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Nimue (Nimue)
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Post Number: 5563
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Posted on Tuesday, July 20, 2010 - 10:33 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Letitia is a life-long atheist, but her opinion of Ralph went way up when she learned he was a minister. How come?
Kdoc (Kdoc)
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Post Number: 1002
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Posted on Tuesday, July 20, 2010 - 10:46 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

did she previously have a very low opinion? neutral opinion? high opinion?

did her opinion change involve seeing him perform some action as well as learning his job? had he said something relevant before she learned?

when she learned, was the relevant thing that improved her opinion that she now thought him - clever? compassionate? educated? sincere? well dressed? kind? honourable? self disciplined? brave? altruistic? good looking? physically attractive? richer? more powerful? tolerant? artistically accomplished?

politics relevant? academic life?

is it relevant what type of minister he was? does the puzzle require him to be a christian minister? if so - a particular denomination?

is there relationship relevant? is he her client? she his? is there a romantic relationship? or a desire for one on her part? his?
are they strangers? relevant how long they have known each other?

are any of these relevant (about either of them): their hobbies? pets? families? education? age? physical appearance? wealth? place of residence?
Nimue (Nimue)
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Post Number: 5566
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Posted on Tuesday, July 20, 2010 - 11:17 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Kdoc (Kdoc)
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Posted on Tuesday, July 20, 2010 - 10:46 pm: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)
did she previously have a very low opinion? yesneutral opinion? nohigh opinion? no

did her opinion change involve seeing him perform some action as well as learning his job? no had he said something relevant before she learned? no

when she learned, was the relevant thing that improved her opinion that she now thought him - clever? nocompassionate? no educated? no sincere? no well dressed? noish kind? no honourable? yesish self disciplined? yope brave? noaltruistic? nogood looking? no physically attractive? noricher? nomore powerful? no tolerant? noartistically accomplished? no

politics relevant? no academic life? no

is it relevant what type of minister he was?There may be some types for which the puzzle would not work does the puzzle require him to be a christian minister? It would also work for a priest or a rabbi. I don't know about other religions if so - a particular denomination? Most Christian denominations would be ok

is there relationship relevant? nois he her client? possibly she his? dittois there a romantic relationship?irrel or a desire for one on her part? dittohis? ditto
are they strangers? possibly relevant how long they have known each other? no

are any of these relevant (about either of them): their hobbies? pets? families? education? age? physical appearance? wealth? place of residence? no to all
Balin (Balin)
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Post Number: 2161
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Posted on Tuesday, July 20, 2010 - 11:26 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is it something he believed that made her respect him more? Did she now see that the two of them shared something in common? Is social work relevant?

Are you Letitia?
Nimue (Nimue)
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Post Number: 5568
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Posted on Tuesday, July 20, 2010 - 11:36 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Balin (Balin)
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Posted on Tuesday, July 20, 2010 - 11:26 pm: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)
Is it something he believed that made her respect him more? noDid she now see that the two of them shared something in common? no Is social work relevant? no

Are you Letitia? no. This is not a true story.
Balin (Balin)
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Post Number: 2166
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Posted on Tuesday, July 20, 2010 - 11:49 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did she have a scrund? A false assumption? Did she think Ralph did something else for a living? Or did she just not know? Does Letitia know Ralph? Has she simply heard of him? Do they share mutual acquaintances?
Nimue (Nimue)
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Post Number: 5570
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Posted on Tuesday, July 20, 2010 - 11:53 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Balin (Balin)
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Post Number: 2166
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Posted on Tuesday, July 20, 2010 - 11:49 pm: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)
Did she have a scrund no A false assumption? yesDid she think Ralph did something else for a living? irrel Or did she just not know? possiblyDoes Letitia know Ralph? irrel Has she simply heard of him?irrel Do they share mutual acquaintances? probably
Balin (Balin)
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Post Number: 2168
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Posted on Wednesday, July 21, 2010 - 12:09 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Was the FA about a quality of Ralph's? Was it about Ralph, period?
Nimue (Nimue)
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Post Number: 5576
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Posted on Wednesday, July 21, 2010 - 12:41 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Balin (Balin)
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Posted on Wednesday, July 21, 2010 - 12:09 am: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)
Was the FA about a quality of Ralph's? yes Was it about Ralph, period? It was about something specific about him
It_so_happened (It_so_happened)
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Posted on Wednesday, July 21, 2010 - 6:49 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did she misinterpret something he did? Or said?
Did the FA involve any of the following:
Profession?
Nationality?
Age?
Religion?
Gender?
Morality/Ethics?
Interests?
Idealogical position?
A physical quality?
Nimue (Nimue)
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Post Number: 5578
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Posted on Wednesday, July 21, 2010 - 6:53 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

It_so_happened (It_so_happened)
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Posted on Wednesday, July 21, 2010 - 6:49 pm: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)
Did she misinterpret something he did?yope Or said? no
Did the FA involve any of the following:
Profession? Well, she assumed he wasn't a minister, but there's more to it than that!
Nationality? no
Age? no
Religion?see above
Gender? no
Morality/Ethics? yes
Interests? no
Idealogical position? no
A physical quality?yes or yesish
It_so_happened (It_so_happened)
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Post Number: 455
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Posted on Wednesday, July 21, 2010 - 7:14 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did she get this assumption by looking at him?
Is his manner of dress relevant?
An object that he had with him?

Did the area of morality in which she believed him lacking involve:
Sexuality?
His treatment of women? Children? People in general? Animals?
Pride?
A self-indulgent sin (such as laziness, gluttony, porn)?
Nimue (Nimue)
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Post Number: 5580
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Posted on Wednesday, July 21, 2010 - 7:22 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

It_so_happened (It_so_happened)
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Posted on Wednesday, July 21, 2010 - 7:14 pm: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)
Did she get this assumption by looking at him? no
Is his manner of dress relevant? yes
An object that he had with him? yesish

Did the area of morality in which she believed him lacking involve:
Sexuality? yes
His treatment of women? yes Children? no People in general? no Animals? no
Pride? no
A self-indulgent sin (such as laziness, gluttony, porn)? None of those, but the "sin" in question is self-indulgent
It_so_happened (It_so_happened)
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Post Number: 457
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Posted on Wednesday, July 21, 2010 - 7:46 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Prostitution relevant?
Rape?
Adultery?
Just general "sleeping around"?

Is a particular item of clothing relevant?
Nimue (Nimue)
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Post Number: 5581
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Posted on Wednesday, July 21, 2010 - 8:05 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

It_so_happened (It_so_happened)
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Posted on Wednesday, July 21, 2010 - 7:46 pm: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)
Prostitution relevant? no
Rape? possibly
Adultery? possibly
Just general "sleeping around"? possibly

Is a particular item of clothing relevant? yes. GOOOOOD question!!
It_so_happened (It_so_happened)
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Post Number: 458
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Posted on Wednesday, July 21, 2010 - 8:20 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Item of clothing:
Shirt? Pants? Shoes? Socks? Unerwear? Belt? Tie? Hat? Necklace? Ring? Earing? Jacket? Robe? White Collar (like some ministers/priests wear)? Tattoo?
If not any of those:
Something religious?
Something purely fashionable (jewelry, etc)?
Something for a particular type of weather?
Nimue (Nimue)
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Post Number: 5582
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Posted on Wednesday, July 21, 2010 - 8:29 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

It_so_happened (It_so_happened)
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Posted on Wednesday, July 21, 2010 - 8:20 pm: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)
Item of clothing:
Shirt? Pants? Shoes? Socks? Unerwear? Belt? Tie? Hat? Necklace? Ring? Earing? Jacket? Robe? White Collar (like some ministers/priests wear)? Tattoo? robe
If not any of those:
Something religious? yes--robe
Something purely fashionable (jewelry, etc)? no
Something for a particular type of weather? no
It_so_happened (It_so_happened)
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Post Number: 460
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Posted on Wednesday, July 21, 2010 - 8:34 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Was he wearing it at the time of her FA?
Or did he have it somewhere else?
Did she think it was a dress?
Balin (Balin)
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Posted on Wednesday, July 21, 2010 - 8:35 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Had she seen his robe? While he was wearing it? A picture of him wearing it? And she thought he was, say, a drag queen or something?
Nimue (Nimue)
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Posted on Wednesday, July 21, 2010 - 8:42 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

It_so_happened (It_so_happened)
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Posted on Wednesday, July 21, 2010 - 8:34 pm: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)
Was he wearing it at the time of her FA? irrel
Or did he have it somewhere else? ditto
Did she think it was a dress? no
Balin (Balin)
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Posted on Wednesday, July 21, 2010 - 8:35 pm: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)
Had she seen his robe? no While he was wearing it? no A picture of him wearing it? no And she thought he was, say, a drag queen or something? no
It_so_happened (It_so_happened)
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Posted on Wednesday, July 21, 2010 - 8:50 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

so whether or not she ever saw the robe is irrelevant, correct?
did she see anything at all that caused her to suspect him?
hear something, spoken or otherwise?
did his robe cause him to behave in a certain manner?
Nimue (Nimue)
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Posted on Wednesday, July 21, 2010 - 9:14 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

It_so_happened (It_so_happened)
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Posted on Wednesday, July 21, 2010 - 8:50 pm: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)
so whether or not she ever saw the robe is irrelevant, correct? No. It's it's relevant that she DIDN'T see it
did she see anything at all that caused her to suspect him? no
hear something, spoken or otherwise? yes: spoken
did his yesrobe cause him to behave in a certain manner?
Nimue (Nimue)
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Posted on Wednesday, July 21, 2010 - 9:16 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

BLOOPERRRRRRRRRRRRR ALLERTTTTTTT! The last past of the last post should be as follows:}so whether or not she ever saw the robe is irrelevant, correct? No. It's it's relevant that she DIDN'T see it.
did she see anything at all that caused her to suspect him? no
hear something, spoken or otherwise? yes: spoken
did his robe cause him to behave in a certain manner?yes
Kdoc (Kdoc)
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Posted on Wednesday, July 21, 2010 - 11:04 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

did she hear him say something? or someone else say something? that made her think he was sexually immoral in some way? sexually predatory? sexually promiscuous?
and was the thing that was said concerning a robe? or concerning a robe but sounding like something else?
did she then learn that he was a minister? and so the thing that she heard was put in correct context? and she reaslised she had misunderstood something? and so he was not guilty of that bad stuff after all?
the thing that was said - did it relate to some activity? to what someone thought? to someone's likes and dislikes?
Nimue (Nimue)
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Posted on Thursday, July 22, 2010 - 12:06 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Kdoc (Kdoc)
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Posted on Wednesday, July 21, 2010 - 11:04 pm: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)
did she hear him say something? no or someone else say something? yes that made her think he was sexually immoral in some way? yessexually predatory? yes sexually promiscuous? yes
and was the thing that was said concerning a robe? yesor concerning a robe but sounding like something else? yes
did she then learn that he was a minister? yes and so the thing that she heard was put in correct context? yes and she reaslised she had misunderstood something? yes and so he was not guilty of that bad stuff after all? yes
the thing that was said - did it relate to some activity? yes to what someone thought? no to someone's likes and dislikes?no
Biograd (Biograd)
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Posted on Thursday, July 22, 2010 - 12:23 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Was it something like he couldn't keep his belt on or his zipper zipped? which sounded like it was metaphorical in terms of lack of sexual restraint, but it really was referring to a literal "wardrobe malfunction" due to his robe?
Nimue (Nimue)
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Posted on Thursday, July 22, 2010 - 12:36 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Biograd (Biograd)
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Posted on Thursday, July 22, 2010 - 12:23 am: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)
Was it something like he couldn't keep his belt on or his zipper zipped? nowhich sounded like it was metaphorical in terms of lack of sexual restraint, but it really was referring to a literal "wardrobe malfunction" due to his robe? no, but you're very very ORT
Balin (Balin)
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Posted on Thursday, July 22, 2010 - 2:53 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Was the thing said related to his job as a minister? But it sounded sexual?
Jenburdoo (Jenburdoo)
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Posted on Thursday, July 22, 2010 - 3:29 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Could Letitia be said to admire Ralph?

Did she think he was a monk? Was he?
Kdoc (Kdoc)
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Posted on Thursday, July 22, 2010 - 11:43 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

did she hear someone say something that made her think he was taking off his clothes inappropriately? that he was undressing?

is a synonym for clerical robes relevant? vestment? cassock? surplice?

is it relevant that ministers wear trousers under their robes so are not in fact 'indecently dressed' if they take their robes off in public?

had she thought he was a flasher?
Ohlala8 (Ohlala8)
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Posted on Thursday, July 22, 2010 - 3:42 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Anything to do with getting the robe dry cleaned?
Nimue (Nimue)
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Posted on Friday, July 23, 2010 - 7:14 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Balin (Balin)
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Posted on Thursday, July 22, 2010 - 2:53 am: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)
Was the thing said related to his job as a minister? yesishBut it sounded sexual? yes
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Posted on Thursday, July 22, 2010 - 3:29 am: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)
Could Letitia be said to admire Ralph? irrel

Did she think he was a monk? no Was he? no
Kdoc (Kdoc)
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Posted on Thursday, July 22, 2010 - 11:43 am: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)
did she hear someone say something that made her think he was taking off his clothes inappropriately? yesthat he was undressing? yes

is a synonym for clerical robes relevant? novestment? cassock? surplice?

is it relevant that ministers wear trousers under their robes so are not in fact 'indecently dressed' if they take their robes off in public? yesish

had she thought he was a flasher? possibly
Ohlala8 (Ohlala8)
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Posted on Thursday, July 22, 2010 - 3:42 pm: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)
Anything to do with getting the robe dry cleaned? no
Kdoc (Kdoc)
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Posted on Friday, July 23, 2010 - 7:53 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

did someone say he was undressing in the church? in some other relevant place?

Was the scenario like this:

person X to Letitia: Ralph is taking his clothes off/undressing in the church!
Letitia think: my goodness - a sexual deviant!
Person X: he's the minister
Letitia thinks: thank goodness for that - he's just taking his robes off!

(don't think I'd ever make it as a screenwriter)
Nimue (Nimue)
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Posted on Friday, July 23, 2010 - 9:23 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Kdoc (Kdoc)
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Posted on Friday, July 23, 2010 - 7:53 pm: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)
did someone say he was undressing in the church? yopein some other relevant place? ditto

Was the scenario like this:

person X to Letitia: Ralph is taking his clothes off/undressing in the church!
Letitia think: my goodness - a sexual deviant!
Person X: he's the minister
Letitia thinks: thank goodness for that - he's just taking his robes off! That's not quite it, but you're VERY ORT

(don't think I'd ever make it as a screenwriter)
Biograd (Biograd)
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Posted on Sunday, July 25, 2010 - 5:41 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is the word "disrobe" relevant?
Balin (Balin)
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Posted on Sunday, July 25, 2010 - 4:46 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

What about "defrock"?
Nimue (Nimue)
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Posted on Sunday, July 25, 2010 - 7:23 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Biograd (Biograd)
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Posted on Sunday, July 25, 2010 - 5:41 am: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)
Is the word "disrobe" relevant?yes!!
Balin (Balin)
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Posted on Sunday, July 25, 2010 - 4:46 pm: Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)
What about "defrock"? "Disrobe' is better

*** SPOILER ***********
When Letetia overheard Zinnia say, "Ralph and I went into his office, and the first thing he did was disrobe," L. assumed that meant R. had undressed and was hitting on one of his clients. When she learned that R. was a minister, she realized that he was just taking off his clerical robe, under which he was, presumably, fully dressed. Thanks for solving it, Balin, and please see my new puzzle you know where.
Balin (Balin)
New member
Username: Balin

Post Number: 2271
Registered: 4-2010
Posted on Sunday, July 25, 2010 - 8:01 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Great puzzle!

Although I didn't solve it; Biograd did.
Nimue (Nimue)
New member
Username: Nimue

Post Number: 5623
Registered: 8-2001
Posted on Sunday, July 25, 2010 - 8:47 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

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