| Author | Message | ||
| Wizardofnz (Wizardofnz)
New member Username: Wizardofnz Post Number: 431 Registered: 10-2003 |
Title is of as much relevance as mine normally are. An old man offers a young man a book for a fraction of its value. Although the offer is genuine and the young man can afford it, he becomes completely humiliated. Explain. | ||
| Martinfg (Martinfg)
New member Username: Martinfg Post Number: 443 Registered: 8-2005 |
Did the old man write the book? Did the young man write the book? | ||
| Goldenspiral (Goldenspiral)
New member Username: Goldenspiral Post Number: 2 Registered: 3-2007 |
Is the book Fiction? Non Fiction? or obscure like a book of stamps matches etc? Did the old man think the book would help or benefit the young man in some way? Is the book a rare? expensive book? Was the old man an expert in the contents of the book? is the old man related to the young man? Were there other people present when the old man offered the young man the book? | ||
| ~damia~ (~damia~)
New member Username: ~damia~ Post Number: 239 Registered: 9-2003 |
is the old man rich? poor? is the young man rich? poor? | ||
| Wizardofnz (Wizardofnz)
New member Username: Wizardofnz Post Number: 432 Registered: 10-2003 |
Martinfg Did the old man write the book? no Did the young man write the book? no Goldenspiral Is the book Fiction? no Non Fiction? yes or obscure like a book of stamps matches etc? no Did the old man think the book would help or benefit the young man in some way? yes Is the book a rare? no expensive yes book? Was the old man an expert in the contents of the book? yes is the old man related to the young man? no Were there other people present when the old man offered the young man the book? yes damia is the old man rich? not astonishingly so poor? no is the young man rich? no poor? yes | ||
| Goldenspiral (Goldenspiral)
New member Username: Goldenspiral Post Number: 7 Registered: 3-2007 |
Was the book based in science? arts? religion? other? Is it an academic book? Is or was the old man's proffesion largely relevent to the content of the book? | ||
| Martinfg (Martinfg)
New member Username: Martinfg Post Number: 445 Registered: 8-2005 |
Is it part of a set? | ||
| ~damia~ (~damia~)
New member Username: ~damia~ Post Number: 245 Registered: 9-2003 |
did the young man ask for the book? did he ask the old man for it? or someone else? did he hint to someone he wanted it? was he embarassed about the content of the book? the act of the man giving it to him? the fact other people were around? would it help to know approx how much the book was worth? | ||
| Wizardofnz (Wizardofnz)
New member Username: Wizardofnz Post Number: 434 Registered: 10-2003 |
Goldenspiral Was the book based in science? no arts? no religion? no other? yes Is it an academic book? yes Is or was the old man's proffesion largely relevent to the content of the book? yes Martinfg Is it part of a set? no Damia did the young man ask for the book? prior to the offer, no did he ask the old man for it? no or someone else? no did he hint to someone he wanted it? no was he embarassed about the content of the book? no the act of the man giving it to him? not per se the fact other people were around? not per se would it help to know approx how much the book was worth? no | ||
| Goldenspiral (Goldenspiral)
New member Username: Goldenspiral Post Number: 16 Registered: 3-2007 |
Wizardofnz, Is the book anything to do with health? history or geography? Is the old man famous? or should i say is the old man a well respected figure in his proffesion? internationally known? Would anyone else by embarres if the book had been offered to them? or if the person was a woman? | ||
| Bentarm (Bentarm)
New member Username: Bentarm Post Number: 977 Registered: 6-2001 |
Was the old man attempting to imply that the young man's knowledge in the area that the book was about was sorely lacking? Was the old man an expert in the contents of the book? Was the young man supposed to be? Are any professions relevant? Old man's? Lecturer? teacher? Young man, student? teacher? lecturer? author? | ||
| Wizardofoz (Wizardofoz)
New member Username: Wizardofoz Post Number: 79 Registered: 8-2001 |
Goldenspiral Wizardofnz, Is the book anything to do with health? no history or geography? neither, primarily Is the old man famous? no or should i say is the old man a well respected figure in his proffesion? he is internationally known? in his field, yes Would anyone else by embarres if the book had been offered to them? no or if the person was a woman? no Mr. Faben Was the old man attempting to imply that the young man's knowledge in the area that the book was about was sorely lacking? no Was the old man an expert in the contents of the book? yes Was the young man supposed to be? an 'expert', no, but... Are any professions relevant? yes Old man's? yes Lecturer? bingo teacher? yes, of sorts  Young man, student? yes teacher? lecturer? author? no to the others | ||
| Goldenspiral (Goldenspiral)
New member Username: Goldenspiral Post Number: 25 Registered: 3-2007 |
Did the professor humiliate the student infront of the class by saying he needed the book after failing miserably in his exams? or not answering a question(s) ? | ||
| Wizardofnz (Wizardofnz)
New member Username: Wizardofnz Post Number: 436 Registered: 10-2003 |
Goldenspiral Did the professor humiliate the student infront of the class by saying he needed the book after failing miserably in his exams? no or not answering a question(s) no? | ||
| Bentarm (Bentarm)
New member Username: Bentarm Post Number: 978 Registered: 6-2001 |
Is the subject relevant? economics? politics? literature? Is the offer genuine? If the young man gives the old man the sum he asks for, will he give him the book? Or is the offer just intended to humiliate the young man? Is the offer made in the course of a lecture? In front of a class? | ||
| Wizardofnz (Wizardofnz)
New member Username: Wizardofnz Post Number: 437 Registered: 10-2003 |
Bentarm Is the subject relevant? yes economics? politics? literature? no to these Is the offer genuine? yes If the young man gives the old man the sum he asks for, will he give him the book? yes Or is the offer just intended to humiliate the young man? no Is the offer made in the course of a lecture? yes In front of a class? yes | ||
| Thestreetdetective (Thestreetdetective)
New member Username: Thestreetdetective Post Number: 20 Registered: 3-2007 |
is it a book the person should already have? | ||
| Wizardofnz (Wizardofnz)
New member Username: Wizardofnz Post Number: 438 Registered: 10-2003 |
is it a book the person should already have? not necessarily | ||
| ~damia~ (~damia~)
New member Username: ~damia~ Post Number: 253 Registered: 9-2003 |
had the young man pretended to have read the book? was he top of his class? a show off? | ||
| Goldenspiral (Goldenspiral)
New member Username: Goldenspiral Post Number: 36 Registered: 3-2007 |
would the other students have the same reaction had the offer been made to them? Was the humiliation justified? was he only humuliated due to some inadequacy he had? | ||
| Woodworm (Woodworm)
New member Username: Woodworm Post Number: 505 Registered: 3-2006 |
Is it a maths book? | ||
| Goldenspiral (Goldenspiral)
New member Username: Goldenspiral Post Number: 62 Registered: 3-2007 |
Is the book to stand on? | ||
| Eli (Eli)
New member Username: Eli Post Number: 18 Registered: 11-2003 |
Is the subject physics? chemistry? arts? music? language? history? archeology? medicine? law? other? | ||
| Wizardofnz (Wizardofnz)
New member Username: Wizardofnz Post Number: 439 Registered: 10-2003 |
Damia had the young man pretended to have read the book? no was he top of his class? NO a show off? no Goldenspiral would the other students have the same reaction had the offer been made to them? yes for some, no for others Was the humiliation justified? it wasn't completely unwarranted, but there is a degree of ill fortune involved. was he only humuliated due to some inadequacy he had? YES Woodworm Is it a maths book? no Goldenspiral Is the book to stand on? no Eli Is the subject law? yes | ||
| ~damia~ (~damia~)
New member Username: ~damia~ Post Number: 273 Registered: 9-2003 |
was he really bad in the class? hadn't done some homework? hadn't bothered to read something he needed to? | ||
| Wizardofnz (Wizardofnz)
New member Username: Wizardofnz Post Number: 441 Registered: 10-2003 |
was he really bad in the class? yes hadn't done some homework? yes hadn't bothered to read something he needed to? yes | ||
| ~damia~ (~damia~)
New member Username: ~damia~ Post Number: 285 Registered: 9-2003 |
ok are we looking for much more then? there a bad law student in a class who hasn't done the work, or bothered to read the material, so the professor gives him the book in front of the other students and offers him it for a small sum to embarass him into reading it? do we need to know what the professor says? | ||
| Strongplacebo (Strongplacebo)
New member Username: Strongplacebo Post Number: 70 Registered: 10-2005 |
Is it the very fact that its offered to him for a fraction of the price, the cause of the student's humiliation? The lecturer is implying something? Intentionally? Perhaps that the student is so dumb as to not know the book's value? Would the student have been equally humiliated if he and the lecturer were alone? | ||
| Wizardofnz (Wizardofnz)
New member Username: Wizardofnz Post Number: 444 Registered: 10-2003 |
Damia ok are we looking for much more then? see below there a bad law student in a class who hasn't done the work, or bothered to read the material, so the professor gives him the book in front of the other students and offers him it for a small sum to embarass him into reading it? Incorrect. Were that the case, how does the professor know the student's habits? Why does he choose to target this one particular student? Why would he be so deliberately cruel? Why would he waste the time of the other students on a selfish and vindictive gag? The true answer involves less suspension of belief, and more lateral thinking. do we need to know what the professor says? yes Strong placebo Is it the very fact that its offered to him for a fraction of the price, the cause of the student's humiliation? no The lecturer is implying something? no Intentionally? n/a Perhaps that the student is so dumb as to not know the book's value? incorrect Would the student have been equally humiliated if he and the lecturer were alone? no | ||
| Bodo (Bodo)
New member Username: Bodo Post Number: 1961 Registered: 2-2001 |
Is the professor's assumption that the student does not know the material because he cannot afford the proper references the embarrasing thing? | ||
| Goldenspiral (Goldenspiral)
New member Username: Goldenspiral Post Number: 77 Registered: 3-2007 |
Is the purchase of the book the old man offered a standard text for the course? or is it a better example of a currently used book? Is the book very specific in one area of law? | ||
| Eli (Eli)
New member Username: Eli Post Number: 73 Registered: 11-2003 |
Is there any other relationship between them than being a student and professor? | ||
| Bentarm (Bentarm)
New member Username: Bentarm Post Number: 982 Registered: 6-2001 |
Does the student in fact own a copy of the book already? Has he read the book? | ||
| Storymoron (Storymoron)
New member Username: Storymoron Post Number: 1 Registered: 4-2007 |
Does the student have some sort of disability? Is he blind? | ||
| Wizardofnz (Wizardofnz)
New member Username: Wizardofnz Post Number: 446 Registered: 10-2003 |
Braaains. Bodo (Bodo) New member Username: Bodo Post Number: 1961 Registered: 2-2001 Posted on Sunday, April 01, 2007 - 4:01 am: -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Is the professor's assumption that the student does not know the material because he cannot afford the proper references the embarrasing thing? no Goldenspiral (Goldenspiral) New member Username: Goldenspiral Post Number: 77 Registered: 3-2007 Posted on Sunday, April 01, 2007 - 4:05 pm: ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Is the purchase of the book the old man offered a standard text for the course? yes or is it a better example of a currently used book? no Is the book very specific in one area of law? yes, but irrelevant Eli (Eli) New member Username: Eli Post Number: 73 Registered: 11-2003 Posted on Sunday, April 01, 2007 - 7:11 pm: -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Is there any other relationship between them than being a student and professor? no Bentarm (Bentarm) New member Username: Bentarm Post Number: 982 Registered: 6-2001 Posted on Tuesday, April 03, 2007 - 12:12 am: -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Does the student in fact own a copy of the book already? no Has he read the book? no Storymoron (Storymoron) New member Username: Storymoron Post Number: 1 Registered: 4-2007 Posted on Monday, April 09, 2007 - 4:21 pm: -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Does the student have some sort of disability? no Is he blind? no | ||
| Bodo (Bodo)
New member Username: Bodo Post Number: 2425 Registered: 2-2001 |
Is the student you? Is that relevant? Are you, in fact, a penguin (they're monstrously sneaky, them penguins, always tryin' to infiltrate the forum, they are)? Are you going to actually stick around until your active puzzles are solved this time (:? Are you, in fact, a zombie? Relevant? Is the embarrassment due to a lack of preparedness? Because the lecturer/prof/teacher assumed that the student didn't have access to the resources vs. not studying? Relevant what the other students knew about the offeree? | ||
| Wizardofnz (Wizardofnz)
New member Username: Wizardofnz Post Number: 449 Registered: 10-2003 |
Is the student you? not this time, mercifully Is that relevant? no Are you, in fact, a penguin One moment, please... *scrutinises* Nope, afraid not (they're monstrously sneaky, them penguins, always tryin' to infiltrate the forum, they are)? Not quite as much as in the days of Enoughwords. Swat my hind with a melon rind, that's my penguin state of mind Are you going to actually stick around until your active puzzles are solved this time (:? I'll try to break the habit of a lifetime, but I can't promise anything Are you, in fact, a zombie? *shines light into each pupil* Nope, it appears not Relevant? no Is the embarrassment due to a lack of preparedness? yes indeedy Because the lecturer/prof/teacher assumed that the student didn't have access to the resources vs. not studying? no Relevant what the other students knew about the offeree? not any specific offeree, but... | ||
| Eli (Eli)
New member Username: Eli Post Number: 826 Registered: 11-2003 |
Did the professor expect the student to not have done the homework? Did he want to humiliate the student? Was it a usual thing for that student to come to lecture unprepared? If the professor had offered him the book at a higher price, would he still be embarrassed? | ||
| Wizardofnz (Wizardofnz)
New member Username: Wizardofnz Post Number: 452 Registered: 10-2003 |
Did the professor expect the student to not have done the homework? no Did he want to humiliate the student? no Was it a usual thing for that student to come to lecture unprepared? yes If the professor had offered him the book at a higher price, would he still be embarrassed? yes - although the situation would be slightly less likely to arise | ||
| Eli (Eli)
New member Username: Eli Post Number: 829 Registered: 11-2003 |
Am a bit confused, so I want to check this. The professor did not intend, or want, to embarrass the student, yet you mention that the student was target. Is that correct? Had the student done anything before the lecture that made the professor come up with the offer? | ||
| Wizardofnz (Wizardofnz)
New member Username: Wizardofnz Post Number: 456 Registered: 10-2003 |
Am a bit confused, so I want to check this. The professor did not intend, or want, to embarrass the student, yet you mention that the student was target. Is that correct? this is all correct Had the student done anything before the lecture that made the professor come up with the offer? no | ||
| Eli (Eli)
New member Username: Eli Post Number: 833 Registered: 11-2003 |
Did he do something during the lecture that caused the professor to target him? Was one of the answers especially stupid? | ||
| Wizardofnz (Wizardofnz)
New member Username: Wizardofnz Post Number: 458 Registered: 10-2003 |
Did he do something during the lecture that caused the professor to target him? yes Was one of the answers especially stupid? no one particular answer was particularly stupid | ||
| Gapcarp (Gapcarp)
New member Username: Gapcarp Post Number: 32 Registered: 11-2007 |
did the student fall asleep during the lecture? | ||
| Wizardofnz (Wizardofnz)
New member Username: Wizardofnz Post Number: 461 Registered: 10-2003 |
did the student fall asleep during the lecture? no | ||
| Eli (Eli)
New member Username: Eli Post Number: 839 Registered: 11-2003 |
Was the student causing disruption during lecture? If so, relevant what he did? | ||
| Crazypalpig (Crazypalpig)
New member Username: Crazypalpig Post Number: 1872 Registered: 8-2006 |
Were almost all of them somewhat stupid? | ||
| Wizardofnz (Wizardofnz)
New member Username: Wizardofnz Post Number: 465 Registered: 10-2003 |
Was the student causing disruption during lecture? no If so, relevant what he did? n/a Crazypalpig Were almost all of them somewhat stupid? In light of your recent puzzle about Shakespeare's alternative to tort reform, I'm sure you would consider them to be so :P Objectively speaking, however, the answer is no. | ||
| Crazypalpig (Crazypalpig)
New member Username: Crazypalpig Post Number: 1873 Registered: 8-2006 |
I asked that because you said no particular was particularly stupid, and the first thought I made was, so were all of them a bit stupid? Did the prof say one sentence? 2 sentences? Is the specific sum relevant? | ||
| Lporter229 (Lporter229)
New member Username: Lporter229 Post Number: 203 Registered: 11-2007 |
Was the offer genuine? Did the prof expect the student to accept the offer? Was the offer part of the lecture, as in the prof came to class intending to make the offer? Was he trying to teach the student something? teach the class something? | ||
| Gapcarp (Gapcarp)
New member Username: Gapcarp Post Number: 34 Registered: 11-2007 |
was the offer to prove a point on a specific point of law?was it an offer for money? or was it an offer of exchange for something the student had in his possession?was the student eating or drinking in class? | ||
| Wizardofnz (Wizardofnz)
New member Username: Wizardofnz Post Number: 468 Registered: 10-2003 |
Crazypalpig Did the prof say one sentence? 2 sentences? he said many sentences, and not all at once Is the specific sum relevant? no Lporter Was the offer genuine? yes Did the prof expect the student to accept the offer? yes Was the offer part of the lecture, as in the prof came to class intending to make the offer? yes indeed Was he trying to teach the student something? no teach the class something? yes-ish | ||
| Wizardofnz (Wizardofnz)
New member Username: Wizardofnz Post Number: 469 Registered: 10-2003 |
Gapcarp was the offer to prove a point on a specific point of law? not to prove a point, but you're on the right track was it an offer for money? yes or was it an offer of exchange for something the student had in his possession? yes, money :P was the student eating or drinking in class? no | ||
| Gapcarp (Gapcarp)
New member Username: Gapcarp Post Number: 37 Registered: 11-2007 |
is this offer the first encounter between the two?were there any other stipulations with the offer?is the fraction of value amount relevant?was he making some sort of example out of the student? | ||
| Wizardofnz (Wizardofnz)
New member Username: Wizardofnz Post Number: 473 Registered: 10-2003 |
is this offer the first encounter between the two? irrelevant were there any other stipulations with the offer? no is the fraction of value amount relevant? no was he making some sort of example out of the student? no | ||
| Alex319 (Alex319)
New member Username: Alex319 Post Number: 598 Registered: 5-2007 |
Was a specific area of law relevant? If so, is the area... ...copyright law? ...contract law? ...property law? ...criminal law? ...something else? Was the point to illustrate a specific type of offer or transaction? If they had made the transaction, would it have been illegal? Was the professor the author of the textbook he was offering? Is that relevant? | ||
| Gapcarp (Gapcarp)
New member Username: Gapcarp Post Number: 39 Registered: 11-2007 |
was the lecturer explaining bankruptcy to the lad? | ||
| Wizardofnz (Wizardofnz)
New member Username: Wizardofnz Post Number: 475 Registered: 10-2003 |
Alex Was a specific area of law relevant? very If so, is the area... ...copyright law? ...contract law? This ...property law? ...criminal law? ...something else? Was the point to illustrate a specific type of offer or transaction? YES If they had made the transaction, would it have been illegal? no Was the professor the author of the textbook he was offering? no Is that relevant? no Gapcarp was the lecturer explaining bankruptcy to the lad? no | ||
| Gapcarp (Gapcarp)
New member Username: Gapcarp Post Number: 42 Registered: 11-2007 |
was the offer intended to be part of a negotiation? | ||
| Alex319 (Alex319)
New member Username: Alex319 Post Number: 600 Registered: 5-2007 |
Would he have made the same point (with regards to law) if he offered a different item, instead of the textbook? Did he make the offer verbally, or was there a written contract involved? Was he illustrating the concept of an oral agreement? Did the rest of the class know about the student's poor study habits? Did the professor tell them? Was the implication that the student wouldn't read the textbook once he bought it, and so would gain little or no benefit from the deal? Was the point he was trying to illustrate about contract law related to... (list copied from Wikipedia): ...contract formation? ...defenses against formation? ...contract interpretation? ...excuses for non-performance? ...rights of third parties? ...breach of contract? ...remedies for breach of contract? | ||
| Wizardofnz (Wizardofnz)
New member Username: Wizardofnz Post Number: 478 Registered: 10-2003 |
Would he have made the same point (with regards to law) if he offered a different item, instead of the textbook? yes, but it wouldn't have been as enticing Did he make the offer verbally yes, or was there a written contract involved? no Was he illustrating the concept of an oral agreement? yes Did the rest of the class know about the student's poor study habits? not before the offer was made Did the professor tell them? no Was the implication that the student wouldn't read the textbook once he bought it, and so would gain little or no benefit from the deal? no Was the point he was trying to illustrate about contract law related to... (list copied from Wikipedia): ...contract formation? yes ...defenses against formation? ...contract interpretation? ...excuses for non-performance? ...rights of third parties? ...breach of contract? ...remedies for breach of contract? no to others | ||
| Alex319 (Alex319)
New member Username: Alex319 Post Number: 610 Registered: 5-2007 |
Was the main point of law being illustrated the difference between an oral and a written contract? About how oral contracts have less legal standing than written ones? Do we have to find out the relevant point of law in order to solve the puzzle? Would the student still have been embarrassed if a professor in a class unrelated to law offered him a textbook for his class in the same way, and did not say anything about law? Did the preofessor just say something along the lines of "Do you want to buy this textbook for $X", or did he say something else? Is the specific way he worded his statement relevant? | ||
| Wizardofnz (Wizardofnz)
New member Username: Wizardofnz Post Number: 481 Registered: 10-2003 |
Was the main point of law being illustrated the difference between an oral and a written contract? no About how oral contracts have less legal standing than written ones? noDo we have to find out the relevant point of law in order to solve the puzzle? no Would the student still have been embarrassed if a professor in a class unrelated to law offered him a textbook for his class in the same way, and did not say anything about law? possibly Did the preofessor just say something along the lines of "Do you want to buy this textbook for $X", initially, yes or did he say something else?yes Is the specific way he worded his statement relevant? no | ||
| Wizardofnz (Wizardofnz)
New member Username: Wizardofnz Post Number: 482 Registered: 10-2003 |
* RECAP * A law lecturer offers a student a book for a fraction of its value to illustrate a point about contract formation. The specific point is irrelevant. The student becomes humiliated because he had not done his law readings. The professor did not intend to humiliate the student, nor did he know at the start of the lecture which student would find himself in this position. Still to go: How was the student chosen? Why was his ignorance especially humiliating? | ||
| Alex319 (Alex319)
New member Username: Alex319 Post Number: 626 Registered: 5-2007 |
Did he only make the offer to one student? Did he choose the student by... ...random/arbitrary selection among all students in the class? ...random/arbitrary selection among students who volunteered? ...looking at a record of students who already purchased the textbook, and who hadn't? Did the student already purchase the textbook before being offered one? Did he lose it? Have it stolen? ...looking at the students' grades? Did he choose the particular student because of particularly high grades? low ones? Did the professor ask the student a question (aside from "Do you want to buy this textbook")? Was the question related to the law readings? Was the student unable to answer the question due to his lack of reading? Or did he answer it incorrectly? Did the student end up accepting the offer of the book? Is this relevant? Did he initially refuse and then accept? Or vice versa? | ||
| Suzycute (Suzycute)
New member Username: Suzycute Post Number: 6 Registered: 1-2008 |
Is plagiarism a feature of this scenario? | ||
| Gapcarp (Gapcarp)
New member Username: Gapcarp Post Number: 44 Registered: 11-2007 |
was the young man a teacher or administator himself? | ||
| Wizardofnz (Wizardofnz)
New member Username: Wizardofnz Post Number: 486 Registered: 10-2003 |
Alex319 Did he only make the offer to one student? no Did the professor ask the student a question (aside from "Do you want to buy this textbook")? yes Was the question related to the law readings? yes Was the student unable to answer the question due to his lack of reading? yes ***** SPOILER ***** The old man (a professor of law) made an offer to the students attending one of his lectures to buy a textbook on contract law for a ridiculously cheap amount. One student was quick to volunteer; however, this offer had the hidden catch of the student being quizzed on the principles of offer and acceptance in contract law as they pertained to that particular offer. He would have known the answers had he read the case from the casebook (which was available seperately, cheaply, and all the students already had) |
