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Doriana (Doriana)
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Username: Doriana

Post Number: 183
Registered: 9-2013
Posted on Friday, October 25, 2013 - 3:01 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

The puzzle statement is very similar to my last puzzle, but this one, sadly, is based on several true stories :-(

Natalie (H/child/F) wanted to scare her daddy. She died.
Redwine (Redwine)
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Username: Redwine

Post Number: 470
Registered: 10-2013
Posted on Friday, October 25, 2013 - 3:03 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is daddy's profession relevant? If she had wanted to scare her mother, could the effect have been the same?
Doriana (Doriana)
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Username: Doriana

Post Number: 184
Registered: 9-2013
Posted on Friday, October 25, 2013 - 3:03 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Is daddy's profession relevant? no If she had wanted to scare her mother, could the effect have been the same? under the right circumstances, yes
Redwine (Redwine)
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Post Number: 471
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Posted on Friday, October 25, 2013 - 3:04 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did Natalie use an item to scare her daddy?
Did her daddy got scared?
Would it be true to say that daddy killed Natalie? Was her death accidental?
Doriana (Doriana)
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Username: Doriana

Post Number: 185
Registered: 9-2013
Posted on Friday, October 25, 2013 - 3:06 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did Natalie use an item to scare her daddy? yes for svv of "item"
Did her daddy got scared? no
Would it be true to say that daddy killed Natalie? yes Was her death accidental? yes
Psydkik (Psydkik)
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Post Number: 462
Registered: 9-2013
Posted on Friday, October 25, 2013 - 3:25 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Was she killed within 1 minute of trying to scare daddy? Within 5 minutes? Within an hour? Within a day? Within a month?
Yojimbo (Yojimbo)
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Username: Yojimbo

Post Number: 317
Registered: 9-2013
Posted on Friday, October 25, 2013 - 3:40 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

automobiles relevant?
Doriana (Doriana)
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Username: Doriana

Post Number: 187
Registered: 9-2013
Posted on Friday, October 25, 2013 - 4:08 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Was she killed within 1 minute of trying to scare daddy? Within 5 minutes? let's say this; it depends a bit on how we define the beginning of "scaring daddy" Within an hour? Within a day? Within a month?

automobiles relevant? very!
Kayleearafinwiel (Kayleearafinwiel)
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Username: Kayleearafinwiel

Post Number: 55
Registered: 9-2013
Posted on Friday, October 25, 2013 - 4:34 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I have an idea, but I don't want to cause an early $poyler...

Did Natalie hide under/inside something?
Doriana (Doriana)
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Username: Doriana

Post Number: 190
Registered: 9-2013
Posted on Friday, October 25, 2013 - 4:39 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I have an idea, but I don't want to cause an early $poyler...

Did Natalie hide under/inside something? yes
Alexanderhamilton (Alexanderhamilton)
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Username: Alexanderhamilton

Post Number: 202
Registered: 9-2013
Posted on Friday, October 25, 2013 - 5:13 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did Natalie plan to scare her father by hiding under his car? But was then driven over?

Alternatively, did she hid inside her father's car?
Kayleearafinwiel (Kayleearafinwiel)
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Username: Kayleearafinwiel

Post Number: 56
Registered: 9-2013
Posted on Friday, October 25, 2013 - 6:51 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

bowing out...will hang around to see how long this takes. thnx for confirming my guess on FB, my truly doriana kitteh =) didn't mean to guess so fast, but I probably saw this the same place you did
Doriana (Doriana)
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Username: Doriana

Post Number: 191
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Posted on Friday, October 25, 2013 - 7:04 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did Natalie plan to scare her father by hiding under his car? no But was then driven over? but yes

Alternatively, did she hid inside her father's car? no
Redwine (Redwine)
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Username: Redwine

Post Number: 481
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Posted on Friday, October 25, 2013 - 8:39 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did Natalie hide in the garage? If not, did she hide indoor? Outdoor?
Was her plan to unexpectedly appear from the place where she was hiding?
Could this have happened if Natalie had been playing hide and seek with her daddy?
Doriana (Doriana)
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Username: Doriana

Post Number: 192
Registered: 9-2013
Posted on Friday, October 25, 2013 - 9:07 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did Natalie hide in the garage? no If not, did she hide indoor? Outdoor? this
Was her plan to unexpectedly appear from the place where she was hiding? yes
Could this have happened if Natalie had been playing hide and seek with her daddy no
Ixoye724 (Ixoye724)
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Post Number: 4261
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Posted on Friday, October 25, 2013 - 10:08 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did she hide under the car? On top of the car? Next to the car?
Is the kind of vehicle relevant? Car/truck/SUV/van/other?
Doriana (Doriana)
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Username: Doriana

Post Number: 193
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Posted on Friday, October 25, 2013 - 10:35 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did she hide under the car? On top of the car? Next to the car? no to all, possible FA
Is the kind of vehicle relevant? not really Car/truck/SUV/van/other?
Redwine (Redwine)
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Username: Redwine

Post Number: 487
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Posted on Friday, October 25, 2013 - 10:39 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did she hide behind the garage door? Was her plan to go out from her hiding place as soon as her daddy starst the car?
Doriana (Doriana)
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Username: Doriana

Post Number: 194
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Posted on Friday, October 25, 2013 - 11:39 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did she hide behind the garage door? no Was her plan to go out from her hiding place as soon as her daddy starst the car? no, same possible FA
Yojimbo (Yojimbo)
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Username: Yojimbo

Post Number: 324
Registered: 9-2013
Posted on Saturday, October 26, 2013 - 2:07 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Was she unaware that he was going to operate the car at all? When he hit her, was he going forward? Reverse?
Did she hide inside something? A box? The trash can? Was she inside something when she was hit?
Did he realize he'd hit her right away? or wonder what lumpy thing he'd driven over, and then find out?
Doriana (Doriana)
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Username: Doriana

Post Number: 196
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Posted on Saturday, October 26, 2013 - 6:06 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Was she unaware that he was going to operate the car at all? FA When he hit her, was he going forward? Reverse? reverse
Did she hide inside something? yesish A box? The trash can? but none of these Was she inside something when she was hit? yesish
Did he realize he'd hit her right away? or wonder what lumpy thing he'd driven over, and then find out? irrel
Yojimbo (Yojimbo)
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Post Number: 334
Registered: 9-2013
Posted on Saturday, October 26, 2013 - 7:10 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Was he driving the car when it hit her? Was it merely rolling? Had it fallen off jacks?
Doriana (Doriana)
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Username: Doriana

Post Number: 199
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Posted on Saturday, October 26, 2013 - 7:36 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Was he driving the car when it hit her? yes Was it merely rolling? Had it fallen off jacks? no to rest
Psydkik (Psydkik)
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Post Number: 476
Registered: 9-2013
Posted on Saturday, October 26, 2013 - 8:23 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

What an odd combination of ishes and FAs :-o

Daddy was driving the car?

Daddy was operating the car?

Daddy was driving the car in reverse?

Daddy was operating the car in such a way that it moved backwards?

The 'car' was a motor vehicle, four wheels, made of metal, steering wheel, gear lever, doors, windscreen, engine, runs on petrol/diesel, that sort of thing?

Natalie existed before the car started moving?

Natalie wanted to scare Daddy?

Natalie actively intended to scare Daddy, and acted with conscious intention to scare?


Natalie was partly inside and partly not inside something when she was hit?

Natalie was in something which had holes in that exposed part of her to the outside world? Or behind something that wasn't fully enclosed? Or under something that wasn't fully enclosed?

Natalie was inside someone rather than something?
Doriana (Doriana)
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Username: Doriana

Post Number: 201
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Posted on Saturday, October 26, 2013 - 8:48 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Daddy was driving the car? yes

Daddy was operating the car? yes

Daddy was driving the car in reverse? only when he ran over her

Daddy was operating the car in such a way that it moved backwards? see above

The 'car' was a motor vehicle, four wheels, made of metal, steering wheel, gear lever, doors, windscreen, engine, runs on petrol/diesel, that sort of thing? yes

Natalie existed before the car started moving? yes, but possible FA

Natalie wanted to scare Daddy? yes

Natalie actively intended to scare Daddy, and acted with conscious intention to scare? yes


Natalie was partly inside and partly not inside something when she was hit? no, she was inside something, but you should explore the something to avoid FAs

Natalie was in something which had holes in that exposed part of her to the outside world? Or behind something that wasn't fully enclosed? Or under something that wasn't fully enclosed? no to all, see above

Natalie was inside someone rather than something? no
Redwine (Redwine)
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Username: Redwine

Post Number: 501
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Posted on Saturday, October 26, 2013 - 9:55 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Was Natalie only inside her clothing when she got run over? If not, was the something made predominantly of metal? Wood? fabric? plastic? Glass? Was it a part of the house? Was Natalie's whole body inside this something?
Does possible FA in the statement: "Natalie existed before the car started moving" concern Natalie's existence? the car? car starting moving?
Is the car in question a toy car? A car in a funfair?
Doriana (Doriana)
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Username: Doriana

Post Number: 203
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Posted on Saturday, October 26, 2013 - 11:03 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Was Natalie only inside her clothing when she got run over? no If not, was the something made predominantly of metal? Wood? this is closest fabric? plastic? Glass? Was it a part of the house? no Was Natalie's whole body inside this something? yes
Does possible FA in the statement: "Natalie existed before the car started moving" concern Natalie's existence? the car? car starting moving? this one
Is the car in question a toy car? A car in a funfair? no, it's a normal car
Yojimbo (Yojimbo)
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Post Number: 346
Registered: 9-2013
Posted on Saturday, October 26, 2013 - 11:32 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Was she in a tree? Hiding in shrubbery?
Doriana (Doriana)
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Username: Doriana

Post Number: 204
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Posted on Sunday, October 27, 2013 - 12:20 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Was she in a tree? Hiding in shrubbery? no to both, but getting closer
Psydkik (Psydkik)
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Post Number: 482
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Posted on Sunday, October 27, 2013 - 1:55 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Daddy was driving the car?

At some point, the car was not moving?
And then it started moving?
And it was still moving when it ran Natalie over?

Natalie existed?
Natalie existed before the car started moving?
Doriana (Doriana)
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Username: Doriana

Post Number: 205
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Posted on Sunday, October 27, 2013 - 3:33 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Daddy was driving the car yes

At some point, the car was not moving? no, it was moving all the time
And then it started moving? no, see above
And it was still moving when it ran Natalie over? yes

Natalie existed? yes
Natalie existed before the car started moving? yes

The FA is about *where* the car is at what point of the chain of events.
Psydkik (Psydkik)
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Username: Psydkik

Post Number: 484
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Posted on Monday, October 28, 2013 - 12:23 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Was Natalie unaware that Daddy was driving the car?
Yojimbo (Yojimbo)
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Post Number: 349
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Posted on Monday, October 28, 2013 - 12:46 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did Natalie intend to drop down on the car from where she was hiding, as if in an action film?
When Natalie was hiding:
...was the car moving?
...was she was aware the car was moving?
Did Daddy think she was in the car?
Was the car in a garage, or otherwise indoors or under shelter at any part of this scenario?
When Natalie was hiding, was she was aware the car was moving?
Doriana (Doriana)
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Username: Doriana

Post Number: 206
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Posted on Monday, October 28, 2013 - 4:23 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Was Natalie unaware that Daddy was driving the car? no

Did Natalie intend to drop down on the car from where she was hiding, as if in an action film? {no, she just wanted to appear unexpectedly}
When Natalie was hiding:
...was the car moving? yes
...was she was aware the car was moving? yes
Did Daddy think she was in the car? no
Was the car in a garage, or otherwise indoors or under shelter at any part of this scenario? no
When Natalie was hiding, was she was aware the car was moving? yes
Plebeian (Plebeian)
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Posted on Tuesday, October 29, 2013 - 10:12 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Was Natalie, at any relevant point, inside the car?
Did this event happen close to the family home?
Doriana (Doriana)
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Username: Doriana

Post Number: 208
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Posted on Tuesday, October 29, 2013 - 12:52 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Was Natalie, at any relevant point, inside the car? no
Did this event happen close to the family home? yes, right in front of their house... which should also give you a HINT on what she was hiding in
Redwine (Redwine)
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Post Number: 568
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Posted on Tuesday, October 29, 2013 - 2:10 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did she hide a sort of wooden shed? A porch?
Did her daddy hit the container she was in, not aware of her presence? Was it a thing that is normally hit by cars?
Doriana (Doriana)
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Post Number: 210
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Posted on Tuesday, October 29, 2013 - 5:24 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did she hide a sort of wooden shed? A porch? no to both
Did her daddy hit the container FA, remember that "shrubbery" was closest she was in, not aware of her presence? yes Was it a thing that is normally hit by cars? not normally, but it's also not totally unusual for it to be hit by a car
Redwine (Redwine)
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Posted on Tuesday, October 29, 2013 - 7:30 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did she hide in man-made structure? Something natural?
Doriana (Doriana)
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Post Number: 212
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Posted on Wednesday, October 30, 2013 - 12:53 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did she hide in man-made structure? Something natural? A bit of both, actually
Yojimbo (Yojimbo)
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Posted on Wednesday, October 30, 2013 - 12:58 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Was she hiding in a hedge?
Doriana (Doriana)
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Post Number: 213
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Posted on Wednesday, October 30, 2013 - 1:21 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Was she hiding in a hedge? no
Yojimbo (Yojimbo)
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Posted on Wednesday, October 30, 2013 - 1:23 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Or how about: was she hiding in a pile of leaves?
Doriana (Doriana)
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Post Number: 214
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Posted on Wednesday, October 30, 2013 - 2:06 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Or how about: was she hiding in a pile of leaves? yes!
Yojimbo (Yojimbo)
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Posted on Wednesday, October 30, 2013 - 2:30 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did Natalie intend to burst out of the pile of leaves and surprise Daddy? Did she just mistime her burst and not jump out in time, and he backed over her?
Yojimbo (Yojimbo)
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Posted on Wednesday, October 30, 2013 - 2:34 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Left this bit out: did she expect him to be driving forward, but he reversed instead?
Doriana (Doriana)
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Posted on Wednesday, October 30, 2013 - 10:41 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Did Natalie intend to burst out of the pile of leaves and surprise Daddy? yes Did she just mistime her burst and not jump out in time, and he backed over her? yes

Left this bit out: did she expect him to be driving forward, but he reversed instead? yesish

I think you've found everything we need for the

********SPOILER********

Natalie was playing in a pile of leaves just outside her house when she saw her daddy's car approach. She thought it would be fun to surprise him by jumping out of the pile when he pulls into the driveway.

Her daddy, however, was playing to have some fun himself by parking on the giant pile of leaves. So instead of pulling right into the driveway, he reversed, unaware that his little daughter was hiding in there.

Sadly, this is based on several true incidents :-(


Thanks for playing anyway, nice work, Yojimbo, Redwine, Psydkik etc.!
Yojimbo (Yojimbo)
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Posted on Wednesday, October 30, 2013 - 2:44 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Nice puzzle, but argh - rather gruesome outcome. Poor Natalie, not to mention her horrified father. Doriana, can you give us a puzzle with kittens, bunnies, and a happy ending?
Kayleearafinwiel (Kayleearafinwiel)
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Posted on Wednesday, October 30, 2013 - 4:06 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

kittehz, and pengwinz, and cheezburgur?
Doriana (Doriana)
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Posted on Wednesday, October 30, 2013 - 4:25 pm:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Yojimbo, my rulebreaker has a lot of rabbits. That's the closest I have to kittens, bunnies, penguins, cheezburgurz and happy endings. But I'll try to think of a less gloomy puzzle :-)
Yojimbo (Yojimbo)
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Post Number: 438
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Posted on Thursday, October 31, 2013 - 12:53 am:   Edit PostDelete PostView Post/Check IPPrint Post   Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I've checked in on that a number of times, but not in the last week or so... although my brain proves rather feeble for those rulebreaker gizmos. But I'll drop in and see if I can muster a puzzle-skewering post...

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