[Balin] Omission impossible

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[Balin] Omission impossible

Postby Balin » Sat Aug 04, 2018 10:02 am

A man is asked to supply certain information to a company. He does, but some relevant information the company requested is omitted.

Some time later, he sees the information gathered by the company and notices that the omitted information has been included. However, instead of being pleased, this significantly annoys him.

Why?
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Re: [Balin] Omission impossible

Postby wolfier » Sat Aug 04, 2018 4:44 pm

Social network related?
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Re: [Balin] Omission impossible

Postby Earnest » Sun Aug 05, 2018 6:49 am

Are those info required to anyone who want to deal with the company? Are the info generic ones? (E.g. name, surname, address, cell phone, married/not married...)

"some relevant information the company requested is omitted" = the man did not provide the info to the company?
Is the company famous worldwide?
Could rhe company, with just the info provided by the man easily recover the omitted ones (E.g. he provided name and age and the company recovered automatically the social security code...)?
If so, by doing researches on the net? By violating the privacy of the man? Did the man try to subscribe somewhere? Amazon relevant? Youtube? Are the info personal? Did he want to sign up?

this significantly annoys him = because a privacy violation?

Was there a reason why he wanted to omit those info a part from the fact that he did not want to share those info?

Are the info necessary for the service provided by the company? Are also the omitted ones?

"He sees the info gathered by the company" = anyone providing the info is able to see the gathered info he/she provides?
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Re: [Balin] Omission impossible

Postby Balin » Mon Aug 06, 2018 2:03 am

Social network related? No

Are those info required to anyone who want to deal with the company? Yes Are the info generic ones? No (E.g. name, surname, address, cell phone, married/not married...) No

"some relevant information the company requested is omitted" = the man did not provide the info to the company? Correct
Is the company famous worldwide? No
Could rhe company, with just the info provided by the man easily recover the omitted ones Yes (E.g. he provided name and age and the company recovered automatically the social security code...)? But not like this
If so, by doing researches on the net? Theoretically, but this wouldn't have been necessary By violating the privacy of the man? No
Did the man try to subscribe somewhere? No Amazon relevant? No Youtube? No Are the info personal? In a way, but the info could also be described as not personal Did he want to sign up? No

this significantly annoys him = because a privacy violation? No

Was there a reason why he wanted to omit those info a part from the fact that he did not want to share those info? Yes, he had a reason

Are the info necessary for the service provided by the company? Yes Are also the omitted ones? No

"He sees the info gathered by the company" = anyone providing the info is able to see the gathered info he/she provides? Yes
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Re: [Balin] Omission impossible

Postby wolfier » Mon Aug 06, 2018 4:37 am

Again, starting with the obvious - is the company related to insurance?
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Re: [Balin] Omission impossible

Postby Earnest » Mon Aug 06, 2018 7:17 am

Does the company work mainly with single individuals? More individuals together? Does the company provide financial services? Tourism relevant? Does the company deal with: private security guards? Private detectives? Weapons? Cell phones? Home deliveries? Health? Cars? Tour operator? Travels? Death/graveyards?

To be sure is the situation described realistic?

Did he need to provide infos about a place? His home?
Did he give the info by talking on a phone? Was the conversation recorded? Relevant?

Reason of the man not to give the info: he wanted to hide sonething/someone? Criminal activities relevant? Did he know that the omitted info could be recovered by the company through the info he gave? Was him afraid that also someone else, in possession of the same info could recover the omitted ones? Were the omitted info embarassing for him
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Re: [Balin] Omission impossible

Postby wolfier » Mon Aug 06, 2018 7:46 am

have to ask - did anyone die in this puzzle?
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Re: [Balin] Omission impossible

Postby Balin » Tue Aug 07, 2018 3:22 am

Again, starting with the obvious - is the company related to insurance? No

Does the company work mainly with single individuals? More individuals together? With a somewhat large group of individuals
Does the company provide financial services? Tourism relevant? Does the company deal with: private security guards? Private detectives? Weapons? Cell phones? Home deliveries? Health? Cars? Tour operator? Travels? Death/graveyards? No to all

To be sure is the situation described realistic? Yes - this is in fact a true story

Did he need to provide infos about a place? Noish His home? No
Did he give the info by talking on a phone? No Was the conversation recorded? DOYD of "recorded," but I will say Yes, with a possible FA warning Relevant? Yes

Reason of the man not to give the info: he wanted to hide sonething/someone? Not in the sense you're meaning Criminal activities relevant? No Did he know that the omitted info could be recovered by the company through the info he gave? Yes Was him afraid that also someone else, in possession of the same info could recover the omitted ones? No, but this may be on track Were the omitted info embarassing for him Given the context, I'll say Yes

have to ask - did anyone die in this puzzle? No, everyone in this puzzle is alive and well (surprisingly for an LTPF situation)
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Re: [Balin] Omission impossible

Postby Earnest » Tue Aug 07, 2018 7:14 am

Was a badge made by the company for him?

The info were not personal right (in the sense that they are not related to physical appearence, marriage status, address, his economic situation...)? Could anyone provide those same info to the company? Or were them connected to a relevant charachteristic of the man (e.g. his job, him being in possession of a password?...) Were the info provided measuraments? His habits (e.g. he was requested to provide the channels of the TV that did not work to a technician. He provided the channels' number which belong to a TV pacage of sex movies)?

Are the omitted info related in a logical way to the given ones? (E.g. because of those info, then he must also habe those omitted info..)
Did he took a virus in the PC? Did he made a subscription to an erotic app wirhout his will, which in turns would have revealed his attitude to visit red light web sites?

Did the company gather the info in a website? In a paper? Were the infos available to anyone? To anyone who work in the company?

Company serivices deal with: internet? Tv? Technology? Finding a job? Clothing? Supermarket? Vacuum cleaners? Something made in the house of the client? Holidays? Hotels? Photography? Model agency? Building? Sport? Pharmacy? Agriculture? Airplanes? Means of transport?
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Re: [Balin] Omission impossible

Postby Enjay » Tue Aug 07, 2018 8:31 pm

Is it relevant how the company gathered the omitted information? Was the man annoyed because they must have got the information from another source? From a source he didn't want them to deal with?
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Re: [Balin] Omission impossible

Postby jumpingjacks » Sat Aug 11, 2018 7:08 pm

Is there someone else involved besides the company and the man? Does this person see the omitted information? Is this what annoys him?
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Re: [Balin] Omission impossible

Postby Balin » Sun Aug 12, 2018 4:15 pm

Was a badge made by the company for him? No

The info were not personal right (in the sense that they are not related to physical appearence, marriage status, address, his economic situation...)? That's correct Could anyone provide those same info to the company? The same type of information, but not the exact same information Or were them connected to a relevant charachteristic of the man (e.g. his job, him being in possession of a password?...) Yes, and "job" is close but not it Were the info provided measuraments? No His habits (e.g. he was requested to provide the channels of the TV that did not work to a technician. He provided the channels' number which belong to a TV pacage of sex movies)? No

Are the omitted info related in a logical way to the given ones? Yes (E.g. because of those info, then he must also habe those omitted info..) Yes
Did he took a virus in the PC? Did he made a subscription to an erotic app wirhout his will, which in turns would have revealed his attitude to visit red light web sites? No to these

Did the company gather the info in a website? No In a paper? Not a newspaper, but Yes, in some form of paper material Were the infos available to anyone? Theoretically To anyone who work in the company? Yes, FA

Company serivices deal with: internet? Tv? Technology? Finding a job? Clothing? Supermarket? Vacuum cleaners? Something made in the house of the client? Holidays? Hotels? Photography? Model agency? Building? Sport? Pharmacy? Agriculture? Airplanes? Means of transport? No to all, FA

Is it relevant how the company gathered the omitted information? Yes Was the man annoyed because they must have got the information from another source? No From a source he didn't want them to deal with? No

Is there someone else involved besides the company and the man? Yes, the group of people who would see this information Does this person see the omitted information? Yes Is this what annoys him? Among things

Welcome back Jackie - good to see you here again!
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Re: [Balin] Omission impossible

Postby jumpingjacks » Sun Aug 12, 2018 5:54 pm

Is the man a research subject? Was he taking part in an experiment? Social experiment? Was he filmed? Paper material - academic journal?
Is the time period relevant? Is this a modern tale?

And thank you, it's good to be back! And at least i didn't leave it six years this time... ;)
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Re: [Balin] Omission impossible

Postby Balin » Sun Aug 12, 2018 11:37 pm

Is the man a research subject? Was he taking part in an experiment? Social experiment? Was he filmed? Paper material - academic journal? No to all
Is the time period relevant? Yes Is this a modern tale? Yes

And thank you, it's good to be back! And at least i didn't leave it six years this time... ;) Definitely glad that wasn't the case again!
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Re: [Balin] Omission impossible

Postby jumpingjacks » Mon Aug 13, 2018 2:31 am

Just trying to figure out the FAs above... is the FA that the company has people working for them at all? Is the FA that the company provides a service? Would this work if it were a company such as Apple? Is it a for-profit company? Non-profit? Charity? School? Government? Political party? Media-related?
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Re: [Balin] Omission impossible

Postby Earnest » Mon Aug 13, 2018 8:50 am

Did the company ask the man to fill in a paper? Did someone interview the man? Did they ask the man to submit his CV?
Relevant how many info the company needed to provide the service? Did he need to provide personal info too along with the omitted ones?

FA = is it an "automatic service" (e.g. vending machines, Truth teller,...)

Gathered info: in a receipt? In a bill?
Was the paper the result of the service requested? (e.g. it was an announcement...)?
To be sure...with "giving info to a company" is it meant something like he needed to print something and to do that he needed to "give info" to the printer (belonging to a company) in order it to print them or something along these lines? I mean, nowadays we give info to many companies in this sense (e.g. with cookies when we enter a website...)

Did he want a birthday cake but did not want his age to be written on the cake?

Was him unemployed?
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Re: [Balin] Omission impossible

Postby GalFisk » Tue Aug 14, 2018 7:01 am

Did the company obtain the omitted information elsewhere? Deduce it from information supplied? From information obtained elsewhere?
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Re: [Balin] Omission impossible

Postby Balin » Tue Aug 14, 2018 7:42 pm

Just trying to figure out the FAs above... is the FA that the company has people working for them at all? This isn't the FA Is the FA that the company provides a service? This isn't the FA either Would this work if it were a company such as Apple? Not at all! Is it a for-profit company? Non-profit? Charity? School? Government? Political party? Media-related? For-profit, same FA, No to rest

Did the company ask the man to fill in a paper? Did someone interview the man? Did they ask the man to submit his CV? No to these
Relevant how many info the company needed to provide the service? Yes Did he need to provide personal info too along with the omitted ones? It's a type of personal info, I'll say

FA = is it an "automatic service" (e.g. vending machines, Truth teller,...) No

Gathered info: in a receipt? In a bill? Neither
Was the paper the result of the service requested? (e.g. it was an announcement...)? Yes, but not like the example
To be sure...with "giving info to a company" is it meant something like he needed to print something and to do that he needed to "give info" to the printer (belonging to a company) in order it to print them or something along these lines? I mean, nowadays we give info to many companies in this sense (e.g. with cookies when we enter a website...) I mean that the company directly asked him for certain information, and he sent that information to them

Did he want a birthday cake but did not want his age to be written on the cake? No, but a clever idea!

Was him unemployed? Irrel - perhaps this may help clear the FA

Did the company obtain the omitted information elsewhere? Deduce it from information supplied? This From information obtained elsewhere?
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Re: [Balin] Omission impossible

Postby gregoryuconn » Wed Aug 15, 2018 12:49 am

Was it genetic information? Or some other information that could be determined by a DNA test? And they got his DNA from when he licked the envelope to mail back the forms?
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Re: [Balin] Omission impossible

Postby Balin » Wed Aug 15, 2018 2:56 am

Was it genetic information? Or some other information that could be determined by a DNA test? And they got his DNA from when he licked the envelope to mail back the forms? Clever thought, but No to all
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Re: [Balin] Omission impossible

Postby GalFisk » Wed Aug 15, 2018 5:19 am

Did he want the omitted information to stay private? Relevant how he sees the information? Where? Are his motives financial? Is he annoyed that the information is present? That someone deduced it?
WAG: does he think the information provided is only processed by computers, but the deduction is evidence that it has been inspected by human?
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Re: [Balin] Omission impossible

Postby Earnest » Wed Aug 15, 2018 9:34 am

Can we assume modern times?

FA = is it related to the fact that I said to "anyone" instead of to "anything" for instance? or maybe just one person works for the company? to be sure...company in the text of the puzzle is referred always to the same company right? To be sure: "is omitted" = he omitted them voluntarily right?
I have noticed the FA is also when I listed the possible services provided by the company...so did the company actually provide services? Just gather info? Gather info before providing the service? Could it work even without info provided at all?

Is the company connected with entertainment? Money? Cinema? Flowers? Is there an app doing the same job of the company?

Did he need to send something? Did he need to sign something (modules, documents...)? Relevant? Were the info to be supplied in the format of a paper to be filled? Yes-no questions? Multiple choice questions? Were the omitted info?
Did he need to answer a question like "how many times you did something...?"

Did the firm gather the info in a single piece of paper? in more papers? In a ticket? in a calendar? (e.g. like google that automatically sync everything on your phone with the google calendar) in a picture? in a book? in a badge? in a passport? in a document? In a certificate? a license? A driving license? a postcard?

Did he need to write down a card? Is the company a big one? A very small one? Was the paper he needed to complete meant to be anonymous but actually from the provided info it was easy to understand that it was him?
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Re: [Balin] Omission impossible

Postby Balin » Wed Aug 15, 2018 5:25 pm

Did he want the omitted information to stay private? Not so much "to stay private" as "to stay omitted" Relevant how he sees the information? Yes Where? Yes Are his motives financial? No Is he annoyed that the information is present? Yes That someone deduced it? No
WAG: does he think the information provided is only processed by computers, but the deduction is evidence that it has been inspected by human? No

Can we assume modern times? Yes

FA = is it related to the fact that I said to "anyone" instead of to "anything" for instance? No or maybe just one person works for the company? No to be sure...company in the text of the puzzle is referred always to the same company right? Yes To be sure: "is omitted" = he omitted them voluntarily right? Yes
I have noticed the FA is also when I listed the possible services provided by the company...so did the company actually provide services? See below Just gather info? No Gather info before providing the service? See below Could it work even without info provided at all? No

Is the company connected with entertainment? This - which might help clear the FA. No to rest Money? Cinema? Flowers? Is there an app doing the same job of the company? No

Did he need to send something? Only in providing the information Did he need to sign something (modules, documents...)? Not relevantly Relevant? See prev
Were the info to be supplied in the format of a paper to be filled? Not sure what you mean by this - No to rest Yes-no questions? Multiple choice questions? Were the omitted info?
Did he need to answer a question like "how many times you did something...?" Noish

Did the firm gather the info in a single piece of paper? in more papers? In a ticket? in a calendar? (e.g. like google that automatically sync everything on your phone with the google calendar) in a picture? in a book? in a badge? in a passport? in a document? In a certificate? a license? A driving license? a postcard? In a small booklet

Did he need to write down a card? No
Is the company a big one? No A very small one? Yes Was the paper he needed to complete meant to be anonymous but actually from the provided info it was easy to understand that it was him? No
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Re: [Balin] Omission impossible

Postby Earnest » Wed Aug 15, 2018 6:38 pm

entertainment = bets? amusement parks relevant? circus? media relevant? theater? matches?Radio? insurance? publishing? make up? barber? toys? music? skydiving? relax? pub? lotto? bathing? extraction relevant? Dance? Disco? Karaoke? TV show? Casino? Gambling?

Did he want to dedicate a song to someone (or someone wanted to dedicate to him)? Palm reading relevant? Were the same info (even the omitted ones) not gathered (e.g. told separately)result in something embarrassing for him? Is the gathering part of the embarrassment?

Is the booklet hand written? Relevant? Is the booklet the final product? Are there pictures on it? Just the gathered infos? Suggestions? Forecasts? Fake certificates? his face? Did it have more than one page?
was the booklet given to him? To someone else? relevant?

Was him at his first date with a girl/woman?

WAG: I know it's not the answer however.....was he playing the role of a certain character and needed to provide the info about that character?

Were the info gathered in a particular manner? Did he need to provide an info about an hobby of him? a passion? An habit? Something about which he could have lied? If he fear something (e.g. if he fear height...?)? If he suffer from some disease/disturb (e.g. the one who suffer from the disease/disturb would have had a different service than the one who do not)? Sexual habits relevant? Toupee (e.g. he was forced to say that he was bald but at a first glance it seems that he had all his hairs so that logical implication: he must have wore a toupee)? Clothing habits relevant? Habits in the bathroom? Smoking habits? attitude with dogs/animals in general?

By the given info, could someone have deduced: that he was unemployed? that he has been in prison? that he was poor? that he was in therapy? car model (e.g. he needed to give a collateral to the casino and provide just the license plate but not the model of his car which was a wreck w.r.t. other cars in the casino)? The fact that he was single/had no children?

Did the company report exactly what he wanted to omit (or something like also the company omit the info but by the omission it was clear which the omitted info were)?
Last edited by Earnest on Wed Aug 15, 2018 7:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: [Balin] Omission impossible

Postby jumpingjacks » Wed Aug 15, 2018 7:21 pm

Is this a musical theatre company? Is the info printed in a programme? Did they ask him to provide info of his previous experience, and he left it blank, but they then printed "X has no previous experience" in his bio? That would be funny :D
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Re: [Balin] Omission impossible

Postby Balin » Thu Aug 16, 2018 5:44 pm

entertainment = bets? amusement parks relevant? circus? media relevant? theater? This, see below matches? Radio? insurance? publishing? make up? barber? toys? music? skydiving? relax? pub? lotto? bathing? extraction relevant? Dance? Disco? Karaoke? TV show? Casino? Gambling?

Did he want to dedicate a song to someone (or someone wanted to dedicate to him)? No Palm reading relevant? No Were the same info (even the omitted ones) not gathered (e.g. told separately)result in something embarrassing for him? No Is the gathering part of the embarrassment? Indirectly

Is the booklet hand written? No Relevant? Somewhat, see below Is the booklet the final product? See below Are there pictures on it? Yes Just the gathered infos? Yes Suggestions? Forecasts? Fake certificates? his face? No to these Did it have more than one page? Yes
was the booklet given to him? Yes, but more relevantly... To someone else? ...Yes relevant? Yes

Was him at his first date with a girl/woman? No

WAG: I know it's not the answer however.....was he playing the role of a certain character Yes, see below and needed to provide the info about that character? No, but OTRT, see below

Were the info gathered in a particular manner? Yes (email) Did he need to provide an info about an hobby of him? Yes, see belo a passion? An habit? Something about which he could have lied? If he fear something (e.g. if he fear height...?)? If he suffer from some disease/disturb (e.g. the one who suffer from the disease/disturb would have had a different service than the one who do not)? Sexual habits relevant? Toupee (e.g. he was forced to say that he was bald but at a first glance it seems that he had all his hairs so that logical implication: he must have wore a toupee)? Clothing habits relevant? Habits in the bathroom? Smoking habits? attitude with dogs/animals in general? No to the rest of these

By the given info, could someone have deduced: that he was unemployed? that he has been in prison? that he was poor? that he was in therapy? car model (e.g. he needed to give a collateral to the casino and provide just the license plate but not the model of his car which was a wreck w.r.t. other cars in the casino)? The fact that he was single/had no children? No to all; I like your wild guesses though!

Did the company report exactly what he wanted to omit Yes (or something like also the company omit the info but by the omission it was clear which the omitted info were)?

Is this a musical theatre company? Yes! (The FA was assuming the "company" was a corporation) Is the info printed in a programme? Yes
Did they ask him to provide info of his previous experience Yes and he left it blank No but they then printed "X has no previous experience" in his bio? No That would be funny :D It is funny! It's not quite the answer, but you're very much OTRT now.
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Re: [Balin] Omission impossible

Postby jumpingjacks » Thu Aug 16, 2018 5:57 pm

So he did fill in the bit about his previous experience? But left out some of the stuff he'd done? Did he previously perform in something embarrassing that he didn't want to have in his bio? Is the musical he is currently performing in relevant? Is its intended audience relevant? eg. is it targeted at children? And he had previously performed in a raunchy musical that he didn't want included?
Are his qualifications relevant? Dance qualifications? Acting qualifications? Singing?
Is his age relevant?
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Re: [Balin] Omission impossible

Postby jumpingjacks » Thu Aug 16, 2018 5:59 pm

Perhaps he just put in the name of the production he'd performed in, but the company described it at length? "Previous credits include Equus, where young Daniel bared all..."
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Re: [Balin] Omission impossible

Postby Earnest » Thu Aug 16, 2018 6:12 pm

Ok I just noticed that I have done more or less the same questions as jumping...sorry for that!

Is he asked to provide his abilities in performing? Acting? Did he omit to say that he feared heights? Was him supposed to act? To take part to the scenes,? To remain behind the scenes? Did the booklet gather all his past performances...also the embarassing ones?

Since they are appreciated...
WAG--> the corporation was planning to make a musical. He was asked his past experiences. He gave them infos about the previous experiences in theater in the form of the title and interpretation (e.g. Macbeth, a reinterpretation if X) but without mentioning his roles, which do not include vocals performances. The corporation simply checked his roles by a quick look at the internet, discover it and assigned him just dialogues in the booklet.
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Re: [Balin] Omission impossible

Postby Balin » Fri Aug 17, 2018 11:15 pm

So he did fill in the bit about his previous experience? Yes But left out some of the stuff he'd done? Partially Did he previously perform in something embarrassing that he didn't want to have in his bio? No, but OTRT...
Is the musical he is currently performing in relevant? Yes, see next... Is its intended audience relevant? Yes... eg. is it targeted at children? Yes! And he had previously performed in a raunchy musical that he didn't want included? Yes!

****SPOILER****

I was recently in a local production of Mary Poppins. When listing previous experience for my bio in the playbill, I listed one show as "Best Little/Texas," intentionally omitting the word "Whorehouse" because I knew there'd be plenty of children in the audience. But when I read one of the playbills on our opening night, they'd expanded it to the full title... which was not at all what I'd wanted!
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Re: [Balin] Omission impossible (*DROP THE CURTAIN*)

Postby jumpingjacks » Fri Aug 17, 2018 11:36 pm

Haha! Love it :D
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