[WiZ] To the vanquished belong the sp... Log Out | Topics | Search
Moderators | Register | Edit Profile

Lateral Puzzles » Solved Lateral Thinking Puzzles » Solved Puzzles - November 2013 » [WiZ] To the vanquished belong the spoils « Previous Next »

Author Message
Wizardofnz (Wizardofnz)
New member
Username: Wizardofnz

Post Number: 721
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Tuesday, October 22, 2013 - 11:46 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Quickie while I think of something more taxing. Early spoliers, do the considerate thing.

Two men are fighting each other. The first man kills the second man. The assembled crowd unanimously agree that the second man won the fight. Why?
Psydkik (Psydkik)
New member
Username: Psydkik

Post Number: 405
Registered: 9-2013
Posted on Wednesday, October 23, 2013 - 12:56 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I've e-mailed a possible spoiler, so I'll come back and ask some questions once I've found out that it's wrong ;-)
Wizardofnz (Wizardofnz)
New member
Username: Wizardofnz

Post Number: 722
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Wednesday, October 23, 2013 - 12:59 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

You are incorrect, but in a most interesting way. Fire away with your questions!
Balin (Balin)
New member
Username: Balin

Post Number: 131
Registered: 9-2013
Posted on Wednesday, October 23, 2013 - 4:58 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is their mode of fighting relevant? Is this a war? A competition? Boxing? Wrestling?
Relevant when/where this takes place?
True story? FYOI? FSEI?
Psydkik (Psydkik)
New member
Username: Psydkik

Post Number: 406
Registered: 9-2013
Posted on Wednesday, October 23, 2013 - 9:59 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Was this a fight to the death?

The fight ended when the death occurred? Some time before the death occurred? Some time after?

Did Mr First kill Mr Second during the fight?

The men are human males?

If I called the two men Jack and Harry, would the following statement be correct:
Jack and Harry are fighting each other. Jack kills Harry. The assembled crowd unanimously agree that Harry won the fight. ?
Redwine (Redwine)
New member
Username: Redwine

Post Number: 407
Registered: 10-2013
Posted on Wednesday, October 23, 2013 - 8:34 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Could the second man have killed the first man, if he had wanted to? Does the puzzle take place on the Far East?
Wizardofnz (Wizardofnz)
New member
Username: Wizardofnz

Post Number: 724
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Wednesday, October 23, 2013 - 9:21 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Balin:

Is their mode of fighting relevant? yes Is this a war? A competition? this Boxing? yope Wrestling? yope
Relevant when/where this takes place? yes
True story? this FYOI? FSEI?

Psydkik:

Was this a fight to the death? not intentionally

The fight ended when the death occurred? no Some time before the death occurred? yes Some time after? no

Did Mr First kill Mr Second during the fight? the result of the fight would have been agreed upon before the death occurred

The men are human males? yes

If I called the two men Jack and Harry, would the following statement be correct:
Jack and Harry are fighting each other. Jack kills Harry. The assembled crowd unanimously agree that Harry won the fight. ? correct

Redwine:

Could the second man have killed the first man, if he had wanted to? he was physically able to do so Does the puzzle take place on the Far East? no
Balin (Balin)
New member
Username: Balin

Post Number: 135
Registered: 9-2013
Posted on Wednesday, October 23, 2013 - 10:41 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I had a suspicion from the start and the answers so far seem to support it. Email sent.
Wizardofnz (Wizardofnz)
New member
Username: Wizardofnz

Post Number: 732
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Wednesday, October 23, 2013 - 10:55 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Your suspicions are correct.
Psydkik (Psydkik)
New member
Username: Psydkik

Post Number: 422
Registered: 9-2013
Posted on Thursday, October 24, 2013 - 12:36 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

After the fight ended, but before Mr Second was killed...
...did the crowd agree Mr Second had won?
...did the crowd agree Mr First had won?
...had the crowd not made up their mind yet?

Was the time between the end of the fight and the death of Mr Second less than 10 minutes? Less than an hour? Less than a day? Less than a week?

Did Mr Second die from wounds received in the fight?
Wizardofnz (Wizardofnz)
New member
Username: Wizardofnz

Post Number: 733
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Thursday, October 24, 2013 - 12:47 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

After the fight ended, but before Mr Second was killed...
...did the crowd agree Mr Second had won? yes
...did the crowd agree Mr First had won? no
...had the crowd not made up their mind yet? no

Was the time between the end of the fight and the death of Mr Second less than 10 minutes? yes Less than an hour? Less than a day? Less than a week? consequently, yes to all

Did Mr Second die from wounds received in the fight? He died due to being wounded in the fight - but I think you're suggesting something far more gradual than what happened.
Wizardofnz (Wizardofnz)
New member
Username: Wizardofnz

Post Number: 734
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Thursday, October 24, 2013 - 12:48 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

In fact, I think 'no' would be the best response to the last question.
Redwine (Redwine)
New member
Username: Redwine

Post Number: 414
Registered: 10-2013
Posted on Thursday, October 24, 2013 - 8:29 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did Mr Second die of poison? Commit suicide?
Wizardofnz (Wizardofnz)
New member
Username: Wizardofnz

Post Number: 743
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Thursday, October 24, 2013 - 8:31 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did Mr Second die of poison? Commit suicide? neither
Redwine (Redwine)
New member
Username: Redwine

Post Number: 442
Registered: 10-2013
Posted on Thursday, October 24, 2013 - 8:48 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

If Mr First had won the fight, would then Mr Second still have died?
Wizardofnz (Wizardofnz)
New member
Username: Wizardofnz

Post Number: 752
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Thursday, October 24, 2013 - 8:58 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

If Mr First had won the fight, would then Mr Second still have died? Unlikely, although he would have been badly injured.
Redwine (Redwine)
New member
Username: Redwine

Post Number: 446
Registered: 10-2013
Posted on Thursday, October 24, 2013 - 9:05 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did they use weapons in the fight? If yes, were these fire arms? White weapons?
Was the fight organized? If no, is it relevant why were they fighting?
Did Mr Second achieve the purpose of the fight?
Are their professions relevant?
Wizardofnz (Wizardofnz)
New member
Username: Wizardofnz

Post Number: 756
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Thursday, October 24, 2013 - 9:22 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did they use weapons in the fight? no If yes, were these fire arms? White weapons? n/a
Was the fight organized? yes If no, is it relevant why were they fighting? n/a
Did Mr Second achieve the purpose of the fight? yes
Are their professions relevant? yes
Psydkik (Psydkik)
New member
Username: Psydkik

Post Number: 441
Registered: 9-2013
Posted on Thursday, October 24, 2013 - 9:35 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

So Mr Second suffered a mortal injury during the fight?

Was this injury inflicted by Mr First? Intentionally? Just the way he intended? Or did he shoot a bullet that bounced off a lamppost and a drainpipe before hitting Mr Second by mistake?
ke?

Did Mr Second win because Mr Second fought better? Or because Mr First was disqualified?
Were there rules to the fight that Mr First broke?
Wizardofnz (Wizardofnz)
New member
Username: Wizardofnz

Post Number: 758
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Thursday, October 24, 2013 - 9:39 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

So Mr Second suffered a mortal injury yes during the fight? strictly speaking, no

Was this injury inflicted by Mr First? yes Intentionally? no Just the way he intended? no Or did he shoot a bullet that bounced off a lamppost and a drainpipe before hitting Mr Second by mistake? this is an amusing thought, given the scenario. No, this isn't the solution.
ke? Kevin Grivois is not relevant to the solution.

Did Mr Second win because Mr Second fought better? yes Or because Mr First was disqualified? no
Were there rules to the fight that Mr First broke? no rules were broken by either man
Psydkik (Psydkik)
New member
Username: Psydkik

Post Number: 446
Registered: 9-2013
Posted on Friday, October 25, 2013 - 12:36 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Was the winner of the fight determined by a simple "Mr First or Mr Second" decision? Or based on a points tally during the fight?

Mr Second suffered a mortal injury?
And this injury, which later killed him, was initially inflicted before the fight started? during the fight? after the fight ended?

And this injury was caused by Mr First:
- punching him with a hand?
- kicking him with a foot or leg?
- hitting him with an arm?
- jumping on top of him and crushing him?
- headbutting him?
- tripping him over?
- pushing him?
- breaking his heart by telling him he didn't love him?

Did the injury draw blood?

Was the murder 'weapon' some part of Mr First himself? Or was there some other item involved?
Wizardofnz (Wizardofnz)
New member
Username: Wizardofnz

Post Number: 764
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Friday, October 25, 2013 - 1:16 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Was the winner of the fight determined by a simple "Mr First or Mr Second" decision? yes, it was a binary affair Or based on a points tally during the fight? no

Mr Second suffered a mortal injury? yes
And this injury, which later killed him, was initially inflicted before the fight started? noduring the fight? after the fight ended? yes

And this injury was caused by Mr First:
- punching him with a hand?
- kicking him with a foot or leg?
- hitting him with an arm?
- jumping on top of him and crushing him?
- headbutting him?
- tripping him over?
- pushing him? none of the above.
- breaking his heart by telling him he didn't love him? He must have had a heart of ice. Which eventually melted, leaving a man dead... Hmm. I think we've discovered a new spin on a classic.

Did the injury draw blood? not relevantly!

Was the murder 'weapon' some part of Mr First himself? yes Or was there some other item involved? no
Redwine (Redwine)
New member
Username: Redwine

Post Number: 453
Registered: 10-2013
Posted on Friday, October 25, 2013 - 8:50 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did Mr First suffer from a relevant medical condition?
Was Mr Second's injury visible from outside? Would it be visible if Mr Second was naked?
Alexanderhamilton (Alexanderhamilton)
New member
Username: Alexanderhamilton

Post Number: 205
Registered: 9-2013
Posted on Friday, October 25, 2013 - 8:38 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

The where:
Does this take place in Europe? North America? South America? Asia? Australia? Africa? At sea? Does the country still exist?

The when: Does this take place in BC? Does in take place between 0-500 AD? 501-1000 AD? 1000-1500 AD? The 1500's? 1600's? 1700's? 1800's? 1900's? 2000's?
Wizardofnz (Wizardofnz)
New member
Username: Wizardofnz

Post Number: 766
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Saturday, October 26, 2013 - 7:31 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Redwine:

Did Mr First suffer from a relevant medical condition? no
Was Mr Second's injury visible from outside? there would probably have been some visible trace, but most of the damage would be unseen Would it be visible if Mr Second was naked? yes, as above

AlexanderHamilton:

The where:
Does this take place in Europe? this North America? South America? Asia? Australia? Africa? At sea? Does the country still exist? yes

The when: Does this take place in BC? this Does in take place between 0-500 AD? 501-1000 AD? 1000-1500 AD? The 1500's? 1600's? 1700's? 1800's? 1900's? 2000's?
Redwine (Redwine)
New member
Username: Redwine

Post Number: 495
Registered: 10-2013
Posted on Saturday, October 26, 2013 - 11:22 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

As a result of Mr Second winning the fight, did Mr First die? Were they gladiators?
Psydkik (Psydkik)
New member
Username: Psydkik

Post Number: 472
Registered: 9-2013
Posted on Saturday, October 26, 2013 - 11:58 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

So Mr First and Mr Second had a fight.
Mr Second won the fight.
Then Mr First injured Mr Second.
Then Mr Second died from that injury.
Is that in the right order?

So the answer to the original question is that the reason Mr Second was declared winner of the fight was because Mr Second won the fight?

And the later injury and death was a separate, later event that was not part of the fight?
Wizardofnz (Wizardofnz)
New member
Username: Wizardofnz

Post Number: 768
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Monday, October 28, 2013 - 9:53 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Redwine:

As a result of Mr Second winning the fight, did Mr First die? no Were they gladiators? no

Psydkik:

So Mr First and Mr Second had a fight.
Mr Second won the fight.
Then Mr First injured Mr Second.
Then Mr Second died from that injury.
Is that in the right order? Items 1 and 4 are in the correct order

So the answer to the original question is that the reason Mr Second was declared winner of the fight was because Mr Second won the fight? yes

And the later injury and death was a separate, later event that was not part of the fight? incorrect
Redwine (Redwine)
New member
Username: Redwine

Post Number: 561
Registered: 10-2013
Posted on Monday, October 28, 2013 - 10:26 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is the correct order:
Mr First and Mr Second had a fight.
Then Mr First injured Mr Second during a fight.
Mr Second won the fight.
Then Mr Second died from that injury?

Were these men soldiers? Did they fight on their own behalf? As representatives of armies? As representatives of nations? Could they have chosen not to fight?
Wizardofnz (Wizardofnz)
New member
Username: Wizardofnz

Post Number: 772
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Tuesday, October 29, 2013 - 12:43 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is the correct order:
Mr First and Mr Second had a fight.
Then Mr First injured Mr Second during a fight.
Mr Second won the fight.
Then Mr Second died from that injury? In the interest of avoiding contradicting myself, I will say for the puzzle's sake that the last 3 items on the list happened more or less simultaneously.

Were these men soldiers? no Did they fight on their own behalf? yes As representatives of armies? As representatives of nations? and yes Could they have chosen not to fight? yes
Alexanderhamilton (Alexanderhamilton)
New member
Username: Alexanderhamilton

Post Number: 209
Registered: 9-2013
Posted on Tuesday, October 29, 2013 - 2:37 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

So they fought on their own AND as representatives of their nations? Is this some sort of sporting event? Are the ancient Olympics relevant? Relevant of not, was this event ever part of the modern Olympics? Or is this whole thing more of a David and Goliath type situation?

Is this taking place in ancient Greece? Macedonia? Cyprus? Some other European nation before Christ that still exists?
Redwine (Redwine)
New member
Username: Redwine

Post Number: 585
Registered: 10-2013
Posted on Tuesday, October 29, 2013 - 3:49 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Do we have a record of this fight in the Bible? In Greek mythology? in Roman mythology? Other mythology?
Wizardofnz (Wizardofnz)
New member
Username: Wizardofnz

Post Number: 774
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Tuesday, October 29, 2013 - 7:53 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Alexanderhamilton:

So they fought on their own AND as representatives of their nations? correct Is this some sort of sporting event? yes Are the ancient Olympics relevant? and yes Relevant of not, was this event ever part of the modern Olympics? no. perhaps because this very sort of thing occured. Or is this whole thing more of a David and Goliath type situation? no

Is this taking place in ancient Greece? yes Macedonia? Cyprus? Some other European nation before Christ that still exists? no

Redwine:

Do we have a record of this fight in the Bible? In Greek mythology? in Roman mythology? Other mythology? no to all - this is generally considered to be factual by scholars
Alexanderhamilton (Alexanderhamilton)
New member
Username: Alexanderhamilton

Post Number: 215
Registered: 9-2013
Posted on Tuesday, October 29, 2013 - 8:18 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Does the sport involve boxing AND wrestling? Would it be fair to say the event was some sort of ancient MMA, without any real restrictions on fighting styles?

Did the second man win because the first man disqualified himself? Did he cheat? Did he break a rule? Was the rule simply "no killing?" Or did he do an illegal action?
Wizardofnz (Wizardofnz)
New member
Username: Wizardofnz

Post Number: 777
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Tuesday, October 29, 2013 - 8:23 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Does the sport involve boxing AND wrestling? yes! Would it be fair to say the event was some sort of ancient MMA, without any real restrictions on fighting styles? that would be fair

Did the second man win because the first man disqualified himself? no, in the sense that he didn't break any rules or use an illegal move Did he cheat? no Did he break a rule? Was the rule simply "no killing?" Or did he do an illegal action? no to the rest. Suffice it to say that the second man won the fight on his own merit.
Alexanderhamilton (Alexanderhamilton)
New member
Username: Alexanderhamilton

Post Number: 216
Registered: 9-2013
Posted on Tuesday, October 29, 2013 - 8:34 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did the second man win the Olympic event? Did he win in a more abstract sense? Did he "win" by ending up in Elysium, for example?

Is Greek culture or religion relevant?

If the first man had pummeled the second man within an inch of his life and than stopped, would the second man still have won? Is the second man's death necessary for his victory?
Wizardofnz (Wizardofnz)
New member
Username: Wizardofnz

Post Number: 778
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Tuesday, October 29, 2013 - 8:56 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did the second man win the Olympic event? yes, posthumously Did he win in a more abstract sense? no Did he "win" by ending up in Elysium, for example? No, but nice and lateral!

Is Greek culture or religion relevant? no

If the first man had pummeled the second man within an inch of his life and than stopped, would the second man still have won? if the second man had just sat there getting pummelled, he would not have won Is the second man's death necessary for his victory? no, but was inevitable in this case
Redwine (Redwine)
New member
Username: Redwine

Post Number: 594
Registered: 10-2013
Posted on Tuesday, October 29, 2013 - 11:09 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did the second man play according to the rules, while first man did not?
Wizardofnz (Wizardofnz)
New member
Username: Wizardofnz

Post Number: 782
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Tuesday, October 29, 2013 - 11:13 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did the second man play according to the rules, while first man did not? they both fought according to the rules
Psydkik (Psydkik)
New member
Username: Psydkik

Post Number: 507
Registered: 9-2013
Posted on Wednesday, October 30, 2013 - 12:08 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did the first man die from an injury received in the fight as well?
Wizardofnz (Wizardofnz)
New member
Username: Wizardofnz

Post Number: 783
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Wednesday, October 30, 2013 - 1:12 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did the first man die from an injury received in the fight as well? no
Redwine (Redwine)
New member
Username: Redwine

Post Number: 609
Registered: 10-2013
Posted on Wednesday, October 30, 2013 - 1:08 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did Mr Second have a relevant medical condition? Was Mr First in rage because he lost the fight and in that rage he mortally injured Mr Second?
Wizardofnz (Wizardofnz)
New member
Username: Wizardofnz

Post Number: 786
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Wednesday, October 30, 2013 - 7:41 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did Mr Second have a relevant medical condition? no Was Mr First in rage because he lost the fight and in that rage he mortally injured Mr Second? no - he accepted his defeat quite graciously
Psydkik (Psydkik)
New member
Username: Psydkik

Post Number: 513
Registered: 9-2013
Posted on Wednesday, October 30, 2013 - 9:40 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Was the fight won by:
- the person who did the strongest single attack?
- the person who did the most/best attacks over the course of some period of time?
- the person who fought in the most stylish way?
- the person who the crowd liked best?

Was there anyone else whose task it was to declare a winner? Or was 'the crowd' the only judge of who won?
Wizardofnz (Wizardofnz)
New member
Username: Wizardofnz

Post Number: 788
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Wednesday, October 30, 2013 - 9:57 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Was the fight won by:
- the person who did the strongest single attack?
- the person who did the most/best attacks over the course of some period of time?
- the person who fought in the most stylish way?
- the person who the crowd liked best? none of the above - although establishing how the winner was determined is a helpful line of questioning

Was there anyone else whose task it was to declare a winner? There were official adjudicators Or was 'the crowd' the only judge of who won? No, but they immediately came to the same conclusion as the judges
Alexanderhamilton (Alexanderhamilton)
New member
Username: Alexanderhamilton

Post Number: 226
Registered: 9-2013
Posted on Thursday, October 31, 2013 - 3:55 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Was the fight won by whoever surrendered last? And since the dead man never surrendered, he won? Was it won by whoever pinned the other? And in his death, his body pinned him?

Would these matches occasionally end without a clear winner? Is it typically clear who won as soon as the match ends? Do matches typically end with deaths?
Redwine (Redwine)
New member
Username: Redwine

Post Number: 629
Registered: 10-2013
Posted on Thursday, October 31, 2013 - 3:57 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Was the fight won by:
- the person who did a single attack in a certain way?
- the person who does something faster?
- the person who does something longer?
- the person who is last man standing?

Did the fighting people use any equipment?
Wizardofnz (Wizardofnz)
New member
Username: Wizardofnz

Post Number: 798
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Thursday, October 31, 2013 - 7:38 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Alexanderhamilton:

Was the fight won by whoever surrendered last? And since the dead man never surrendered, he won? OTRT. The fight was ended when the man who lived surrendered. Was it won by whoever pinned the other? no, but... And in his death, his body pinned him? ...this is OTRT, and worth exploring

Would these matches occasionally end without a clear winner? no Is it typically clear who won as soon as the match ends? yes Do matches typically end with deaths? no

Redwine:

Was the fight won by:
- the person who did a single attack in a certain way?
- the person who does something faster?
- the person who does something longer?
- the person who is last man standing? none of the above

Did the fighting people use any equipment? no
Redwine (Redwine)
New member
Username: Redwine

Post Number: 642
Registered: 10-2013
Posted on Thursday, October 31, 2013 - 8:11 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Was the second man able to surrender?
Wizardofnz (Wizardofnz)
New member
Username: Wizardofnz

Post Number: 803
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Thursday, October 31, 2013 - 9:38 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Was the second man able to surrender? yes
Gregoryuconn (Gregoryuconn)
New member
Username: Gregoryuconn

Post Number: 81
Registered: 10-2013
Posted on Sunday, November 03, 2013 - 3:16 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did the first man sit on the mat for some time after the dead guy died without surrendering, but didn't win because the dead guy hadn't surrendered? And then he realized the dead guy wasn't going to surrender and surrendered himself rather than stay there for all eternity?
Wizardofnz (Wizardofnz)
New member
Username: Wizardofnz

Post Number: 808
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Sunday, November 03, 2013 - 7:27 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did the first man sit on the mat for some time after the dead guy died without surrendering, but didn't win because the dead guy hadn't surrendered? And then he realized the dead guy wasn't going to surrender and surrendered himself rather than stay there for all eternity? No. Remember that Mr. First dealing Mr. Second a mortal injury, Mr. Second winning the fight (by virtue of Mr. First surrendering) and Mr. Second dying all happened, essentially, simultaneously.
Redwine (Redwine)
New member
Username: Redwine

Post Number: 674
Registered: 10-2013
Posted on Monday, November 04, 2013 - 1:10 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did Mr First want the injury to be mortal? Was he aware that the injury was mortal? Did he want to grant Mr Second fame and prize as a sort of compensation for having killed him?
Alexanderhamilton (Alexanderhamilton)
New member
Username: Alexanderhamilton

Post Number: 236
Registered: 9-2013
Posted on Monday, November 04, 2013 - 2:09 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is it relevant how he delivered the fatal blow (punch, kick, etc.)? Did the first man surrender because he legitimately didn't think he could win? Did he realize he had killed the other man?

This is a bit out there, but did he kill the other man WHILE surrendering? As in whichever body motion you do to surrender hit the other man and killed him?
Wizardofnz (Wizardofnz)
New member
Username: Wizardofnz

Post Number: 813
Registered: 10-2003
Posted on Monday, November 04, 2013 - 7:49 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Redwine:

Did Mr First want the injury to be mortal? no Was he aware that the injury was mortal? Mr Second keeling over dead was a pretty strong indicator Did he want to grant Mr Second fame and prize as a sort of compensation for having killed him? no

Alexanderhamilton:

Is it relevant how he delivered the fatal blow (punch, kick, etc.)? Yes! Did the first man surrender because he legitimately didn't think he could win? yes Did he realize he had killed the other man? only after the fight was over

This is a bit out there, but did he kill the other man WHILE surrendering? YES!! As in whichever body motion you do to surrender hit the other man and killed him? yes!

This is the crux of the puzzle - any further detail does not materially change the solution, so here's the

***** SPOILER *****

564 BC: Arrhichion of Phigalia, Greek pankratiast, caused his own death by accident during the Olympic finals. Held by his unidentified opponent in a stranglehold and unable to free himself, Arrichion's trainer shouted "What a fine funeral if you do not submit at Olympia!" Arrichion then kicked his opponent with his right foot while casting his body to the left, causing his opponent so much pain that he made the sign of defeat to the umpires, while at the same time breaking Arrichion's own neck as the other fighter was still strangleholding him. Since the opponent had conceded defeat, Arrichion was proclaimed victor posthumously.


Well done to Alexanderhamilton for administering _this_ deathblow, and well done to Redwine for never surrendering!

Add Your Message Here
Post:
Username: Posting Information:
This is a private posting area. Only registered users and moderators may post messages here.
Password:
Options: Enable HTML code in message
Automatically activate URLs in message
Action: