[IrishElk] Before a Fall

[irishelk]

Mandy pretends that she has done something embarrassing that she has not actually done, but she does this because of pride. What is it?

[trebor]

Is she trying to save the reputation of someone who has done the thing? Has anyone done the particular embarrassing thing she is claiming?

Does she do this at work? At home? At a recreational activity? At school? Is she a HA?

[CoffeeBean]

Would the thing have embarrassed Mandy herself? Another person? Mandy as well as another person? Other people?

Does the embarrassing thing involve interacting with another person? With an object? Saying something? Performing an action? Going to a specific place?

Does another person or people assume that Mandy has done the embarrassing thing before she pretends that she has done it? Does Mandy tell another person or people that she has done it?

Is it relevant or helpful to know how many people are involved in the situation? Is it just between Mandy and one other person? Mandy among a small group of people? Mandy and the whole world?

[irishelk]

trebor

Is she trying to save the reputation of someone who has done the thing? No. Has anyone done the particular embarrassing thing she is claiming? No, good q.

Does she do this at work? At home? At a recreational activity? Closest to this. At school?
Is she a HA? Yes.


CoffeeBean

Would the thing have embarrassed Mandy herself? Normally, yes, probably. Another person? Mandy as well as another person? Other people? It's only really embarrassing to the person who does it.

Does the embarrassing thing involve interacting with another person? No. With an object? Yes. Saying something? No. Performing an action? Yesish. Going to a specific place? It happens in a specific place.

Does another person or people assume that Mandy has done the embarrassing thing before she pretends that she has done it? No. Does Mandy tell another person or people that she has done it? Yes.

Is it relevant or helpful to know how many people are involved in the situation? Not specifically. Is it just between Mandy and one other person? Mandy among a small group of people? This. Mandy and the whole world?

[Earnest]

Is burping involved? Is any physical disease/discomfort relevant?
Was she performing a relevant action? E.g. eating? sleeping? cutting? talking? playing? cooking? chatting? using the phone? making pictures? others?

By pretending to have done the something embarrassing is she trying to save her reputation? To avoid that others think that she has done something else for other reasons? I mean, she has done ambiguous action A and was seen by others. For saving appearances/her reputation she pretended to have done action E (embarrassing). If so, was she seen by others doing action A? By someone in particular? Her son? Her husband? A friend? Is action A a crime? a joke? something that she wants to keep secret? a surprise?

Is her job relevant? Sexy shop relevant? Potentially embarrassing places?
Is Mandy famous? Public personality relevant?
Mandy pretends that she has done something embarrassing that she has not actually done --> did she openly. claimed it? Or maybe she let someone else think that she has done something embarrassing (e.g. she knew to be spied/photographed)?

WAG--> She is a spy and was caught in a motel with another man. She was making an interrogation to the man and to keep the secret she let others think that she was betraying her husband. Something along these lines?

[irishelk]

Earnest

Is burping involved? No. Is any physical disease/discomfort relevant? No.
Was she performing a relevant action? Yes, or at least she says she was. E.g. eating? sleeping? cutting? talking? playing? cooking? chatting? using the phone? Yope--this is relevant. making pictures? others? Yes.

By pretending to have done the something embarrassing is she trying to save her reputation? Yes. To avoid that others think that she has done something else for other reasons? OTRT. I mean, she has done ambiguous action A and was seen by others. For saving appearances/her reputation she pretended to have done action E (embarrassing). This is not exactly the situation. If so, was she seen by others doing action A? By someone in particular? Her son? Her husband? A friend? Friends are present and see some of the relevant actions. Is action A a crime? a joke? something that she wants to keep secret? a surprise? What occurs in front of others is none of these.

Is her job relevant? No. Sexy shop relevant? No. Potentially embarrassing places? Yes.
Is Mandy famous? No. Public personality relevant? No.
Mandy pretends that she has done something embarrassing that she has not actually done --> did she openly. claimed it? Yes. Or maybe she let someone else think that she has done something embarrassing (e.g. she knew to be spied/photographed)?

WAG--> She is a spy and was caught in a motel with another man. She was making an interrogation to the man and to keep the secret she let others think that she was betraying her husband. Something along these lines? No, nothing this exciting.

[Earnest]

using the phone? Yope--this is relevant --> to be sure: are we talking about her phone? The phone of someone else? Her boyfriend? a friend? Relevant? Action with the phone: social media relevant? checking email? checking messages? Deleting pictures? cheating rules? checking the web? Is she performing something with the "software" or with the "hardware"? I mean is she using the phone as a physical object or for what it can be done with the phone? is the action performed with the phone the embracing one? the one she claimed to have done? The other one?

[trebor]

Had she actually done something that was worse than whatever she claimed to have done? Was the lie to cover her tracks somehow? Did it establish an alibi for her? If she hadn't claimed the embarrassing action would the damage to her reputation be: mild? Moderate? Severe? Would it result in the loss of friends? The loss of romantic relationships? A professional setback? A setback related to whatever the recreational activity is?

Does the pretending involve telling someone(s) verbally that she did the thing? Writing it down? (If so, on the phone?) Performing an action? Faking an action?

Is the recreational activity related to: sports/athletics? Music? Drama? Other arts? A book club? Social circle? AA? A religious group? Political organization? Special interest organization? Do you do this activity outdoors? Indoors?

[irishelk]

Earnest

using the phone? Yope--this is relevant --> to be sure: are we talking about her phone? Yes. The phone of someone else? Her boyfriend? a friend? Relevant? Somewhat.
Action with the phone: social media relevant? checking email? checking messages? Deleting pictures? cheating rules? checking the web? None of these, and while it's technically an 'action,' that's an odd word for what happens.
Is she performing something with the "software" or with the "hardware"? For what she pretends to have done? Mostly the hardware. I mean is she using the phone as a physical object or for what it can be done with the phone? Mostly the former. is the action performed with the phone the embracing one? Not sure what you mean? the one she claimed to have done? The other one?


trebor

Had she actually done something that was worse than whatever she claimed to have done? No. Was the lie to cover her tracks somehow? Not really. Did it establish an alibi for her? No. If she hadn't claimed the embarrassing action would the damage to her reputation be: mild? Moderate? Severe? Hard to say, would depend on the person. Would it result in the loss of friends? The loss of romantic relationships? A professional setback? Irr, though she might fear these consequences. A setback related to whatever the recreational activity is? No.

Does the pretending involve telling someone(s) verbally that she did the thing? Yes. Writing it down? (If so, on the phone?) No. Performing an action? No. Faking an action? Only by saying that is happened.

Is the recreational activity (It's only this in a very loose sense) related to: sports/athletics? Music? Drama? Other arts? A book club? Social circle? This. AA? A religious group? Political organization? Special interest organization? Do you do this activity outdoors? Indoors? Could be either, but they are indoors.

[Balin]

Is the social circle linked by a common hobby? Activity? Location? Occupation? Age? Gender?

[irishelk]

Balin

Is the social circle linked by a common hobby? Activity? Location? Occupation? Age? Gender? Not really relevant, they are friends in the same location.

[markobr]

Noone has done the embarrassing thing: Nobody ever? Or just nobody of much relevance in the situation? Have there been any people who actually did the embarrassing thing anywhere, ever? If so: Only people (geographically) far away of Mandy? Only people living way before Mandy? Only people socially far away of Mandy?

Is Mandy actually H?A?F? (From the answers we know, it surely looks like that, bun well, you never know...)

Is the relevant thing embarrassing because it is percieved as: immoral? stupid? unnecessary? Contrary to what Mandy usually would value? Illegal? Simply a waste of time?

[trebor]

Is Mandy out with friends having a drink? Do they have a rule like whoever touches their phone first foots the bill for everyone? Is talking on the phone relevant? Checking the time? Paying for something? Did she tell her friends she had already done whatever the thing was with the phone, when in fact she hadn't? Perhaps one of her friends was like, "Oh, did you tell [mutual friend] that our plans changed and we're meeting here now?" and Mandy had to lie about it for some reason?

[wunderland]

Is the 'action' with the phone: buying it? selling it? lending it to someone? touching it? looking at it? ignoring it? carrying it? leaving it behind somewhere? losing it? damaging it?
Is the 'action' with the phone the embarrassing thing that she pretends to have done? or part of it? Or is it something she actually does?

[irishelk]

markobr

Noone has done the embarrassing thing: Nobody ever? No. Or just nobody of much relevance in the situation? Yes. Have there been any people who actually did the embarrassing thing anywhere, ever? Oh definitely. If so: Only people (geographically) far away of Mandy? Only people living way before Mandy? Only people socially far away of Mandy? No/irr.

Is Mandy actually H?A?F? (From the answers we know, it surely looks like that, bun well, you never know...) Yes.

Is the relevant thing embarrassing because it is percieved as: immoral? stupid? This is closest. unnecessary? Contrary to what Mandy usually would value? Illegal? Simply a waste of time?


trebor

Is Mandy out with friends having a drink? No. Do they have a rule like whoever touches their phone first foots the bill for everyone? No, interesting thought. Is talking on the phone relevant? Checking the time? Paying for something? No to all.
Did she tell her friends she had already done whatever the thing was with the phone, when in fact she hadn't? Yes. Perhaps one of her friends was like, "Oh, did you tell [mutual friend] that our plans changed and we're meeting here now?" and Mandy had to lie about it for some reason? Nothing like this.


wunderland

Is the 'action' with the phone: buying it? selling it? lending it to someone? touching it? looking at it? ignoring it? carrying it? leaving it behind somewhere? losing it? Sort of/nearly. damaging it? YES.
Is the 'action' with the phone the embarrassing thing that she pretends to have done? Yes. or part of it? Or is it something she actually does? No.

[wunderland]

Does she pretend to have dropped the phone in a toilet?
Does she claim that the phone is not working at all, as a result of the damage?
Is the phone actually damaged, but in a different way than she is pretending?
Is she trying to prevent someone else from using her phone? or to explain why she isn't using it herself?

[irishelk]

wunderland

Does she pretend to have dropped the phone in a toilet? Yes! Nice one.
Does she claim that the phone is not working at all, as a result of the damage? Not necessarily.
Is the phone actually damaged, but in a different way than she is pretending? No.
Is she trying to prevent someone else from using her phone? or to explain why she isn't using it herself? No.

[Balin]

So she is relevantly not using her phone, correct?
Is her and her friends' location relevant? Is everyone else using her phone?
Does Mandy actually have her phone on her while with her friends? Relevant?

[irishelk]

Balin

So she is relevantly not using her phone, correct? Correct.
Is her and her friends' location relevant? Yes. Is everyone else using her phone? No.
Does Mandy actually have her phone on her while with her friends? Yes. Relevant? Yes.

[Balin]

(Just to correct a typo in that set that changed the question:)
...Is everyone else using their phones?

Are they in public? Indoors? Outdoors? At someone else's house?
Is Mandy's phone functioning properly? Is it out of battery?

[irishelk]

Balin

(Just to correct a typo in that set that changed the question:)
...Is everyone else using their phones? Ah. Irr.

Are they in public? Indoors? Outdoors? This. At someone else's house? Yes.
Is Mandy's phone functioning properly? Yes/irr. Is it out of battery? Irr.

[wunderland]

Does she take a break from the "recreational activity" to use the bathroom, and return claiming to have dropped her phone in the toilet just then? or does she just claim to have dropped it in a toilet at some point in the past?

Are they having a barbecue? / garden party?

[irishelk]

wunderland

Does she take a break from the "recreational activity" to use the bathroom, and return claiming to have dropped her phone in the toilet just then? Yes. or does she just claim to have dropped it in a toilet at some point in the past? No.

Are they having a barbecue? / garden party? Either of these work.

[wunderland]

So she still has the phone with her when she returns, correct?
Can the others see the phone?
Does she do something relevant after she returns (other than claiming to have dropped the phone in the toilet)? If so, does that something also involve the phone? and is she trying to explain this action?
Is she trying to explain something about the phone's condition?
Is she trying to explain the length of her absence?
Does she want the others to do something? say something?

[trebor]

Had her bathroom visit been particularly noisy? Had she blocked the toilet? Was there something else notable about her time in the bathroom? Had she dropped the phone in something else? Spilled something on it? Was her phone functional when she came back to the group?

Had she been trying to text someone to give her an excuse to leave the gathering?

[irishelk]

wunderland

So she still has the phone with her when she returns, correct? Yes.
Can the others see the phone? Yes.
Does she do something relevant after she returns (other than claiming to have dropped the phone in the toilet)? Not exactly, or not immediately. If so, does that something also involve the phone? Something else happens with the phone. and is she trying to explain this action?
Is she trying to explain something about the phone's condition? No.
Is she trying to explain the length of her absence? No.
Does she want the others to do something? Yesish. say something? This would likely be part of the 'doing something.'


trebor

Had her bathroom visit been particularly noisy? Had she blocked the toilet? Was there something else notable about her time in the bathroom? Had she dropped the phone in something else? Spilled something on it? No to all.
Was her phone functional when she came back to the group? Yes.

Had she been trying to text someone to give her an excuse to leave the gathering? No.

[wunderland]

Does she ask someone to call her phone to see if it's still working? If so, is her real motivation to discover the person's phone number?

[irishelk]

wunderland

Does she ask someone to call her phone to see if it's still working? No. If so, is her real motivation to discover the person's phone number? No, good guess.

[Balin]

Does she make a phone call during the bathroom trip?

[irishelk]

Balin

Does she make a phone call during the bathroom trip? No.

[trebor]

Something else happens with the phone. Does she give it to someone else? Does someone else take it from her? Does she relevantly make/receive a call? Text someone? Check social media? Send receive/an email? Play a game?

Is the topic of conversation with the group relevant? Are any pets relevant? Is it relevant how they know each other?

This may be out of the blue, but is sexting/taking risque selfies relevant?

[irishelk]

trebor

Something else happens with the phone. Yep. Does she give it to someone else? Does someone else take it from her? Probably, briefly. Does she relevantly make/receive a call? Text someone? Check social media? Send receive/an email? Play a game? No to rest.

Is the topic of conversation with the group relevant? No. Are any pets relevant? No. Is it relevant how they know each other? No, assume pretty close friend group.

This may be out of the blue, but is sexting/taking risque selfies relevant? No, but good idea.

[raevenclaw]

does someone ask her if she had dropped her phone in the toilet? if something happened to her phone? does mandy actively claim she dropped her phone in the toilet without prompting? relevant?

[trebor]

Does she take a picture with the phone? Does someone else? If so, does “ Does she want the others to do something? Yesish. say something? This would likely be part of the 'doing something.'” relate to posing/saying cheese?

[irishelk]

raevenclaw

does someone ask her if she had dropped her phone in the toilet? if something happened to her phone? No. does mandy actively claim she dropped her phone in the toilet without prompting? Yes. relevant? It could still work if someone asked, but less likely.


trebor

Does she take a picture with the phone? No. Does someone else? No. If so, does “ Does she want the others to do something? Yesish. say something? This would likely be part of the 'doing something.'” relate to posing/saying cheese? No.

[wunderland]

If someone briefly takes the phone from her, does this happen before she claims to have dropped it in the toilet? or after? Do they do this because she asks them to? Does she want them to?
Does she ask for something to clean the phone? which she actually wants for some other purpose?
Does she visibly (to her friends) clean the phone herself?

[irishelk]

wunderland

If someone briefly takes the phone from her, does this happen before she claims to have dropped it in the toilet? or after? This. Do they do this because she asks them to? She might, or they might suggest it, irr. Does she want them to? Yes.
Does she ask for something to clean the phone? Not clean exactly, but OTRT. which she actually wants for some other purpose? Yes.
Does she visibly (to her friends) clean the phone herself? Not clean, but what happens does actually publicly occur, yes.

[wunderland]

Did she ask for something to dry the phone? Rice? Are she and her friends relevantly eating rice?

[trebor]

Is Mandy going through some food scarcity? Maybe financial hardship too? And she is trying to get some food without directly explaining her situation?

[irishelk]

wunderland

Did she ask for something to dry the phone? Rice? Are she and her friends relevantly eating rice?


trebor

Is Mandy going through some food scarcity? Maybe financial hardship too? And she is trying to get some food without directly explaining her situation?

Wunderland and trebor for the win!

***********************SPOILER

Mandy is experiencing poverty and is having trouble buying even food essentials, but is too proud to admit this to friends. While hanging out at a friend's house, she returns from the bathroom and claims that she accidentally dropped her phone in the toilet. Everyone present gives the standard advice, which is to let it dry in a big bag of rice for at least 12 hours. Her friend is happy to provide this, so she slips her (actually clean) phone into the bag and goes home with dinner for several days.

[Balin]

Clever!!