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Jondahr (Jondahr)
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Post Number: 42
Registered: 9-2013
Posted on Wednesday, October 02, 2013 - 5:29 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Jeniffer hadn't done anything wrong, but even if she could convince the police of that, she would still have helped a criminal get away.
Doriana (Doriana)
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Post Number: 6
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Posted on Wednesday, October 02, 2013 - 7:53 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Jennifer = H/A/F?
a criminal = H/A/M? F?

Did she know she had helped a criminal get away? Did she know the criminal?

Had the criminal committed murder? manslaughter? assault? battery? rape? kidnapping? theft? robbery? burglary? property damage? a drug-related crime? a white collar crime?
Psydkik (Psydkik)
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Post Number: 71
Registered: 9-2013
Posted on Wednesday, October 02, 2013 - 8:04 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did Jeniffer's parents misspell her name deliberately? ;-)

The 'that' in the question, it refers to 'Jeniffer not having done anything wrong'?

"Jeniffer" = "she" = "she"?

Did Jeniffer see the criminal? Did she know he/she/it was a criminal?
Jondahr (Jondahr)
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Post Number: 43
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Posted on Wednesday, October 02, 2013 - 10:40 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Jennifer = H/A/F? yes
a criminal = H/A/M? F? HAF, but could just as well have been a guy

Did she know she had helped a criminal get away? Did she know the criminal? no and no

Had the criminal committed murder? manslaughter? assault? battery? rape? kidnapping? theft? this robbery? burglary? property damage? a drug-related crime? a white collar crime?



Did Jeniffer's parents misspell her name deliberately? ;-) nope, that's all on me, as is the shifty grammar of that puzzle statement - my brain is evidently shutting down. Please feel free to spell her name correctly in your questions - I'm sure she would like that

The 'that' in the question, it refers to 'Jeniffer not having done anything wrong'? yes

"Jeniffer" = "she" = "she"? yes

Did Jeniffer see the criminal? yes Did she know he/she/it was a criminal? no
Doriana (Doriana)
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Post Number: 12
Registered: 9-2013
Posted on Thursday, October 03, 2013 - 12:05 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Location relevant? If so, indoors? outdoors? private residence? public building? If the latter, shop? supermarket? school? government building? museum? theatre? gym? office? hospital?

Relevant what the thief stole? Did she steal whatever she stole from Jennifer? from someone else?
Yojimbo (Yojimbo)
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Post Number: 42
Registered: 9-2013
Posted on Thursday, October 03, 2013 - 12:10 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did "Jeniffer" [I like her weird name spelling, but can go either way, and likely will go both -- my nephew's name is spelled "Jeffery"] assist the criminal by being an inadvertent getaway driver? Is the perpetrator hitchhiking? Did Jennifer give her bus or car fare? Loan her a bicycle?
Did she physically assist the perpetrator in any way?
And, um, did they know each other?
Jondahr (Jondahr)
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Post Number: 45
Registered: 9-2013
Posted on Thursday, October 03, 2013 - 6:39 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Location relevant? very much so If so, indoors? mostly this outdoors? private residence? public building? If the latter, shop? and mostly this supermarket? school? government building? museum? theatre? gym? office? hospital?

There is a bit of "outside" involved as well, but I think you would probably be better off concentrating on the inside.

Relevant what the thief stole? yope Did she steal whatever she stole from Jennifer? no from someone else? so yes


Did "Jeniffer" [I like her weird name spelling, but can go either way, and likely will go both -- my nephew's name is spelled "Jeffery" I actually know a lot of people with weird spelled versions of ordinary names, so it seems our heroine is in good company ;)] assist the criminal by being an inadvertent getaway driver? no Is the perpetrator hitchhiking? no Did Jennifer give her bus or car fare? Loan her a bicycle? no, nothing like this
Did she physically assist the perpetrator in any way? yesish or yope, depends on how you define "physically"
And, um, did they know each other? Jennifer and the criminal? No.
Amol (Amol)
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Post Number: 82
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Posted on Thursday, October 03, 2013 - 8:55 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Was a vehicle involved ? Was the thief driving it ? Was Jennifer ? Did the thief steal a vehicle ?

Was Jennifer an employee in the shop ? Did she sell something to the thief ? Something to do with a vehicle ? Did she advise her about something ? Did the thief steal something from the shop ? Shoplifting ?

Did Jennifer remove some obstacle from the path of the thief ? Did she open a door ? Did she think she was helping a person in need ?
Jondahr (Jondahr)
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Post Number: 47
Registered: 9-2013
Posted on Thursday, October 03, 2013 - 10:05 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Posted on Thursday, October 03, 2013 - 8:55 am:
Was a vehicle involved ? Was the thief driving it ? Was Jennifer ? Did the thief steal a vehicle ? no vehicle is relevant

Was Jennifer an employee in the shop ? no Did she sell something to the thief ? no Something to do with a vehicle ? no vehicle relevant whatsoever Did she advise her about something ? no Did the thief steal something from the shop ? yes Shoplifting ? but this goes way beyond shoplifting

Did Jennifer remove some obstacle from the path of the thief ? stretching the term "obstacle" a bit, yes Did she open a door ? but no Did she think she was helping a person in need ? no
Plebeian (Plebeian)
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Post Number: 887
Registered: 7-2006
Posted on Thursday, October 03, 2013 - 11:11 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did Jennifer cause the shop door (or a window) to be opened, allowing the thief in? Or out?
Type of shop relevant? High value items, e.g. jewels? Or single expensive items, e.g. car?
Jondahr (Jondahr)
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Post Number: 48
Registered: 9-2013
Posted on Thursday, October 03, 2013 - 1:20 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did Jennifer cause the shop door (or a window) to be opened, allowing the thief in? Or out? no
Type of shop relevant? absolutely High value items, e.g. jewels? Or single expensive items, e.g. car? both, really, but our criminal got away with one single expensive item
Plebeian (Plebeian)
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Post Number: 890
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Posted on Thursday, October 03, 2013 - 2:22 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Would it help to discover what the item stolen was?
(I assume a car was not OTRT).
Something which could be carried reasonably easily by a single person?
Or something heavy enough to need more than one to lift?
Yojimbo (Yojimbo)
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Post Number: 58
Registered: 9-2013
Posted on Thursday, October 03, 2013 - 4:09 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did the perpetrator steal from the shop when it was open for business, or after hours?
did the shop sell electronics? jewelry? firearms?
Psydkik (Psydkik)
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Post Number: 91
Registered: 9-2013
Posted on Thursday, October 03, 2013 - 4:10 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did Jeniffer do something (legal, but...) which distracted or blocked police so that they weren't able to catch the criminal?
Jondahr (Jondahr)
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Post Number: 50
Registered: 9-2013
Posted on Thursday, October 03, 2013 - 4:13 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Would it help to discover what the item stolen was? quite possibly
(I assume a car was not OTRT). no, as I have insisted repeatedly, no vehicle is relevant in any way
Something which could be carried reasonably easily by a single person? absolutely
Or something heavy enough to need more than one to lift? that would be one weak thief
Yojimbo (Yojimbo)
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Post Number: 61
Registered: 9-2013
Posted on Thursday, October 03, 2013 - 4:24 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

would the item fit in the thief's pocket?
Psydkik (Psydkik)
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Post Number: 98
Registered: 9-2013
Posted on Thursday, October 03, 2013 - 9:06 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Don't forget to come back to Yojimbo's and my questions - I think we must have posted them while you were replying to Plebeian earlier :-)
Yojimbo (Yojimbo)
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Post Number: 66
Registered: 9-2013
Posted on Friday, October 04, 2013 - 1:26 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Does the stolen item involve precious or semi-precious metals? Something highly collectible?
Did Jennifer interact with the police at all?
and yes, please, see previous Qs
Jondahr (Jondahr)
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Post Number: 51
Registered: 9-2013
Posted on Friday, October 04, 2013 - 8:18 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did the perpetrator steal from the shop when it was open for business this, or after hours?
did the shop sell electronics? jewelry? firearms? none of these


Did Jeniffer do something (legal, but...) which distracted or blocked police so that they weren't able to catch the criminal? yesish or yope, somewhat OTRT

would the item fit in the thief's pocket? no


Does the stolen item involve precious or semi-precious metals? probably not Something highly collectible? some people would certainly think so, but I think this line of reasoning will lead you astray


Did Jennifer interact with the police at all? yes, as the puzzle implies she does have to convince them of something
and yes, please, see previous Qs I hope I caught all of them.
Amol (Amol)
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Post Number: 87
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Posted on Friday, October 04, 2013 - 8:59 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Was it a holdup ? Did the thief steal cash ?

Was Jennifer a customer in the shop ? Did she think (at the time) that the thief was another customer ? an employee of the shop ?

Did the thief interact with Jennifer ? Talk to her ? Did he interact with her in particular ? Or anyone else in her place would have been OK ?
Psydkik (Psydkik)
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Post Number: 107
Registered: 9-2013
Posted on Friday, October 04, 2013 - 9:31 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Were police at the scene of the crime before the crime took place?

Were they called to the scene by a victim or witness?

Did the police think Jeniffer was doing something illegal?
Jondahr (Jondahr)
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Username: Jondahr

Post Number: 52
Registered: 9-2013
Posted on Friday, October 04, 2013 - 2:52 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Was it a holdup ? no Did the thief steal cash ? no

Was Jennifer a customer in the shop ? yes Did she think (at the time) that the thief was another customer ? and yes! an employee of the shop ?

Did the thief interact with Jennifer ? in a way... Talk to her ? no Did he interact with her in particular ? Or anyone else in her place would have been OK ? anyone could in theory have worked, but There was something about Jennifer on that occasion that mase her a good target


Were police at the scene of the crime before the crime took place? no, but......

Were they called to the scene by a victim or witness? not exactly... (Though I guess you could call this person a "witness" as well, but it wasn't his primary function)

Did the police think Jeniffer was doing something illegal? yes!!
Amol (Amol)
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Post Number: 89
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Posted on Friday, October 04, 2013 - 7:49 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did the thief take help from Jennifer ? Without asking her ? Did she drop something in Jennifer's bag ?

Is Jennifer's profession relevant ? Was she a police ?

Did the thief herself call the police ?
Psydkik (Psydkik)
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Post Number: 116
Registered: 9-2013
Posted on Saturday, October 05, 2013 - 12:54 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did the police, as a result of dealing with what they thought was Jeniffer doing something illegal, miss an opportunity to catch the criminal that they would otherwise have been able to take?

Was Jeniffer's illegal-looking act something that was caused by the criminal in some way?
- on purpose?
- by mistake?

Were the police called to the scene by a member of shop staff? By the criminal himself?!
Jondahr (Jondahr)
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Post Number: 57
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Posted on Saturday, October 05, 2013 - 10:23 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did the thief take help from Jennifer ? Without asking her ? indeed Did she drop something in Jennifer's bag ? YES! Well done!

Is Jennifer's profession relevant ? Was she a police ? no and no

Did the thief herself call the police ? no, but good thinking, and in a strange way somewhat OTRT


Did the police, as a result of dealing with what they thought was Jeniffer doing something illegal, miss an opportunity to catch the criminal that they would otherwise have been able to take? yes!

Was Jeniffer's illegal-looking act something that was caused by the criminal in some way?
- on purpose? yes indeed
- by mistake?

Were the police called to the scene by a member of shop staff? yes By the criminal himself?! see above
Amol (Amol)
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Post Number: 90
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Posted on Saturday, October 05, 2013 - 10:29 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

So the thief dropped something in Jennifer's bag... Was that the object she wanted to steal ? Did she plan to steal something else ? And just wanted to distract the shop staff / police ?

Did the thief point out Jennifer to the shop staff ? Who then called the police ?
Jondahr (Jondahr)
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Post Number: 59
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Posted on Saturday, October 05, 2013 - 2:49 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

So the thief dropped something in Jennifer's bag... Was that the object she wanted to steal ? no, a different object entirely Did she plan to steal something else ? yes And just wanted to distract the shop staff / police ? exactly

Did the thief point out Jennifer to the shop staff ? but no Who then called the police ? but the staff eventually called the police, yes
Psydkik (Psydkik)
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Post Number: 129
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Posted on Saturday, October 05, 2013 - 4:13 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did the staff member call the police because:
- (s)he thought Jeniffer was doing something illegal?
- (s)he thought the Criminal was doing something illegal?
- (s)he thought the police were required for some other reason?

(for the above read 'doing' as 'doing or about to be doing' because I guess shoplifting isn't technically a crime until you leave the shop, which presumably they hadn't at the time the police were called)
Jondahr (Jondahr)
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Post Number: 60
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Posted on Saturday, October 05, 2013 - 8:11 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Psydkik (Psydkik)

Did the staff member call the police because:
- (s)he thought Jeniffer was doing something illegal? this, no to the others
- (s)he thought the Criminal was doing something illegal?
- (s)he thought the police were required for some other reason?
Amol (Amol)
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Post Number: 91
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Posted on Sunday, October 06, 2013 - 7:36 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Are shop alarms relevant ?
Jondahr (Jondahr)
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Post Number: 61
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Posted on Sunday, October 06, 2013 - 8:58 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Are shop alarms relevant ? Very much so!! Good thinking!
Amol (Amol)
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Post Number: 95
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Posted on Sunday, October 06, 2013 - 2:54 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

So when an alarm goes off, the relevant customer is stopped and searched ?

Is the alarm turned off for a short time (before turning it on again) ? Is this time window used by our thief to leave without sounding an alarm ?

Or is it that everyone focuses on the first alarm, and the thief can get away even if she has set an alarm off herself ?
King_louie2 (King_louie2)
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Post Number: 27
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Posted on Sunday, October 06, 2013 - 3:42 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Or..... The thief leaves right on her heels so there is only a single alarm.
Psydkik (Psydkik)
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Post Number: 144
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Posted on Monday, October 07, 2013 - 8:51 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Are we talking about a burglar alarm for the shop as a whole?
Or one of those sensor things at the doorway that checks whether you're leaving with something that's been security-tagged?
Jondahr (Jondahr)
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Post Number: 63
Registered: 9-2013
Posted on Saturday, October 12, 2013 - 8:07 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

So when an alarm goes off, the relevant customer is stopped and searched ? yes

Is the alarm turned off for a short time (before turning it on again) ? Is this time window used by our thief to leave without sounding an alarm ? not quite...

Or is it that everyone focuses on the first alarm, and the thief can get away even if she has set an alarm off herself ? you are getting there, but...


Or..... The thief leaves right on her heels so there is only a single alarm. DING DING DING - we have a winner!!


Are we talking about a burglar alarm for the shop as a whole?
Or one of those sensor things at the doorway that checks whether you're leaving with something that's been security-tagged? this one!


I think this is more than sufficient forme to post a...


******SPOILER******

Jennifer was browsing at an expensive clothes store. At the same store, a thief (let's call her Michelle) was planning on stealing a very expensive dress. However, the store has an automatic alarm at the door which will go off if any security tagged clothes are removed from the store. To be able to carry out her crime, Michelle first sneaks the dress into her own bag and then puts a pair of gloves into Jennifer's bag (which happens to be open). She then waits around until Jennifer exits. The alarm goes off, and the security guard stops her. Michelle seizes the opportunity to exit while the alarm is still sounding. Since the alarm can't go off twice at the same time, and since everyone's eyes were on Jennifer, Michelle is able to exit and get away with the dress, while Jennifer has to answer for trying to steal a pair of gloves she never touched.


Well played everyone! Especially congrats to Amol for getting on the right track and to King Louie for nailing it! :-)

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