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Biograd (Biograd)
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Username: Biograd

Post Number: 690
Registered: 6-2008
Posted on Wednesday, March 10, 2010 - 9:14 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Thanks Galfisk for the idea. This one just sent to me by a friend:

A sloppy attempt to reuse a piece of garbage resulted in an explosion and a broken roof.
Galfisk (Galfisk)
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Username: Galfisk

Post Number: 1346
Registered: 9-2009
Posted on Wednesday, March 10, 2010 - 9:53 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

You're welcome.
Did the explosion cause the broken roof? Or did the broken roof cause the explosion? Did the sloppy attempt cause the explosion? Or the broken roof? "Piece of garbage" = actual garbage? Or a very poorly made product? Was it reused for its intended use? Or used for something else?
Can it best be classified as: an object? A material? A device? A machine? A substance?
Was the explosion from rapid release of pressure? Or from combustion? If so, combustion of: solid matter? Liquid? Gas? dust? Aerosol?
Was someone injured? Killed?
Biograd (Biograd)
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Username: Biograd

Post Number: 692
Registered: 6-2008
Posted on Wednesday, March 10, 2010 - 10:07 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

You're welcome.
Did the explosion cause the broken roof? This Or did the broken roof cause the explosion? Did the sloppy attempt cause the explosion? Yes Or the broken roof? Only as a consequence of the explosion "Piece of garbage" = actual garbage? Yes Or a very poorly made product? Was it reused for its intended use? Yes, at least in terms of purpose--though it was used improperly Or used for something else?
Can it best be classified as: an object? This A material? A device? And this A machine? Though I wouldn't call it this A substance?
Was the explosion from rapid release of pressure? This was definitely the main problem Or from combustion? this may have played a role too If so, combustion of: solid matter? Liquid? Gas? Gas (as in a gaseous substance, not gasoline) is relevant dust? Aerosol?
Was someone injured? Very probably Killed? No, thankfully.
Galfisk (Galfisk)
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Username: Galfisk

Post Number: 1347
Registered: 9-2009
Posted on Wednesday, March 10, 2010 - 10:55 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Was the gas stored under pressure? Or heated until pressure was created? Was it: air? Steam? Welding gas? Flammable gas? Was it stored as a liquid under pressure? Was it stored in a gas tank? In the piece of garbage? Is it made of metal? Rust relevant? Was it a case of reusing something that should only be used once and then disposed of?
Biograd (Biograd)
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Username: Biograd

Post Number: 693
Registered: 6-2008
Posted on Thursday, March 11, 2010 - 8:12 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Was the gas stored under pressure? Yes Or heated until pressure was created? No Was it: air? Steam? Welding gas? None of these Flammable gas? Not by itself Was it stored as a liquid under pressure? Was it stored in a gas tank? This, a cylinder In the piece of garbage? Yes, the piece of garbage was the cylinder Is it made of metal? so yes Rust relevant? but not this, at least primarily Was it a case of reusing something that should only be used once and then disposed of? No, it was a refillable tank
Galfisk (Galfisk)
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Username: Galfisk

Post Number: 1349
Registered: 9-2009
Posted on Thursday, March 11, 2010 - 9:03 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Was the cylinder intended for this type of gas? Was it: damaged? Poorly manufactured? Expired? Was it made from: steel? Aluminium? Fiberglass? Carbon fiber? Something else? Did it explode: while filling? Some time afterwards? Was it overfilled? Was it a diving cylinder? Was it filled using the correct equipment? Cooling relevant? Or heating?
Biograd (Biograd)
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Username: Biograd

Post Number: 694
Registered: 6-2008
Posted on Friday, March 12, 2010 - 5:41 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Was the cylinder intended for this type of gas? Yes

Was it: damaged? Hmmm... When retrieved for reuse, it appears not. However, in the process of attempted reuse, it was modified in a very relevant way that could be considered damage Poorly manufactured? Probably no Expired? If you mean according to a formal expiration date, it is unknown. All we know is that it was discarded by its former owner, who did not intend for it to be filled by anyone else.

Was it made from: steel? Likely part this--though report only mentions it was metal Aluminium? Fiberglass? Carbon fiber? Something else? Did it explode: while filling? Some time afterwards? This Was it overfilled? YES Was it a diving cylinder? No Was it filled using the correct equipment? No Cooling relevant? Or heating? Neither, really
Galfisk (Galfisk)
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Username: Galfisk

Post Number: 1352
Registered: 9-2009
Posted on Friday, March 12, 2010 - 7:42 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Was the safety valve modified? Or blocked? To allow for overfilling? Is it relevant which gas it was filled with? Do we need to find out more about the person(s) involved? Did they intend to overfill the tank? Did they know of the dangers doing so? Or did they think the safety margins were big enough even after overfilling? Did the tank explode "spontaneously"? Or did something happen to it that made it explode? Such as being hit by something? Or falling over?
Biograd (Biograd)
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Username: Biograd

Post Number: 696
Registered: 6-2008
Posted on Monday, March 15, 2010 - 12:51 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Was the safety valve modified? Or blocked? Yes To allow for overfilling? Yes Is it relevant which gas it was filled with? A similar accident could have happened with almost any highly pressurized gas, but a property of the gas in this case may well have made the situation worse Do we need to find out more about the person(s) involved? Noish Did they intend to overfill the tank? No Did they know of the dangers doing so? No Or did they think the safety margins were big enough even after overfilling? Did the tank explode "spontaneously"? Or did something happen to it that made it explode? Something happened Such as being hit by something? No Or falling over? Possibly
Galfisk (Galfisk)
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Username: Galfisk

Post Number: 1395
Registered: 9-2009
Posted on Monday, March 15, 2010 - 8:37 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Was it filled with hydrogen? (thinking of hydrogen embrittlement) Or was it a property that made the explosion itself worse?
Did they think the safety valve was leaking? Was the tank jolted? By an earthquake? Or did the pressure inside rise further somehow? Relevant how long the tank sat before exploding?
Biograd (Biograd)
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Username: Biograd

Post Number: 698
Registered: 6-2008
Posted on Monday, March 15, 2010 - 6:49 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Was it filled with hydrogen? No(thinking of hydrogen embrittlement) Or was it a property that made the explosion itself worse? This
Did they think the safety valve was leaking? Who knows what they were thinking, but they were very aware of gas escaping from it before they plugged it Was the tank jolted? Probably By an earthquake? But not by this Or did the pressure inside rise further somehow? Relevant how long the tank sat before exploding? Noish

HINT: The most important thing now is the location of this all
Galfisk (Galfisk)
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Username: Galfisk

Post Number: 1403
Registered: 9-2009
Posted on Monday, March 15, 2010 - 10:39 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did it happen: on a farm? In an industrial setting? In a dive shop? On a ship? Or oil rig? Airport? In a military setting? Relevant how big the tank was? Did the gas catch fire after the tank exploded? Or suffocate someone? Was it poisonous? Or corrosive?
Biograd (Biograd)
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Username: Biograd

Post Number: 700
Registered: 6-2008
Posted on Tuesday, March 16, 2010 - 5:26 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did it happen: on a farm? No In an industrial setting? The overfilling, presumably. The explosion, no. In a dive shop? On a ship? Or oil rig? Airport? In a military setting? No to all the rest Relevant how big the tank was? Well, that's necessarily at least somewhat relevant, in terms of how big the explosion is, no? But not critically. Did the gas catch fire after the tank exploded? Hmm... noish or yope. This and the "flammable" question above are missing something. Flammability of things is relevant though Or suffocate someone? Was it poisonous? Or corrosive? No to all the rest
Galfisk (Galfisk)
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Username: Galfisk

Post Number: 1412
Registered: 9-2009
Posted on Tuesday, March 16, 2010 - 10:42 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did the tank contain oxygen? Did it explode in a hospital? Ambulance? Other medical setting? Or was it intended for cutting? Or spacecraft?
Biograd (Biograd)
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Username: Biograd

Post Number: 703
Registered: 6-2008
Posted on Wednesday, March 17, 2010 - 5:11 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did the tank contain oxygen? YES Did it explode in a hospital? Ambulance? Other medical setting? Or was it intended for cutting? This was its intended use. Though, it was not being used for that (yet) when the accident occurred Or spacecraft?
Galfisk (Galfisk)
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Username: Galfisk

Post Number: 1425
Registered: 9-2009
Posted on Thursday, March 18, 2010 - 7:58 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did it explode in a building? Vehicle? Outside? Did it damage something relevant in addition to the roof? Did it leak oxygen before it exploded? Were people present when it exploded? Did people cause the explosion? Or was it caused by a natural event?
Biograd (Biograd)
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Username: Biograd

Post Number: 706
Registered: 6-2008
Posted on Thursday, March 18, 2010 - 5:51 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did it explode in a building? No Vehicle? Yes Outside? The vehicle was outside Did it damage something relevant in addition to the roof? Yes, the vehicle (and of course the cylinder) Did it leak oxygen before it exploded? Who knows? Were people present when it exploded? Yes Did people cause the explosion? Noish Or was it caused by a natural event? But I wouldn't call it this either
Yuva (Yuva)
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Username: Yuva

Post Number: 14
Registered: 3-2010
Posted on Thursday, March 18, 2010 - 9:54 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Sloppy attempt = recycle the tank? components of the tank? Is it a real incident? Was it in the news? If yes, is there more to guess?
Galfisk (Galfisk)
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Username: Galfisk

Post Number: 1442
Registered: 9-2009
Posted on Thursday, March 18, 2010 - 10:55 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Ws it caused by a traffic accident? Did the vehicle swerve? Hit something? Run off the road? Or was it hit by something?
Biograd (Biograd)
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Username: Biograd

Post Number: 709
Registered: 6-2008
Posted on Saturday, March 20, 2010 - 9:32 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Sloppy attempt = recycle the tank? We already established that the sloppiness involved overfilling the tank, and plugging the safety valve when it opened, rather than taking it as a warning. components of the tank? Is it a real incident? Yes Was it in the news? Maybe If yes, is there more to guess? Yes: Where was the vehicle with the tank? What happened right before it exploded? Where was the relevant roof?

Ws it caused by a traffic accident? Not in the sense of a collision Did the vehicle swerve? Yope Hit something? No Run off the road? Yesish, but beware mislead Or was it hit by something? No
Galfisk (Galfisk)
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Username: Galfisk

Post Number: 1464
Registered: 9-2009
Posted on Sunday, March 21, 2010 - 1:36 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did the vehicle: take a sharp turn? At high speed? Or hit a bump? Get a flat tire? Was the tank in the: trunk? Back seat? Front seat? Was the vehicle a car? Was the vehicle's roof destroyed? Or a garage roof? Was the roof over the explosion? Or did shrapnel fly some distance and hit the roof? Or did the vehicle drive onto the roof after the explosion? Did (most of) the tank fly off in one direction? Did the tank explode in the vehicle? Or did it fall off and then explode?
Biograd (Biograd)
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Username: Biograd

Post Number: 710
Registered: 6-2008
Posted on Sunday, March 21, 2010 - 8:43 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did the vehicle: take a sharp turn? At high speed? Or hit a bump? Get a flat tire? This Was the tank in the: trunk? Back seat? Front seat? No to all, see next Was the vehicle a car? It was a pickup truck Was the vehicle's roof destroyed? Well the whole vehicle was, but I was referring to another roof Or a garage roof? No Was the roof over the explosion? No Or did shrapnel fly some distance and hit the roof? Yesish Or did the vehicle drive onto the roof after the explosion? No Did (most of) the tank fly off in one direction? YES Did the tank explode in the vehicle? This Or did it fall off and then explode?
Biograd (Biograd)
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Username: Biograd

Post Number: 711
Registered: 6-2008
Posted on Sunday, March 21, 2010 - 8:44 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

You've got all the pieces now, just put it together!
Galfisk (Galfisk)
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Username: Galfisk

Post Number: 1469
Registered: 9-2009
Posted on Sunday, March 21, 2010 - 9:31 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Someone had found a discarded oxygen cylinder, and decided to make use of it for cutting gas. When they were filling it with oxygen the safety valve started to leak, so they blocked it and continued filling. The overfilled tank was transported on the back of a pickup truck when the truck suffered a flat tire. This jolted the tank, which exploded and destroyed the vehicle. Even though the oxygen contributed to the ferocity of the ensuing fire, the driver got away with his life (though probably not his hearing). The cylinder meanwhile flew off and went through the roof of a nearby building.
Biograd (Biograd)
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Username: Biograd

Post Number: 712
Registered: 6-2008
Posted on Monday, March 22, 2010 - 12:15 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

************Spoiler********************

Yes, Galfisk got it. Here is the link--be sure to check out the picture on page 15 that shows the trajectory of the cylinder.

http://www.elcosh.org/record/document/607/d000585.pdf
Galfisk (Galfisk)
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Username: Galfisk

Post Number: 1481
Registered: 9-2009
Posted on Monday, March 22, 2010 - 12:51 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Wow, they were lucky to survive. Plugging a cryogenic tank is even stupider, it needs to vent excess pressure as heat gets inside and the liquid slowly boils off.
If I understand the design correctly from the article, the tank required a vacuum to be present between the inner and outer walls as insulation, and this vacuum had been lost as well.
Indeed a sloppy attempt, by people who apparently didn't know the first thing about cryogenic tanks.
Thanks for an interesting puzzle!

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