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Lateral Puzzles » Solved Lateral Thinking Puzzles » Solved Puzzles - April 2005 » [Sundowner] An der Alster, an der Elbe, an der Bill » Archive through December 08, 2004 « Previous Next »

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Jens Weber (Sundowner)
Posted on Friday, November 26, 2004 - 12:35 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

It worked for the second time.
Birgitta Ericsson (Brid)
Posted on Friday, November 26, 2004 - 12:59 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did it not work the first time round?
Jens Weber (Sundowner)
Posted on Friday, November 26, 2004 - 1:05 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did it not work the first time round? It worked the first time as well, but in a different (more straightforward) way.
Birgitta Ericsson (Brid)
Posted on Friday, November 26, 2004 - 1:36 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Are German rivers relevant to the puzzle?
Is it based on a true story? Something you experienced?
Are any human beings involved? Many of them?
Jens Weber (Sundowner)
Posted on Friday, November 26, 2004 - 2:12 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Are German rivers relevant to the puzzle? Not at all. The title is not random, though.
Is it based on a true story? Yes. (both the first and second occasion)
Something you experienced? Only the second occasion. I'm too young for having experienced the first one personally.
Are any human beings involved? Sure Many of them? Quite a lot.
David Burn (Woubit)
Posted on Friday, November 26, 2004 - 5:19 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Another tale of seafaring folk?
Jens Weber (Sundowner)
Posted on Friday, November 26, 2004 - 5:28 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Another tale of seafaring folk? No. Seafaring is one of the professions not at all involved in this puzzle.
David Burn (Woubit)
Posted on Friday, November 26, 2004 - 5:31 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Well, the only other profession I can think of related to the title is folk singing. Is this relevant?
Jens Weber (Sundowner)
Posted on Friday, November 26, 2004 - 5:48 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Well, the only other profession I can think of related to the title is folk singing. Is this relevant? Neither this one, unfortunately. None of the relevant professions is related to the title. The title is a clue in some other way.
Jason Borsom (Serges)
Posted on Saturday, November 27, 2004 - 2:11 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Does this puzzle have anything relevant to do with Germany? German? Germans?

Was there quite a large dfference in time between the first and second occurrences of the relevant event? Years? Decades? Centuries? Millenia? Eons? (Whichever is closest)

Was it "working" viewed as a positive thing? Negative? Ambiguous depending on viewpoint?
Jens Weber (Sundowner)
Posted on Sunday, November 28, 2004 - 10:54 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Does this puzzle have anything relevant to do with Germany? German? Germans? Only insofar as both events, happened in Germany and involved a lot of Germans. But this is just a matter of fact, it's not necessary for the puzzle to work.

Was there quite a large difference in time between the first and second occurrences of the relevant event? Years? Decades? Centuries? 250 years. Millenia? Eons? (Whichever is closest)

Was it "working" viewed as a positive thing? Negative? Ambiguous depending on viewpoint? For most of the involved people it was positive, one group of the people involved in event 2 might have seen it as neutral or slightly negative.
Jason Borsom (Serges)
Posted on Tuesday, November 30, 2004 - 8:24 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did the second instance of the event occur in the last year? 5 years? 10 years? 20 years? 50 years? 100 years? 200 years? 500 years?

When you say a lot of Germans were involved, is it restricted to certain demographic/s? More than half the population? More than a million? More than a thousand? More than a hundred?

Did it take longer to work the second time around? More effort? More planning? More assistance? Improved technology or scientific knowledge?

Was it a political event? Scientific? Artistic? Social? Religious?

The subgroup that may have seen it as slightly negative... were they of a different opinion as a group than the population as a whole? For a specific reason unique to some shared commonality among the group? Would a rational person today see this event as primarily positive?

Could this event occur in the present day?

Did this event affect only Germans? Forgiving temporal constraints, were the same people affected by the event each time (or was the first event in a different "place" as the second one)?

Was this an obvious event, or more subtle?
Jens Weber (Sundowner)
Posted on Tuesday, November 30, 2004 - 12:31 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did the second instance of the event occur in the last year? 5 years? 10 years? 20 years? 50 years? 100 years? 200 years? 500 years? This year.

When you say a lot of Germans were involved, is it restricted to certain demographic/s? Not really.
More than half the population? More than a million? More than a thousand? More than a hundred? In event 1: maybe 1000, maybe less. In event 2: 500-2000.

Did it take longer to work the second time around? No.
More effort? Even less effort.
More planning? Some planning was required, but not much.
More assistance? No.
Improved technology or scientific knowledge? Improved technology was available and reduced the effort considerably. But it would have been possible even without this technology.

Was it a political event? Scientific? Artistic? Social? Religious? Both events (yesishly) artistic and social. But there is still another word that would fit better for both events.

The subgroup that may have seen it as slightly negative... were they of a different opinion as a group than the population as a whole? Noish.
For a specific reason unique to some shared commonality among the group? Yesish.
Would a rational person today see this event as primarily positive? Still depends on the point of view.

Could this event occur in the present day? Event 2 occured recently. Event 1 might have happened in our days as well (in adapted setting), and I believe it happens from time to time.

Did this event affect only Germans? Both events involved also a number of foreigners, but this is not really relevant. In both cases the events involved people of certain circles, which, in our multi-cultural society, always consist of locals (in that case Germans) and foreigners.
Forgiving temporal constraints, were the same people affected by the event each time (or was the first event in a different "place" as the second one)? No. The place is different, and also the involved groups are different.

Was this an obvious event, or more subtle? I'm not sure what you mean. Both events were easy to be noticed by the involved people.
Jason Borsom (Serges)
Posted on Tuesday, November 30, 2004 - 1:16 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

athletic event? competitive event?

anything involving a body of water? water in general?

was this second event a televised or reported-upon event, on any/all of local/national/world stages?

Were the people involved in the event talented or gifted in some fashion?
Jens Weber (Sundowner)
Posted on Tuesday, November 30, 2004 - 2:38 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

athletic event? No. competitive event? No.
anything involving a body of water? No. water in general? No.
was this second event a televised or reported-upon event, on any/all of local/national/world stages? Not at all. I learned about it just because I was, by chance, in that location.
Were the people involved in the event talented or gifted in some fashion? To some extent, yes.
Jason Borsom (Serges)
Posted on Tuesday, November 30, 2004 - 2:47 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Would this event be better described as a gathering for some specific purpose? Perhaps a festival or fair?
Jens Weber (Sundowner)
Posted on Wednesday, December 01, 2004 - 2:24 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Would this event be better described as a gathering for some specific purpose? The second event? Might be described this way, but this could also be misleading.
Perhaps a festival or fair? No, nothing like this.
Jason Borsom (Serges)
Posted on Thursday, December 02, 2004 - 6:49 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Was the second event in any way meant to pay tribute to the first event? Were either or both events intentionally planned?

Art/performing relevant? Intellect/knowledge? Common interest? (As far as the people inherent to the event/s are concerned)

The discerning subset of event 2... was there a similar group of less-than-contents in event 1?
Jens Weber (Sundowner)
Posted on Thursday, December 02, 2004 - 8:53 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Was the second event in any way meant to pay tribute to the first event? No. Both events are completely unrelated except for the fact that some idea is employed in both cases.
Were either or both events intentionally planned? Both were intentional.

Art/performing relevant? Event 1: yes. Event 2: yope.
Intellect/knowledge? Event 1: yes. Event 2: no.
Common interest? Both events: somewhat. (As far as the people inherent to the event/s are concerned)

The discerning subset of event 2... was there a similar group of less-than-contents in event 1? I don't think so.
Jens Weber (Sundowner)
Posted on Wednesday, December 08, 2004 - 11:30 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

REFOCUS - An der Alster, an der Elbe, an der Bill
It worked for the second time.

There is some idea that worked very well in 1735 (event 1). In 2004 essentially the same idea, though in a completely different setting, worked again very well (event 2).

Event 1 involved one famous guy and a larger unspecified group of people. Art/performing and intellect/knowledge is relevant. The famous guy can be described as gifted or talented.

Event 2 involved a smaller group of people which can be refered to by a name, and a larger group. The larger group determined by a common property or interest, and consists of two subgroups (defined by their respective common interests). The smaller one of these subgroups is not satisfied with the event. Art/performing and technology are yopeishly relevant in this event.

Both events were intentional, that is, inititated by someone. They both took place in Germany, but in different cities.

To find out:
Who are the relevant people/groups in both events?
What is the idea?

Hint: see title
Mezzoforte (Mezzoforte)
Posted on Wednesday, December 08, 2004 - 3:13 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Fireworks relevant?
Jens Weber (Sundowner)
Posted on Wednesday, December 08, 2004 - 4:29 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Fireworks relevant? No.