[IrishElk] Dante's Inferno

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[IrishElk] Dante's Inferno

Postby irishelk » Fri Nov 30, 2018 2:10 pm

90 minutes was such a short time, given that 90 minutes was such a long time!
Last edited by irishelk on Sat Feb 16, 2019 5:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: [IrishElk] Dante's Inferno

Postby GalFisk » Fri Nov 30, 2018 5:12 pm

Were they both the same period of 90 minutes? Was it short for one person and long for another? Did one person make another miserable? Happy? Children relevant? TV?
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Re: [IrishElk] Dante's Inferno

Postby wolfier » Fri Nov 30, 2018 6:58 pm

Is it about a football (soccer) match? Is it about a movie?
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Re: [IrishElk] Dante's Inferno

Postby irishelk » Sat Dec 01, 2018 3:16 pm

GalFisk

Were they both the same period of 90 minutes? No. Was it short for one person and long for another? Noish. Did one person make another miserable? At one point. Happy? At one point. Children relevant? No. TV? No.


wolfier

Is it about a football (soccer) match? No. Is it about a movie? No.
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Re: [IrishElk] Dante's Inferno

Postby Balin » Sat Dec 01, 2018 8:39 pm

Did the same person (or people) experience both periods of 90 minutes?
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Re: [IrishElk] Dante's Inferno

Postby GalFisk » Sat Dec 01, 2018 9:22 pm

Did the same person make another miserable and happy? Was the same person made miserable and happy? Was the misery before the happiness? Was the misery caused intentionaly? The happiness?
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Re: [IrishElk] Dante's Inferno

Postby irishelk » Wed Dec 05, 2018 3:03 pm

Balin

Did the same person (or people) experience both periods of 90 minutes? One person was present for both.


GalFisk

Did the same person make another miserable and happy? No. Was the same person made miserable and happy? Yope to noish. Was the misery before the happiness? Yes. Was the misery caused intentionaly? Yes. The happiness? Yes.

These questions might lead you off-track, as it is based on a true story, and it's hard to determine which persons were happy and unhappy, when, and to what extent.
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Re: [IrishElk] Dante's Inferno

Postby wolfier » Wed Dec 05, 2018 4:07 pm

First the misery, then the happiness, is there any sadness after that?
Is it the same person who experiences misery and happiness, also the person who are present in both of the 90 minute periods?
Do these two 90 minute periods have overlap? If not, are they seconds/minutes/hours/... apart?
Is an event involving birth or death relevant?
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Re: [IrishElk] Dante's Inferno

Postby irishelk » Wed Dec 05, 2018 4:41 pm

wolfier

First the misery, then the happiness, is there any sadness after that? Most likely--it is hard to determine the emotional state of everyone involved.
Is it the same person who experiences misery and happiness, also the person who are present in both of the 90 minute periods? The same person might have experienced all three, but again, the emotions are hard to determine.
Do these two 90 minute periods have overlap? No. If not, are they seconds/minutes/hours/... apart? Nearly a year.
Is an event involving birth or death relevant? Yes, death.
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Re: [IrishElk] Dante's Inferno

Postby trebor » Thu Dec 06, 2018 6:42 am

Is one of the 90-minute intervals a funeral? Is it the lifespan of someone involved?

The 90 minutes that was a long time, was it a long time to: suffer? Complete something? Wait? Same questions for the short time.
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Re: [IrishElk] Dante's Inferno

Postby irishelk » Fri Dec 07, 2018 1:05 pm

trebor

Is one of the 90-minute intervals a funeral? No. Is it the lifespan of someone involved? No.

The 90 minutes that was a long time, was it a long time to: suffer? No. Complete something? Yes. Wait? Yes.

Same questions for the short time: was it a short time to: suffer? Possibly for one person. Complete something? For one party, yes. Wait? For one person, yes.
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Re: [IrishElk] Dante's Inferno

Postby Balin » Fri Dec 07, 2018 8:10 pm

Is inheritance relevant?
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Re: [IrishElk] Dante's Inferno

Postby irishelk » Sat Dec 08, 2018 2:23 pm

Balin

Is inheritance relevant? Only indirectly.
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Re: [IrishElk] Dante's Inferno

Postby trebor » Sun Dec 09, 2018 4:52 pm

Was one person waiting for news regarding another person?

Are there two people pertinent to this puzzle? Two to five? More than five?
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Re: [IrishElk] Dante's Inferno

Postby irishelk » Mon Dec 10, 2018 11:09 pm

trebor

Was one person waiting for news regarding another person? Not directly.

Are there two people pertinent to this puzzle? Two to five? More than five? This: about 15 directly, others indirectly.
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Re: [IrishElk] Dante's Inferno

Postby trebor » Fri Dec 14, 2018 7:07 pm

Are the 15 people related to each other? Does somebody die within the course of this puzzle? Before it? After? Is the death of a human relevant at all? The death of another animal? Death as a concept in general?

Is the person who was present for both periods one of the people who was waiting (if that makes sense)? Is organ donation involved? Another medical procedure? A diagnosis? Is one of the people involved here a medical professional?
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Re: [IrishElk] Dante's Inferno

Postby irishelk » Sat Dec 15, 2018 10:07 pm

trebor

Are the 15 people related to each other? Three of them are. Does somebody die within the course of this puzzle? Yes. Before it? After? Is the death of a human relevant at all? Yes. The death of another animal? Death as a concept in general? No to rest.

Is the person who was present for both periods one of the people who was waiting (if that makes sense)? It does, and yes. Is organ donation involved? Another medical procedure? A diagnosis? Is one of the people involved here a medical professional? No to rest.
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Re: [IrishElk] Dante's Inferno

Postby trebor » Sat Dec 15, 2018 10:59 pm

Is the person who dies the one present for both periods? Are they a HAM? Relevant?
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Re: [IrishElk] Dante's Inferno

Postby irishelk » Sun Dec 16, 2018 2:12 pm

trebor

Is the person who dies the one present for both periods? No. Are they a HAM? Yope, slight FA. Relevant? A bit, yes.
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Re: [IrishElk] Dante's Inferno

Postby trebor » Thu Dec 20, 2018 12:13 am

Does more ham one person die?
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Re: [IrishElk] Dante's Inferno

Postby irishelk » Tue Dec 25, 2018 2:21 pm

trebor

Does more than one person die? Yes--one HAM, one HAF.
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Re: [IrishElk] Dante's Inferno

Postby trebor » Mon Dec 31, 2018 6:26 pm

Are the methods of death relevant? Is either of them accidental? Murder? Suicide?
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Re: [IrishElk] Dante's Inferno

Postby irishelk » Tue Jan 01, 2019 3:08 pm

trebor

Are the methods of death relevant? Yes indeed. Is either of them accidental? Murder? Both are this. Suicide?


************************SHORT RECAP/CLARIFICATION

So, the statement refers to two separate 90-minute periods that occurred nearly a year apart from one another. The first 90 minutes was a long time to complete something and to wait. The second 90 minutes was a short time to complete something and to wait. Only one person was relevantly present for both periods; during the second period, that person was waiting while another party completed something.

This puzzle involves the murders of a man and a woman. It is a true story.
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Re: [IrishElk] Dante's Inferno

Postby KayleeArafinwiel » Thu Jan 03, 2019 5:16 pm

Were the 90 minute periods the murders? Was the one relevant person present for both the murderer? An accomplice?
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Re: [IrishElk] Dante's Inferno

Postby trebor » Thu Jan 03, 2019 8:12 pm

Did the second victim murder the first one? Murder method relevant? Motive? Love triangle?
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Re: [IrishElk] Dante's Inferno

Postby irishelk » Fri Jan 04, 2019 1:46 pm

KayleeArafinwiel

Were the 90 minute periods the murders? One was. Was the one relevant person present for both the murderer? Possibly. An accomplice? Possibly.


trebor

Did the second victim murder the first one? No. Murder method relevant? No, but it might help. Motive? No--it's unknown. Love triangle? Unlikely.
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Re: [IrishElk] Dante's Inferno

Postby Hobbsicle » Sun Jan 13, 2019 6:23 pm

First 90 minutes: how long it took for the people to die? How long it took for the murderer to kill them? How long it took for the police to arrive? Is a fight relevant? Does this take place inside? Outside? Day? Night? In a relevant country? At a relevant location?

Second 90 minutes: how long the trial lasted? Something else related to the justice process?
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Re: [IrishElk] Dante's Inferno

Postby trebor » Sat Jan 26, 2019 1:53 am

So we have about fifteen people directly involved, of which two are murder victims and one is the murderer, correct? Could the remaining twelve possibly be a jury?

Is the length of jury deliberation relevant? Perhaps it took them only 90 minutes to arrive at a verdict? If not that, is sentencing relevant? Another aspect of the legal proceedings?
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Re: [IrishElk] Dante's Inferno

Postby irishelk » Sat Jan 26, 2019 2:59 pm

Hobbsicle

First 90 minutes: how long it took for the people to die? Noish. How long it took for the murderer to kill them? Yesish! Explore. How long it took for the police to arrive? No. Is a fight relevant? No. Does this take place inside? This. Outside? Day? This. Night? In a relevant country? US, only vaguely relevant. At a relevant location? Yes, two.

Second 90 minutes: how long the trial lasted? Yesish, see below. Something else related to the justice process? Yes.


trebor

So we have about fifteen people directly involved, of which two are murder victims and one is the murderer, correct? Yep. Could the remaining twelve possibly be a jury? Exactly. =)

Is the length of jury deliberation relevant? Yes. Perhaps it took them only 90 minutes to arrive at a verdict? Yes! If not that, is sentencing relevant? Another aspect of the legal proceedings?

Nice questions, both of you. You've figured out the "short" 90 minutes and are circling around the "long" 90.
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Re: [IrishElk] Dante's Inferno

Postby trebor » Wed Feb 06, 2019 12:45 am

The murder method doesn't really matter, but something about how long it took for the murderer to commit the murder is worth exploring. Hmmm. Did the murderer have to spend time preparing for the kills? Did he have to set things in motion and then wait 90 minutes? Did he kill one, and then 90 minutes later kill the other?
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Re: [IrishElk] Dante's Inferno

Postby Balin » Wed Feb 06, 2019 9:17 pm

Does the "long" 90 minutes also take place in the courtroom? Does it take place before the murders? During/between? After? At the time of the murderer's arrest? After?
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Re: [IrishElk] Dante's Inferno

Postby irishelk » Wed Feb 06, 2019 9:40 pm

trebor

The murder method doesn't really matter, but something about how long it took for the murderer to commit the murder is worth exploring. Hmmm. Did the murderer have to spend time preparing for the kills? Irr.Did he have to set things in motion and then wait 90 minutes? No. Did he kill one, and then 90 minutes later kill the other? Yes!

Minor FA in these qs, which doesn't really matter but might help you to resolve.
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Re: [IrishElk] Dante's Inferno

Postby trebor » Wed Feb 06, 2019 9:54 pm

Is it relevant why the deaths weren’t simultaneous? Were the victims a couple? Had he broken into their home? If so, was the second victim out, and so the murderer had to wait for their return? Relevant which was killed first, the male or the female? Is the gender of the murderer relevant?
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Re: [IrishElk] Dante's Inferno

Postby irishelk » Mon Feb 11, 2019 4:25 pm

trebor

Is it relevant why the deaths weren’t simultaneous? Yesish. Very relevant that they weren't. Were the victims a couple? Yes. Had he broken into their home? Great question. Unknown. If so, was the second victim out, and so the murderer had to wait for their return? Yes--this is the case whether there was a break-in or not. Relevant which was killed first, the male or the female? No, but the wife was killed first. Is the gender of the murderer relevant? Not in itself, but this is under dispute.

:? Sorry for vague answers, but it is a true story and the vaguery is part of the solution.
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Re: [IrishElk] Dante's Inferno

Postby Hobbsicle » Thu Feb 14, 2019 5:37 pm

So I’m gathering that the jury deliberation and sentencing was rather hasty, given the unusual facts of the case that might suggest that whatever story they were given by the prosecutor doesn’t quite fit, and the anomaly hinges around this 90 minutes between killing the two people. Correct?

Is there a prior connection between the accused and the victims? Is it unlikely that he would have been there for the sole purpose of killing both of them? Was he out to kill only one? Was he a burglar? And thus waiting around for an hour and a half at your own crime scene was unlikely?
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Re: [IrishElk] Dante's Inferno

Postby trebor » Sat Feb 16, 2019 1:05 am

The gender is under dispute? Is the murderer unknown? Is the murderer transgender (in which case I would certainly say their gender is whatever the label themselves as)? Does the speed of the sentencing have to do with the thought that neither male nor female penitentiaries would be safe for them?
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Re: [IrishElk] Dante's Inferno

Postby irishelk » Sat Feb 16, 2019 5:02 pm

Hobbsicle

So I’m gathering that the jury deliberation and sentencing was rather hasty, given the unusual facts of the case that might suggest that whatever story they were given by the prosecutor doesn’t quite fit, and the anomaly hinges around this 90 minutes between killing the two people. Correct? Yes!

Is there a prior connection between the accused and the victims? Is it unlikely that he would have been there for the sole purpose of killing both of them? Was he out to kill only one? Was he a burglar? And thus waiting around for an hour and a half at your own crime scene was unlikely? You got it!


trebor
The gender is under dispute? Is the murderer unknown? This. Is the murderer transgender (in which case I would certainly say their gender is whatever the label themselves as)? Very true, but in this case irr. =)


******************SPOILER

This concerns Lizzie Borden, of (allegedly) taking-an axe-and-giving-her-parents-several-whacks fame. She was arrested for her parents' murder, but acquitted by a jury. No one has ever been convicted for the murders, hence my many ish-y answers about the murderer.

According to the coroner, there was an hour and a half gap between the murder of Lizzie's stepmother and her father. This immediately casts suspicion on her, as she was in their family house the whole time. Why would a murderer have stuck around and waited that whole time to kill the father? And why would they spare Lizzie, who supposedly didn't see her stepmother's body or anything suspicious for that whole 90 minutes?

Given that strangely long gap, it's remarkable that the jury took the same amount of time, just 90 minutes, to acquit her.
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