| Author | Message | ||
| Enjay (Enjay)
New member Username: Enjay Post Number: 2019 Registered: 4-2007 |
I recently read a book involving a policeman, who stated that perpetrators of a certain crime can often be caught in an unexpected (to me, at least) way. I can't vouch for how true this is of real-life policing, but can you work out the situation? | ||
| Doriana (Doriana)
New member Username: Doriana Post Number: 3233 Registered: 12-2010 |
the certain crime... murder? manslaughter? assault? rape? robbery? kidnapping? theft? fraud? drug-related? traffic-related? a white-collar crime? Does the unexpected way involve some kind of trap? | ||
| Enjay (Enjay)
New member Username: Enjay Post Number: 2031 Registered: 4-2007 |
the certain crime... murder? Probably this manslaughter? Potentially this assault? Or this rape? robbery? kidnapping? theft? fraud? drug-related? traffic-related? a white-collar crime? No to rest Does the unexpected way involve some kind of trap? No | ||
| Doriana (Doriana)
New member Username: Doriana Post Number: 3236 Registered: 12-2010 |
Is DNA involved? Other traces that the criminal leaves behind? Witnesses relevant? | ||
| Galfisk (Galfisk)
New member Username: Galfisk Post Number: 4971 Registered: 9-2009 |
Social media? Bragging? Confessing to someone? Hospitals involved? | ||
| Deholmes (Deholmes)
New member Username: Deholmes Post Number: 171 Registered: 11-2012 |
suicide? the only crime you can be arrested for attempting but not for successfully committing. | ||
| Redwine (Redwine)
New member Username: Redwine Post Number: 1708 Registered: 1-2011 |
By this unusual way, are criminals caught in the act? Does "catching" involve: working out the perpetrators' identity? gaining sufficient evidence to prove them guilty? Does the policeman's statement include all cases of homicide? Are circumstances of the crime relevant? | ||
| Enjay (Enjay)
New member Username: Enjay Post Number: 2032 Registered: 4-2007 |
Is DNA involved? Yes, in part Other traces that the criminal leaves behind? No Witnesses relevant? No Social media? Bragging? Confessing to someone? Hospitals involved? No to all suicide? the only crime you can be arrested for attempting but not for successfully committing. Not this...and can you not be arrested for attempted murder, attempted robbery etc? By this unusual way, are criminals caught in the act? No Does "catching" involve: working out the perpetrators' identity? This gaining sufficient evidence to prove them guilty? This too Does the policeman's statement include all cases of homicide? No Are circumstances of the crime relevant? Yes, very | ||
| Redwine (Redwine)
New member Username: Redwine Post Number: 1713 Registered: 1-2011 |
Do the criminals, to whom the policeman's statement applies, commit also other crimes in the same act? If yes, terroristic crimes? taking hostages? kidnapping? | ||
| Enjay (Enjay)
New member Username: Enjay Post Number: 2033 Registered: 4-2007 |
Do the criminals, to whom the policeman's statement applies, commit also other crimes in the same act? If yes, terroristic crimes? taking hostages? kidnapping? Irrel, assume no | ||
| Doriana (Doriana)
New member Username: Doriana Post Number: 3244 Registered: 12-2010 |
The relevant circumstances: Where the crime was committed? when it was committed? the relationship between the criminal and the victim? Are weapons relevant? Does the way they're caught involve any recent technologies? Would the same way have been possible 20 years ago? 50? 100? | ||
| Redwine (Redwine)
New member Username: Redwine Post Number: 1719 Registered: 1-2011 |
Are means of transportation relevant? Can this way apply to other crimes than homicide? | ||
| Enjay (Enjay)
New member Username: Enjay Post Number: 2034 Registered: 4-2007 |
The relevant circumstances: Where the crime was committed? when it was committed? the relationship between the criminal and the victim? None of these Are weapons relevant? Yes Does the way they're caught involve any recent technologies? DNA testing makes it extra likely they'll be caught but this way existed to some extent before that Would the same way have been possible 20 years ago? 50? 100? Yes to all, but less so before the advent of DNA tests (not sure when that was) Are means of transportation relevant? No Can this way apply to other crimes than homicide? Yes | ||
| Redwine (Redwine)
New member Username: Redwine Post Number: 1723 Registered: 1-2011 |
Are the relevant DNA samples those of perpetrators? Those of victims? Are the samples taken from the weapons? Is catching the criminal this way possible if he shots at the victim from distance? Stabs the victim? Strangles the victim with a randomly found piece of string? Poisons the victim's food? | ||
| Enjay (Enjay)
New member Username: Enjay Post Number: 2036 Registered: 4-2007 |
Are the relevant DNA samples those of perpetrators? This Those of victims? No Are the samples taken from the weapons? No Is catching the criminal this way possible if he shots at the victim from distance? Stabs the victim? Yes, no to rest Strangles the victim with a randomly found piece of string? Poisons the victim's food? | ||
| Galfisk (Galfisk)
New member Username: Galfisk Post Number: 4984 Registered: 9-2009 |
Does it work with fingerprints also? Leaving the weapon behind relevant? | ||
| Enjay (Enjay)
New member Username: Enjay Post Number: 2038 Registered: 4-2007 |
Does it work with fingerprints also? No Leaving the weapon behind relevant? No, this would work whether or not the weapon was left | ||
| Doriana (Doriana)
New member Username: Doriana Post Number: 3255 Registered: 12-2010 |
Is/Are the victim's wound/s relevant? | ||
| Enjay (Enjay)
New member Username: Enjay Post Number: 2040 Registered: 4-2007 |
Is/Are the victim's wound/s relevant? No | ||
| Galfisk (Galfisk)
New member Username: Galfisk Post Number: 4989 Registered: 9-2009 |
Are they caught only because they leave DNA behind at the crime scene? Or do they leave DNA somewhere else relevant? Existing DNA registers relevant? Relevant what form the DNA is in? If so: blood? Hair? Skin? Spit? Semen? Urine or feces? Injuries to the killer relevant? Is the DNA on the weapon, and transferred to the victim when the weapon is used? | ||
| Enjay (Enjay)
New member Username: Enjay Post Number: 2043 Registered: 4-2007 |
Are they caught only because they leave DNA behind at the crime scene? This is half of it, see below Or do they leave DNA somewhere else relevant? No Existing DNA registers relevant? They would help to catch the criminal I suppose Relevant what form the DNA is in? Yes If so: blood? This Hair? Skin? Spit? Semen? Urine or feces? Injuries to the killer relevant? Yes, and this is the second half Is the DNA on the weapon, and transferred to the victim when the weapon is used? Yope | ||
| Galfisk (Galfisk)
New member Username: Galfisk Post Number: 4998 Registered: 9-2009 |
Is the blood from: the victim hurting the killer? The killer hurting himself? Do killers surprisingly often hurt themselves? | ||
| Enjay (Enjay)
New member Username: Enjay Post Number: 2046 Registered: 4-2007 |
Is the blood from: the victim hurting the killer? No The killer hurting himself? Yes Do killers surprisingly often hurt themselves? Yes - how? | ||
| Galfisk (Galfisk)
New member Username: Galfisk Post Number: 4999 Registered: 9-2009 |
With their own weapon? Before the murder? during? After? When running away? When hiding? When chasing the victim? When being chased by someone? | ||
| Enjay (Enjay)
New member Username: Enjay Post Number: 2051 Registered: 4-2007 |
With their own weapon? Yes Before the murder? during? This, no to rest After? When running away? When hiding? When chasing the victim? When being chased by someone? | ||
| Galfisk (Galfisk)
New member Username: Galfisk Post Number: 5000 Registered: 9-2009 |
Do they hurt a certain body part of themselves? Hold the knife incorrectly? Accidentally stab the hand they're holding the victim with? Holding the victim relevant at all? Get hurt on the knife while it's stuck in the victim? Drop the knife on themselves? On their feet? Relevant if they're angry? Relevant if the victim is restrained? If so, relevant how the victim is restrained? Is any movement of the victim relevant? | ||
| Shez (Shez)
New member Username: Shez Post Number: 3722 Registered: 2-2011 |
do they hurt themselves on the weapon as they pull it out - say for multiple stabbings? or do they stab over-enthusiastically and damage themselves that way? | ||
| Deholmes (Deholmes)
New member Username: Deholmes Post Number: 174 Registered: 11-2012 |
I have a 44 mag that if not held right can draw blood from around my thumb is this in the general area of the DNA Clue? Was blood left accidently on the weapon? something else? And leave the cloth with DNA? Was the cloth a clue? | ||
| Enjay (Enjay)
New member Username: Enjay Post Number: 2052 Registered: 4-2007 |
Do they hurt a certain body part of themselves? Yes Hold the knife incorrectly? Yesish Accidentally stab the hand they're holding the victim with? No Holding the victim relevant at all? No Get hurt on the knife while it's stuck in the victim? No Drop the knife on themselves? No On their feet? No Relevant if they're angry? Relevant if the victim is restrained? If so, relevant how the victim is restrained? Is any movement of the victim relevant? Irrel to all do they hurt themselves on the weapon as they pull it out - say for multiple stabbings? No or do they stab over-enthusiastically and damage themselves that way? Yes I have a 44 mag that if not held right can draw blood from around my thumb is this in the general area of the DNA Clue? The DNA clue is to do with accidentally drawing the criminal's own blood by the weapon, but it is specific to a knife attack Was blood left accidently on the weapon? something else? This And leave the cloth with DNA? Was the cloth a clue? No cloth is relevant | ||
| Galfisk (Galfisk)
New member Username: Galfisk Post Number: 5009 Registered: 9-2009 |
Hurting themselves in the: head? Arm? Hand? Torso? Leg? Foot? Butt? Relevant where their blood ends up? | ||
| Enjay (Enjay)
New member Username: Enjay Post Number: 2057 Registered: 4-2007 |
Hurting themselves in the: head? Arm? Hand? This Torso? Leg? Foot? Butt? Relevant where their blood ends up? Only in that it is left behind for the police to find | ||
| Galfisk (Galfisk)
New member Username: Galfisk Post Number: 5016 Registered: 9-2009 |
Stabbing hand? Other hand? Slipping with the hand relevant? Slipping in blood? Using knives not fit for the purpose? Knives with no hand guard? | ||
| Enjay (Enjay)
New member Username: Enjay Post Number: 2058 Registered: 4-2007 |
Stabbing hand? Yes Other hand? Slipping with the hand relevant? Yes Slipping in blood? no Using knives not fit for the purpose? Yesish, see next Knives with no hand guard? YES I think most of the pieces are there, can you put it together? | ||
| Galfisk (Galfisk)
New member Username: Galfisk Post Number: 5017 Registered: 9-2009 |
Knife murderers are an often inexperienced lot, and having no concept of what it takes to successfully stab a person, they often use inappropriate, unsafe knives as well as disproportionate force and poor technique, leaving them at a high risk of slipping with their hands and cutting themselves on their own weapon. The blood surprisingly often left behind from these accidents leads police to the culprit, who is apprehended, tried and jailed, thus taking him or her out of commission and ensuring the continued ineptness of the knife-murdering segment of the population. | ||
| Enjay (Enjay)
New member Username: Enjay Post Number: 2061 Registered: 4-2007 |
Knife murderers are an often inexperienced lot, and having no concept of what it takes to successfully stab a person, they often use inappropriate, unsafe knives as well as disproportionate force and poor technique, leaving them at a high risk of slipping with their hands and cutting themselves on their own weapon. The blood surprisingly often left behind from these accidents leads police to the culprit, who is apprehended, tried and jailed, thus taking him or her out of commission and ensuring the continued ineptness of the knife-murdering segment of the population. All correct, and that's the bulk of the sp01ler. The novel included one other detail, by which the criminal's hurting himself got him caught despite the fact that he was not on DNA records so testing the blood he left behind was not immediately helpful. You can try to get that but otherwise I'll end this soon. | ||
| Redwine (Redwine)
New member Username: Redwine Post Number: 1732 Registered: 1-2011 |
Did the police check the hospitals for that kind of injuries? | ||
| Galfisk (Galfisk)
New member Username: Galfisk Post Number: 5027 Registered: 9-2009 |
Did he go to the hospital? Get a bandage? Throw the bandage in his own trash, where it was picked up by police? Or something along those lines? I recall a story about a suspected murderer, who defied all attempts of collecting a DNA sample from him. "I know what you're trying to do" he said at one occasion, and spat contemptuously on the ground - the spit sample was what they needed in order to try and convict him for the murder. | ||
| Enjay (Enjay)
New member Username: Enjay Post Number: 2062 Registered: 4-2007 |
Did the police check the hospitals for that kind of injuries? Not in the story, but that's a good thought - it was even simpler than that Did he go to the hospital? Get a bandage? Throw the bandage in his own trash, where it was picked up by police? Or something along those lines? No to all I recall a story about a suspected murderer, who defied all attempts of collecting a DNA sample from him. "I know what you're trying to do" he said at one occasion, and spat contemptuously on the ground - the spit sample was what they needed in order to try and convict him for the murder. Clever! | ||
| Galfisk (Galfisk)
New member Username: Galfisk Post Number: 5040 Registered: 9-2009 |
Did they go door to door? Did they see someone with a bandaged hand? An injured hand? Did he bleed somewhere relevant? Was the comparison DNA from blood he lost? From blood drawn from him? From something else? A sample recovered from him: secretly? by force? willingly? | ||
| Enjay (Enjay)
New member Username: Enjay Post Number: 2064 Registered: 4-2007 |
Did they go door to door? Did they see someone with a bandaged hand? This... An injured hand? And this Did he bleed somewhere relevant? Was the comparison DNA from blood he lost? From blood drawn from him? From something else? A sample recovered from him: secretly? by force? willingly? ****SPOILER**** A policeman investigating a knife crime in a novel I read claimed that as stabbing someone takes much more force than most people realise, it is common for the attacker's hand to slip down onto the blade of the knife as it goes in. This can mean that the attacker's blood is left behind and can be analysed for DNA. In the novel, they couldn't do this but when the policeman noticed that one of the victim's associates had a bandaged hand, that was enough to put the police on the right track. Thanks to all who played, especially Galfisk for chasing it through to the end! |
