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Nimue (Nimue)
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Post Number: 4130
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Posted on Tuesday, February 17, 2009 - 10:57 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Many Americans have a scrund about the point of a popular American legend (or maybe it should be called a popular American superstition). What is it?
Doctapeppa (Doctapeppa)
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Posted on Tuesday, February 17, 2009 - 11:35 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Pecos Bill.
Nimue (Nimue)
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Posted on Wednesday, February 18, 2009 - 12:02 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Doctapeppa (Doctapeppa)
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Posted on Tuesday, February 17, 2009 - 11:35 pm: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)
Pecos Bill. Not to my knowledge, because I don't even know who Pecos Bill is
Doctapeppa (Doctapeppa)
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Posted on Wednesday, February 18, 2009 - 12:09 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)


quote:

Pecos Bill is a legendary American Cowboy, apocryphally immortalized in numerous tall tales of the Old West during American westward expansion into the Southwest of Texas, New Mexico and Arizona. Their stories were probably invented by Edward O'Reilly in 1923 and are considered to be an example of fakelore. Pecos Bill was a late addition to the "big man" idea of characters like Paul Bunyan or John Henry.


Howardwoman (Howardwoman)
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Posted on Wednesday, February 18, 2009 - 1:06 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is it about one of the presidents? A folk hero?
Nimue (Nimue)
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Posted on Wednesday, February 18, 2009 - 1:40 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Howardwoman (Howardwoman)
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Posted on Wednesday, February 18, 2009 - 1:06 am: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)
Is it about one of the presidents? no A folk hero? noish
Bentarm (Bentarm)
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Posted on Wednesday, February 18, 2009 - 3:00 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is it about a real-life person?
Is it likely that non-Americans have the same scrund?
Is this legend/superstition a supposedly factual story about something that happened at some time in the past? Many times? Does it claim that if you do X, Y will happen?
Nimue (Nimue)
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Posted on Wednesday, February 18, 2009 - 8:49 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Bentarm (Bentarm)
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Is it about a real-life person? no
Is it likely that non-Americans have the same scrund?I think noish
Is this legend/superstition a supposedly factual story about something that happened at some time in the past? yesish Many times? yesishDoes it claim that if you do X, Y will happen? yesish
Doctapeppa (Doctapeppa)
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Posted on Wednesday, February 18, 2009 - 10:49 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is this "legend" in the style of urban legends?

quote:

An urban legend, urban myth, or urban tale is a form of modern folklore consisting of stories thought to be factual by those circulating them. The term is often used to mean something akin to an "apocryphal story." Like all folklore, urban legends are not necessarily false, but they are often distorted, exaggerated, or sensationalized over time.


Nimue (Nimue)
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Posted on Wednesday, February 18, 2009 - 11:42 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Doctapeppa (Doctapeppa)
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Posted on Wednesday, February 18, 2009 - 10:49 pm: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)
Is this "legend" in the style of urban legends? no

quote:

An urban legend, urban myth, or urban tale is a form of modern folklore consisting of stories thought to be factual by those circulating them. The term is often used to mean something akin to an "apocryphal story." Like all folklore, urban legends are not necessarily false, but they are often distorted, exaggerated, or sensationalized over time.
Doctapeppa (Doctapeppa)
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Posted on Thursday, February 19, 2009 - 1:25 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is this a "legend" in the style of a traditional story?


quote:

Traditional stories, expressed as myth, legend, folklore, fairy tale, and fable, are used interchangeably in common speech as a synonym for popular fiction. Similar terms include anecdote, parable, and fairy stories. In the academic circles of literature, religion, history, and anthropology, these terms are important jargon to identify and interpret stories more precisely. Not every story will fall into exactly one category. Some stories belong in multiple categories and some stories do not fit into any category.


Nimue (Nimue)
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Posted on Thursday, February 19, 2009 - 1:56 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Doctapeppa (Doctapeppa)
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Posted on Thursday, February 19, 2009 - 1:25 am: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)
Is this a "legend" in the style of a traditional story?

quote:

Traditional stories, expressed as myth, legend, folklore, fairy tale, and fable, are used interchangeably in common speech as a synonym for popular fiction. Similar terms include anecdote, parable, and fairy stories. In the academic circles of literature, religion, history, and anthropology, these terms are important jargon to identify and interpret stories more precisely. Not every story will fall into exactly one category. Some stories belong in multiple categories and some stories do not fit into any category.yesish, but it's very short for a legend
Doctapeppa (Doctapeppa)
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Posted on Thursday, February 19, 2009 - 2:28 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Hmmm... Is it like a parable or something?
Bolapara (Bolapara)
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Posted on Friday, February 20, 2009 - 3:54 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Would it be about someone like Johnny AppleSeed - who was a real person but most of what we are taught about him is folklore?

Or is it not about any particular person?

Are ghosts relevant? headless horseman? bloody mary?

Religion relevant?

Is this a figure that would be mentioned in a history book?

Would this folkish type person be more likely to be talked about at certain times of the year? certain times of the day or night?
Bentarm (Bentarm)
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Posted on Friday, February 20, 2009 - 3:59 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

'the point of' a popular american legend - the point as in the intended moral?
Or is there some particular part of the story that you think many people do not know?
Nimue (Nimue)
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Posted on Friday, February 20, 2009 - 10:44 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Doctapeppa (Doctapeppa)
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Posted on Thursday, February 19, 2009 - 2:28 am: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)
Hmmm... Is it like a parable or something? not a parable
Bolapara (Bolapara)
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Posted on Friday, February 20, 2009 - 3:54 am: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)
Would it be about someone like Johnny AppleSeed - who was a real person but most of what we are taught about him is folklore? no. P.S. Did any of you ever go to a summer camp where you were expected to sign the "Johnny Appleseed prayer" before meals? I did (even though the camp was sopposed to be non-religious)

Or is it not about any particular person? correct

Are ghosts relevant? no headless horseman? no bloody mary? no

Religion relevant?no

Is this a figure that would be mentioned in a history book? no

Would this folkish type person be more likely to be talked about at certain times of the year? yes, but it's not a person certain times of the day or night? ditto
Bentarm (Bentarm)
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'the point of' a popular american legend - the point as in the intended moral? no
Or is there some particular part of the story that you think many people do not know?yope or noish
Bodo (Bodo)
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Posted on Saturday, February 21, 2009 - 9:36 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Not something historical like the "Boston Massacre" then? Is it about an event vs. a person? Any propaganda involved?
Doctapeppa (Doctapeppa)
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Posted on Sunday, February 22, 2009 - 1:33 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Point =

1. A location or place.

We should meet at a pre-arranged point.

2. (geometry) A zero-dimensional mathematical object representing a location in one or more dimensions.
3. A particular moment in an event or occurrence.

There comes a point in a marathon when some people give up.
At this point in the meeting, I'd like to propose a new item for the agenda.

4. The sharp tip of an object.

Cut the skin with the point of the knife.

5. A peninsula.
6. (backgammon) One of the twelve triangular positions in either table of a backgammon board, on which the stones are played.
7. (arithmetic) A decimal point (used when reading decimal fractions aloud).

10.5 ("ten point five"; = ten and a half)

8. An opinion which adds (or supposedly adds) to the discussion.

David made a valuable point about the strengths of our competitors.

9. (gaming) A unit of measure of success or failure in a game or competition; the unit of scoring.

The one with the most points will win the game
Germany awarded Greece the maximum 12 points in the Eurovision Song Contest.

10. An extremity of an animal.

The point color of that cat was a deep, rich sable.

11. (rail transport, Commonwealth) a device by which trains change tracks; switch
12. (cricket) a fielding position square of the wicket on the off side, between gully and cover.
13. The position at the front or vanguard of an advancing force.
* 2005: Willie Jones decided to become Kimani Jones, Black Panther, on the day his best friend, Otis Nicholson, stepped on a mine while walking point during a sweep in the central highlands. Martin Torgoff, Can't Find My Way Home (Simon & Schuster 2005, p. 189)
14. (nautical) An angle equivalent to eleven and a quarter degrees, that is 1/32 of a circle. Most commonly used to indicate a relative bearing to an object or vessel, but can be used to describe a compass bearing.
15. A compass point.
16. (typography) a unit of measure equal to 1/12 of a pica, or approximately 1/72 of an inch (exactly 1/72 of an inch in the digital era).
Nimue (Nimue)
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Posted on Sunday, February 22, 2009 - 6:47 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Bodo (Bodo)
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Not something historical like the "Boston Massacre" then? no Is it about an event vs. a person? Well, it's an event but it doesn't really involve a personAny propaganda involved? no
Doctapeppa (Doctapeppa)
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Posted on Sunday, February 22, 2009 - 1:33 am: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)
Point =

1. A location or place.

We should meet at a pre-arranged point.

2. (geometry) A zero-dimensional mathematical object representing a location in one or more dimensions.
3. A particular moment in an event or occurrence.

There comes a point in a marathon when some people give up.
At this point in the meeting, I'd like to propose a new item for the agenda.

4. The sharp tip of an object.

Cut the skin with the point of the knife.

5. A peninsula.
6. (backgammon) One of the twelve triangular positions in either table of a backgammon board, on which the stones are played.
7. (arithmetic) A decimal point (used when reading decimal fractions aloud).

10.5 ("ten point five"; = ten and a half)

8. An opinion which adds (or supposedly adds) to the discussion.

David made a valuable point about the strengths of our competitors.

9. (gaming) A unit of measure of success or failure in a game or competition; the unit of scoring.

The one with the most points will win the game
Germany awarded Greece the maximum 12 points in the Eurovision Song Contest.

10. An extremity of an animal.

The point color of that cat was a deep, rich sable.

11. (rail transport, Commonwealth) a device by which trains change tracks; switch
12. (cricket) a fielding position square of the wicket on the off side, between gully and cover.
13. The position at the front or vanguard of an advancing force.
* 2005: Willie Jones decided to become Kimani Jones, Black Panther, on the day his best friend, Otis Nicholson, stepped on a mine while walking point during a sweep in the central highlands. Martin Torgoff, Can't Find My Way Home (Simon & Schuster 2005, p. 189)
14. (nautical) An angle equivalent to eleven and a quarter degrees, that is 1/32 of a circle. Most commonly used to indicate a relative bearing to an object or vessel, but can be used to describe a compass bearing.
15. A compass point.
16. (typography) a unit of measure equal to 1/12 of a pica, or approximately 1/72 of an inch (exactly 1/72 of an inch in the digital era). Point in the sense of import, as in "What's the point of that?"
Doctapeppa (Doctapeppa)
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Posted on Thursday, February 26, 2009 - 8:47 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

They think that the point of a Native American legend about a tortoise creating the world is that everything should be done slowly when the point is actually that people should worship tortoises?
Nimue (Nimue)
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Posted on Thursday, February 26, 2009 - 8:57 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Doctapeppa (Doctapeppa)
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They think that the point of a Native American legend about a tortoise creating the world is that everything should be done slowly when the point is actually that people should worship tortoises? No, but you're on the right track in a general sense, actually, in 2 senses
Kalira (Kalira)
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Posted on Thursday, February 26, 2009 - 9:13 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Aha... is the story of the tortoise and the hare relevant? And the scrund is about the "moral" of the story?

Do they not have the tortoise and the hare in the UK?

Is the scrund that the moral shouldn't be "Slow and steady wins the race" but rather "Don't take a nap in the middle of a race"? :-)
Nimue (Nimue)
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Posted on Thursday, February 26, 2009 - 9:44 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Kalira (Kalira)
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Aha... is the story of the tortoise and the hare relevant?no And the scrund is about the "moral" of the story? no

Do they not have the tortoise and the hare in the UK? I have no idea

Is the scrund that the moral shouldn't be "Slow and steady wins the race" but rather "Don't take a nap in the middle of a race"? :-) no
Doctapeppa (Doctapeppa)
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Posted on Wednesday, March 04, 2009 - 11:34 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is Guitar Hero III: Legends of Rock extremely relevant to this puzzle?
Nimue (Nimue)
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Posted on Wednesday, March 04, 2009 - 11:45 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Doctapeppa (Doctapeppa)
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Is Guitar Hero III: Legends of Rock extremely relevant to this puzzle? It's not at all relevant. In fact, I never even heard of it before I saw this question.
Doctapeppa (Doctapeppa)
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Posted on Friday, March 06, 2009 - 9:00 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is it a fable?
(For the purposes of this question, a "fable" is a brief, succinct story, in prose or verse, that features animals, plants, inanimate objects, or forces of nature which are anthropomorphized, and that illustrates a moral lesson, which may at the end be expressed explicitly in a pithy maxim.)

Is it a parable?
(For the purposes of this question, a "parable" is a brief, succinct story, in prose or verse, that illustrates a moral or religious lesson.)

Is it an apologue?
(For the purposes of this question, an "apologue" is a brief fable or allegorical story with pointed or exaggerated details, meant to serve as a pleasant vehicle for a moral doctrine or to convey a useful lesson without stating it explicitly.)

Is it an anecdote?
(For the purposes of this question, an "anecdote" is a short tale narrating an interesting or amusing biographical incident.)

Is it folklore?
(For the purposes of this question, "folklore" is the body of expressive culture, including tales, music, dance, legends, oral history, proverbs, jokes, popular beliefs, customs, and so forth within a particular population comprising the traditions of that culture, subculture, or group.)

Is it a fairy tail?
(For the purposes of this question, a "fairy tale" is a fictional story that may feature folkloric characters such as fairies, goblins, elves, trolls, giants, and talking animals, and usually enchantments, often involving a far-fetched sequence of events.)

Is it a ghost story?
(For the purposes of this question, a "ghost story" is a true story of an experience, or any piece of fiction, or drama, that includes a ghost, or simply takes as a premise the possibility of ghosts or the belief of some character(s) in them.)

Is it a joke?
(For the purposes of this question, a "joke" is a short story or ironic depiction of a situation communicated with the intent of being humorous.)

Is it a tall tale?
(For the purposes of this question, a "tall tale" is a story with unbelievable elements, related as if it was true and factual.)
Nimue (Nimue)
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Posted on Friday, March 06, 2009 - 10:45 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Posted on Friday, March 06, 2009 - 9:00 pm: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)
Is it a fable?no
(For the purposes of this question, a "fable" is a brief, succinct story, in prose or verse, that features animals, plants, inanimate objects, or forces of nature which are anthropomorphized yesish, and that illustrates a moral lesson, which may at the end be expressed explicitly in a pithy maxim.) no

Is it a parable? no
(For the purposes of this question, a "parable" is a brief, succinct story, in prose or verse, that illustrates a moral or religious lesson.)

Is it an apologue? no
(For the purposes of this question, an "apologue" is a brief fable or allegorical story with pointed or exaggerated details, meant to serve as a pleasant vehicle for a moral doctrine or to convey a useful lesson without stating it explicitly.)

Is it an anecdote? yope or noish
(For the purposes of this question, an "anecdote" is a short tale narrating an interesting or amusing biographical incident.)

Is it folklore? yesish
(For the purposes of this question, "folklore" is the body of expressive culture, including tales, music, dance, legends, oral history, proverbs, jokes, popular beliefs, customs, and so forth within a particular population comprising the traditions of that culture, subculture, or group.)

Is it a fairy tail? no
(For the purposes of this question, a "fairy tale" is a fictional story that may feature folkloric characters such as fairies, goblins, elves, trolls, giants, and talking animals, and usually enchantments, often involving a far-fetched sequence of events.)

Is it a ghost story? no
(For the purposes of this question, a "ghost story" is a true story of an experience, or any piece of fiction, or drama, that includes a ghost, or simply takes as a premise the possibility of ghosts or the belief of some character(s) in them.)

Is it a joke? no
(For the purposes of this question, a "joke" is a short story or ironic depiction of a situation communicated with the intent of being humorous.)

Is it a tall tale? yesish
(For the purposes of this question, a "tall tale" is a story with unbelievable elements, related as if it was true and factual.)
Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
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Posted on Tuesday, March 10, 2009 - 11:49 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is this an Indian legend? A story from slavery? Some other ethnic group?

Is it about (or restricted to) a particular area (The Southwest, the Mississippi, etc)?

You mentioned superstitions in the puzzle statement. Do some listeners have a superstition after hearing this story (say, after hearing Sleepy Hollow, they refuse to cross a bridge at night)?

Does the legend cause its hearers to believe a scrund about something?

The legend isn't "Step on a crack, break your mother's back," is it? Is it in the form of some other short aphorism, or in the form of a short story told around a campfire or read in a book?
Nimue (Nimue)
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Posted on Wednesday, March 11, 2009 - 7:37 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
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Posted on Tuesday, March 10, 2009 - 11:49 pm: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)
Is this an Indian legend? no A story from slavery? noSome other ethnic group? no particular ethnic identification that I know of

Is it about (or restricted to) a particular area (The Southwest, the Mississippi, etc)?

You mentioned superstitions in the puzzle statement. Do some listeners have a superstition after hearing this story possibly(say, after hearing Sleepy Hollow, they refuse to cross a bridge at night)? that's not it

Does the legend cause its hearers to believe a scrund about something?possibly

The legend isn't "Step on a crack, break your mother's back," is it?no Is it in the form of some other short aphorism, or in the form of a short story told around a campfire or read in a book? It's a superstition, Very unlikely anyone would tell it around a campfire
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Posted on Tuesday, March 17, 2009 - 6:11 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

The toothfairy?

Does the 'superstition' involve saying something? doing something? perhaps a gesture such as "touchwood" or crossing one's fingers?

Is it something a mother would say to her child? as a warning? or is it meant to be cute?

Would you perceive it as generally harmless? unintelligent? redundant? pointless completely?
Nimue (Nimue)
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Posted on Tuesday, March 17, 2009 - 7:28 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Noobdogg (Noobdogg)
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Post Number: 6
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Posted on Tuesday, March 17, 2009 - 6:11 am: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)
The toothfairy? no

Does the 'superstition' involve saying something? no doing something? yesperhaps a gesture such as "touchwood" or crossing one's fingers? no

Is it something a mother would say to her child? possiblyas a warning? noor is it meant to be cute? yes

Would you perceive it as generally harmless? yesunintelligent? yesredundant? nopointless completely?yes
Noobdogg (Noobdogg)
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Post Number: 31
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Posted on Friday, March 20, 2009 - 7:57 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)


quote:

For the purposes of this question, a "fable" is a brief, succinct story, in prose or verse, that features animals, plants, inanimate objects, or forces of nature which are anthropomorphized yesish




Would you be so kind as to specify which of those entities are yesishly anthropomorphized?
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Posted on Friday, March 20, 2009 - 4:31 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Noobdogg (Noobdogg)
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Posted on Friday, March 20, 2009 - 7:57 am: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

quote:

For the purposes of this question, a "fable" is a brief, succinct story, in prose or verse, that features animals, plants, inanimate objects, or forces of nature which are anthropomorphized yesish



Would you be so kind as to specify which of those entities are yesishly anthropomorphized?It's an animal. And I'll be so kind as to add that you should find out what animal
Noobdogg (Noobdogg)
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Post Number: 39
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Posted on Friday, March 20, 2009 - 5:03 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I thought of the Easter bunny before but realised religion was irrelevant.

Smokey the Bear? (or Smacky the frog for Mitch Hedberg fans :-D)

Speaking of frogs, perhaps the whole kiss the frog - get a prince deal?

Is the animal feline? canine? primate?
Nimue (Nimue)
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Noobdogg (Noobdogg)
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I thought of the Easter bunny before but realised religion was irrelevant. That's right--it's not the Easter bunny

Smokey the Bear? (or Smacky the frog for Mitch Hedberg fans :-D) no

Speaking of frogs, perhaps the whole kiss the frog - get a prince deal? no

Is the animal feline? nocanine? no primate? no
Peter365 (Peter365)
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Posted on Tuesday, March 24, 2009 - 1:08 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is it a bird? The Stork?
Nimue (Nimue)
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Peter365 (Peter365)
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Posted on Tuesday, March 24, 2009 - 1:08 pm: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)
Is it a bird?no The Stork? no
Haenlomal (Haenlomal)
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Posted on Wednesday, March 25, 2009 - 12:14 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Insect? If yes, ant? Grasshopper?
Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
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Posted on Wednesday, March 25, 2009 - 4:06 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Anything to do with saying "Bless you!" after sneezing?

A sort of fable... but not Native or African-American, hence not Coyote the trickster or Brer Rabbit... I just finished Watership Down and was thinking about that.

Is this a distinctly American superstition?

If it is in the form of "If you do X, then Y will happen," is Y a negative or a positive result, and is X a negative or positive thing to do?

Oh, and you never answered this one:
Is it about (or restricted to) a particular area (The Southwest, the Mississippi, etc)? Paul Bunyan stories, for example, are not commonly told in, say, Arizona.

Is this scrund/superstition well known, or is it dying out? Is it only well know among folklore experts? Would a child be likely to know it? A college student? A parent? An oldster? Has it been exported to other countries? Are similar superstitions held elsewhere?

Is the supernatural involved? Anything scientifically measurable (for example, you can't tell if salt tossed over your shoulder is really going into the Devil's eyes, but you could tell if "Red sky at morning, sailor's warning" actually meant something.)
Nimue (Nimue)
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Posted on Wednesday, March 25, 2009 - 4:11 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Haenlomal (Haenlomal)
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Insect?no If yes, ant? Grasshopper?
Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
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Anything to do with saying "Bless you!" after sneezing? no

A sort of fable... but not Native or African-American, hence not Coyote the trickster or Brer Rabbit... I just finished Watership Down and was thinking about that.

Is this a distinctly American superstition? yesish

If it is in the form of "If you do X, then Y will happen," yope or noishis Y a negative or a positive resultthat's the scrund!, and is X a negative or positive thing to do? see previous answer

Oh, and you never answered this one: sorry!
Is it about (or restricted to) a particular area (The Southwest, the Mississippi, etc)? yes Paul Bunyan stories, for example, are not commonly told in, say, Arizona.

Is this scrund/superstition well known, or is it dying out? the former Is it only well know among folklore experts? no Would a child be likely to know it? yesA college student? yesA parent? yesOldster? yes ("Oldster"??)Has it been exported to other countries? I don' knows Are similar superstitions held elsewhere?ditto

Is the supernatural involved? no Anything scientifically measurable (for example, you can't tell if salt tossed over your shoulder is really going into the Devil's eyes, but you could tell if "Red sky at morning, sailor's warning" actually meant something? yes or yesish
Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
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Posted on Thursday, March 26, 2009 - 2:37 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Possible areas the scrund is from/about/restricted to:

Southwest? Deep South? Mississippi? Great Plains? Rocky Mountains? Appalachians? Alaska? Hawaii? Pacific coast? Atlantic coast? New England? Tidewater? Old Northwest (Ohio, Michigan, etc)?

I think that covers everywhere.

Oldster? yes ("Oldster"??) Well, the last time I asked, "Senior Citizen?" you were annoyed, and this was the first non-PC term that came to mind. [grin]

You said noish to a folk hero. Several folk heroes? A group? Someone who is not generally considered a "folk hero?" Did he/she/they exist in real life? Or something akin to them? Is a band, crew, tribe, or some other sort of group involved?

Jesse James or the Wild Bunch? Any criminal activities involved?

Does the story/fable/superstition feature animals? Talking ones? Are the hero(es) H/A/M?

Would it help to determine the era in which the story is set -- ie Colonial, pre-Civil War, post-Civil War, Westward Expansion, etc?

Is this a story we would learn in school, from our families, from tv, from friends and neighbors?
Nimue (Nimue)
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Posted on Thursday, March 26, 2009 - 4:38 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
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Posted on Thursday, March 26, 2009 - 2:37 am: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)
Possible areas the scrund is from/about/restricted to:

Southwest?no Deep South? noMississippi? noGreat Plains? possibly could apply there but not the origin|Rocky Mountains? dittoAppalachians? ditto dittoAlaska? no Hawaii? no Pacific coast? no Atlantic coast? yope New England? could apply there but not the originTidewater? Does that mean Maryland & Virginia? If so, no Old Northwest (Ohio, Michigan, etc)?yes

I think that covers everywhere.

Oldster? yes ("Oldster"??) Well, the last time I asked, "Senior Citizen?" you were annoyed, and this was the first non-PC term that came to mind. [grin] Gee, whatever happened to 'old person'??!!

You said noish to a folk hero. Several folk heroes?b{ no} A group? noSomeone who is not generally considered a "folk hero?" yopeDid he/she/they exist in real life?yope Or something akin to them? see previous answerIs a band, crew, tribe, or some other sort of group involved? no

Jesse James or the Wild Bunch no? no Any criminal activities involved?

Does the story/fable/superstition feature animals? yes Talking ones? noAre the hero(es) H no/A no/M yesish?

Would it help to determine the era in which the story is set -- ie Colonial, pre-Civil War, post-Civil War, Westward Expansion, etc? no specific era

Is this a story we would learn in school, from our families, from tv, from friends and neighbors? yes to all
Nimue (Nimue)
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Posted on Friday, March 27, 2009 - 6:13 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

HINT: As soon as you guess the animal, you should be able to identify the superstition in question.
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Posted on Saturday, March 28, 2009 - 6:38 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

blue ox?
black cat?
Nimue (Nimue)
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Bolapara (Bolapara)
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blue ox? no
black cat? no
Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
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Posted on Wednesday, April 01, 2009 - 2:58 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Coyote? Fox? Bre'r Rabbit? Beaver?

Is the animal a carnivore, herbivore, insectivore or omnivore? Is it a chordate? Is it fish or fowl?
Nimue (Nimue)
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Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
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Coyote? Fox? Bre'r Rabbit? Beaver? no to all 4

Is the animalba carnivore, herbivore, insectivore or omnivore? I don't know Is it a chordate? yes Is it fish or fowl? neither
D_gordon (D_gordon)
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Posted on Friday, April 03, 2009 - 12:06 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is the relevant animal a reptile? Amphibian? Mammal?
Nimue (Nimue)
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D_gordon (D_gordon)
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Is the relevant animal a reptile? Amphibian? Mammal? mammal
Kalira (Kalira)
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Posted on Wednesday, April 08, 2009 - 7:06 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is the relevant animal a rodent? canine? feline? ursine? porcine? ovine? bovine? a primate? a monotreme? a lagomorph? batlike? a whale? a dolphin? a marsupial?
Nimue (Nimue)
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Posted on Wednesday, April 08, 2009 - 9:36 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Kalira (Kalira)
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Posted on Wednesday, April 08, 2009 - 7:06 pm: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)
Is the relevant animal a rodent? canine? feline? ursine? porcine? ovine? bovine? a primate? a monotreme? a lagomorph? batlike? a whale? a dolphin? a marsupial? it is a rodent
Kalira (Kalira)
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Posted on Wednesday, April 08, 2009 - 10:35 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Hmm... "If you build a better mousetrap, someone's going to build a better mouse"?

Is it a mouse? rat? hamster? guinea pig? chinchilla? :-D
Nimue (Nimue)
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Kalira (Kalira)
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Posted on Wednesday, April 08, 2009 - 10:35 pm: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)
Hmm... "If you build a better mousetrap, someone's going to build a better mouse"? No, but I like that!

Is it a mouse? rat? hamster? guinea pig? chinchilla? none of those :-D
Kalira (Kalira)
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Posted on Thursday, April 09, 2009 - 2:13 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

How about a groundhog? Prediction of spring relevant?
Nimue (Nimue)
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Posted on Thursday, April 09, 2009 - 7:26 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Kalira (Kalira)
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Posted on Thursday, April 09, 2009 - 2:13 pm: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)
How about a groundhogYes!! The scrund involves Groundhog Day! Now, please finish it off!! Prediction of spring relevant? Yes!!
Kalira (Kalira)
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Posted on Thursday, April 09, 2009 - 8:11 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Okay, so the scrund -- does it have to do with whether or not rodents actually have the ability to predict the weather? the fact that there are always 6 more weeks of winter after Feb. 2? the origins of the holiday? the fact that the term "groundhog day" has come to be associated with going through the same thing over and over again (as in the movie)?
Nimue (Nimue)
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Posted on Thursday, April 09, 2009 - 8:52 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Kalira (Kalira)
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Posted on Thursday, April 09, 2009 - 8:11 pm: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)
Okay, so the scrund -- does it have to do with whether or not rodents no the fact that there are always 6 more weeks of winter after Feb. 2? yes the origins of the holiday? no the fact that the term "groundhog day" has come to be associated with going through the same thing over and over again (as in the movie)? no

This is close enough for me to declare a
************ SPOILER *****************
The Groundhog Day story is that if the groundhog sees his shadow (in Western Pennsylvania), there will be 6 more weeks of winter. Otherwise, spring is right around the corner.The scrund is that the legend assumes that 6 more weeks of winter weather would be a lot for that area. But it's actually less than average, so people who hate winter should hope that the groundhog sees his shadow so they'll have only 6 more weeks of winter instead of the more usual 7 or so.Thanks for solving it, Kalira, & how about directing that clever lateral mind to my ongoing puzzles as well as to the one I'm about to post at the bottom of the page?

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