[Westing1992] Rain or Shine

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[Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby Westing1992 » Sat Sep 03, 2016 2:09 pm

It was a benevolent lie for the sake of one, but the truth would have prevented others from a fruitless search.
Last edited by Westing1992 on Mon Oct 31, 2016 4:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby BRTD » Sat Sep 03, 2016 7:16 pm

Who are the others? Are they humans?
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby jumpingjacks » Sat Sep 03, 2016 8:21 pm

Has there been a death? Was the lie a concealment of the fact of someone's death? Was the search for a missing person? A body?
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby Westing1992 » Sun Sep 04, 2016 12:15 am

Who are the others? Are they humans? Yes, they're humans, and also adults and (mostly) males. The one is HAM as well.

Has there been a death? Was the lie a concealment of the fact of someone's death? Was the search for a missing person? A body? Nothing quite so grim.
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby Twilightseeker » Sun Sep 04, 2016 1:06 am

Was the fruitless search for a physical object? Search for an answer, a concept, a virtual item (e.g. like in a video game)? A person? A place? a property/condition? Was it a spiritual or religious search?
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby irishelk » Sun Sep 04, 2016 12:10 pm

"For the sake of one"--one person? If so, adult person?

Is this a scientific search?

Was the lie that something existed when it did not? That something was useful when it wasn't? That something could be found in a certain place when it couldn't? Was something taken literally that was meant to be figurative?
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby Westing1992 » Mon Sep 05, 2016 2:32 am

Was the fruitless search for a physical object? This. Search for an answer, a concept, a virtual item (e.g. like in a video game)? A person? A place? a property/condition? Was it a spiritual or religious search?

"For the sake of one"--one person? If so, adult person? Yes and yes.

Is this a scientific search? No.

Was the lie that something existed when it did not? This is on the right track. That something was useful when it wasn't? No. That something could be found in a certain place when it couldn't? This is also a bit similar (though a specific place wasn't indicated). Was something taken literally that was meant to be figurative? No.
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby Twilightseeker » Mon Sep 05, 2016 3:24 am

Was the object considered a technology? Is it bigger than a chicken? bigger than a table? Is it something that was invented in the last century? Is it organic or inorganic? is it manmade?
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby Westing1992 » Mon Sep 05, 2016 8:43 pm

Was the object considered a technology? Yes--very much so. Is it bigger than a chicken? bigger than a table? Bigger than a chicken, smaller than a table. Is it something that was invented in the last century? Yes. Is it organic or inorganic? is it manmade? Inorganic, manmade.
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby Twilightseeker » Mon Sep 05, 2016 10:03 pm

Is the object a computing device? A desktop computer? A television? A printer? Is it something a lot of people in developed countries own in their homes today? Is a medical technology? Is it used only in scientific contexts (e.g. a piece of lab equipment or something similar)?
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby Westing1992 » Wed Sep 07, 2016 1:50 am

Is the object a computing device? A desktop computer? Yes and Yes! A television? A printer? Is it something a lot of people in developed countries own in their homes today? Yes; see above. Is a medical technology? Is it used only in scientific contexts (e.g. a piece of lab equipment or something similar)?
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby Twilightseeker » Wed Sep 07, 2016 2:10 am

Are they looking for a specific individual machine? A general type of computer? Does any of them own the computer they are looking for? Is it in a public place (e.g. library) or a private place (e.g. a home) or neither (like a restricted lab or something)? Are they looking to buy a computer? Find certain data that's on a computer? Use a particular program?
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby Westing1992 » Thu Sep 08, 2016 12:34 am

Are they looking for a specific individual machine? Yes. A general type of computer? Does any of them own the computer they are looking for? The specific one? No. The same type? Most likely. Is it in a public place (e.g. library) or a private place (e.g. a home) or neither (like a restricted lab or something)? FA. Are they looking to buy a computer? Perhaps. Find certain data that's on a computer? Use a particular program? This and this.
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby Twilightseeker » Thu Sep 08, 2016 2:42 am

So, there is no such computer, but they were told that there was? Was the lie told by one of them? Someone else?

Benevolent lie for the sake of one: to prevent harm to this one? prevent loss, embarrassment, sadness, anger, confusion, disappointment, shame, death?
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby Westing1992 » Thu Sep 08, 2016 10:04 pm

So, there is no such computer, but they were told that there was? Not quite... Was the lie told by one of them? Someone else? Someone else.

Benevolent lie for the sake of one: to prevent harm to this one? prevent loss, embarrassment, sadness, anger, confusion, disappointment, shame, death? To prevent shame/embarrassment.
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby Westing1992 » Tue Sep 13, 2016 1:59 pm

Hint: The computer in question existed at one time, but not anymore.
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby Zanreo » Fri Sep 16, 2016 9:22 pm

Was the computer destroyed? Was the specific model recalled? Was it a prototype that didn't go into production? Relevant whose computer it was?
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby Westing1992 » Fri Sep 16, 2016 10:54 pm

Was the computer destroyed? Yes. Was the specific model recalled? Was it a prototype that didn't go into production? Neither of these; the type of computer isn't as important as what was on it. Relevant whose computer it was? Yes.
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby Twilightseeker » Sat Sep 17, 2016 8:19 am

Was it the computer of one of the searchers? Of the one for whom the "benevolent lie" was told? Of someone else? If of someone else, did any of the searchers know this person?
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby Westing1992 » Sat Sep 17, 2016 3:51 pm

Was it the computer of one of the searchers? Of the one for whom the "benevolent lie" was told? This. Of someone else? If of someone else, did any of the searchers know this person?
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby Zanreo » Sat Sep 17, 2016 3:52 pm

Some kind of confidential material on it? Or something otherwise secret? A specific program? Specific files? Just something embarassing?
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby Westing1992 » Sat Sep 17, 2016 10:24 pm

Some kind of confidential material on it? Or something otherwise secret? A specific program? This. Specific files?Just something embarassing?
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby Westing1992 » Thu Sep 22, 2016 4:29 pm

Recap: A man had a computer with a certain program on it. The computer was destroyed. A benevolent lie was told to guard the man from shame/embarrassment; however, the truth would have prevented many others from searching for the computer.
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby Balin » Thu Sep 22, 2016 6:55 pm

Was the program a virus of some sort? Was it worth a lot of money?
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby Westing1992 » Thu Sep 22, 2016 8:39 pm

Was the program a virus of some sort? No. Was it worth a lot of money? Not particularly.
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby Twilightseeker » Thu Sep 22, 2016 10:35 pm

Did the man who owned the computer accidentally destroy it himself? Did one of the others? Someone else? Did it get destroyed on purpose, by accident?

Was the program on any other computer? Was it a program that the "one" guy wrote/created?
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby Westing1992 » Fri Sep 23, 2016 6:22 pm

Did the man who owned the computer accidentally destroy it himself? Did one of the others? Someone else? By someone not indicated in the puzzle. Did it get destroyed on purpose, by accident? They were destroyed with malicious intent.

Was the program on any other computer? There were backups on discs, but those were destroyed too. Was it a program that the "one" guy wrote/created? YES.
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby Twilightseeker » Sat Sep 24, 2016 6:38 am

So they were searching for a computer on which the "one" guy had created a program. Someone destroyed it with malicious intent...in order to hurt this "one" guy? To keep his program from being used? to get back at the "one" guy? Did his friends not want him to feel bad that his program now didn't exist?
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby Westing1992 » Sat Sep 24, 2016 3:42 pm

So they were searching for a computer on which the "one" guy had created a program. Someone destroyed it with malicious intent...in order to hurt this "one" guy? To keep his program from being used? to get back at the "one" guy? To hurt him, yes. The program was incidental.
Did his friends not want him to feel bad that his program now didn't exist? No; I feel that this question has some false assumptions anyway. Neither the tellers of the benevolent lie nor the searchers could be really classified as "friends".
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby Twilightseeker » Sun Sep 25, 2016 3:26 am

If not friends, acquaintances? coworkers? family members? other relationship?

Someone destroyed his computer to hurt him. Did the "others" know that he had a program on the computer that was specific? Were they trying to find the computer in order to use it for some purpose? Did they look in specific places? his house? place of work? elsewhere?
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby Westing1992 » Sun Sep 25, 2016 9:01 pm

If not friends, acquaintances? coworkers? family members? other relationship? For the liars or the searchers?

Someone destroyed his computer to hurt him. Did the "others" know that he had a program on the computer that was specific? Yes. Were they trying to find the computer in order to use it for some purpose? No, they were trying to find it for the program. Did they look in specific places? Not really.his house? place of work? Neither of these. elsewhere?
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby Twilightseeker » Tue Sep 27, 2016 4:21 am

Were the liars people who knew the "one" guy? Were the searchers? Is it relevant what kind of program was or what its function was?
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby Westing1992 » Tue Sep 27, 2016 10:47 pm

Were the liars people who knew the "one" guy? Yes. Were the searchers? No. Is it relevant what kind of program was or what its function was? Somewhat relevant; the type of program explains why the searchers would know/care about it.
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby GalFisk » Wed Sep 28, 2016 4:39 am

Was the program a game? School work? Virus? Hacking/cracking tool? Work assignment? Was it especially: clever? Small? Large? Unique? Did it take a lot of time and/or effort to create the program? Did it contain secrets? If the searchers had found the program, would the man be in trouble? Be happy? Are the searchers law enforcement?
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby Westing1992 » Wed Sep 28, 2016 6:07 pm

Was the program a game? THIS! School work? Virus? Hacking/cracking tool? Work assignment? Also this. Was it especially: clever? Small? Large? Unique? None of these; it could be considered unique in that there were no other copies of it, but that's not really the point.
Did it take a lot of time and/or effort to create the program? A decent amount of time. Did it contain secrets? No. If the searchers had found the program, would the man be in trouble? Be happy? Since it was destroyed, this is a FA; but it the lie were true, the man would would be happy if it were found. Are the searchers law enforcement? No.
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby Zanreo » Wed Oct 05, 2016 11:39 am

Was the lie that the game still existed somewhere? That it was still in development?
Game's code relevant to why the searchers would care about it? Graphics? Anything else?
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby biograd » Wed Oct 05, 2016 5:16 pm

Was the game later re-created? or a close imitation of it? If so, did this new version become well-known/famous?

Were the "searchers" video game fans? people interested in the history of video games? people with some other hobby related to gaming?

What I'm guessing is this--someone created a game, but the only copy was destroyed before it could be released to the public. In order to not make this person feel angry about there being people who would be so spiteful, some "friends" told the lie that the computer was lost/misplaced/otherwise still "out there somewhere". Later, another version was created and became known. Word got around to fans of the game that a lost original version had been created, but that the computer it was on had disappeared. This led to many video game fans examining old computers for sale (at used computer dealers, flea markets, etc.) to see if they could find the original game on it. Is this OTRT?
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby Westing1992 » Wed Oct 05, 2016 10:32 pm

Was the lie that the game still existed somewhere? Not directly, but it was inferred from the actual lie. That it was still in development? No.
Game's code relevant to why the searchers would care about it? Graphics? Anything else? Not particularly; they were interested in the game as a whole.

Was the game later re-created? or a close imitation of it? If so, did this new version become well-known/famous? FA; the game in question itself was a recreation (or port) of a preexisting game.

Were the "searchers" video game fans? people interested in the history of video games? people with some other hobby related to gaming? Any of these could work.

What I'm guessing is this--someone created a game, but the only copy was destroyed before it could be released to the public. In order to not make this person feel angry about there being people who would be so spiteful, some "friends" told the lie that the computer was lost/misplaced/otherwise still "out there somewhere". Later, another version was created and became known. Word got around to fans of the game that a lost original version had been created, but that the computer it was on had disappeared. This led to many video game fans examining old computers for sale (at used computer dealers, flea markets, etc.) to see if they could find the original game on it. Is this OTRT? YES! But like I said, the game in question was a port; plus, the nature/reason for the lie is wrong. But the lie DID lead the searchers on a wild goose chase like this.
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby Westing1992 » Tue Oct 11, 2016 5:49 pm

Recap: A man had a computer with a video game program on it. The computer (and game) was destroyed by someone to hurt the man. A third party lied to guard the man from shame/embarrassment; the nature of the lie
however, implied that the computer with the game still existed somewhere. This caused video game hobbyists to scour flea markets in the vain hope of finding the destroyed computer.

What still needs to be discovered: What was the lie that was told? And why would this lie prevent shame/embarrassment to the man, that telling the truth would not?
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby biograd » Tue Oct 11, 2016 8:42 pm

Was the lie that whoever took the computer thought it wasn't being used or didn't have anything important on it? This way, he wouldn't realize that someone firstly *knew* about the existence of the game, and secondly destroyed it deliberately?
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby Westing1992 » Tue Oct 11, 2016 11:47 pm

Was the lie that whoever took the computer thought it wasn't being used or didn't have anything important on it? This way, he wouldn't realize that someone firstly *knew* about the existence of the game, and secondly destroyed it deliberately? No.
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby Balin » Tue Oct 18, 2016 2:40 pm

Was the lie directly about what happened to the computer?
Is the reason for the destruction of the computer more specific than "hurting the man"?
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby Westing1992 » Tue Oct 18, 2016 8:24 pm

Was the lie directly about what happened to the computer? Yes.
Is the reason for the destruction of the computer more specific than "hurting the man"? No.
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby Balin » Wed Oct 19, 2016 1:17 am

Was the lie that the computer was stolen? Moved somewhere else? That there was another computer/a duplicate?
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby Westing1992 » Wed Oct 19, 2016 7:28 pm

Was the lie that the computer was stolen? This! Moved somewhere else? That there was another computer/a duplicate?
But why would they say it was stolen instead of destroyed?
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby GalFisk » Wed Oct 19, 2016 7:38 pm

Did they say it was stolen by the same person who destroyed it? By someone else? Circumstances around the supposed theft relevant? Around the actual destruction?
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby Westing1992 » Thu Oct 20, 2016 12:08 am

Did they say it was stolen by the same person who destroyed it? By someone else? They said it was stolen by an unknown person; they knew who destroyed it, though. Circumstances around the supposed theft relevant? No. Around the actual destruction? Yes.
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby Balin » Thu Oct 20, 2016 3:07 pm

Was anything besides the computer destroyed?
Was it destroyed in an explosion? A fire? Arson?
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby Westing1992 » Thu Oct 20, 2016 10:51 pm

Was anything besides the computer destroyed? Back-ups of the game.
Was it destroyed in an explosion? A fire? Arson? None of these; it was broken with a hammer or other tool.
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby Twilightseeker » Fri Oct 21, 2016 1:33 am

Were the "liars" trying to protect the identity of who destroyed it? Trying to protect them? From the guy who created/ported the game?
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby Westing1992 » Fri Oct 21, 2016 7:03 pm

Were the "liars" trying to protect the identity of who destroyed it? No. Trying to protect them? From the guy who created/ported the game? No, the programmer knew perfectly well who destroyed the computer.
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby irishelk » Sun Oct 23, 2016 4:53 pm

Was the lie actually told to the creator? Or to the public/other people?

Was the lie told to cover why someone wanted to hurt the creator? Had the creator done something embarrassing? Perhaps made this version of the game without permission from the original creators? Or something unrelated to the game? Like he'd had an affair?

Saying it was stolen vs. destroyed: Does this prevent embarrassment because of the manner of the computer's destruction? Perhaps the creator was careless with the computer in a way that allowed someone to destroy it? Did he physically leave it somewhere? Or leave it unsecured so that the destroyer could access it?

Was it physical destruction? Destruction with a virus/malware/etc?
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby Westing1992 » Sun Oct 23, 2016 8:34 pm

Was the lie actually told to the creator? No. Or to the public/other people? This.

Was the lie told to cover why someone wanted to hurt the creator? On the right track. Had the creator done something embarrassing? Perhaps made this version of the game without permission from the original creators? No. Or something unrelated to the game? Like he'd had an affair? Also on the right track...

Saying it was stolen vs. destroyed: Does this prevent embarrassment because of the manner of the computer's destruction? Perhaps the creator was careless with the computer in a way that allowed someone to destroy it? Did he physically leave it somewhere? Or leave it unsecured so that the destroyer could access it? None of these are the reason for the lie.

Was it physical destruction? This. Destruction with a virus/malware/etc?
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby GalFisk » Sun Oct 23, 2016 9:13 pm

Was the destruction done as revenge? Was the main intent: to destroy the game? To hurt the creator? To destroy the computer? Was there anything else relevant on the computer?
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby Westing1992 » Mon Oct 24, 2016 7:24 pm

Was the destruction done as revenge? Yes. Was the main intent: to destroy the game? To hurt the creator? This. To destroy the computer? Was there anything else relevant on the computer? No.
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby Grip » Fri Oct 28, 2016 10:20 am

Had the programmer wronged the saboteur in some way? stolen from him? was in general mean to him?
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby Westing1992 » Fri Oct 28, 2016 5:31 pm

Had the programmer wronged the saboteur in some way? You could say he did. Most would consider the sabotage to be in no way justified, however. stolen from him? was in general mean to him? Neither of these; plus, there's a FA in these two questions that, if cleared, could help point you to the answer.
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby Grip » Fri Oct 28, 2016 5:37 pm

Did the programmer know he had wronged him? unintentionally wronged him?

was the wrong a legal one? personal?
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby Westing1992 » Fri Oct 28, 2016 10:17 pm

Did the programmer know he had wronged him? unintentionally wronged him? Same false assumptions... but the programmer knew his wrong, and intentionally did it.

was the wrong a legal one? personal? Personal
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby Grip » Fri Oct 28, 2016 11:43 pm

Is the FA that the Sab was male? is adultery relevant?

was the Sab a child?
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby Westing1992 » Sat Oct 29, 2016 4:43 pm

Is the FA that the Sab was male? Yes! (meaning that she's female) is adultery relevant? No.

was the Sab a child? No.
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby Grip » Sat Oct 29, 2016 4:58 pm

Was there any romantic entanglement between the programmer and the Sab?
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby Westing1992 » Sat Oct 29, 2016 10:30 pm

Was there any romantic entanglement between the programmer and the Sab? Yes! And I think that's close enough for a

***SPOILER***
This is based on the story of the Parasol Stars port for the Commodore 64. (Since a parasol protects from both rain and sun, that's where the title came from). Computer games in those days were typically programmed entirely by one person; in this case, a man going through a messy divorce. When the game was almost complete, his ex destroyed the computer and backups in a drunken rage. The company that hired the man decided to cancel the game entirely rather than have it remade from the ground up; however, to save him from having his personal issues made public, they instead said that the computer was stolen. But this made several computer game enthusiasts think that the computer, with the program on it, might still exist out there, causing a fruitless search.
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby Grip » Sat Oct 29, 2016 11:50 pm

Nice puzzle!
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Re: [Westing1992] Rain or Shine

Postby irishelk » Sun Oct 30, 2016 5:00 pm

Wow, interesting story.
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