| Author | Message | ||
| Emma_nilsson (Emma_nilsson)
New member Username: Emma_nilsson Post Number: 328 Registered: 5-2010 |
I was the only one with ice claws that day, which was just as it should be. | ||
| Ciaobella (Ciaobella)
New member Username: Ciaobella Post Number: 840 Registered: 8-2011 |
Did you want ice claws? Did anyone else? Was this some kind of costume? Was it literally ice? Or did it look like ice? Was it some kind of food (like bear claws)? | ||
| Beachbum (Beachbum)
New member Username: Beachbum Post Number: 18 Registered: 2-2012 |
Were you ice skating? Ice fishing? Ice sailing? Out on the ice at all? Are other people relevant? If so, were they also out on the ice? Not on the ice? | ||
| Solitiare (Solitiare)
New member Username: Solitiare Post Number: 782 Registered: 7-2011 |
I have no idea what ice claws are, for which I am truly thankful! What are ice claws, anyway? | ||
| Beachbum (Beachbum)
New member Username: Beachbum Post Number: 19 Registered: 2-2012 |
I admit to doing a www search to find out. They are a pair of grips with a spike at the end of the grips, that can dig in to ice. If someone falls through ice, they hold these in their hands and spike them into the ice to help pull themselves out. I'm sure a web site or Emma could explain it better. | ||
| Emma_nilsson (Emma_nilsson)
New member Username: Emma_nilsson Post Number: 334 Registered: 5-2010 |
Did you want ice claws? definately Did anyone else? no Was this some kind of costume? no Was it literally ice? no Or did it look like ice? no Was it some kind of food (like bear claws)? no - I'll explain what ice claws are in a moment Were you ice skating? this Ice fishing? Ice sailing? Out on the ice at all? yes Are other people relevant? yes If so, were they also out on the ice? this Not on the ice? I have no idea what ice claws are, for which I am truly thankful! What are ice claws, anyway? I admit to doing a www search to find out. They are a pair of grips with a spike at the end of the grips, that can dig in to ice. If someone falls through ice, they hold these in their hands and spike them into the ice to help pull themselves out. I'm sure a web site or Emma could explain it better. This is a very good explanation, and it is, indeed, these kinds of "ice claws" I am referring to in this puzzle. ((http://www.newmoonski.com/mm5/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=nmss&Product_Code=51-9291&Category_Code=nordic-skates)) It's a really good idea to have them when on the ice and still, I was the only one carrying them the other day, and it was not surprising at all... How come? | ||
| Kyeannpepper (Kyeannpepper)
New member Username: Kyeannpepper Post Number: 337 Registered: 1-2012 |
Other's weight relevant? | ||
| Emma_nilsson (Emma_nilsson)
New member Username: Emma_nilsson Post Number: 335 Registered: 5-2010 |
Other's weight relevant? no, though I knew that question would come =) | ||
| Solitiare (Solitiare)
New member Username: Solitiare Post Number: 784 Registered: 7-2011 |
Possibility 1: Nobody else had them because the weather had been too warm, but suddenly froze, so they were used for their intended purpose. Possibility 2: Nobody else had them because the weather was too warm, and stayed warm. They were used for something besides their intended purpose. Possibility 3: The weather was cold, but they were still not used for their intended purpose. This is IRL, right? | ||
| Emma_nilsson (Emma_nilsson)
New member Username: Emma_nilsson Post Number: 336 Registered: 5-2010 |
by 'they', you mean the ice claws I was wearing? and by 'used', you mean me simply wearing them? Possibility 1: Nobody else had them because the weather had been too warm, but suddenly froze, so they were used for their intended purpose. this is correct, at least the way I see it. You probably want to define/explore Possibility 2: Nobody else had them because the weather was too warm, and stayed warm. this is also correct in a way They were used for something besides their intended purpose. no Possibility 3: The weather was cold, but they were still not used for their intended purpose. no This is IRL, right? yes, happend last weekend | ||
| Beachbum (Beachbum)
New member Username: Beachbum Post Number: 26 Registered: 2-2012 |
Where you involved in some way in training people how to rescue someone that has fallen through ice? Or possibly, training people to rescue themselves after falling through ice? Is demonstrating the usefulness of ice claws relevant? One great thing about LTPF is that a lot of the puzzles are actually very educational (well, erm, especially after I start searching the web). Now I know, the next time I live on a lake, to have a handful of ice claws on hand to give to the neighbors/friends/family who go decide do go out skating. | ||
| Emma_nilsson (Emma_nilsson)
New member Username: Emma_nilsson Post Number: 337 Registered: 5-2010 |
Where you involved in some way in training people how to rescue someone that has fallen through ice? Or possibly, training people to rescue themselves after falling through ice? Is demonstrating the usefulness of ice claws relevant? no to all, sadly One great thing about LTPF is that a lot of the puzzles are actually very educational (well, erm, especially after I start searching the web). Now I know, the next time I live on a lake, to have a handful of ice claws on hand to give to the neighbors/friends/family who go decide do go out skating. It's educational indeed! I was a little surprised though, 'ice claws' doesn't seem widely known world-wide. Is it a very swedish thing? If so, does everyone else go ice-skating without them?? I wonder if less people die ice-skating in Sweden than elsewhere... Maybe I should clearify one thing: In Sweden, it's COMMON to have ice claws when on the ice. Practically everyone has them. | ||
| Beachbum (Beachbum)
New member Username: Beachbum Post Number: 30 Registered: 2-2012 |
Emmma, in the USA, indeed it doesn't seem widely known. However I could be wrong because I don't do a lot of ice skating (well actually none), so I could just out of the loop. Also, I imagine that people seriously in to ice sports in our country would know about them. And I also I think that the sports people would also be wearing wet/dry suits as well! I agree, because they are so inexpensive (cheaper than these-skates I'm sure), that it seems silly not to go out without them. Of course, I suspect that falling into to cold water without a wet or dry suit, is a very serious emergency, and I wonder whether such a person would have the physical or mental strength to use the ice claws. All I know is that when dropping through ice, you're supposed to immediately kick like crazy, to get back on the ice from the direction you came from (since it's likely the strong ice). And if there are any signs of severe hypothermia, to seek emergency medical attention promptly! For example, I read that one danger is cardiac arrest as the the cold blood flows back in to the heart. | ||
| Ciaobella (Ciaobella)
New member Username: Ciaobella Post Number: 861 Registered: 8-2011 |
I apologize. I'm from a warm climate. We have indoor ice-skating arenas, but "ice claws" have never been a necessity for me. | ||
| Beachbum (Beachbum)
New member Username: Beachbum Post Number: 52 Registered: 2-2012 |
Were the other skaters for some reason forbidden to use ice claws? Was the weather warm enough that the ice claws were not needed for the other people? Were you the only one of the skaters who could not swim? Was there some reason that if the other skaters used ice claws, some bad might happen? I'm assuming that the other people were on the ice were also skating. Is this true? | ||
| Emma_nilsson (Emma_nilsson)
New member Username: Emma_nilsson Post Number: 341 Registered: 5-2010 |
Were the other skaters for some reason forbidden to use ice claws? I don't think so Was the weather warm enough that the ice claws were not needed for the other people? no Were you the only one of the skaters who could not swim? no Was there some reason that if the other skaters used ice claws, some bad might happen? no I'm assuming that the other people were on the ice were also skating. Is this true? yes | ||
| Beachbum (Beachbum)
New member Username: Beachbum Post Number: 66 Registered: 2-2012 |
Where the other people skating, but somewhere else (like an ice rink where there is no water to fall through)? | ||
| Emma_nilsson (Emma_nilsson)
New member Username: Emma_nilsson Post Number: 343 Registered: 5-2010 |
Where the other people skating, but somewhere else (like an ice rink where there is no water to fall through)? we were all on the same lake, but you're kind of on the right track here anyway... | ||
| Beachbum (Beachbum)
New member Username: Beachbum Post Number: 104 Registered: 2-2012 |
Well in that case, was there an area of the lake where it would have been impossible to fall through? Because it was much colder in a certain area of the lake? Were the other skaters in an area that was especially shady? Was it just that the melted water underneath was very shallow or even non-existent where the other skaters were? | ||
| Emma_nilsson (Emma_nilsson)
New member Username: Emma_nilsson Post Number: 345 Registered: 5-2010 |
Well in that case, was there an area of the lake where it would have been impossible to fall through? yes! Because it was much colder in a certain area of the lake? Were the other skaters in an area that was especially shady? Was it just that the melted water underneath was very shallow or even non-existent where the other skaters were? OTRT, but no, there was a different reason to why the others were in no danger of falling through the ice. I can $poil if you want. | ||
| Shez (Shez)
New member Username: Shez Post Number: 3000 Registered: 2-2011 |
was the place where the others were skating covered in real ice? were they actually on a skating rink at the same location as the lake? | ||
| Emma_nilsson (Emma_nilsson)
New member Username: Emma_nilsson Post Number: 346 Registered: 5-2010 |
was the place where the others were skating covered in real ice? yes were they actually on a skating rink at the same location as the lake? noish... depends on your definition of a skating rink, I suppose. We were all on the same lake, however. | ||
| Beachbum (Beachbum)
New member Username: Beachbum Post Number: 116 Registered: 2-2012 |
Natural lake? Artificial? Lost of things just below water level to hang on to? Like old tree branches? Old bricks? Old houses? | ||
| Emma_nilsson (Emma_nilsson)
New member Username: Emma_nilsson Post Number: 347 Registered: 5-2010 |
Natural lake? this Artificial? Lost of things just below water level to hang on to? Like old tree branches? Old bricks? Old houses? no. remember, the others were in no danger to fall through the ice | ||
| Beachbum (Beachbum)
New member Username: Beachbum Post Number: 118 Registered: 2-2012 |
Was the lake in some areas very shallow and so there was ice down to the bottom of the lake, with no water underneath? | ||
| Emma_nilsson (Emma_nilsson)
New member Username: Emma_nilsson Post Number: 348 Registered: 5-2010 |
Was the lake in some areas very shallow yes and so there was ice down to the bottom of the lake, with no water underneath? no A hint might be that this happened in March | ||
| Beachbum (Beachbum)
New member Username: Beachbum Post Number: 127 Registered: 2-2012 |
Ok sorry Emma, I'm stuck on this. I take it a key factor was that the weather was warm. Does this puzzle require any practical skating knowledge, other than that if the ice is too thin, or if the weather is too warm (and in danger of melting the ice), you might fall in? Was is it a warm sunny day, and the other skaters were in the shade, and you weren't? | ||
| Beachbum (Beachbum)
New member Username: Beachbum Post Number: 148 Registered: 2-2012 |
Hint? Recap? | ||
| Emma_nilsson (Emma_nilsson)
New member Username: Emma_nilsson Post Number: 359 Registered: 5-2010 |
Ok sorry Emma, I'm stuck on this. I take it a key factor was that the weather was warm. you are right to do so Does this puzzle require any practical skating knowledge, other than that if the ice is too thin, or if the weather is too warm (and in danger of melting the ice), you might fall in? no, this is all you need to know, but it would also help to know a bit details about ice-melting... but I'm sure you can figure it out Was is it a warm sunny day, and the other skaters were in the shade, and you weren't? no, we were all in the sun, it was a lovely day Hint? Recap? I'll give you a bit of the scenario... It had been a good ice skating season and a really cold winter. At the end of February, the ice on the lake was almost half a meter thick. People stopped bothering taking ice claws with them when skating. Suddenly the weather shifted, it turned warm and the ice started melting. However, it was still so thick, noone was worried or in any danger of falling through the ice. Except for me. And weight isn't relevant. =) | ||
| Kyeannpepper (Kyeannpepper)
New member Username: Kyeannpepper Post Number: 679 Registered: 1-2012 |
Were you wearing different skates from the rest? Sharper ones? Were you skating in an area that was covered in snow, where the ice might be thinner? Salt or alcohol lowering the freezing point of water relevant? | ||
| Emma_nilsson (Emma_nilsson)
New member Username: Emma_nilsson Post Number: 360 Registered: 5-2010 |
Were you wearing different skates from the rest? Sharper ones? no Were you skating in an area that was covered in snow, where the ice might be thinner? a big YES to this, except that the area wasn't covered in snow - and not only might be thinner, I was in serious danger of getting wet that day =) Salt or alcohol lowering the freezing point of water relevant? no | ||
| Kyeannpepper (Kyeannpepper)
New member Username: Kyeannpepper Post Number: 683 Registered: 1-2012 |
So it was indeed thinner, so thin you had a much larger chance than the others of falling in, right? And it was thinner from a natural cause, right? Or was it thinner from a manmade cause? | ||
| Emma_nilsson (Emma_nilsson)
New member Username: Emma_nilsson Post Number: 361 Registered: 5-2010 |
So it was indeed thinner, so thin you had a much larger chance than the others of falling in, right? indeed And it was thinner from a natural cause, right? this Or was it thinner from a manmade cause? you don't have to figure out exactly why the ice was thinner, but why was I the only one in danger of falling through? | ||
| Enjay (Enjay)
New member Username: Enjay Post Number: 1463 Registered: 4-2007 |
Were you the only one skating in that area for some reason? To stop others doing so? Or were others but you were more likely to fall through? Are you heavier? The only adult with lots of children? | ||
| Emma_nilsson (Emma_nilsson)
New member Username: Emma_nilsson Post Number: 362 Registered: 5-2010 |
Were you the only one skating in that area for some reason? yes! no to rest, though To stop others doing so? Or were others but you were more likely to fall through? Are you heavier? The only adult with lots of children? | ||
| Enjay (Enjay)
New member Username: Enjay Post Number: 1464 Registered: 4-2007 |
Did you know the ice was thinner there? Is the reason why nobody else was there that they knew there was a risk of falling in? Is it because you had ice claws that you were OK with skating there? Or did you bring ice claws because you knew you would be skating on thin ice? | ||
| Emma_nilsson (Emma_nilsson)
New member Username: Emma_nilsson Post Number: 363 Registered: 5-2010 |
Did you know the ice was thinner there? yes Is the reason why nobody else was there that they knew there was a risk of falling in? yes, but only part of the reason Is it because you had ice claws that you were OK with skating there? I wasn't really ok with it, I was quite nervous Or did you bring ice claws because you knew you would be skating on thin ice? yes | ||
| Enjay (Enjay)
New member Username: Enjay Post Number: 1465 Registered: 4-2007 |
Were you skating 'normally', ie just gliding around having fun? Or did you go onto the thin ice for a reason? To fetch something? Were you chosen to go onto the thin ice, because somebody had to? Was it your choice to go there? Were you playing a game? Testing whether the ice was safe? | ||
| Emma_nilsson (Emma_nilsson)
New member Username: Emma_nilsson Post Number: 364 Registered: 5-2010 |
Were you skating 'normally', ie just gliding around having fun? no! Or did you go onto the thin ice for a reason? yes To fetch something? no Were you chosen to go onto the thin ice, because somebody had to? no Was it your choice to go there? yes Were you playing a game? no Testing whether the ice was safe? no | ||
| Enjay (Enjay)
New member Username: Enjay Post Number: 1467 Registered: 4-2007 |
Did you go onto it because it was thin? Or for some other reason, despite the fact that it was more dangerous? Is it relevant why you and not someone else was on the thin ice? Were other people skating on the thicker ice? Were they skating for the same purpose as you? Were you following a particular route as you skated? Did you skate exclusively on the thin ice? | ||
| Emma_nilsson (Emma_nilsson)
New member Username: Emma_nilsson Post Number: 365 Registered: 5-2010 |
Did you go onto it because it was thin? no Or for some other reason, despite the fact that it was more dangerous? so, yes Is it relevant why you and not someone else was on the thin ice? yes Were other people skating on the thicker ice? yes Were they skating for the same purpose as you? yes (or well, actually no, which makes this puzzle even harder, but you can assume yes - that we were all there skating just to have a nice day out) Were you following a particular route as you skated? yesish - explore! Did you skate exclusively on the thin ice? no! | ||
| Shez (Shez)
New member Username: Shez Post Number: 3034 Registered: 2-2011 |
were you responible for the safety of the others? like a lifeguard in a swimming pool? were you testing the ice to see where it would not be safe? | ||
| Enjay (Enjay)
New member Username: Enjay Post Number: 1468 Registered: 4-2007 |
Were you trying to draw out a particular path with your skates? Were you skating around the edge of the lake? Skating up and down it? Figure skating? Racing? Did you (as opposed to someone else) go on the thin ice because you were the only one following whatever route you were following? Because you had ice claws, so it was safest for you to go? Because it was safest for you for some other reason? Because everyone else was too scared? If you had stuck to the thicker ice, would something bad have happened? Would you have had less fun? Would the others have had less fun? | ||
| Emma_nilsson (Emma_nilsson)
New member Username: Emma_nilsson Post Number: 366 Registered: 5-2010 |
were you responible for the safety of the others? like a lifeguard in a swimming pool? no were you testing the ice to see where it would not be safe? no, I already knew it wasn't safe Were you trying to draw out a particular path with your skates? not sure what you mean by this, rephrase? The answer might be yes Were you skating around the edge of the lake? this, but misleading Skating up and down it? Figure skating? Racing? no to rest Did you (as opposed to someone else) go on the thin ice because you were the only one following whatever route you were following? yes! Because you had ice claws, so it was safest for you to go? Because it was safest for you for some other reason? Because everyone else was too scared? not sure how to answer these questions... Noone cared that I went onto the thin ice (except for one who warned about open water in the vicinity) and I didn't do it for the sake of someone else. The others avoided the thin ice, some probably because they were too scared to go, but mostly for a different reason. If you had stuck to the thicker ice, would something bad have happened? noish, but explore Would you have had less fun? yesish, explore Would the others have had less fun? no | ||
| Enjay (Enjay)
New member Username: Enjay Post Number: 1469 Registered: 4-2007 |
Are the tracks that your skates left in the ice relevant? I meant that you might have been trying to draw a shape, or write a message, with your tracks, which would require going onto the thinner ice? Were you doing laps of the lake? Going round and round the edge? Did you repeat whatever route you were taking more than once? Did you at any point skate in the middle of the lake? Was the thin ice at one end of the lake? In the middle? In more than one spot? | ||
| Shez (Shez)
New member Username: Shez Post Number: 3036 Registered: 2-2011 |
did you go onto the thin ice to look for something? retrieve something? because it was more fun to skate there? | ||
| Emma_nilsson (Emma_nilsson)
New member Username: Emma_nilsson Post Number: 368 Registered: 5-2010 |
Are the tracks that your skates left in the ice relevant? I meant that you might have been trying to draw a shape, or write a message, with your tracks, which would require going onto the thinner ice? no, nothing like this Were you doing laps of the lake? yes, but might still be misleading Going round and round the edge? yesish Did you repeat whatever route you were taking more than once? yes but irr Did you at any point skate in the middle of the lake? no Was the thin ice at one end of the lake? yes and no In the middle? no In more than one spot? yes did you go onto the thin ice to look for something? retrieve something? no because it was more fun to skate there? no, I didn't at all enjoy skating there | ||
| Beachbum (Beachbum)
New member Username: Beachbum Post Number: 172 Registered: 2-2012 |
Is it simply because you live on the lake (if so, lucky you!), and you have to skate through some thin ice in front of your house? | ||
| Emma_nilsson (Emma_nilsson)
New member Username: Emma_nilsson Post Number: 369 Registered: 5-2010 |
Is it simply because you live on the lake (if so, lucky you!), and you have to skate through some thin ice in front of your house? this is certainly close enough, very good! SPOILER I live near a big lake, where I go ice skating every winter. This february, the sun had been out for several days, melting the ice near the shore of the lake. Further out, where the skating tracks were, the ice was very thick indeed and safe to skate on without ice claws. People coming to the lake to skate, entered the ice from a point near the train station, where the ice was safe, even near the shore. I was the only one stepping onto the ice elsewhere (at the point of the lake closest to my house), where the ice was very thin. At several places near the shore, there was even open water. While crossing this part of thin ice, I was quite worried the ice would break, but at least the water wasn't very deep there. =) When I reached the skating tracks, I got some funny looks because I was the only one with ice claws, as they didn't know I had actually needed them to get onto the tracks. | ||
| Beachbum (Beachbum)
New member Username: Beachbum Post Number: 180 Registered: 2-2012 |
Damn, I actually got one right! You are very lucky to to have a house on a lake!! (Always looking for a place to keep a centreboard sloop!) | ||
| Emma_nilsson (Emma_nilsson)
New member Username: Emma_nilsson Post Number: 370 Registered: 5-2010 |
The lake isn't quite big enough to sail on, but I live fairly close to another lake that is, so yeah. =) | ||
| Beachbum (Beachbum)
New member Username: Beachbum Post Number: 187 Registered: 2-2012 |
Well just to be clear, that wasn't a request .. besides, flying to Sweeden after work during the summer days could be quite expensive! Kind of bummed about the whole thing because moved where I am now because of a big beautiful lake a mile from my Townhouse, only to find out that it's so over-run with motorboats and PWC's that it could be downright dangerous to sail on it at certain times. Plus there's the issue of where to keep the dinghy. There is long island sound and a casual sailing club on a local lake but the lake is a 25 minute drive (and now has motorboats), and Long Island sound, though it has clubs, is an hour drive. |
