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Noel (Noel)
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Post Number: 296
Registered: 7-2009
Posted on Friday, August 28, 2009 - 2:31 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Jerry's parents moved to the US from Mexico before he was born. He grew up there and had his own children there, who also grew up there and had their own children there. But when Jerry's granddaughter (Becky) was an adult, she needed something that she couldn't get in the US, so she moved to Mexico. What was it that she needed?

Note: I'm really enjoying gourami's camouflaged rulebreaker concept, so I decided I should do one before they get old and we all get tired of them. =) For those who haven't participated in the previous ones, the important thing to remember is that the scenario above is not what you are trying to solve. However, you should ask questions about it to get you started. Nonsense questions won't help you. I'll answer your questions according to a rule. Figure out what that rule is.
Noel (Noel)
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Post Number: 297
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Posted on Friday, August 28, 2009 - 2:32 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

PS, any questions or statements that you don't want answered according to the rule should be in italics.
Dropofahat (Dropofahat)
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Post Number: 325
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Posted on Friday, August 28, 2009 - 2:51 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

What Becky "needed" in Mexico:
Is weather relevant?
Is it tangible?
Don't I already know what it is?
Didn't I solve this puzzle already?

Oops, you said nonsense questions wouldn't help...

Did Becky need some kind of paperwork?
Did Jerry need the same thing Becky did?
Did Becky have any children?
Did she move to Mexico permanently?
Noel (Noel)
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Post Number: 298
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Posted on Friday, August 28, 2009 - 3:09 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Dropofahat (Dropofahat)
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Post Number: 325
Registered: 8-2009
Posted on Friday, August 28, 2009 - 2:51 pm:

What Becky "needed" in Mexico:
Is weather relevant? no
Is it tangible? yes
Don't I already know what it is? I don't know
Didn't I solve this puzzle already? I don't know

Oops, you said nonsense questions wouldn't help...mainly I meant the questions that aren't really questions that you often see in a regular rulebreaker (like "abcdef?"). But you're right, I'm not sure that those previous couple of questions will help you much, either.

Did Becky need some kind of paperwork? no
Did Jerry need the same thing Becky did? yesish
Did Becky have any children? probably not
Did she move to Mexico permanently? irrel
Ohlala8 (Ohlala8)
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Post Number: 376
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Posted on Friday, August 28, 2009 - 7:40 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Just to check...

Did Becky need some kind of paperwork?
Did Jerry need the same thing Becky did?
Did Becky have any children?
Did she move to Mexico permanently?

Did she not need it until she reached a certain age? Did she not realize she needed it until she reached a certain age? Did she need it all along, but was unable to go to Mexico until a certain age?
Ohlala8 (Ohlala8)
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Post Number: 377
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Posted on Friday, August 28, 2009 - 7:42 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Again, just to check. If the answers are all the same, don't bother.

Did Becky need some kind of paperwork?
Did Jerry need the same thing Becky did?
Did Becky have any children?
Did she move to Mexico permanently?

Did she not need it until she reached a certain age? Did she not realize she needed it until she reached a certain age? Did she need it all along, but was unable to go to Mexico until a certain age?
Noel (Noel)
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Post Number: 305
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Posted on Friday, August 28, 2009 - 9:46 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Ohlala8 (Ohlala8)
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Post Number: 376
Registered: 6-2009
Posted on Friday, August 28, 2009 - 7:40 pm:

Just to check...

Did Becky need some kind of paperwork? no
Did Jerry need the same thing Becky did? no
Did Becky have any children? irrel.
Did she move to Mexico permanently? yope

Did she not need it until she reached a certain age? noish Did she not realize she needed it until she reached a certain age? no (and because negative questions confuse me: "no" means she always realized her need Did she need it all along yes but was unable to go to Mexico until a certain age? no. She was never able to go to Mexico.
Noel (Noel)
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Post Number: 306
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Posted on Friday, August 28, 2009 - 9:47 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Actually, let's make this one more clear:
Did she
move to Mexico no
permanently? yes
Noel (Noel)
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Post Number: 307
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Posted on Friday, August 28, 2009 - 9:48 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Ohlala8 (Ohlala8)
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Post Number: 377
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Posted on Friday, August 28, 2009 - 7:42 pm:

Again, just to check. If the answers are all the same, don't bother. they're all the same
Noel (Noel)
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Post Number: 308
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Posted on Friday, August 28, 2009 - 9:59 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

****ack! BLOOPER.

I answered some of Ohlala8's questions about the wrong character. I'll answer them again for both characters. Sorry for the confusion!


Did Becky need some kind of paperwork? no
Did Jerry need some kind of paperwork? no
Did Jerry need the same thing Becky did? no
Did Becky have any children? irrel.
Did Jerry have any children? irrel.
Did Becky move to Mexico permanently? no
Did Jerry move to Mexico no permanently? yes


Did Becky not need it until she reached a certain age? noish, it could have happened when she was younger than she actually was (but not a small child) Did Becky not realize she needed it until she reached a certain age? if the circumstances had presented themselves when she was somewhat younger, she would have realized the need then Did she need it all along no but was unable to go to Mexico until a certain age? no. She was never able to go to Mexico.

Did Jerry not need it until he reached a certain age? noish Did he not realize he needed it until he reached a certain age? no (and because negative questions confuse me: "no" means he always realized his need) Did he need it all along yes but was unable to go to Mexico until a certain age? no. He was never able to go to Mexico.
Ferrets101 (Ferrets101)
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Post Number: 66
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Posted on Friday, August 28, 2009 - 11:47 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is Jerry H? A? M? is Becky F? A? M? Was Jerry still alive when Becky returned to Mexico?
Ferrets101 (Ferrets101)
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Post Number: 67
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Posted on Friday, August 28, 2009 - 11:47 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Whoops, that should say is Becky H? A? F?
Noel (Noel)
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Posted on Friday, August 28, 2009 - 11:58 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Ferrets101 (Ferrets101)
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Post Number: 66
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Posted on Friday, August 28, 2009 - 11:47 pm:

Is Jerry H? A? M? yes to all is Becky H? A? yes to both F? no - should we call him Beck? Was Jerry still alive yes, but not for long when Becky returned to Mexico? irrelevant what country he is in
Ferrets101 (Ferrets101)
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Posted on Tuesday, September 01, 2009 - 7:07 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is Beck transsexual (ie did he have a sex change operation)? If so, did he go from female to male? Or from male to female? Is he transgender? If so, is his preferred gender male but his genetalia female? Or the other way around? In the puzzle statement, you mentioned Beck is Jerry's granddaughter, but then you said he (Beck) was male. Therefore, does granddaughter = Jerry's child's female child? If so, is Beck's parent that is Jerry's child Jerry's son? Or Jerry's daughter? Any transsexuals not asked about above relevant? What about transgenders?
Noel (Noel)
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Post Number: 340
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Posted on Tuesday, September 01, 2009 - 8:15 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is Beck transsexual (ie did he have a sex change operation)? If so, did he go from female to male? Or from male to female? Is he transgender? If so, is his preferred gender male but his genetalia female? Beck's sexuality and gender identity are irrelevant. He does need to be a male for one reason, but he has always been male and always identified as male.

In the puzzle statement, you mentioned Beck is Jerry's granddaughter, but then you said he (Beck) was male. Therefore, does granddaughter = Jerry's child's female child? Beck is not Jerry's granddaughter. However, they are related. If so, is Beck's parent that is Jerry's child Jerry's son? see previous Or Jerry's daughter? see previous

Any transsexuals not asked about above relevant? What about transgenders? both irrelevant
Ferrets101 (Ferrets101)
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Posted on Wednesday, September 02, 2009 - 12:45 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is Beck Jerry's son? Brother? Grandson? Father? Uncle? Grandfather? Great-grandson?
Noel (Noel)
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Post Number: 343
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Posted on Wednesday, September 02, 2009 - 1:01 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is Beck Jerry's son? Brother? this one Grandson? Father? Uncle? Grandfather? Great-grandson?
Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
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Posted on Wednesday, September 02, 2009 - 4:53 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is Becky H/A/F? Is Jerry H/A/M? Are Becky and Jerry insects?
Noel (Noel)
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Posted on Wednesday, September 02, 2009 - 1:50 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Jenburdoo

Post Number: 1337
Registered: 5-2003

Posted on Wednesday, September 02, 2009 - 4:53 am:

Is Becky H/A/F? Becky? Who's Becky? There is no Becky Is Jerry H/A/M? yes to all, but gender is irrelevant. Are Becky and Jerry insects? no
Ferrets101 (Ferrets101)
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Posted on Thursday, September 03, 2009 - 7:33 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Does Mexico refer to the country Mexico?
To any of the following:

Mexico City?
Mexico, Illinois?
# Mexico, Indiana
# Mexico, Kentucky
# Mexico, Maine
# Mexico, Maryland
* Mexico, Allegany County, Maryland
* Mexico, Carroll County, Maryland
* New Mexico, Maryland
* Oakwood, Maryland, formerly Mexico


# Mexico, Missouri
# Mexico (village), New York
# Mexico (town), New York
# Mexico, Ohio

* Mexico, Crawford County, Ohio
* Mexico, Wyandot County, Ohio


* Mexico, Juniata County, Pennsylvania
* Mexico, Montour County, Pennsylvania


# Mexico, South Carolina
# Mexico, Texas

* "Mexico" (Jefferson Airplane song), a song by Jefferson Airplane
* "Mexico", a song from Gorilla (James Taylor album)
* "Mexico" (Bob Moore song), a song by Bob Moore and his Orchestra from 1961
* "Mexico", a song by Incubus from their album Morning View
* "Mexico", a song by The Refreshments from their 1996 album Fizzy Fuzzy Big & Buzzy
* "Mexico", a song by Cake from their 1998 album Prolonging the Magic
* "Mexico!", a song by the Les Humphries Singers
* "Mexico" (Butthole Surfers song)
* Mexico (EP), an album by Hot Chip
* Mexico, a 2006 album by Jean Leclerc
* "México, México", a song by RBD for the Mexico national football team in the 2006 FIFA World Cup


* Mexico (novel), a novel by James A. Michener
* Mexico (game), a dice game
* Mexico (Epcot), a pavilion within Walt Disney World in Florida
* Mexico (barque), a ship wrecked at Southport on 9 December 1886


Does US refer to:

The United States of America?
# Us", a song by Ice Cube from his 1991 album Death Certificate
# "Us", a song by Céline Dion from her 1997 album Let's Talk About Love
# "US", a song by Stephen Malkmus and the Jicks from the 2003 album Pig Lib
# "Us", a song by Regina Spektor from her 2004 album Soviet Kitsch
# Us (Maceo Parker album), a 1974 album by Maceo Parker
# Us (Peter Gabriel album), a 1992 album by Peter Gabriel
# Us (Mull Historical Society album), a 2003 album by Mull Historical Society

* University of Salford, a university in the UK
* University of Salzburg, a university in Austria
* Université de Sherbrooke, a university in Canada
* University School, a private all-boys day school in Hunting Valley, Ohio, United States


* Us Weekly, an American celebrity magazine
* Us (TV movie)
* us is often used to denote µs (microsecond) when the proper "µ" (micro sign) character or Greek "μ" (Mu) letter are either both missing, or cannot be easily entered
* .us, Internet TLD of the United States of America
* United Services Club or US Club, a golf club in Mumbai
Noel (Noel)
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Posted on Thursday, September 03, 2009 - 8:18 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Ferrets101

Post Number: 95
Registered: 8-2009

Posted on Thursday, September 03, 2009 - 7:33 pm: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)
Does Mexico refer to the country Mexico?
To any of the following:

Mexico City?
Mexico, Illinois?
# Mexico, Indiana
# Mexico, Kentucky
# Mexico, Maine
# Mexico, Maryland
* Mexico, Allegany County, Maryland
* Mexico, Carroll County, Maryland
* New Mexico, Maryland
* Oakwood, Maryland, formerly Mexico


# Mexico, Missouri
# Mexico (village), New York
# Mexico (town), New York
# Mexico, Ohio

* Mexico, Crawford County, Ohio
* Mexico, Wyandot County, Ohio


* Mexico, Juniata County, Pennsylvania
* Mexico, Montour County, Pennsylvania


# Mexico, South Carolina
# Mexico, Texas

* "Mexico" (Jefferson Airplane song), a song by Jefferson Airplane
* "Mexico", a song from Gorilla (James Taylor album)
* "Mexico" (Bob Moore song), a song by Bob Moore and his Orchestra from 1961
* "Mexico", a song by Incubus from their album Morning View
* "Mexico", a song by The Refreshments from their 1996 album Fizzy Fuzzy Big & Buzzy
* "Mexico", a song by Cake from their 1998 album Prolonging the Magic
* "Mexico!", a song by the Les Humphries Singers
* "Mexico" (Butthole Surfers song)
* Mexico (EP), an album by Hot Chip
* Mexico, a 2006 album by Jean Leclerc
* "México, México", a song by RBD for the Mexico national football team in the 2006 FIFA World Cup


* Mexico (novel), a novel by James A. Michener
* Mexico (game), a dice game
* Mexico (Epcot), a pavilion within Walt Disney World in Florida
* Mexico (barque), a ship wrecked at Southport on 9 December 1886 of all the things you asked about, this one is the closest to having any relevance to the puzzle


Does US refer to:

The United States of America?
# Us", a song by Ice Cube from his 1991 album Death Certificate this would be somewhat fitting to listen to during the event
# "Us", a song by Céline Dion from her 1997 album Let's Talk About Love
# "US", a song by Stephen Malkmus and the Jicks from the 2003 album Pig Lib
# "Us", a song by Regina Spektor from her 2004 album Soviet Kitsch
# Us (Maceo Parker album), a 1974 album by Maceo Parker
# Us (Peter Gabriel album), a 1992 album by Peter Gabriel
# Us (Mull Historical Society album), a 2003 album by Mull Historical Society

* University of Salford, a university in the UK
* University of Salzburg, a university in Austria
* Université de Sherbrooke, a university in Canada
* University School, a private all-boys day school in Hunting Valley, Ohio, United States


* Us Weekly, an American celebrity magazine
* Us (TV movie)
* us is often used to denote µs (microsecond) when the proper "µ" (micro sign) character or Greek "μ" (Mu) letter are either both missing, or cannot be easily entered
* .us, Internet TLD of the United States of America
* United Services Club or US Club, a golf club in Mumbai

A very impressive list! However, none of the above are correct. Geographic location is irrelevant. There are no songs involved. No novels, no shipwrecks, no pavilions, no magazines, no movies, no abbreviations, no schools, and no golf clubs.
Ohlala8 (Ohlala8)
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Posted on Thursday, September 03, 2009 - 10:07 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is Jerry HAM? Did Jerry start out in the US? And move somewhere (not Mexico)? If so, relevant where he moved [LTPF list of countries]? Or is it just important that the move was permanent? Or did he not move at all, but do something else permanently? Did Jerry need something? Did he get what he needed?

Is Becky HAF? Did Becky start out in the US? Did she need something? Did she need to go to Mexico to get it? Did she actually go to Mexico? Did she get what she needed? Did she travel at all?

Are there any other relevant characters?
Noel (Noel)
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Posted on Friday, September 04, 2009 - 2:03 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Ohlala8

Post Number: 382
Registered: 6-2009

Posted on Thursday, September 03, 2009 - 10:07 pm:

Is Jerry HAM? yes Did Jerry start out in the US? no, he never set foot in the US And move somewhere (not Mexico)? he did travel, in a sense, prior to this event If so, relevant where he moved [LTPF list of countries]? Or is it just important that the move was permanent? he didn't really "move", as in change residence, but he did stay where he traveled to Or did he not move at all, but do something else permanently? yes, this one Did Jerry need something? He had two kinds of needs, but they're not really things. He needed something to happen, and he needed something to not happen. Did he get what he needed? no, neither type of need was fulfilled

Is Becky HAF? HAM Did Becky start out in the US? he never set foot in the US Did she need something? yes, but an event, not a thing Did she need to go to Mexico to get it? he had to go somewhere, but not Mexico Did she actually go to Mexico? no Did she get what she needed? yes Did she travel at all? yes

Are there any other relevant characters? yes, in the thousands at least. But none participated directly.
Ferrets101 (Ferrets101)
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Posted on Friday, September 04, 2009 - 5:38 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

teleportation relevant? time travel?
Noel (Noel)
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Posted on Friday, September 04, 2009 - 5:45 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

teleportation relevant? no time travel? no - no travel of any kind
Noel (Noel)
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Posted on Thursday, September 10, 2009 - 5:09 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Hint1: Ferrets101, go back and look at your long list of Us and Mexico disambiguation. What do the two list items I commented on have in common?

Hint2: Ohlala8, one way to start to tackle this puzzle is to find out why they never went to Mexico or the US.
Noel (Noel)
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Posted on Thursday, September 24, 2009 - 8:14 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

By the way, you can feel free to ask questions about anything you want. The scenario at the top was chosen quasi-randomly (it was the most recent solved puzzle I had hosted). It's just there to give you something to ask questions about, but if it's confusing, skip it and ask about any situation you want.
Ohlala8 (Ohlala8)
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Posted on Friday, September 25, 2009 - 6:24 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

sorry I abandoned your puzzle there for awhile, I got kind of confused trying to keep track of the answers you gave to my questions versus the answers you gave to other people's questions. If this keeps up, I'm going to make a spreadsheet or something.

Okay, so there are two immediately relevant characters, Jerry and Beck, correct? And they do not live in, nor have they ever visited, Mexico or the US, correct? Do they both live in the same place? Canada? Central America? South America? Europe? Asia? Africa? Australia? Antarctica? an island? underwater? outer space?

Are they both alive? Do they know one another? If so, are they relatives? friends? coworkers? in a professional relationship? gay lovers?

As a result of Jerry not getting what he needed, was he negatively impacted in some way (answer both for what he needed to happen and what he needed not to happen, please)? If so, financially? physically? emotionally? mentally? did he die?

Would it have been possible for both Beck's and Jerry's needs to be fulfilled? Would Beck have been unhappy that Jerry didn't get what he needed? Would Jerry have been happy that Beck got what he needed?
Noel (Noel)
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Posted on Friday, September 25, 2009 - 2:37 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I'd say just keep track of your answers for now. Worry about the others once you figure out how I'm answering yours. You're right that your answers are different from others. Thanks for picking this back up again.

Okay, so there are two immediately relevant characters, Jerry and Beck, correct? yes And they do not live in, nor have they ever visited, Mexico or the US, correct? correct Do they both live in the same place? yes Canada? Central America? South America? Europe? Asia? this one Africa? Australia? Antarctica? an island? underwater? outer space?

Are they both alive? no Do they know one another? not really, but they've encountered one another If so, are they relatives? friends? coworkers? in a professional relationship? this is closest gay lovers?

As a result of Jerry not getting what he needed, was he negatively impacted in some way (answer both for what he needed to happen and what he needed not to happen, please)? yes...and the end result is the same for both needs, as they're very related and inseparable. You can think of them collectively as one need, but with two components. Does that make any sense? If so, financially? physically? emotionally? mentally? did he die? this one

Would it have been possible for both Beck's and Jerry's needs to be fulfilled? no, good question Would Beck have been unhappy that Jerry didn't get what he needed? no Would Jerry have been happy that Beck got what he needed? no
Ohlala8 (Ohlala8)
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Posted on Saturday, September 26, 2009 - 12:29 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Can I just pull an [LTPF list of Asian countries]? Is the country relevant because of the government? economic system? a specific law? the climate? geographic features? history? neighboring countries? population? how developed/undeveloped it is? Do Jerry and Beck belong to a particular ethnic subgroup?

Did Jerry die by... starvation? lack of water? murder? suicide? accident? disease? heart attack? old age? How much time passed between him realizing his need and his death? seconds? minutes? hours? days? weeks? months? years? Is the thing that Jerry needed not to happen the same thing that Beck needed to happen? If Beck's need hadn't been fulfilled, would he have died? In the same way that Jerry died?
Ferrets101 (Ferrets101)
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Posted on Sunday, September 27, 2009 - 9:08 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is the reason the barque "Mexico" is relevant because:

shipwrecks are relevant?
ships are relevant?
southport is relevant?

Is the reason Ice Cube's song "US" on the album "Death Certificate" relevant because:
Jerry died?
Becky/Beck died?
Someone else died?
Or is the Ice Cube Part relevant? As in, are ice cubes relevant? icebergs (which really are just like big giant icebergs if you think about it?)

Were Beck and/or Jerry on a ship that crashed into an iceberg? Was it the Titanic?
Noel (Noel)
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Posted on Monday, September 28, 2009 - 2:57 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Can I just pull an [LTPF list of Asian countries]? sure, it's the middle east, and it's in the vicinity of Israel (I'm not sure of the exact location) Is the country relevant because of the government? yope economic system? a specific law? the climate? geographic features? history? this one neighboring countries? yope population? how developed/undeveloped it is? Do Jerry and Beck belong to a particular ethnic subgroup? yes. No to rest.

Did Jerry die by... starvation? lack of water? murder? this one is closest suicide? accident? disease? heart attack? old age? How much time passed between him realizing his need and his death? seconds? minutes? hours? days? days, I think. weeks? months? years? Is the thing that Jerry needed not to happen the same thing that Beck needed to happen? yes If Beck's need hadn't been fulfilled, would he have died? yes In the same way that Jerry died? not exactly, but similar
Noel (Noel)
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Posted on Monday, September 28, 2009 - 3:03 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is the reason the barque "Mexico" is relevant because:

shipwrecks are relevant? this one, but only vaguely, in that shipwrecks involve death...see below
ships are relevant?
southport is relevant?

Is the reason Ice Cube's song "US" on the album "Death Certificate" relevant because:
Jerry died? yes
Becky/Beck died? not yet, but he will soon
Someone else died? no
Or is the Ice Cube Part relevant? As in, are ice cubes relevant? icebergs (which really are just like big giant icebergs if you think about it?) no

Were Beck and/or Jerry on a ship that crashed into an iceberg? Was it the Titanic? no, but this guess is brilliant considering the coincidence of "ice cube" and "shipwreck" (neither of which is relevant at this point).

You got all you needed to out of those clues, so you can forget about them now. Jerry died, and Beck will die soon.
Ferrets101 (Ferrets101)
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Posted on Saturday, October 03, 2009 - 9:57 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did Jerry die in a terrorist attack? Is terrorism at all involved as relating to Jerry? As related to Beck? At all? Will Beck die as a result of terrorism? Is how Beck will die relevant? Can we even determine how Beck will die at this point? When you say Beck will die soon, do you mean: Within minutes? Hours? Days? Months? Weeks? Years? When this puzzle is solved, regardless of when that may be? Is it possible theoretically for Beck to die before someone solves this puzzle?
Noel (Noel)
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Posted on Sunday, October 04, 2009 - 5:56 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did Jerry die in a terrorist attack? no Is terrorism at all involved as relating to Jerry? no As related to Beck? At all? Will Beck die as a result of terrorism? no terrorism relevant at all Is how Beck will die relevant? very Can we even determine how Beck will die at this point? not exactly sure what you're asking. Beck knows how he will die. You will figure it out eventually. When you say Beck will die soon, do you mean: Within minutes? probably this one Hours? Days? Months? Weeks? Years? When this puzzle is solved, regardless of when that may be? haha, no Is it possible theoretically for Beck to die before someone solves this puzzle? ?? He will die within minutes. So assuming you're asking if his expected death is shorter than the time it takes to finish this puzzle, then yes, because the puzzle will take more than minutes to solve. But if you're asking whether his state of living or death will change in the puzzle while you're trying to solve it, then no. For the duration of this puzzle, he will be forever "within minutes of dying"
Ohlala8 (Ohlala8)
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Posted on Sunday, October 04, 2009 - 7:51 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is the Israel/Palestine conflict relevant? Is Jerry Israeli? Palestinian? Is Beck Israeli? Palestinian? Are either of them soldiers? Was what they each needed a military objective? Was Jerry killed in battle? Executed by his own side? Killed in a terrorist attack? Killed as a POW? Does he die directly at Beck's hands? Is Beck indirectly responsible for Jerry's death because he was going after what he needed? Was Jerry's death the thing that Beck needed?
Noel (Noel)
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Posted on Monday, October 05, 2009 - 3:26 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is the Israel/Palestine conflict relevant? no Is Jerry Israeli? Palestinian? Is Beck Israeli? Palestinian? /b{no to all. To clarify a previous answer, the location is the physical geographical location where Israel is. It is not the country of Israel} Are either of them soldiers? Jerry-yes. Beck-noish Was what they each needed a military objective? yes Was Jerry killed in battle? yes Executed by his own side? Killed in a terrorist attack? Killed as a POW? Does he die directly at Beck's hands? this one Is Beck indirectly responsible for Jerry's death because he was going after what he needed? directly responsible Was Jerry's death the thing that Beck needed? yes
Noel (Noel)
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Posted on Monday, October 05, 2009 - 3:27 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is Jerry Israeli? Palestinian? Is Beck Israeli? Palestinian? no to all. To clarify a previous answer, the location is the physical geographical location where Israel is. It is not the country of Israel
Ohlala8 (Ohlala8)
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Posted on Monday, October 05, 2009 - 9:24 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Does the story take place in modern times? 20th century? 19th? 18th? 17th? [insert a whole bunch more centuries]?

Is any bible story relevant? For some reason I keep thinking of Abraham and Isaac. Do Jerry and Beck have actual names that your average person of a particular religion might recognize?

Do Beck and Jerry belong to the same ethnic group? Are either of them Hebrews? Arabs? Philistines? You'll have to forgive my limited knowledge of the area around Israel. So, Beck needs to kill Jerry or else Jerry will kill him? Would a situation be possible in which both of them survived? Relevant why Beck wins? Relevant why this takes days? Does the actual fight take days? Or are there relevant preparations leading up to the fight? Are they in single combat? Or is this part of a war? If so, am I allowed to google the wars that happened in Israel in whatever century we end up in?
Noel (Noel)
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Posted on Monday, October 05, 2009 - 10:57 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Ohlala8 (Ohlala8)
Posted on Monday, October 05, 2009 - 9:24 pm:

Does the story take place in modern times? 20th century? 19th? 18th? 17th? [insert a whole bunch more centuries]? around 1000 BC

Is any bible story relevant? yes For some reason I keep thinking of Abraham and Isaac. but not this story Do Jerry and Beck have actual names that your average person of a particular religion might recognize?yes

Do Beck and Jerry belong to the same ethnic group? no Are either of them Hebrews? yes, or close. Beck is an Israelite. Arabs? no Philistines? yes, Jerry You'll have to forgive my limited knowledge of the area around Israel. So, Beck needs to kill Jerry or else Jerry will kill him? yes Would a situation be possible in which both of them survived? yes -- only if they didn't fight each other Relevant why Beck wins? yes Relevant why this takes days? Looking into the story again, I'm not clear on whether it takes one day or multiple. What's relevant is that there's a delay of some length (I seem to remember it being days, but could be wrong) Does the actual fight take days? no Or are there relevant preparations leading up to the fight? this Are they in single combat? yes Or is this part of a war? and yes If so, am I allowed to google the wars that happened in Israel in whatever century we end up in? feel free to Google famous stories from the Old Testament of the Bible
Ohlala8 (Ohlala8)
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Posted on Tuesday, October 06, 2009 - 4:20 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

ooooooh, David and Goliath???

If that's not it, I'll be sad.
Noel (Noel)
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Posted on Tuesday, October 06, 2009 - 12:46 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Ohlala8 (Ohlala8)

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Posted on Tuesday, October 06, 2009 - 4:20 am:

ooooooh, David and Goliath??? yes! Beck is David and Jerry is Goliath. Jerry (Goliath) has recently been killed.

Ohlala8 - now go back and look at Ferrets101's questions and answers (and anyone else's who joins in).

New rule: Ohlala8 has already established (and I've confirmed) that different people can have different answers to the same question. if anyone wants to ask questions as if you were someone else, just start your post with that person's name, ok?.
Ferrets101 (Ferrets101)
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Posted on Sunday, October 11, 2009 - 12:19 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is Beck David? Is Jerry Goliath?

(From this down until I say otherwise, I am Noel)

Is Beck David? Is Jerry Goliath?

(From this down until I say otherwise, I am an imaginary user named abcdefg)

Is Beck David? Is Jerry Goliath?

(From this down until I say otherwise, I am Dropofahat)

Is Beck David? Is Jerry Goliath?

(From this down until I say otherwise, I am an imaginary user named DavidAndGoliath)

Is Beck David? Is Jerry Goliath?
Noel (Noel)
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Posted on Monday, October 12, 2009 - 1:20 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is Beck David? Is Jerry Goliath? no to both

(From this down until I say otherwise, I am Noel)

Is Beck David? Is Jerry Goliath? no to both

(From this down until I say otherwise, I am an imaginary user named abcdefg)

Is Beck David? Is Jerry Goliath? yes to both

(From this down until I say otherwise, I am Dropofahat:

Is Beck David? Is Jerry Goliath? no to both

(From this down until I say otherwise, I am an imaginary user named DavidAndGoliath)

Is Beck David? Beck? Who's Beck? There is no Beck. Is Jerry Goliath? no
Ferrets101 (Ferrets101)
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Posted on Monday, October 12, 2009 - 1:45 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Are any ferrets involved?

(From here until I say otherwise, I am an imaginary user called dogs101)

Are any dogs involved?


(From here on until I say otherwise, I am an imaginary user called trees101)

Are any trees involved?
Noel (Noel)
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Posted on Monday, October 12, 2009 - 2:11 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Are any ferrets involved? no

(From here until I say otherwise, I am an imaginary user called dogs101)

Are any dogs involved? no


(From here on until I say otherwise, I am an imaginary user called trees101)

Are any trees involved? no
Noel (Noel)
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Posted on Wednesday, October 21, 2009 - 3:16 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Ok, this has stalled, so I'm going to ask myself some questions to get it going again. Of course, I'm taking short cuts because it's just silly otherwise =)

(Noel)

Is Jerry HAM? yes, but gender irrel. Is Becky? yes to H/A. gender irrel. Are there any other relevant parties? unknown. There are probably a few others at most, and all are H/A, gender irrel.

Is location relevant? yes If so, is Jerry [LTPF list of locations]? on the ground
Same questions for Becky? in the air
Same questions for other relevant parties? in the air

Is Jerry living? no Becky? yes Other relevant parties? yes

Are there any relevant objects? yes If so, are they with Jerry? Becky? The others? each person has one relevant object in his or her possession

ok, hopefully that's enough to get this puzzle jump started again. I would also suggest that someone do a recap of my replies to Ferrets101 from earlier in the puzzle (when he was asking questions as himself). As I said before, anyone can ask questions as anyone else -- just let me know who you are pretending to be before you start asking questions.
Noel (Noel)
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Posted on Thursday, October 22, 2009 - 9:06 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

RECAP:

(Ohlala8)
Jerry is Goliath and Beck is David. Jerry/Goliath has just died. Nothing more to find out.


(Noel)
see most recent post


(Dropofahat)
It is relevant that Becky probably didn't have children. Becky yesishly needed the same thing as Jerry.


(Ferretts101)
Beck and Jerry are both male. They are brothers. It is necessary for them to be brothers (e.g. Beck could not be Becky). Jerry is dead, and Beck is about to die within minutes. Beck knows how he will die. hint: figuring out how he knows is the key to solving this puzzle

Geographic location is irrelevant. Travel is irrelevant.



(Jenburdoo)
There is no Becky. Jerry is human and adult. Gender is irrelevant.

(abcdefg)
Beck and Jerry are David and Goliath.

(DavidAndGoliath)
Jerry is not Goliath. There is no Becky.
Noel (Noel)
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Posted on Friday, October 23, 2009 - 3:10 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Sorry Ferrets101, I just realized I misspelled your name in the previous post
Quovynyte (Quovynyte)
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Posted on Friday, October 23, 2009 - 6:51 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Ack! I just spent ages typing out why I couldn't understand your recap. But my mouse slipped and I lost it. :-( Anyway, can you kinda explain it me?
Ohlala8 (Ohlala8)
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Posted on Friday, October 23, 2009 - 7:16 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I'm Ferrets101 here
Are Jerry and Beck Cain and Abel? Jacob and Esau? Is the Bible at all relevant? Is it the classic puzzle where Beck realizes his siamese twin is dead? Is a classic puzzle relevant? Do Beck and Jerry have recognizable real names?
Noel (Noel)
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Posted on Friday, October 23, 2009 - 7:22 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

yes, sorry. I told you you could start at the recap without reading the rest of the puzzle, when what I meant was "read the first post (including the part in italics) of the puzzle and then you can skip to the recap."

Additional information: Later in the puzzle, Ohlala8 correctly guessed that I was answering her questions about a different situation than I was answering other people's questions. Therefore, from that point forward, I issued a new rule: you can ask questions normally, or you can pretend to be someone else by indicating who you are pretending to be before asking questions.

As stated in the first post, your goal is to discover the rule I am using to answer questions. The recap shows what is known about the answers I have given each person so far.

If you have additional questions about this type of puzzle, search the archives for Gourami's original camouflaged rulebreaker puzzle.
Noel (Noel)
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Posted on Friday, October 23, 2009 - 7:24 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I'm Ferrets101 here

Are Jerry and Beck Cain and Abel? Jacob and Esau? Is the Bible at all relevant? Is it the classic puzzle where Beck realizes his siamese twin is dead? this one Is a classic puzzle relevant? so yes Do Beck and Jerry have recognizable real names?

no to rest

thanks for picking this one up again!
Ohlala8 (Ohlala8)
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Posted on Friday, October 23, 2009 - 7:49 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

aaaaaand now I'm you!
Was Jerry in the air when he was alive? Is Beck in an airplane? helicopter? parasailing? hang-gliding? skydiving? jumping? falling? could this happen in real life? DID it happen irl?
Noel (Noel)
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Posted on Friday, October 23, 2009 - 7:59 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

(noel)
Was Jerry in the air when he was alive? yes Is Beck in an airplane? helicopter? parasailing? hang-gliding? skydiving? jumping? falling? none of the above could this happen in real life? yes DID it happen irl? not that I know of
Quovynyte (Quovynyte)
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Posted on Friday, October 23, 2009 - 8:37 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

So each answer changes for each person? Cool!

Is Beck David?
Is Jerry Goliath?
Noel (Noel)
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Posted on Friday, October 23, 2009 - 8:47 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

(Quovynyte)

Is Beck David? There is no Beck.
Is Jerry Goliath? no
Ohlala8 (Ohlala8)
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Posted on Friday, October 23, 2009 - 10:04 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

still noel
Is Beck in a standing position? Hanging from something? Touching anything apart from his clothing? Is he in motion? If so, straight down? Down at a sharp angle? Down at a relatively safe angle? Parallel to the ground? Straight up? Up at an angle? Is he outdoors? Is he kept in the air by a machine of some kind? Natural air currents? Thrust, as from a jetpack? Something slowing his descent, like a parachute? Wings? Is he in the air by his own choice? For his own enjoyment? In order to do something specific?
Quovynyte (Quovynyte)
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Posted on Friday, October 23, 2009 - 10:27 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I'll be myself for once
Is Beck in a standing position? Hanging from something? Touching anything apart from his clothing? Is he in motion? If so, straight down? Down at a sharp angle? Down at a relatively safe angle? Parallel to the ground? Straight up? Up at an angle? Is he outdoors? Is he kept in the air by a machine of some kind? Natural air currents? Thrust, as from a jetpack? Something slowing his descent, like a parachute? Wings? Is he in the air by his own choice? For his own enjoyment? In order to do something specific?
Noel (Noel)
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Posted on Monday, October 26, 2009 - 1:26 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

(Noel)

Is Beck in a standing position? probably Hanging from something? yes and no Touching anything apart from his clothing? yes Is he in motion? yes If so, straight down? no Down at a sharp angle? no Down at a relatively safe angle? possibly Parallel to the ground? possibly Straight up? no Up at an angle? possibly, but unlikely, I think Is he outdoors? yes Is he kept in the air by a machine of some kind? no Natural air currents? no Thrust, as from a jetpack? no Something slowing his descent, like a parachute? no Wings? no Is he in the air by his own choice? yes For his own enjoyment? yes In order to do something specific? don't know
Noel (Noel)
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Posted on Monday, October 26, 2009 - 1:30 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

(Quovynyte)

Is Beck in a standing position? There is no Beck. I'll assume these questions are about Jerry. No, Jerry is not in a standing position Hanging from something? yes Touching anything apart from his clothing? yes Is he in motion? not anymore If so, straight down? last time he moved, it was straight down Is he outdoors? no

Is he kept in the air by a machine of some kind? Natural air currents? Thrust, as from a jetpack? Something slowing his descent, like a parachute? Wings? no to all

Is he in the air by his own choice? yes For his own enjoyment? no In order to do something specific? yes
Noel (Noel)
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Posted on Wednesday, October 28, 2009 - 1:12 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

(these are clarifications of some of the above responses to "Noel")

Hanging from something? yes and no -- Beck himself is standing. But the thing he is standing on/in is hanging.

Touching anything apart from his clothing? yes -- the only relevant things he is touching are the thing he is standing on/in and the one relevant object that each person has in his position


(Clarification of a response to Quovynyte)

Touching anything apart from his clothing? yes -- the only relevant thing Jerry is touching is the thing he is hanging from
Noel (Noel)
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Posted on Thursday, October 29, 2009 - 6:31 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Also, I'm giving the following information because I can't think how you would possibly think of it on your own without a puzzle scenario to base your questions on:

(Quovynyte)
There is water on the floor beneath where Jerry is hanging.

Hint to ohlala8: continue asking this line of questioning (as Noel) from before: Is Beck in an airplane? helicopter? parasailing? hang-gliding? skydiving? It's none of these, but...
Ohlala8 (Ohlala8)
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Posted on Saturday, October 31, 2009 - 12:57 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Interesting... (I'm gonna let Quovynyte have the pleasure of solving his, so I'm still Noel.)

Is Beck hanging from a plane/helicopter? A crane? A building? A kite-like object? Is the thing he's hanging from on the ground?
Quovynyte (Quovynyte)
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Posted on Saturday, October 31, 2009 - 3:25 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is ice relevant? Steam?
Is a body of water relevant?
Is Beck hanging in a building?
Is he hanging from a machine? A vehicle?
Is what he holding a rope?
Is his occupation relevant?
Noel (Noel)
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Posted on Sunday, November 01, 2009 - 11:29 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is Beck hanging from a plane/helicopter? this is closest, but not very close A crane? A building? A kite-like object? Is the thing he's hanging from on the ground? none of the above
Noel (Noel)
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Posted on Sunday, November 01, 2009 - 11:30 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

oops, the previous post was in response to "Noel"
Noel (Noel)
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Posted on Sunday, November 01, 2009 - 11:32 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

(Quovynyte)

Is ice relevant? yes Steam?
Is a body of water relevant?
Is Beck hanging in a building? yes
Is he hanging from a machine? A vehicle?
Is what he holding a rope? he's not holding anything, but that is what he's touching
Is his occupation relevant?

no to rest
Quovynyte (Quovynyte)
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Posted on Wednesday, November 04, 2009 - 2:20 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did he hang himself by standing on a block of ice, and attaching rope from his neck to somewhere above him, then as the ice melted his body got lower and lower thus hanging himself?
Noel (Noel)
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Posted on Wednesday, November 04, 2009 - 3:25 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did he hang himself by standing on a block of ice, and attaching rope from his neck to somewhere above him, then as the ice melted his body got lower and lower thus hanging himself? that's exactly it. nothing more to find out.
Ohlala8 (Ohlala8)
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Posted on Thursday, November 05, 2009 - 5:57 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I have to say, I'm enjoying this one, but I've never been much good at rulebreakers. It can't have to do with previously posted puzzles, because it works for fictional users. And as far as I know, the classics don't have definitive titles, so it's probably not an alphabet thing. Quovynyte, I'll keep solving the puzzle parts if you help me out on the rule part!

Is this puzzle a "classic?" An urban legend? A famous fictional story? A puzzle previously posted on LTPF?

Did Jerry die by falling? Is there a chance that Beck will die in the same way that Jerry did?
Yojimbo (Yojimbo)
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Posted on Thursday, November 05, 2009 - 9:01 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I'm just reading along on this -- at this point; that may change -- and enjoying it, but I do have a question...
would you say there's now a LTPF [Mexico list]?
Noel (Noel)
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Posted on Thursday, November 05, 2009 - 12:39 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I have to say, I'm enjoying this one, but I've never been much good at rulebreakers. thanks for continuing to work on it. I'm not very good at rulebreakers either. There are two near the top of the puzzle list that I've been thinking about for what feels like eons, but I'm not any closer to solving them than I was when I started. But even if it doesn't feel like it to you, it seems to me that you're making progress.

It can't have to do with previously posted puzzles, because it works for fictional users. correct. It does not have to do with the user's previously posted puzzles. And as far as I know, the classics don't have definitive titles, so it's probably not an alphabet thing. Quovynyte, I'll keep solving the puzzle parts if you help me out on the rule part!


(Noel) (I'm assuming you're still asking as me, based on your questions)

Is this puzzle a "classic?" yes An urban legend? A famous fictional story? A puzzle previously posted on LTPF? yes
no to rest

Did Jerry die by falling? yes Is there a chance that Beck will die in the same way that Jerry did? yes, I suppose there is. He and his companions hope that they have avoided that fate, though.
Noel (Noel)
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Posted on Thursday, November 05, 2009 - 12:41 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I'm just reading along on this -- at this point; that may change -- and enjoying it, but I do have a question...
would you say there's now a LTPF [Mexico list]?
most definitely. Not to mention a most impressive [US list]. Now we just need more puzzles about Mexico to make the list useful =)
Ohlala8 (Ohlala8)
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Posted on Thursday, November 05, 2009 - 9:34 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Okay, so is it the hot air balloon one, then? Where they drew straws to see who had to jump out and lighten the load?
Noel (Noel)
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Posted on Thursday, November 05, 2009 - 9:46 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

(Noel)

Okay, so is it the hot air balloon one, then? Where they drew straws to see who had to jump out and lighten the load? yes
Noel (Noel)
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Posted on Thursday, November 05, 2009 - 9:55 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

seems like a good time for an UPDATED RECAP:

(Ohlala8)
Solved. Jerry is Goliath and Beck is David. Jerry/Goliath has just died.

(Noel)
Solved. Jerry and Becky were in a hot air balloon with some other people. The balloon started to sink, so they all drew matches to see who would have to jump out to reduce the weight. Jerry pulled the short match, so he jumped out of the balloon and died.


(Dropofahat)
It is relevant that Becky probably didn't have children. Becky yesishly needed the same thing as Jerry.


(Ferretts101)
Solved. Beck and Jerry are conjoined twins. Beck looks over and sees that Jerry has died, so he knows that he will die soon.


(Jenburdoo)
There is no Becky. Jerry is human and adult. Gender is irrelevant.

(abcdefg)
Solved. Beck and Jerry are David and Goliath.

(DavidAndGoliath)
Jerry is not Goliath. There is no Becky.

(Quovynyte)
Solved. Jerry hung himself by standing on a block of ice, attaching rope from his neck to somewhere above him, and then as the ice melted his body got lower and lower and was hung.
Noel (Noel)
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Posted on Wednesday, November 11, 2009 - 8:16 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Apologies again to Ferrets101. Since I copied and pasted the updated recap from the previous recap, I misspelled your name yet again. You would think I could spell your name, given that I can spell Quovynyte just fine =)

Hint: You may find it more helpful to ask questions as Jenburdoo or Dropofahat than to ask them as DavidAndGoliath.
Ohlala8 (Ohlala8)
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Posted on Tuesday, November 17, 2009 - 8:04 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

dropofahat

Is Becky unable to have children? Does she not want children? Is she HAF? Is she of childbearing age? Was she engaging in some kind of risky behavior that a mother probably would not do? Does she die? Does Jerry die? Is anyone injured?
Noel (Noel)
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Posted on Tuesday, November 17, 2009 - 9:41 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is Becky unable to have children? possibly or probably Does she not want children? irrel Is she HAF? H - yes / A - irrel / F - no, male Is she of childbearing age? irrel Was she engaging in some kind of risky behavior that a mother probably would not do? irrel Does she die? no, but she will soon Does Jerry die? Jerry is already dead Is anyone injured? possibly, but irrelevant. It doesn't matter whether Jerry died naturally or due to an injury.
Quovynyte (Quovynyte)
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Posted on Saturday, November 21, 2009 - 9:39 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

dropofahat

Does Becky have some disability? Does he have some illness or disease? Is he perfectly healthy? Is he a perfectly average human being? His profession relevant? Did Becky need to die? Did Becky need a tangible object? Did Becky need a wife? Did Becky have a sex change?

I still don't get this puzzle at all. It seems like each person has a different puzzle to work out. Then do we have to work out the answer to the puzzle of everybody in LTPF?
Noel (Noel)
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Posted on Saturday, November 21, 2009 - 2:10 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

(dropofahat)

Does Becky have some disability? yes Does he have some illness or disease? no Is he perfectly healthy? no, he is about to die Is he a perfectly average human being? in some ways, I'm sure he is. But as you noted above, he has a disability. His profession relevant? no Did Becky need to die? no, he needed whatever it was that would have kept him from dying. I don't know what that is. Did Becky need a tangible object? no Did Becky need a wife? no Did Becky have a sex change? no

I still don't get this puzzle at all. It seems like each person has a different puzzle to work out. Then do we have to work out the answer to the puzzle of everybody in LTPF? no, not at all. You have to figure out the rule I'm using to determine each person's puzzle. In other words, how am I deciding which scenario goes with which person? In Gourami's original camouflaged rulebreaker, for example, she answered each person's questions as if they were asking about their own most recent completed puzzle in the recently solved area. It has already been established that my rule has nothing to do with puzzles previously posted by the user, though. As a group, you have solved enough people's scenarios to solve the rule, but I suggested adding dropofahat as one that might provide a useful clue since you don't have the rule figured out yet.

HINT: LTPF is relevant
Quovynyte (Quovynyte)
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Posted on Sunday, November 22, 2009 - 5:08 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Still dropofahat.

LTPF puzzles relevant? Mods? Users? Formatting? Layout? Rules? Posts? Solved puzzles? Lateral Limbo? Chatroom? Active puzzles? Recently solved puzzles? Admin?
Noel (Noel)
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Posted on Sunday, November 22, 2009 - 10:41 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Sorry if I was unclear in my hint. LTPF is relevant to the rule in general, not specific to dropofahat.

LTPF puzzles relevant? yes Mods? Users? Formatting? Layout? Rules? Posts? Solved puzzles? yesish Lateral Limbo? Chatroom? Active puzzles? Recently solved puzzles? Admin? no to rest
Ohlala8 (Ohlala8)
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Posted on Monday, November 23, 2009 - 12:35 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

dropofahat

Is Beck a midget? Blind? Deaf? In a wheelchair? Was Jerry his caretaker?
Noel (Noel)
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Posted on Monday, November 23, 2009 - 12:31 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

dropofahat

Is Beck a midget? Blind? Deaf? In a wheelchair? all irrel.
Was Jerry his caretaker? no
Noel (Noel)
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Posted on Monday, November 23, 2009 - 2:39 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

blooper...
I overlooked one of Quovynyte's questions above. My response should have been:
Active puzzles? yope
Ohlala8 (Ohlala8)
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Posted on Monday, November 23, 2009 - 9:14 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Okay, I definitely almost missed this because I thought the answer to mine would have to be about superman! I'd never heard the other version.

As Davidandgoliath...
Did Jerry die in a plane crash?

As Dropofahat...
Is it the conjoined twins story again?

As Jenburdoo...
Is it the guy who stood on a block of ice to hang himself again?

As Testpersonwithareallylongname...
Is Jerry a dj? Is Becky his wife whom he kills?

If it's yes to all these, then I think you count the number of letters in someone's handle, and then count that many down the list of "classic" puzzles.
Noel (Noel)
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Posted on Tuesday, November 24, 2009 - 2:14 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

If it's yes to all these, then I think you count the number of letters in someone's handle, and then count that many down the list of "classic" puzzles. That's it!! Thank you for bringing this one to a close. I've enjoyed it, but it has gone on far too long. There are a couple of other minor points to the rule, but it's time for this one to be over, so I'll just post them.

******SPOILER**********
The rule is:
(1) As Ohlala8 said, you count the number of letters in someone's handle, and then count that many down the list of "classic" puzzles.
(2) The first person mentioned in the classic puzzle is Jerry. The second is Becky. If there is only one person, then there is no Becky.
(3) If a classic puzzle has more than one classic answer scenario, I used the first scenario listed.


Thanks to all who participated, and especially to Ohlala8 and Quovynyte for sticking with it for so long. Special thanks also to Ferrets101 for some very useful questions earlier in the puzzle. When Ferrets stumbled on abcdefg having the same scenario as Ohlala8, and then Ohlala8 realized that classic puzzles were relevant, I thought it would go very quickly after that. Shows what I know. =)

In case anyone is interested in hosting this kind of question in the future, here are a few things I've learned (1) Choose a less complicated scenario as your starting puzzle statement! I picked this one quasi-randomly from among the puzzles I had hosted recently, which was a mistake. Use something simple. (2) Use generic names or don't use names at all. All that Beck/Becky nonsense was a pain (for me and you both, I think!)
Noel (Noel)
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Posted on Tuesday, November 24, 2009 - 2:19 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

one other tip. When Gourami hosted her camouflaged rulebreaker, she gave a lot about the scenario away in her replies. I, on the other hand, started out by sticking to just yes/no answers as much as possible. That turned out to be a bad idea because it just didn't give enough information for people to ask future questions on, so I switched tactics somewhere in the middle of the puzzle to follow Gourami's lead. It worked much better.

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