking advantage of a conventional bank robbery where the robber demands money from him. Brunor lies about the amount of money that the robber got, figuring that even if the robber is caught, no one will believe the robber about how much money he got. Brunor thinks that his own strategy is foolproof, but he gets caught. How come? | ||
| Torquemada (Torquemada)
New member Username: Torquemada Post Number: 35 Registered: 1-2010 |
Starting with the obvious, was he seen pocketing the money? Was he caught by a security camera? Was the money marked in some way? Were the notes numbered sequentially? Was he caught before he left the building? As he left the building? Was he caught when he tried to spend the money? | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 2234 Registered: 5-2003 |
In the story I read, the police were suspicious about an unusual procedure -- the person who stole the dead man's money had been delivering his car from a garage, and claimed the dead man had not answered his door so he just left the key in the ignition. He was the first suspect because he was the last person to have been known to visit the victim, so they checked his locker at work and found the money. Was there a sort of procedure the teller was expected to take that he did not? Some procedure he did take than he shouldn't have? Did the police question him about the robbery before they realized he had stolen money? Did he make a slip of the tongue, or was there some other sort of evidence? | ||
| Nimue (Nimue)
New member Username: Nimue Post Number: 5129 Registered: 8-2001 |
Torquemada (Torquemada) New member Username: Torquemada Post Number: 35 Registered: 1-2010 Posted on Sunday, January 31, 2010 - 10:17 pm: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only) Starting with the obvious, was he seen pocketing the money? Was he caught by a security camera? Was the money marked in some way? no Were the notes numbered sequentially? irrel Was he caught before he left the building? yes As he left the building? no Was he caught when he tried to spend the money? no Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo) New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 2234 Registered: 5-2003 Posted on Sunday, January 31, 2010 - 10:45 pm: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only) In the story I read, the police were suspicious about an unusual procedure -- the person who stole the dead man's money had been delivering his car from a garage, and claimed the dead man had not answered his door so he just left the key in the ignition. He was the first suspect because he was the last person to have been known to visit the victim, so they checked his locker at work and found the money. Was there a sort of procedure the teller was expected to take that he did not?no Some procedure he did take than he shouldn't have? no Did the police question him about the robbery before they realized he had stolen money?no Did he make a slip of the tongue, no or was there some other sort of evidence? yes | ||
| Gourami (Gourami)
Moderator Username: Gourami Post Number: 915 Registered: 10-2008 |
Was Brunor searched? If so, was the evidence on him? Was it in a register? A vault? On the criminal's person? Sitting in the bank in the open? | ||
| Nimue (Nimue)
New member Username: Nimue Post Number: 5131 Registered: 8-2001 |
Gourami (Gourami) Moderator Username: Gourami Post Number: 915 Registered: 10-2008 Posted on Sunday, January 31, 2010 - 10:52 pm: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only) Was Brunor searched? possiblyIf so, was the evidence on him?yope Was it in a register? no dittoA vault? no On the criminal's person? yope Sitting in the bank in the open? yope | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 2236 Registered: 5-2003 |
Was the bank's money numbered in sequential order, and Brunor had some in his possession that corresponded to what was missing from the robber's haul? Was the robber caught? Was anything about the robber relevant? What the robber saw or heard? The robber's interaction with Brunor? | ||
| Gourami (Gourami)
Moderator Username: Gourami Post Number: 916 Registered: 10-2008 |
Was something missing that the criminal should have had? That Brunor should have had? That should have been sitting out in the bank? Could an astute detective have figured out the deception just by looking at Brunor in the bank? Was the criminal caught? Would one have to have any interaction with the criminal to discover Brunor's guilt? | ||
| Nimue (Nimue)
New member Username: Nimue Post Number: 5132 Registered: 8-2001 |
Gourami (Gourami) Moderator Username: Gourami Post Number: 916 Registered: 10-2008 Posted on Monday, February 01, 2010 - 1:55 pm: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only) Was something missing that the criminal should have had? no That Brunor should have had? noThat should have been sitting out in the bank? no Could an astute detective have figured out the deception just by looking at Brunor in the bank? noWas the criminal caught? noishWould one have to have any interaction with the criminal to discover Brunor's guilt? noish | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 2240 Registered: 5-2003 |
You missed my earlier questions, two posts up. Is anyone involved besides Brunor, the robber, and the police? Was Brunor's deception discovered within: Seconds? Minutes? Hours? Days? Weeks? Months? Years? Did Brunor take a specific action that implicated him? Was the evidence against him direct (like fingerprints) or indirect (like a pattern of behavior)? | ||
| Gourami (Gourami)
Moderator Username: Gourami Post Number: 926 Registered: 10-2008 |
Could only one specific person have realized his guilt? If so, was it someone in the bank at the time? A coworker? A customer? someone with the police? A CSI? The robber himself, who somehow gets people to believe him? | ||
| Nimue (Nimue)
New member Username: Nimue Post Number: 5135 Registered: 8-2001 |
Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo) New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 2236 Registered: 5-2003 Posted on Monday, February 01, 2010 - 5:10 am: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only) Was the bank's money numbered in sequential order, and Brunor had some in his possession that corresponded to what was missing from the robber's haul? no Was the robber caught? no Was anything about the robber relevant? yesWhat the robber saw or heard? noThe robber's interaction with Brunor? yes | ||
| Nimue (Nimue)
New member Username: Nimue Post Number: 5136 Registered: 8-2001 |
Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo) New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 2240 Registered: 5-2003 Posted on Tuesday, February 02, 2010 - 4:45 am: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only) You missed my earlier questions, two posts up. Rectified, with my apologies! Is anyone involved besides Brunor, the robber, and the police? yes Was Brunor's deception discovered within: Seconds? Minutes? Hours? Days? hours Weeks? Months? Years? Did Brunor take a specific action that implicated him? yes Was the evidence against him direct (like fingerprints) or indirect (like a pattern of behavior)? pretty direct Gourami (Gourami) Moderator Username: Gourami Post Number: 926 Registered: 10-2008 Posted on Wednesday, February 03, 2010 - 2:14 pm: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only) Could only one specific person have realized his guilt? noIf so, was it someone in the bank at the time? A coworker? A customer? someone with the police? A CSI? The robber himself, who somehow gets people to believe him? | ||
| Gourami (Gourami)
Moderator Username: Gourami Post Number: 930 Registered: 10-2008 |
Did Brunor take this action because he didn't want to be caught? Because he was newly wealthy? Did he put his stolen money somewhere? Did he do something significant with other customers? In the front area of the bank? In/around the vault? At his desk? Was it the behavior itself that was the evidence against him? Or did his action reveal material evidence? | ||
| Nimue (Nimue)
New member Username: Nimue Post Number: 5137 Registered: 8-2001 |
Gourami (Gourami) Moderator Username: Gourami Post Number: 930 Registered: 10-2008 Posted on Thursday, February 04, 2010 - 2:28 pm: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only) Did Brunor take this action because he didn't want to be caught? yesishBecause he was newly wealthy? no Did he put his stolen money somewhere? yes but that's irrelish Did he do something significant with other customers? no In the front area of the bank? In/around the vault? At his desk? probably at his desk Was it the behavior itself that was the evidence against him? Or did his action reveal material evidence? the latter | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 2289 Registered: 5-2003 |
RE: Brunor's interaction with the robber -- Brunor was the teller who handed the robber his money, correct? Or was he the teller next too, or a supervisor, or something else? Was the robber handed cash, or a bag with cash in it, or was the money transferred in some other way? Was the money accompanied by anti-theft devices, such as dye packs? Is so, was the money Brunor stole also accompanied by anti-theft devices? | ||
| Nimue (Nimue)
New member Username: Nimue Post Number: 5139 Registered: 8-2001 |
Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo) New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 2289 Registered: 5-2003 Posted on Sunday, February 07, 2010 - 12:40 am: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only) RE: Brunor's interaction with the robber -- Brunor was the teller who handed the robber his money, correct? yope Or was he the teller next too, or a supervisor, or something else? no Was the robber handed cash, or a bag with cash in it, or was the money transferred in some other way? could be cash or a bag Was the money accompanied by anti-theft devices, such as dye packs? no Is so, was the money Brunor stole also accompanied by anti-theft devices? no | ||
| Gourami (Gourami)
Moderator Username: Gourami Post Number: 936 Registered: 10-2008 |
Did Brunor call attention to the evidence himself, not knowing what it was? Did he reveal it accidentally? If so, was he aware that revealing it would incriminate him? Did he think revealing it would exonerate him instead? So, yope to whether he was the teller robbed...was he not the teller involved in the robbery, but a different teller? Was he one of two tellers involved? One of several? Was the other robber a bank employee? Was Brunor the relevent teller, but he did not "hand the robber his money"? Did he have to get the money from somewhere else? Is the money Brunor had on his person (his own cash, not related to the bank) relevant? | ||
| Nimue (Nimue)
New member Username: Nimue Post Number: 5146 Registered: 8-2001 |
Gourami (Gourami) Moderator Username: Gourami Post Number: 936 Registered: 10-2008 Posted on Thursday, February 11, 2010 - 3:32 pm: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only) Did Brunor call attention to the evidence himself, not knowing what it was? yesishDid he reveal it accidentally?yesish If so, was he aware that revealing it would incriminate him? no Did he think revealing it would exonerate him instead? yope So, yope to whether he was the teller robbed...was he not the teller involved in the robbery, but a different teller? noWas he one of two tellers involved? no One of several? no Was the other robber a bank employee? yope Was Brunor the relevent teller, but he did not "hand the robber his money"? yesish or yope Did he have to get the money from somewhere else? no Is the money Brunor had on his person (his own cash, not related to the bank) relevant? no You're all OWT (on the wrong track) on this puzzle!! | ||
| Galfisk (Galfisk)
New member Username: Galfisk Post Number: 1263 Registered: 9-2009 |
Was the evidence against Brunor found: In the bank? On the robber? On Brunor? Somewhere else? Was Brunor caught because of something the robber did? Or didn't? | ||
| Nimue (Nimue)
New member Username: Nimue Post Number: 5152 Registered: 8-2001 |
Galfisk (Galfisk) New member Username: Galfisk Post Number: 1263 Registered: 9-2009 Posted on Saturday, February 13, 2010 - 5:27 pm: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only) Was the evidence against Brunor found: In the bank? yes On the robber? noishOn Brunor? yopeSomewhere else? yopeWas Brunor caught because of something the robber did? noish Or didn't? yesish | ||
| Galfisk (Galfisk)
New member Username: Galfisk Post Number: 1264 Registered: 9-2009 |
Did the robber forget something relevant? Did he leave something relevant behind? Did the robber ask for a specific sum of money? Did Brunor count on the robber doing something he didn't? Weight of money relevant? Witness statements? | ||
| Nimue (Nimue)
New member Username: Nimue Post Number: 5153 Registered: 8-2001 |
Galfisk (Galfisk) New member Username: Galfisk Post Number: 1264 Registered: 9-2009 Posted on Saturday, February 13, 2010 - 10:25 pm: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only) Did the robber forget something relevant?no Did he leave something relevant behind? no Did the robber ask for a specific sum of money? yesish Did Brunor count on the robber doing something he didn't? yesWeight of money relevant? noWitness statements? yesish | ||
| Galfisk (Galfisk)
New member Username: Galfisk Post Number: 1266 Registered: 9-2009 |
Did the robber ask for all the money in the bank? All the money in a specific place? Was Brunor seen handing over less money that someone else knew he had to give? Was the robber seen carrying less money? Is seeing the amount of money the robber got relevant at all? The thing Brunor thought the robber would do, would he do it: before entering the bank? When entering? When threatening? when getting the money? Preparing to leave? Actually leaving? Getting away? Later? Is the robber's weapon relevant? | ||
| Nimue (Nimue)
New member Username: Nimue Post Number: 5154 Registered: 8-2001 |
Galfisk (Galfisk) New member Username: Galfisk Post Number: 1266 Registered: 9-2009 Posted on Saturday, February 13, 2010 - 11:34 pm: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only) Did the robber ask for all the money in the bank?no All the money in a specific place? no Was Brunor seen handing over less money that someone else knew he had to give? noWas the robber seen carrying less money? yope or yesishIs seeing the amount of money the robber got relevant at all? yes The thing Brunor thought the robber would do, would he do it: before entering the bank? yes When entering? yesWhen threatening? yes when getting the money? yes Preparing to leave? yes Actually leaving? most important Getting away? most important Later? most importantIs the robber's weapon relevant? no | ||
| Nimue (Nimue)
New member Username: Nimue Post Number: 5155 Registered: 8-2001 |
BLOOOOOPERRRRRRRRRALERTTTTTTTT!!!!!!!!!!Is the robber's weapon relevant? no The answer should be yesish | ||
| Galfisk (Galfisk)
New member Username: Galfisk Post Number: 1267 Registered: 9-2009 |
Is the reason why the robber did not do it important? Did it have anything to do with the amount of money he got from the robbery? Would most other robbers have done it? Was the weapon a gun? Was it concealed? Did the robber conceal his face? Relevant? | ||
| Galfisk (Galfisk)
New member Username: Galfisk Post Number: 1268 Registered: 9-2009 |
If not a gun: some other firearm? | ||
| Nimue (Nimue)
New member Username: Nimue Post Number: 5156 Registered: 8-2001 |
Galfisk (Galfisk) New member Username: Galfisk Post Number: 1267 Registered: 9-2009 Posted on Sunday, February 14, 2010 - 12:05 am: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only) Is the reason why the robber did not do it important? yesish Did it have anything to do with the amount of money he got from the robbery? yesish Would most other robbers have done it? no Was the weapon a gun? possibly Was it concealed? irrel Did the robber conceal his face?possibly Relevant?if he concealed his face, the reason is relevant Galfisk (Galfisk) New member Username: Galfisk Post Number: 1268 Registered: 9-2009 Posted on Sunday, February 14, 2010 - 12:05 am: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only) If not a gun: some other firearm? possibly | ||
| Peter365 (Peter365)
New member Username: Peter365 Post Number: 2476 Registered: 1-2007 |
Do Bruner & the Robber know each other? Did either of them use each other's name during the robbery? Had Bruner advance knowledge that the robbery was to take place? Did he expect the robber to be armed? Is knowledge of alarm or safe codes relevant? knowledge of the interior layout of the bank? Did the robber let slip something that hinted at an inside job? | ||
| Nimue (Nimue)
New member Username: Nimue Post Number: 5158 Registered: 8-2001 |
Peter365 (Peter365) New member Username: Peter365 Post Number: 2476 Registered: 1-2007 Posted on Tuesday, February 16, 2010 - 3:17 pm: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only) Do Bruner & the Robber know each other? no Did either of them use each other's name during the robbery? no Had Bruner advance knowledge that the robbery was to take place? no Did he expect the robber to be armed? see previous answer Is knowledge of alarm or safe codes relevant? no knowledge of the interior layout of the bank? no Did the robber let slip something that hinted at an inside job? noish or yope | ||
| Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 2333 Registered: 5-2003 |
Did the robber say or do something that alerted the police that something was wrong with Brunor? | ||
| Nimue (Nimue)
New member Username: Nimue Post Number: 5161 Registered: 8-2001 |
Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo) New member Username: Jenburdoo Post Number: 2333 Registered: 5-2003 Posted on Wednesday, February 17, 2010 - 5:16 am: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only) Did the robber say or do something that alerted the police that something was wrong with Brunor? yope | ||
| Nimue (Nimue)
New member Username: Nimue Post Number: 5170 Registered: 8-2001 |
HINT: You're all OWT (on the wring track) because you all seem to be making a false assumption! | ||
| Galfisk (Galfisk)
New member Username: Galfisk Post Number: 1283 Registered: 9-2009 |
Is the wrong assumption about: Brunor? The robber? The police? Was he not caught by the police? But by security? By a colleague? By a private investigator? By a passersby/bank customer? | ||
| Nimue (Nimue)
New member Username: Nimue Post Number: 5174 Registered: 8-2001 |
Galfisk (Galfisk) New member Username: Galfisk Post Number: 1283 Registered: 9-2009 Posted on Tuesday, February 23, 2010 - 3:39 pm: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only) Is the wrong assumption about: Brunor? no The robber? yes The police? in some cases Was he not caught by the police? But by security? By a colleague? By a private investigator? By a passersby/bank customer? None of these people caught the robber! | ||
| Galfisk (Galfisk)
New member Username: Galfisk Post Number: 1285 Registered: 9-2009 |
Did any of these people catch Brunor? Did Brunor think the robber would be caught? And got in trouble because the robber got away? | ||
| Nimue (Nimue)
New member Username: Nimue Post Number: 5179 Registered: 8-2001 |
Galfisk (Galfisk) New member Username: Galfisk Post Number: 1285 Registered: 9-2009 Posted on Thursday, February 25, 2010 - 10:07 am: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only) Did any of these people catch Brunor? Yes. a colleague caught Brunor Did Brunor think the robber would be caught? He was unsureAnd got in trouble because the robber got away? no | ||
| Biograd (Biograd)
New member Username: Biograd Post Number: 678 Registered: 6-2008 |
Was the robber in fact caught at all? Was there even a real robber involved? Did Brunor mistake someone for a robber, who in fact was not? If a robber was present, did he end up with any money after the robbery was complete (whether or not it was later recovered by the bank)? | ||
| Nimue (Nimue)
New member Username: Nimue Post Number: 5189 Registered: 8-2001 |
Biograd (Biograd) New member Username: Biograd Post Number: 678 Registered: 6-2008 Posted on Saturday, February 27, 2010 - 1:01 am: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only) Was the robber in fact caught at all? see next answer Was there even a real robber involved? no. GOOOOOOOD QUESTION!!Did Brunor mistake someone for a robber, who in fact was not? yes If a robber was present, did he end up with any money after the robbery was complete (whether or not it was later recovered by the bank)? n/a | ||
| Kdoc (Kdoc)
New member Username: Kdoc Post Number: 977 Registered: 7-2001 |
did brunor see what he thought was a robbery? did he see a member of staff doing something and he thought they were robbing the bank? or did he believe for some other reason that a member of staff was going to rob the bank? is blackmail relevant? was he expecting the member of staff to leave after the 'robbery'? when in fact the staff member stayed? | ||
| Oisin (Oisin)
New member Username: Oisin Post Number: 272 Registered: 12-2008 |
Is the "robber" in fact someone testing the security systems of the bank? Or someone wanting to withdraw money from their own account, whom Bruno mistakes for a robber? | ||
| Nimue (Nimue)
New member Username: Nimue Post Number: 5192 Registered: 8-2001 |
Kdoc (Kdoc) New member Username: Kdoc Post Number: 977 Registered: 7-2001 Posted on Saturday, February 27, 2010 - 7:18 pm: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only) did brunor see what he thought was a robbery? yes did he see a member of staff doing something and he thought they were robbing the bank? see below or did he believe for some other reason that a member of staff was going to rob the bank? no is blackmail relevant? no was he expecting the member of staff to leave after the 'robbery'? no when in fact the staff member stayed? no Oisin (Oisin) New member Username: Oisin Post Number: 272 Registered: 12-2008 Posted on Saturday, February 27, 2010 - 10:35 pm: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only) Is the "robber" in fact someone testing the security systems of the bank? yes Or someone wanting to withdraw money from their own account, whom Bruno mistakes for a robber? no **** SPOILER *********** Brunor the bank teller was planning to take advantage of a bank robbery, if one ever occurred, by understating how much money he gave the robber & pocketing the difference. He figured that even if the robber got caught, people would not believe a robber rather than a teller about how much money the robber got. Unfortunately for Brunor, the bank staged a fake robbery to see how well the security system was working. It sure worked against Brunor! This plot comes from a detective story. Please see my mnw puzzle you know where. |
