[IrishElk] Two Up, One Down

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[IrishElk] Two Up, One Down

Postby irishelk » Sun Jan 27, 2019 4:38 pm

I'd noticed that the rule was "two up, one down" at the mall, but I didn't know why. However, when I realized the reason, it made sense. Can you figure it out?
Last edited by irishelk on Sat Mar 23, 2019 1:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: [IrishElk] Two Up, One Down

Postby WiZ » Sun Jan 27, 2019 7:21 pm

I've sent you a PM. I had an idea which makes a little too much sense to be posted as a WAG.
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Re: [IrishElk] Two Up, One Down

Postby JenBurdoo » Sun Jan 27, 2019 9:06 pm

Anything to do with escalators?
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Re: [IrishElk] Two Up, One Down

Postby Earnest » Mon Jan 28, 2019 9:26 am

Parking lots relevant? Arrows? Pressing buttons? Products allocation? Up and down = with respect to the ground? To a floor? In general as directions?

Is two up and one down referred to: hand movements?
Is it two [of something] up and one [of something] down or "if the number is two, do up, while if the number is one, do down"? If the latter are money relevant? Money put in carts? (E.g. different size of money)
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Re: [IrishElk] Two Up, One Down

Postby irishelk » Mon Jan 28, 2019 7:31 pm

WiZ

I've sent you a PM. I had an idea which makes a little too much sense to be posted as a WAG. Hm, for some reason I didn't get it. But if it still seems right given the answers below, go ahead and post! I'd be honored by a one-post WiZ solve. :mrgreen:


JenBurdoo

Anything to do with escalators? Yes!


Earnest

Parking lots relevant? Arrows? Pressing buttons? Products allocation? No to these. Up and down = with respect to the ground? To a floor? Yesish.In general as directions?

Is two up and one down referred to: hand movements? No.
Is it two [of something] up and one [of something] down Yes. or "if the number is two, do up, while if the number is one, do down"?If the latter are money relevant? Money put in carts? (E.g. different size of money) No to rest.
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Re: [IrishElk] Two Up, One Down

Postby WiZ » Mon Jan 28, 2019 7:34 pm

Hmm. It's not in my Sent folder. Admittedly, I was trying to do a lot of things at once at the time.

My PM was in the vein o
f "Is it because one usually finds two up escalators and one down escalator, the logic being that it is far easier to walk down a (non-moving) staircase than up one (especially considering mobility concerns)?"
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Re: [IrishElk] Two Up, One Down

Postby irishelk » Sun Feb 03, 2019 4:42 pm

WiZ

My PM was in the vein of "Is it because one usually finds two up escalators and one down escalator, Yesish...
the logic being that it is far easier to walk down a (non-moving) staircase than up one (especially considering mobility concerns)?" But in this case, for a different reason.
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Re: [IrishElk] Two Up, One Down

Postby Balin » Wed Feb 06, 2019 9:14 pm

So does the "two up, one down" rule mean that in a location with escalators, there are two going up and one going down?
Is the width of the escalators relevant?
Are there any staircases beside the escalators as well?
Is the tendency of people to walk along with an escalator's movement relevant? If so, going up? Going down?
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Re: [IrishElk] Two Up, One Down

Postby irishelk » Wed Feb 06, 2019 9:41 pm

Balin

So does the "two up, one down" rule mean that in a location with escalators, there are two going up and one going down? Yesish.
Is the width of the escalators relevant? No.
Are there any staircases beside the escalators as well? Irr.
Is the tendency of people to walk along with an escalator's movement relevant? No. If so, going up? Going down?
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Re: [IrishElk] Two Up, One Down

Postby GalFisk » Sat Feb 09, 2019 7:24 am

Other meanings of up and down relevant? Such as up=functional? Down=non-functional? Stairs relevant? Elevators? Is the point of the rule to optimize the flow of people?
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Re: [IrishElk] Two Up, One Down

Postby Earnest » Sat Feb 09, 2019 9:01 am

Oh wow I though this one was solved!

I guess we are referring to escalators since elevators can go in both directions right? If so, is the down escalator between the two up escalators?, like U D U? Or D U U? U U D? Or any order is fine? Or they are not even close one to the other? Are there also a normal stairs near the escalators? Is the location of the mall's entrance relevant? Of the exit? Or is it a rule that applies regardless of the location of escalators?
Is it a rule specific to a mall or can it be easily generalized to all malls? Is it for safety reasons? Kind of avoiding thefts to occur? People to escape? Possible interactions among people in the escalators relevant? Had it been two down one up would it work? Is it more the people going uo than the ones going down? Are the two escalators going up identic? Reserved to anyone? Is object transportation on escalators relevant?

Is the possibility of using om escalator whem the other is broken relevant?
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Re: [IrishElk] Two Up, One Down

Postby irishelk » Mon Feb 11, 2019 4:16 pm

GalFisk

Other meanings of up and down relevant? No. Such as up=functional? Down=non-functional? Stairs relevant? Elevators? No to all.
Is the point of the rule to optimize the flow of people? Yes.


Earnest

Oh wow I though this one was solved! No, though WiZ made a huge leap!

I guess we are referring to escalators since elevators can go in both directions right? Correct. If so, is the down escalator between the two up escalators?, like U D U? Or D U U? U U D? Or any order is fine? This. Or they are not even close one to the other? They are, but irr. Are there also a normal stairs near the escalators? Irr.
Is the location of the mall's entrance relevant? Yesish. Of the exit? Yesish, explore. Or is it a rule that applies regardless of the location of escalators? It would apply regardless of their location within the mall, yes.
Is it a rule specific to a mall Yes, good question! or can it be easily generalized to all malls? NO.
Is it for safety reasons? Kind of avoiding thefts to occur? People to escape? Possible interactions among people in the escalators relevant? No to all.
Had it been two down one up would it work? No.
Is it more the people going up than the ones going down? Yope. Are the two escalators going up identical? Yes. Reserved to anyone? No. Is object transportation on escalators relevant? No.

Is the possibility of using one escalator when the other is broken relevant? Not specifically, though this would be an added benefit.
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Re: [IrishElk] Two Up, One Down

Postby GalFisk » Mon Feb 11, 2019 5:04 pm

Parking relevant? Parking garages? Doe the mall have more than one entrance and exit? Does the rule encourage people to move in a certain way? Is optimizing flow the only reason? Or does it increase sales? Make people see more stores? More signs? Get lost? Get less lost? Does it encourage people to spread equally on both levels? To exit through the same door they entered? Through a different one?
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Re: [IrishElk] Two Up, One Down

Postby irishelk » Sun Feb 17, 2019 12:28 pm

GalFisk

Parking relevant? Parking garages? No.
Does the mall have more than one entrance and exit? Yes. Does the rule encourage people to move in a certain way? Not "encourage" so much as help. Is optimizing flow the only reason? Yes. Or does it increase sales? Make people see more stores? More signs? Get lost? Get less lost? Does it encourage people to spread equally on both levels? To exit through the same door they entered? No to these.
Through a different one? No, but they relevantly do this.
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Re: [IrishElk] Two Up, One Down

Postby Earnest » Mon Feb 18, 2019 7:59 am

Can we assume that the escalators (both the two up and the one down) are on the same floor? If not, are the the two up on different floors? Are all of the three on different floors? Is a specific one up associated to the one down? Are there also normal stairs/elevators? Is the one down starting outside of the mall and the one up inside it? Are the two U one after the other (i.e. ended the first it begins the other) If not, would the puzzle work in that way?
Ok...that's a little bit crazy but...is Mario Kart wii involved somehow?...there is a trail with a mall if I remember correctly

Are the escalators located in a place such that you are obliged to see something relevant? Are the escalators located relevantly near to the entrance? Near to the exit? If so all the 3? Just the two U? Is going up associating to entering the mall or moving from a floor to the other of the mall (but still remaining in the inside)? Is going down associated to moving from an upper floor to a lower one? Moving toward the exit? Moving toward the enter of the mall? Are restaurants relevant?(e.g. restaurants'smell. You have just one escalator down so that you are forced to pass from restaurants and are tempted by the smell). Is the rule useful mainly when there is lot of people? Is flow of people entering the mall similar in quantity to flow of people exiting?

Are different attitudes of people when entering or exiting relevant? The fact that when exiting they have more stuffs than when entered? People need to rush? People have to pay at the cash? Avoiding rows relevant?
Is slowing down people relevant?
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Re: [IrishElk] Two Up, One Down

Postby irishelk » Wed Feb 27, 2019 4:39 pm

Earnest

Can we assume that the escalators (both the two up and the one down) are on the same floor? Yes. If not, are the the two up on different floors? Are all of the three on different floors? Is a specific one up associated to the one down? No to rest.
Are there also normal stairs/elevators? Irr. Is the one down starting outside of the mall and the one up inside it? No. Are the two U one after the other (i.e. ended the first it begins the other) If not, would the puzzle work in that way? No--there could be multiple levels with escalators, but each would have two up, one down.
Ok...that's a little bit crazy but...is Mario Kart wii involved somehow?...there is a trail with a mall if I remember correctly Nope. =)

Are the escalators located in a place such that you are obliged to see something relevant? No. Are the escalators located relevantly near to the entrance? Near to the exit? Yope--their position in relation to the entrances/exits is relevant, but they don't have to be especially near the doors. If so all the 3? Just the two U?
Is going up associating to entering the mall or moving from a floor to the other of the mall (but still remaining in the inside)? The beginning and ending of all three are inside the mall. Is going down associated to moving from an upper floor to a lower one? Yes. Moving toward the exit? Possibly, yes. Moving toward the enter of the mall? Possibly, yes. Are restaurants relevant? No. (e.g. restaurants'smell. You have just one escalator down so that you are forced to pass from restaurants and are tempted by the smell).
Is the rule useful mainly when there is lot of people? Yes. Is flow of people entering the mall similar in quantity to flow of people exiting? Yesish, but maybe explore.

Are different attitudes of people when entering or exiting relevant? Yesish. The fact that when exiting they have more stuffs than when entered? No, but good guess. People need to rush? This may be a factor, but not exactly. People have to pay at the cash? Irr. Avoiding rows relevant? Rows as in aisles? No. Rows as in fights? Maybe sometimes.
Is slowing down people relevant? Yesish, or at least people slowing down.
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Re: [IrishElk] Two Up, One Down

Postby Earnest » Wed Feb 27, 2019 5:28 pm

People taking pictures at the entrance? People slowing down to see stores?

Did they want to slow down people exiting the mall so to make them stop a little bit more? (Kind of waiting that there is less people exiting)
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Re: [IrishElk] Two Up, One Down

Postby hoodie » Wed Feb 27, 2019 5:55 pm

Is the mall entrance on the top floor? bottom floor? middle floor?

Is the mall exit on the top floor? bottom floor? middle floor?


Does this have anything to do with people descending only to realize they want to turn around and go back up?
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Re: [IrishElk] Two Up, One Down

Postby irishelk » Wed Mar 06, 2019 1:52 am

Earnest

People taking pictures at the entrance? No. People slowing down to see stores? No.

Did they want to slow down people exiting the mall so to make them stop a little bit more? (Kind of waiting that there is less people exiting) No, kind of the opposite.


hoodie Hi hoodie =)

Is the mall entrance on the top floor? bottom floor? middle floor?

Is the mall exit on the top floor? bottom floor? middle floor? The only relevant details is that there is an entrance/exit on the level at the top of the escalators, and an entrance/exit on the level at the bottom of the escalators.


Does this have anything to do with people descending only to realize they want to turn around and go back up? No.
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Re: [IrishElk] Two Up, One Down

Postby GalFisk » Wed Mar 06, 2019 2:36 pm

Do more people go up than down? Different people? Slower People? Are there other relevant ways of going up? Such as stairs? Elevators? Walking outside the building? Other relevant ways of going down? Such as <above list>?
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Re: [IrishElk] Two Up, One Down

Postby CoffeeBean » Wed Mar 06, 2019 3:43 pm

Is the mall's goal to aid in getting a lot of people to exit quickly? Or in a manner that is orderly?
Is another goal to prevent negative effects like arguments, fights, etc?
Would you say that the need for people to use all escalators is consistent during the course of the mall's operating hours? Or is the need much greater at certain hours or minutes?
Is there a relevant store or attraction at the mall that creates the scenario in which a large group of people need to move from an upper to a lower level all at the same time?
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Re: [IrishElk] Two Up, One Down

Postby irishelk » Wed Mar 20, 2019 8:59 pm

GalFisk

Do more people go up than down? Not exactly, but close. Different people? Yes--at least some. Slower People? No.
Are there other relevant ways of going up? Such as stairs? Elevators? Walking outside the building? Other relevant ways of going down? Such as <above list>? No to all.


CoffeeBean

Is the mall's goal to aid in getting a lot of people to exit quickly? Yes! Or in a manner that is orderly? Also yes.
Is another goal to prevent negative effects like arguments, fights, etc? Probably not primarily, but I'm sure this is a side benefit.
Would you say that the need for people to use all escalators is consistent during the course of the mall's operating hours? No. Or is the need much greater at certain hours or minutes? Certain brief intervals, yes. Timing is very relevant.
Is there a relevant store or attraction at the mall that creates the scenario in which a large group of people need to move from an upper to a lower level all at the same time? No--the reverse.
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Re: [IrishElk] Two Up, One Down

Postby GalFisk » Thu Mar 21, 2019 5:08 am

Do more people want to go up at certain times? Opening time relevant? Closing time? Commuters? Public transport? Rush hour? Emergencies?
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Re: [IrishElk] Two Up, One Down

Postby irishelk » Thu Mar 21, 2019 10:38 pm

GalFisk

Do more people want to go up at certain times? Yes. Opening time relevant?Closing time? No. Commuters? Yes. Public transport? Yes! Rush hour? Emergencies? Not really.
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Re: [IrishElk] Two Up, One Down

Postby GalFisk » Fri Mar 22, 2019 6:49 am

Do a lot of people want to go up at once because: they just got off public transport? They want to be in time for getting on public transport? Type of transport relevant? If so: bus? Train? Tram? Subway?
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Re: [IrishElk] Two Up, One Down

Postby irishelk » Sat Mar 23, 2019 1:31 pm

GalFisk

Do a lot of people want to go up at once because: they just got off public transport? Yep, that's pretty much it. They want to be in time for getting on public transport? Type of transport relevant? If so: bus? Train? Tram? Subway? This.


************************SPOILER

The bottom level of this particular mall is a Metro/subway train station, and apparently underground train stations are always supposed to have two escalators going up for every one going down. The reason is that passengers will find their way down to the platform to get on the train on their own varying schedules, but when people get off the train, it's everyone going in the same direction at the same time.

Nice work.
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