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Vesica (Vesica)
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Username: Vesica

Post Number: 296
Registered: 8-2001
Posted on Tuesday, September 25, 2007 - 8:05 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

This is either going to be very easy or very difficult...

Holden had been waiting for word about 4 new residents all afternoon. When the call finally came he answered on the first ring.

"Yeah?" he barked into the receiver.

"They're here. The oldest is male and…"

Holden grunted his thanks and hung up without another word, satisfied.

Why?
Bentarm (Bentarm)
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Post Number: 1168
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Posted on Tuesday, September 25, 2007 - 8:08 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

how exactly does one pronounce 'and…" '?
Were there four of them? Was the oldest male? were any others female?
relevant how old they were?
Was Holden the owner of the place the people were going to be residents of?
Is it a hotel? hostel? house? apartment? prison?
Obaone (Obaone)
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Post Number: 43
Registered: 9-2007
Posted on Tuesday, September 25, 2007 - 8:14 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Residents = human?
Vesica (Vesica)
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Post Number: 297
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Posted on Tuesday, September 25, 2007 - 8:15 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Bentarm -

how exactly does one pronounce 'and…" '?
Are you making fun of my ellipsis?

Were there four of them? yes
Was the oldest male? yes
were any others female? no
relevant how old they were? Somewhat...
Was Holden the owner of the place the people were going to be residents of? yes
Is it a hotel? hostel? house? apartment? prison? None of these.
Vesica (Vesica)
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Post Number: 298
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Posted on Tuesday, September 25, 2007 - 8:16 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Obaone
Residents = human? No
Obaone (Obaone)
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Post Number: 44
Registered: 9-2007
Posted on Tuesday, September 25, 2007 - 8:17 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Residents =
Animals?
Plants?
Inanimate?
Vesica (Vesica)
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Username: Vesica

Post Number: 299
Registered: 8-2001
Posted on Tuesday, September 25, 2007 - 8:19 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Obaone
Residents =
Animals? This one
Plants?
Inanimate?
Obaone (Obaone)
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Post Number: 46
Registered: 9-2007
Posted on Tuesday, September 25, 2007 - 8:23 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Barnyard animals?
Horses?
Pigs?
Chickens?
Ducks?
Cows?
Mini-cows (they make those now I hear)?
Alpaca?

Other domestic animal?
Dogs?
cats?
Rodents?

Wild animal?
Reptile?
Amphibian?
Mammmal?
Bird?
Fish?
Vesica (Vesica)
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Username: Vesica

Post Number: 300
Registered: 8-2001
Posted on Tuesday, September 25, 2007 - 8:42 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Obaone
Barnyard animals?
Horses?
Pigs?
Chickens?
Ducks?
Cows?
Mini-cows (they make those now I hear)?
Alpaca?

Other domestic animal?
Dogs?
cats?
Rodents?

Wild animal? YES
Reptile?
Amphibian?
Mammmal? YES (to mammal ;) Me thinks your m's got away from you there...)
Bird?
Fish?
Bodo (Bodo)
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Post Number: 2120
Registered: 2-2001
Posted on Tuesday, September 25, 2007 - 8:55 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Zoo? Shelter? Preserve? Are they alive?
Vesica (Vesica)
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Post Number: 303
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Posted on Tuesday, September 25, 2007 - 8:59 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Bodo
Zoo? yes
Shelter? Preserve? No to both
Are they alive? Yes
Bodo (Bodo)
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Post Number: 2122
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Posted on Tuesday, September 25, 2007 - 9:03 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Uh, they aren't - by any chance - lions, are they? (;
Vesica (Vesica)
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Post Number: 305
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Posted on Tuesday, September 25, 2007 - 9:08 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Bodo
Uh, they aren't - by any chance - lions, are they? (; No...am I missing something?
Bodo (Bodo)
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Post Number: 2123
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Posted on Tuesday, September 25, 2007 - 9:12 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I have a vague recollection of teasing you about lions in your puzzles at some point, but my memory is either not what it used-to-was or it wasn't what it used-to-was to begin with.

So, native to: Africa? North America? South America? Asia? Europe? Australia? Antarctica?
Obaone (Obaone)
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Post Number: 51
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Posted on Tuesday, September 25, 2007 - 9:14 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

The man was mightily mollified because he had a male mammal for mating?
ahem...sorry
Vesica (Vesica)
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Post Number: 306
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Posted on Tuesday, September 25, 2007 - 9:16 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Bodo
I have a vague recollection of teasing you about lions in your puzzles at some point, but my memory is either not what it used-to-was or it wasn't what it used-to-was to begin with.
Heh. Neither is mine so...


So, native to: Africa? North America? South America? Asia? Europe? Australia? Antarctica?
North, South and Central America

Yes, I do belatedly realize this puts you friends across the pond at a bit of a disadvantage. Oops?
Bodo (Bodo)
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Post Number: 2124
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Posted on Tuesday, September 25, 2007 - 9:19 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Eh, the fiends across the pond can figger it out wit' da rest of us...and yes, I left the "r" out on dolphin, so there. Oh, I also think (hope) Obaone means to other critters of the same species (yikes).

So, canine? Ursine? Rodent? Feline? Size of a domestic feline? Bigger?
Obaone (Obaone)
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Post Number: 52
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Posted on Tuesday, September 25, 2007 - 9:25 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Well... I guess I mean it in whatever sense will help us solve the puzzle!
Vesica (Vesica)
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Post Number: 307
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Posted on Tuesday, September 25, 2007 - 9:32 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Obaone
The man was mightily mollified because he had a male mammal for mating?Not so much. Though he did now have a male that could be used for mating...

ahem...sorry Alliteration means never having to say you're sorry...

Bodo
So, canine? Ursine? Rodent? Feline? Ursine is bears, right? So no to all
Size of a domestic feline? Yes,approx.
Bigger?....and therefore, No.
Bodo (Bodo)
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Post Number: 2126
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Posted on Tuesday, September 25, 2007 - 9:38 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Skunk? Armadillo? Prarie dog/groundhog? Beaver? That-quilled-thing-I-can't-think-of-the-name-of-to-save-my-life? Got it! Porcupine? Ringtail? Raccoon? Pig?

I don't think there are any ruminants native to the Americas that are that small, but I could be mistaken.
Obaone (Obaone)
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Post Number: 56
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Posted on Tuesday, September 25, 2007 - 9:45 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Suirrel?
(I don't know why you would want to put one in a zoo but..even so...)
Do the males of the species have some kind of defining feature Holden desires that the females do not?
Is it a physical feature?
Vesica (Vesica)
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Post Number: 310
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Posted on Tuesday, September 25, 2007 - 9:54 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Bodo
Skunk?
Armadillo? YES
Prarie dog/groundhog? Beaver? That-quilled-thing-I-can't-think-of-the-name-of-to-save-my-life? Got it! Porcupine? Good for you and No
Ringtail? Raccoon? Pig?

Obaone
SQuirrel?no

Do the males of the species have some kind of defining feature Holden desires that the females do not?
Is it a physical feature? No to both and perhaps a bit of a False assumption going on here...
Bodo (Bodo)
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Post Number: 2131
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Posted on Tuesday, September 25, 2007 - 10:01 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Uh, he was satisfied because they weren't run over on the way to the zoo (I hear that's a habit of theirs)? Hanson's disease relevant? Is there some characteristic of male armadillos that we need to know?
Bentarm (Bentarm)
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Post Number: 1170
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Posted on Tuesday, September 25, 2007 - 11:35 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

If the statement had started "the youngest is male" would he have been equally satisfied?
Is it that he concludes from the wording that at least one of them must be female, otherwise the person speaking would have just said "they're all male"?
And is that supposed to be an ellipsis? as in "..."? To me it looks like an a with a circumflex accent followed by a euro symbol followed by an exclamation mark!
Vesica (Vesica)
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Post Number: 312
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Posted on Wednesday, September 26, 2007 - 12:12 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Bodo
Uh, he was satisfied because they weren't run over on the way to the zoo (I hear that's a habit of theirs)? *snerk* No
Hanson's disease relevant?Nope
Is there some characteristic of male armadillos that we need to know? NO

Bentarm
If the statement had started "the youngest is male" would he have been equally satisfied? YES

Is it that he concludes from the wording that at least one of them must be female, otherwise the person speaking would have just said "they're all male"? No

And is that supposed to be an ellipsis? as in "..."? To me it looks like an a with a circumflex accent followed by a euro symbol followed by an exclamation mark!
What the - What browser are you using? I'm on Firefox and it appears just as I typed it - three dots in row. A perfect ellipsis. What on earth is going on?
Bodo (Bodo)
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Post Number: 2141
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Posted on Wednesday, September 26, 2007 - 12:20 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I'm on Firefox as well - 2.0.0.7 - and it looks as John described (ending in a vertical bar rather than an exclamation mark). Looks the same on IE.
Vesica (Vesica)
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Post Number: 316
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Posted on Wednesday, September 26, 2007 - 12:22 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Then why do I see it as I typed it?

Hello? Anyone more tech-brilliant than I - help?
Bentarm (Bentarm)
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Post Number: 1174
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Posted on Wednesday, September 26, 2007 - 12:33 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

If the statement had started "one of them is male", would that have worked? If it had started "the prettiest is male"? If it had started "the oldest is female"?
Is the only relevant thing he got from the statement that at least one of the armadillos is male?
Is at least one of them female? relevant?
Bentarm (Bentarm)
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Post Number: 1175
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Posted on Wednesday, September 26, 2007 - 12:33 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

and yes, it is a vertical bar rather than an exclamation mark - I just wasn't looking closely enough. Still, definitely not an ellipsis
Vesica (Vesica)
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Posted on Wednesday, September 26, 2007 - 12:36 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

If the statement had started "one of them is male", would that have worked? Yes

If it had started "the prettiest is male"? Yes as well

If it had started "the oldest is female"? Yes-ish, but certainly not for the setup provided. Put another way, if the person had said "The oldest is female" Holden's reaction would have been the same.

Is the only relevant thing he got from the statement that at least one of the armadillos is male? Yes...

Is at least one of them female? relevant? No (not of the four) and YES
Bentarm (Bentarm)
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Post Number: 1176
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Posted on Wednesday, September 26, 2007 - 12:40 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

were they all brothers?
Are armadillos born in sets of identical siblings?
did he know from the statement that they were all male?
Did he know beforehand that at least one of them was male?
Bentarm (Bentarm)
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Post Number: 1177
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Posted on Wednesday, September 26, 2007 - 12:41 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

have they just been born?
Are they being delivered from somewhere? Or born inside the zoo?
Vesica (Vesica)
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Posted on Wednesday, September 26, 2007 - 12:50 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Nicely done, Bentarm!

******* SPOILER *******

Holden was a head zookeep at the local zoo and had been waiting for news about a female armadillo who was expecting. When one of his keepers called at reported "They're here. The oldest is male - " Holden hung up because that one statement told him the gender of all four babies.

Nine-banded Armadillos (the specific armadillos in question here) have four identical pups, stemming from a single fertilized egg, every birth. They are very popular in medical research because they are susceptible to some of the same diseases as humans and come with their own ready-made control group.

Other random armadillo fact: Female armadillos can delay implantation of a fertilized egg for up to two YEARS if conditions aren't favorable for having young. Human females are terribly jealous.


That didn't go too bad for my first time back in ages!
Bodo (Bodo)
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Posted on Wednesday, September 26, 2007 - 1:24 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Nice puzzle, Andrea. Aren't they the only other animal suscept...suspecti...susepct...what can done get Hanson's?
Vesica (Vesica)
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Posted on Wednesday, September 26, 2007 - 1:36 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Hanson's being the PC name for leprosy?
Bodo (Bodo)
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Posted on Wednesday, September 26, 2007 - 1:46 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Well, I thought it were the proper-like name, but anyhow Wiki says that chimpanzees, sooty mangabeys, and cynomolgus macaques can also get it. So I guess I answered my own question.
Suido (Suido)
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Posted on Wednesday, September 26, 2007 - 2:26 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Interesting puzzle, but i found my version of that confusing "...and???" somewhat more curious. Using a Thai computer, I saw "...and(thai letter = long o sound)(Euro dollar symbol)(another thai letter = m sound)"

the pronunciation of which is further complicated by the fact that the long o sound is said AFTER the consonant it precedes. So it appeared to say:
"...and-euro-ohm" cept the euro and ohm sounds should run together in a nice long ohhh. Tricky.
Vesica (Vesica)
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Post Number: 324
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Posted on Wednesday, September 26, 2007 - 2:16 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Suido - Very complicated!! Thai is a beautiful language and I've always meant to pick up some basic words/phrases but wow the written language looks daunting!
Suido (Suido)
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Post Number: 260
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Posted on Thursday, September 27, 2007 - 3:14 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

There're 44 consonants, 32 vowels, plus variant vowel forms, tone marks and a few other symbols. Add to this the fact that a lot of basic words don't bother with vowels, you're just expected to know the word... Heaps of fun :-P
I've only just begun learning it, my favourite so far is 555, which is Thai netspeak for LOL. When you know that 5 is pronounced 'Ha', it all makes sense.

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