[Balin] Politeness judo

An archive of solved lateral thinking puzzles.

Moderators: peter365, Balin, kalira, JenBurdoo, Tiger

[Balin] Politeness judo

Postby Balin » Sat Sep 08, 2018 8:36 pm

A criminal was arrested because he and his victim were both polite. How?
Balin
 
Posts: 6862
Joined: Fri May 23, 2014 11:12 pm
Location: Connecticut, USA

Re: [Balin] Politeness judo

Postby jumpingjacks » Sat Sep 08, 2018 9:40 pm

Dear Matt,
May I trouble you to answer a few questions?
Was the criminal a grown, male human? What about his victim? Is his victim still alive? What was the crime in question - murder? theft? assault? fraud? breaking and entering?
Were they both polite in the same way? Were they polite to each other? Or to someone else? Did they say something that was polite? Do something that was polite?
Thank you for your time, I hope you have a lovely day.
User avatar
jumpingjacks
 
Posts: 948
Joined: Tue Jun 28, 2016 4:54 pm
Location: London, UK

Re: [Balin] Politeness judo

Postby Earnest » Sun Sep 09, 2018 8:06 am

...so...I'm sorry...Matt is Balin? And did something happen? May I also disturb?

Was it suspicious to be polite in the situation in which they were arrested? Relevant which crime they commit? Murder (I suppose not...I have never seen a polite dead man or woman)? Theft? Fraud? A minor crime? A street one? Alchol relevant? Drugs relevant? Others? They were polite = they were polite one to the other? With other people? With police? They perform a relevant gesture in order to be classified as "polite"? E.g. open a door? Say "thank you"? They speak with regards? Were them in a tribunal court? Was there a trial going on?

Was the criminal arrested right after having been polite?
Is it something like they were fighting in a school, the director came see the scene and they both tell a lie not to be in trubles? Is it something like the victim could be a criminal if he or she is seen buying a service from a criminal? (E.g. prostitution relevant? ) was the victim performing an illegal action (e.g. the victim was selling drugs to the person classified as criminal who escaped without payong the drug?) Do victim and criminal coincide?
Earnest
 
Posts: 1799
Joined: Tue May 30, 2017 7:52 am

Re: [Balin] Politeness judo

Postby invisiblemimsy » Sun Sep 09, 2018 5:09 pm

What ho!

Permit me to ask, if you please, whether these two were of the adult, male persuasion? Was an hotel, a bicycle or another form of perambulation relevant, in particular, a train journey? Did the criminal and his victim have anything else in common, aside from their politeness? Did the one show consideration to the other, for example, by offering a seat?
User avatar
invisiblemimsy
 
Posts: 1473
Joined: Mon Jan 08, 2018 11:16 pm
Location: Scotland

Re: [Balin] Politeness judo

Postby Balin » Sun Sep 09, 2018 5:18 pm

Dear Matt,
May I trouble you to answer a few questions? That will not be a problem at all! Go right ahead.
Was the criminal a grown, male human? Yes What about his victim? Yes Is his victim still alive? Yes What was the crime in question - murder? theft? assault? fraud? breaking and entering? Theft
Were they both polite in the same way? I'm not quite sure what you mean by this - can you please clarify? Were they polite to each other? Yes Or to someone else? Did they say something that was polite? Yes (most relevantly, the victim) Do something that was polite? Most relevantly, the criminal
Thank you for your time, I hope you have a lovely day. Glad to be of assistance; I hope your day is also wonderful!

...so...I'm sorry...Matt is Balin? Yes, that is indeed my name And did something happen? Well, according to the website where I read this anecdote May I also disturb? By all means, go right ahead.

Was it suspicious to be polite in the situation in which they were arrested? No Relevant which crime they commit? Yes Murder (I suppose not...I have never seen a polite dead man or woman)? Well, they never do talk out of turn Theft? This Fraud? A minor crime? A street one? Yes, actually Alchol relevant? No Drugs relevant? No Others? No other people, apart from the police They were polite = they were polite one to the other? Yes With other people? No With police? Yes, actually, but this isn't quite as relevant They perform a relevant gesture in order to be classified as "polite"? Yes E.g. open a door? Say "thank you"? They speak with regards? Not these though Were them in a tribunal court? No Was there a trial going on? No

Was the criminal arrested right after having been polite? No
Is it something like they were fighting in a school, the director came see the scene and they both tell a lie not to be in trubles? Interesting thought, but it's not this Is it something like the victim could be a criminal if he or she is seen buying a service from a criminal? Not in this case, No (E.g. prostitution relevant?) No was the victim performing an illegal action (e.g. the victim was selling drugs to the person classified as criminal who escaped without payong the drug?) No Do victim and criminal coincide? No, they are two different people

What ho! Good afternoon! (Or I suppose morning, as I am several time zones away.)

Permit me to ask, if you please, whether these two were of the adult, male persuasion? They were Was an hotel, a bicycle or another form of perambulation relevant, in particular, a train journey? Nothing aside from walking Did the criminal and his victim have anything else in common, aside from their politeness? No Did the one show consideration to the other Yes, in a way for example, by offering a seat? Not like this though
Balin
 
Posts: 6862
Joined: Fri May 23, 2014 11:12 pm
Location: Connecticut, USA

Re: [Balin] Politeness judo

Postby Earnest » Sun Sep 09, 2018 6:04 pm

Relevant what was stolen? Was their politeness suspicious? (E.g. the victim was at gunpoint)

Did criminal and victim have the same reasons to be polite?
Earnest
 
Posts: 1799
Joined: Tue May 30, 2017 7:52 am

Re: [Balin] Politeness judo

Postby invisiblemimsy » Sun Sep 09, 2018 8:18 pm

Just to confirm: There were 3 people - the thief, the victim and the person who arrested them? Anyone else?
Did they know each other? Were they arrested by a policeman? Did they know the person who arrested them?
Was the criminal a pickpocket? A grifter? Was he a habitual criminal? Was street theft his normal m.o.? Could he turn his hand to other crimes or locations? Time of day (list of times)?

Is the title or location relevant? Is there an analogy with martial arts, e.g. precise following of etiquette or rules, a thief's code or suchlike?
User avatar
invisiblemimsy
 
Posts: 1473
Joined: Mon Jan 08, 2018 11:16 pm
Location: Scotland

Re: [Balin] Politeness judo

Postby Balin » Mon Sep 10, 2018 2:31 am

Relevant what was stolen? Just a wallet Was their politeness suspicious? Well, unusual, but I wouldn't say suspicious (E.g. the victim was at gunpoint) Knifepoint, actually

Did criminal and victim have the same reasons to be polite? I'll say Yes

Just to confirm: There were 3 people - the thief, the victim and the person who arrested them? Well, the thief and the victim are directly there. The police makes the arrest later Anyone else? No
Did they know each other? The thief and the victim? No Were they arrested by a policeman? The thief is, yes. The victim is not arrested Did they know the person who arrested them? No
Was the criminal a pickpocket? A grifter? Neither of these types of thievery Was he a habitual criminal? Probably Was street theft his normal m.o.? Irrel Could he turn his hand to other crimes or locations? In theory Time of day (list of times)? Sometime at night

Is the title or location relevant? Not particularly. The title is from TV Tropes Is there an analogy with martial arts, e.g. precise following of etiquette or rules, a thief's code or suchlike? No
Balin
 
Posts: 6862
Joined: Fri May 23, 2014 11:12 pm
Location: Connecticut, USA

Re: [Balin] Politeness judo

Postby GalFisk » Mon Sep 10, 2018 6:56 am

Good day good Sir, may I interrupt you with a few questions?
If so: did the robber say something polite? Do something polite? Give away an object? Let the victim keep an object? Such as photos? Driver's license?
Did the victim say something polite? Do something polite? Let the robber have something he did not ask for? Did the victim gain knowledge about the robber, which was helpful in apprehending him?
Was the robber caught because of an object? Fingerprints? DNA? Other physical evidence?
Thank you, and have a good day.
GalFisk
 
Posts: 8085
Joined: Tue May 27, 2014 8:03 pm
Location: Sweden

Re: [Balin] Politeness judo

Postby invisiblemimsy » Mon Sep 10, 2018 10:38 am

Would it help to explore what led to the theft, motive, other things? What happened afterwards besides the arrest? Did either of them know an arrest would follow? Did the thief bow to the victim or open the door for him or something like that? Was whatever he did a diversion to the theft? Did the victim thank him? Or say, “There’s no need, my good fellow,” or something like that? Is it relevant at what point the victim discovered the theft? Did he realise straight away, or later?

Would the puzzle work if the policeman had not arrested the thief?
User avatar
invisiblemimsy
 
Posts: 1473
Joined: Mon Jan 08, 2018 11:16 pm
Location: Scotland

Re: [Balin] Politeness judo

Postby Earnest » Mon Sep 10, 2018 1:34 pm

Sorry if repeating questions...

Was the police called by the victim? Did the thief try to escape after having stolen the wallet? If so, did the victim try to take the wallet back? If so relevant how they came up being together again with a policeman? Did they fake to be friends? That everything was ok? Relevant why the policeman talked to them? To fine them? To fine the victim?

Was something suspicious seen by police? Or maybe the criminal realized that there were cameras on the street?

When the victim was at knifepoint, were thief and victim talking to a policeman? If so by phone? Directly? Were the two on the car's victim? On the street? In a crowded place? Was the policeman able to see the knife?

Were the two polite in a situation in which politeness was too strange? E.g. they were fined by policeman? Did the victim try to communicate with the policeman (e.g. gestures/signs...) and asking for help in his/her politeness? Did they meet the policeman? Relevant where? On the street?

Politeness = turn on a light? Light up a cigarette? Accept to be fined? Politeness toward the policeman? One to the other? Toward a third person?

Or something like the criminal, an homeless seen by the policeman who walked down the street, faked to pay a meal to the victim. The policeman noticed before the absence of money in the hat where he was asking for money and knew that he had not. So he became suspect when he saw the man taking from his pocket the wallet to pay the lunch to the victim who kindly thanked the criminal being at knifepoint.
Earnest
 
Posts: 1799
Joined: Tue May 30, 2017 7:52 am

Re: [Balin] Politeness judo

Postby Balin » Tue Sep 11, 2018 3:18 pm

Good day good Sir, may I interrupt you with a few questions? That is not a problem at all; please proceed.
If so: did the robber say something polite? Do something polite? This Give away an object? Let the victim keep an object? Such as photos? Driver's license? No to rest
Did the victim say something polite? Yes ]Do something polite? Let the robber have something he did not ask for? No to these Did the victim gain knowledge about the robber, which was helpful in apprehending him? Technically; see below
Was the robber caught because of an object? Fingerprints? This DNA? Other physical evidence?
Thank you, and have a good day. May you also have a good day, sir.

Would it help to explore what led to the theft, motive, other things? Figuring out the events leading up may help What happened afterwards besides the arrest? Yes, a little bit Did either of them know an arrest would follow? Neither were certain Did the thief bow to the victim or open the door for him or something like that? No Was whatever he did a diversion to the theft? No Did the victim thank him? No Or say, “There’s no need, my good fellow,” or something like that? No Is it relevant at what point the victim discovered the theft? The thief robbed the victim at knifepoint, so... Did he realise straight away, or later? He knew he was being robbed

Was the police called by the victim? Yes Did the thief try to escape after having stolen the wallet? If so, did the victim try to take the wallet back? No If so relevant how they came up being together again with a policeman? The thief and victim were not together in the presence of the police Did they fake to be friends? No That everything was ok? No
Relevant why the policeman talked to them? Because the victim reported the theft To fine them? To fine the victim?

Was something suspicious seen by police? No Or maybe the criminal realized that there were cameras on the street? No

When the victim was at knifepoint, were thief and victim talking to a policeman? No If so by phone? Directly? Were the two on the car's victim? On the street? This In a crowded place? Was the policeman able to see the knife? No

Were the two polite in a situation in which politeness was too strange? In the process of the robbery E.g. they were fined by policeman? No Did the victim try to communicate with the policeman (e.g. gestures/signs...) and asking for help in his/her politeness? Called the police after the robbery Did they meet the policeman? The victim did, relevantly Relevant where? It may help On the street? No

Politeness = turn on a light? Light up a cigarette? Accept to be fined? None of these Politeness toward the policeman? One to the other? This Toward a third person?

Or something like the criminal, an homeless seen by the policeman who walked down the street, faked to pay a meal to the victim. The policeman noticed before the absence of money in the hat where he was asking for money and knew that he had not. So he became suspect when he saw the man taking from his pocket the wallet to pay the lunch to the victim who kindly thanked the criminal being at knifepoint. Not a bad thought, but No
Balin
 
Posts: 6862
Joined: Fri May 23, 2014 11:12 pm
Location: Connecticut, USA

Re: [Balin] Politeness judo

Postby jumpingjacks » Tue Sep 11, 2018 5:46 pm

Good evening, it's always a pleasure to see you around these parts.
So the criminal was identified by his fingerprints. Did his act of politeness towards the victim involve touching something belonging to the victim? Did he touch a relevant object besides the wallet? Did he touch the victim's clothes? Touch the victim himself? Did he shake his hand? Perhaps while the victim was wearing gloves, thus leaving beautiful fingerprint marks on them?
As ever, I look forward to your reply with great interest.
User avatar
jumpingjacks
 
Posts: 948
Joined: Tue Jun 28, 2016 4:54 pm
Location: London, UK

Re: [Balin] Politeness judo

Postby Earnest » Tue Sep 11, 2018 7:03 pm

Was the act of politeness performed before the act of taking the wallet to the victim? During the act? After it? Shaking hands relevant? Touching each other? Did the thief force the victim to the act of politeness in order to escape? Bot to be noticed whike stealing the pocket? Was the act of politeness itself which allowed the thief to steal the wallet to the victim (e.g. it forced the victim to put hinself in a position such that the thief was able to steal the wallet in a simpler way) ? And the victim replied instinctively to that act?

I was thinking of something like: it was a rainy day and the victim was waiting for the bus at the bus stop. The thief took the wallet but as an act of politeness left to the victim some dollars to take the bus leaving the fingerprints on the cash...anyway this is an act of politeness just of the thief
Earnest
 
Posts: 1799
Joined: Tue May 30, 2017 7:52 am

Re: [Balin] Politeness judo

Postby Balin » Thu Sep 13, 2018 9:23 pm

Good evening, it's always a pleasure to see you around these parts. Good evening! My apologies for being so tardy in response.
So the criminal was identified by his fingerprints. Correct Did his act of politeness towards the victim involve touching something belonging to the victim? Yes Did he touch a relevant object besides the wallet? Yes Did he touch the victim's clothes? No Touch the victim himself? No
Did he shake his hand? Perhaps while the victim was wearing gloves, thus leaving beautiful fingerprint marks on them? Very nice idea, but a No all around
As ever, I look forward to your reply with great interest. Thank you; I hope these answers have been enlightening!

Was the act of politeness performed before the act of taking the victim's wallet? During the act? After it? A little of all of these, but I'll say primarily "during"
Shaking hands relevant? Touching each other? No to both
Did the thief force the victim to the act of politeness in order to escape? No Not to be noticed whike stealing the wallet? No Was the act of politeness itself which allowed the thief to steal the wallet from the victim Indirectly - although this may mislead (e.g. it forced the victim to put hinself in a position such that the thief was able to steal the wallet in a simpler way)? See prev And the victim replied instinctively to that act? No

I was thinking of something like: it was a rainy day and the victim was waiting for the bus at the bus stop. The thief took the wallet but as an act of politeness left to the victim some dollars to take the bus leaving the fingerprints on the cash...anyway this is an act of politeness just of the thief Not like this, although I like this idea
Balin
 
Posts: 6862
Joined: Fri May 23, 2014 11:12 pm
Location: Connecticut, USA

Re: [Balin] Politeness judo

Postby Earnest » Fri Sep 14, 2018 6:50 am

Did the thief win the trust of the victim? Something like the thief poured wine on the glass of the victim? Opened a door for the victim? Metro relevant? Is the thief just a thief or did he have a relevant profession? E.g. street performer?

Relevant where the fingerprints were? On the wallet? On an object of the victim?
Last edited by Earnest on Fri Sep 14, 2018 5:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Earnest
 
Posts: 1799
Joined: Tue May 30, 2017 7:52 am

Re: [Balin] Politeness judo

Postby jumpingjacks » Fri Sep 14, 2018 5:13 pm

Oh there's no need to apologise, please take all the time you need.
Was the victim perhaps holding something when he was stopped by the thief? Did he perhaps say, "Pardon me, good thief, but i am unable to retrieve my wallet, for you see, my hands are occupied"? And did the thief politely hold the object for him while he took his wallet out? Which left his fingerprints on it?
Or perhaps the victim was so startled by the thief, that he cried out in fear and dropped what he was holding, and with lightning-quick reflexes, the thief reached out and caught it before it hit the ground?
User avatar
jumpingjacks
 
Posts: 948
Joined: Tue Jun 28, 2016 4:54 pm
Location: London, UK

Re: [Balin] Politeness judo

Postby Balin » Sat Sep 15, 2018 2:05 am

Did the thief win the trust of the victim? No Something like the thief poured wine on the glass of the victim? Opened a door for the victim? Metro relevant? No to all Is the thief just a thief or did he have a relevant profession? Just a thief E.g. street performer? No

Relevant where the fingerprints were? On the wallet? On an object of the victim? This

Oh there's no need to apologise, please take all the time you need. Well, that won't be too much more time....
Was the victim perhaps holding something when he was stopped by the thief? Did he perhaps say, "Pardon me, good thief, but i am unable to retrieve my wallet, for you see, my hands are occupied"? And did the thief politely hold the object for him while he took his wallet out? Which left his fingerprints on it? Exactly so!
Or perhaps the victim was so startled by the thief, that he cried out in fear and dropped what he was holding, and with lightning-quick reflexes, the thief reached out and caught it before it hit the ground? Not this, but your prior guess was right on the mark. Congratulations!

****SPOILER****

(Quoting this directly from Reddit:)

My friend got mugged at university when he was walking back from the library at night holding a stack of books. He was held at knife point so he wanted to give the robber his wallet asap. Without thinking, my friend asked the robber to hold his books so he could get his wallet out. Weirdly, the robber obliged and kindly handed back the books after he got the wallet.
"My friend called the police when he was safely back at his dorm and told the story. They asked him "do you still have the books?" The police then fingerprinted the books and actually caught the guy!


Excellently solved Jackie, and well done to the rest of you diligent puzzlers. Have a wonderful evening, and I shall see you on another post.
Balin
 
Posts: 6862
Joined: Fri May 23, 2014 11:12 pm
Location: Connecticut, USA

Re: [Balin] Politeness judo (*BOOKED*)

Postby Earnest » Sat Sep 15, 2018 6:47 am

Great puzzle sir
Earnest
 
Posts: 1799
Joined: Tue May 30, 2017 7:52 am

Re: [Balin] Politeness judo (*BOOKED*)

Postby jumpingjacks » Sun Sep 16, 2018 3:46 am

Oh, what an honour 'tis to have solved your wonderful puzzle! Thank you very much, and I can't wait to play your next one.
User avatar
jumpingjacks
 
Posts: 948
Joined: Tue Jun 28, 2016 4:54 pm
Location: London, UK


Return to Solved Lateral Thinking Puzzles

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google Adsense [Bot] and 6 guests